Poll

Do you support or oppose gun control?

I support gun control
2 (10%)
I oppose gun control
17 (85%)
Not sure
1 (5%)

Total Members Voted: 0

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Offline White Israelite

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Do you support or oppose gun control?
« on: December 27, 2007, 09:05:35 AM »
I oppose all forms of gun control simply because I feel government does not have a right to limit ones constitutional rights. I also oppose gun control because of the fact Adolf Hitler used gun control to deny Jews "permits" to own guns legally and the government can be used against the people.

Offline Dan

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2007, 09:26:24 AM »
I support the 2nd Amendment!

Offline Jasmina

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2007, 09:39:07 AM »
I oppose gun control.
The whole system works because everyone is not mentally ill on the same day!!!!

Offline Ultra Requete

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2007, 09:47:17 AM »
Hitler, Stalin and Mao suported the gun control too. ::) US with its profesional Army and now gradualy imposed gun control will be new Roman Empire, Romans had lost their Republic too.   
Jeremiah 8:11-17

11 They dress the wound of my people as though it were not serious. Peace, peace, they say, when there is no peace.

12 Are they ashamed of their loathsome conduct? No, they have no shame at all; they do not even know how to blush. So they will fall among the fallen; they will be brought down when they are punished, says the LORD.

13 'I will take away their harvest, declares the LORD. There will be no grapes on the vine. There will be no figs on the tree, and their leaves will wither. What I have given them will be taken from them.'

14 Why are we sitting here? Gather together! Let us flee to the fortified cities and perish there! For the LORD our God has doomed us to perish and given us poisoned water to drink, because we have sinned against him.

15 We hoped for peace but no good has come, for a time of healing but there was only terror.

16 The snorting of the enemy's horses is heard from Dan; at the neighing of their stallions the whole land trembles. They have come to devour the land and everything in it, the city and all who live there.

17 See, I will send venomous snakes among you, vipers that cannot be charmed, and they will bite you, declares the LORD.

Love your Enemy
And Heap Burning Coals on his Head!!!
http://net-burst.net/revenge/love_and_wrath_of_God.htm

Offline TavorIMI

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2007, 10:12:23 AM »
Gun control should only be an issue if you can't shoot straight  ;)

I support the second amendment, but unfortunately being a British subject I am denied my civil rights to self defence using the appropriate tools for the job. The only people here in the UK that are allowed firearms are criminals and the government. A thin line sometimes... :(



Still at least I'm allowed a dog  ;D
Shalom to you all from the UK.

Kiwi

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2007, 06:54:31 PM »
I support gun control to a point, I don't want 12 year olds running around with a M16 or a nutter having a AK 47.

Do you want to end up like cuba?

Weapons should only be in the hands of trained people. That includes civvies with training.

I feel that more education on the correct use of firearms is needed, far more of lax controls.

Offline Ambiorix

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2007, 09:43:52 PM »
If we in Europe allow people to carry guns, wouldn't that make a multi-ethnical war much more easier to come true?
Turkey must get out of NATO. NATO must get out of Kosovo-Serbia. Croats must get out of Crajina. All muslims must get out of Christian and Jewish land. Turks must get out of Cyprus. Turks must get out of "Istanbul". "Palestinians" must get out of Israel. Israel must become independent from USA.

Offline MassuhDGoodName

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2007, 10:38:51 PM »
CRIME CONTROL; NOT GUN CONTROL

America is going to have to follow the road once taken by England, in exiling its criminals to islands or other areas which are completely untamed and wild.

This is how the State of Georgia came into existence; it originally was a penal colony where incorrigibles were sent to fend for themselves using only their wits.

Australia came into being in this exact same manner.

We can not afford to house and feed an ever larger prisoner population.

How about shipping them all off to Papua New Guinea; if they don't get eaten by the headhunters or the kimodo dragons, they might live there; far away from civilized society.  I understand that much of that place is still unexplored.

newman

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2007, 10:54:13 PM »
I support gun control to a point, I don't want 12 year olds running around with a M16 or a nutter having a AK 47.

Do you want to end up like cuba?

Weapons should only be in the hands of trained people. That includes civvies with training.

I feel that more education on the correct use of firearms is needed, far more of lax controls.

Up until 1934 it was legal for a 10 year-old to buy ANY weapon including full-auto Browning machine guns in the USA. You'll note there were NO school shootings and virtually no misuse of firearms by kids before that time.

Kiwi

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2007, 10:59:25 PM »
I support gun control to a point, I don't want 12 year olds running around with a M16 or a nutter having a AK 47.

Do you want to end up like cuba?

Weapons should only be in the hands of trained people. That includes civvies with training.

I feel that more education on the correct use of firearms is needed, far more of lax controls.

Up until 1934 it was legal for a 10 year-old to buy ANY weapon including full-auto Browning machine guns in the USA. You'll note there were NO school shootings and virtually no misuse of firearms by kids before that time.

Its not the 1930's now would you trust a 10year Sydney kid with a semi?

Offline White Israelite

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2007, 11:01:20 PM »
I support gun control to a point, I don't want 12 year olds running around with a M16 or a nutter having a AK 47.

Do you want to end up like cuba?

Weapons should only be in the hands of trained people. That includes civvies with training.

I feel that more education on the correct use of firearms is needed, far more of lax controls.

Up until 1934 it was legal for a 10 year-old to buy ANY weapon including full-auto Browning machine guns in the USA. You'll note there were NO school shootings and virtually no misuse of firearms by kids before that time.

Yep my grandpa said that he used to take his rifle to school to go hunting afterwards. We haven't changed, we've had to adapt and lose our rights to satisfy the 3rd world and the liberals.

kellymaureen

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2007, 11:07:18 PM »
I support gun control to a point, I don't want 12 year olds running around with a M16 or a nutter having a AK 47.

Do you want to end up like cuba?

Weapons should only be in the hands of trained people. That includes civvies with training.

I feel that more education on the correct use of firearms is needed, far more of lax controls.

Up until 1934 it was legal for a 10 year-old to buy ANY weapon including full-auto Browning machine guns in the USA. You'll note there were NO school shootings and virtually no misuse of firearms by kids before that time.

An average 10 yr old today is completely different because of his PARENTS and the system.  You are barely allowed to raise your voice at your children now let alone discipline them.  Kids that age today are far more disrespectful and mouthy and just plain bad than they were even when I was a kid.  Its REAL hard to raise a respectful kid today, some of Adam's friends at 11 yrs old call their parents by their first names, they are 'friends' not parents anymore....oh and he KNOWS better ;) 

Kiwi

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2007, 11:10:28 PM »
I support gun control to a point, I don't want 12 year olds running around with a M16 or a nutter having a AK 47.

Do you want to end up like cuba?

Weapons should only be in the hands of trained people. That includes civvies with training.

I feel that more education on the correct use of firearms is needed, far more of lax controls.

Up until 1934 it was legal for a 10 year-old to buy ANY weapon including full-auto Browning machine guns in the USA. You'll note there were NO school shootings and virtually no misuse of firearms by kids before that time.

An average 10 yr old today is completely different because of his PARENTS and the system.  You are barely allowed to raise your voice at your children now let alone discipline them.  Kids that age today are far more disrespectful and mouthy and just plain bad than they were even when I was a kid.  Its REAL hard to raise a respectful kid today, some of Adam's friends at 11 yrs old call their parents by their first names, they are 'friends' not parents anymore....oh and he KNOWS better ;) 

Excalty my point things are every different today, people need to stop wanting the past and work out how to fix the future.

newman

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2007, 08:59:02 AM »
I agree. Kids today are a waste of space. But that's my point: It's not the guns that are a problem........it's our society. The children of dirt-poor, disposessed, unemployed share croppers of the depression era had better manners, morals and values than the children of doctors, lawyers and industrialists do today.

Offline HiWarp

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2007, 10:20:34 AM »
Quote from: newman link=topic=14011.msg#msg date=
I agree. Kids today are a waste of space. But that's my point: It's not the guns that are a problem........it's our society. The children of dirt-poor, disposessed, unemployed share croppers of the depression era had better manners, morals and values than the children of doctors, lawyers and industrialists do today.

Well, the doctors, lawyers and industrialists are all very busy people with very important careers.  You can't expect them to waste their precious and valuable time on something as petty as raising their children.  That's what third world nannies are for.
"When the people fear their government, there is tyranny;
when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”
---Thomas Jefferson

Offline cjd

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2007, 10:54:35 AM »
I am not for total gun control however gun control for certain types of guns might not be all that bad. I really don't see a problem with a guy who collects guns or is a hunter or marksman having a sizable collection of rifles, shotguns or even handguns however I question the ability to keep machine guns around without regulation. The ability to keep a shotgun or hand gun in the home for protection (where laws allow) is very important. Years ago the guns available to the average guy were hand guns that held 6 rounds or possibly a few more or a rifle or shot gun which was not much better. This was enough to hunt and protect your home need be. Anything more substantial was a rarity that required money and even then were not around in great numbers. Today guns that have a lot of fire power are very available and are priced so almost any nut job has the ability to get their hands on one. My point is people have a right to bare arms however what is the need for an average guy to have a machine gun around in the home. Over the past few years more and more incidents of a disturbed kid getting a hold of this sort of high powered weapon and taking down a large number of people before he or she themselves could be disarmed is a testament to how many of the wrong type firearms are floating around in irresponsible hands. I think the founding fathers wanted the civilian population to have the rights to bare arms however they could never have thought guns that could kill hundreds of people in a few minutes could ever exists. For the ability to have that sort of weapon people really need to be checked out and the gun needs to be registered. Sadly people ruin things for themselves if gun dealers and owners took more care of the sales and security of gun ownership guns like that would not end up in the hands of a disturbed 16 year old.   
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Offline White Israelite

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #16 on: December 30, 2007, 06:02:38 PM »
I am not for total gun control however gun control for certain types of guns might not be all that bad. I really don't see a problem with a guy who collects guns or is a hunter or marksman having a sizable collection of rifles, shotguns or even handguns however I question the ability to keep machine guns around without regulation. The ability to keep a shotgun or hand gun in the home for protection (where laws allow) is very important. Years ago the guns available to the average guy were hand guns that held 6 rounds or possibly a few more or a rifle or shot gun which was not much better. This was enough to hunt and protect your home need be. Anything more substantial was a rarity that required money and even then were not around in great numbers. Today guns that have a lot of fire power are very available and are priced so almost any nut job has the ability to get their hands on one. My point is people have a right to bare arms however what is the need for an average guy to have a machine gun around in the home. Over the past few years more and more incidents of a disturbed kid getting a hold of this sort of high powered weapon and taking down a large number of people before he or she themselves could be disarmed is a testament to how many of the wrong type firearms are floating around in irresponsible hands. I think the founding fathers wanted the civilian population to have the rights to bare arms however they could never have thought guns that could kill hundreds of people in a few minutes could ever exists. For the ability to have that sort of weapon people really need to be checked out and the gun needs to be registered. Sadly people ruin things for themselves if gun dealers and owners took more care of the sales and security of gun ownership guns like that would not end up in the hands of a disturbed 16 year old.   


The right to keep and bear arms had nothing to do with hunting ducks or deer, at the time the constitution was written, the military firearm was the musket. Our founding fathers wanted us to have the same firearms as the military to keep balance.

A good chunk of these so called "assault rifles" aren't even true assault rifles.

Take a look at this video.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=YjM9fcEzSJ0

Also machine guns have been regulated since the 1930's. Citizens can own them.

Are so-called "Assault Weapons"
a Threat to Police Officers?

By David B. Kopel

Handgun Control, Inc., would have you believe so, and an article in the Jan-Feb issue of this magazine repeated some of their claims nearly verbatim. But it ain’t necessarily so.

Here are the facts:

In November 1995, Handgun Control, Inc. put out a "study" titled "Cops Under Fire." The study claims that 13% of police officers killed from January 1994 through September 1995 were shot with "assault weapons." HCI also wrote that in 23% of the homicides, the perpetrator’s gun could use a magazine holding more than ten rounds.

But these statistics appear to have been doctored. Using the FBI’s annual report, Law Enforcement Officers Killed and Assaulted, I found several incidents in 1994 (the 1995 edition of the report hasn’t been produced yet) for which the HCI data was inaccurate: the wrong model gun was listed, and the real gun was not banned by the 1994 federal "assault weapon" law; the gun was taken from a police officer; or the murder was perpetrated by a police officer against another officer.

The logical implication of HCI’s counting crimes by polices or crimes with guns taken from police is that police officers should not be allowed to own guns with magazines of more than 10 rounds.

For the cases involving a gun which could hold a magazine of more than 10 rounds, HCI did not specify whether the perpetrator’s gun actually did have such a magazine. Nor did HCI specify how many shots were actually fired. Of the 13 incidents for 1994, the FBI report specifies that more than 10 shots were fired in only once incident.

In truth, so-called "assault weapons" account for a small percentage of police homicides. From 1975 through 1992, there were 1,534 police officers feloniously murdered in the United States. Over these, 16–slightly over 1 percent–were killed with "assault weapons.".

California was the state of origin for the "assault weapon" hoax. In the spring of 1989, the gun prohibition lobbies convinced the state legislature to enact an "assault weapon" prohibition by claiming that police officers were being mowed down right and left by "assault weapons" in that state. But according to a study published in the Journal of California Law Enforcement in 1991, "It is interesting to note, in the current hysteria over semi-automatic and military look-alike weapons, that the most common weapon used to murder police officers was that of the .38 Special and the .357 Magnum revolver." The Journal found that calibers for military-style shoulder weapons accounted for eight percent of officer fatalities. (Of course not every fatality involving a such a caliber necessarily involved an "assault weapon.")

Looking at the broader picture of all gun use in crime, it becomes clear that "assault weapons" are a minor part of the problem. Police gun seizure data from around the nation finds that "assault weapons" account for less than 2% of guns seized by the police; more typically, they account for less than 1%. (Data from 24 major jurisdictions are provided in chapter 4 of my book Guns: Who Should Have Them?)

According the gun prohibition lobbies, Los Angeles is the "assault weapon" capital of the world, where scores of drive-by shootings every year perpetrated with these evil guns. But a study in the New England Journal of Medicine investigated the 583 drive-by shootings in Los Angeles in 1991 in which a person under the age of eighteen was shot at. "Use of an assault weapon was documented in one incident." (H. Range Hutson, Deirdre Anglin, and Michael J. Pratts, "Adolescents and Children Injured or Killed in Drive-By Shootings in Los Angeles," New England Journal of Medicine, vol. 330 [1994], p. 326.)

Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Deputy Dwight Van Horn is the firearms examiner for South-Central L.A., the most gang-ridden spot in the United States. "I deal with firearms-identification experts at departments all over the country," he says, "and I can tell you that the claim that AK-47s or something called an ‘assault weapon’–which is simply a fabricated political and media term meant to vilify firearms that look like military arms but actually means whatever someone wants it to mean–is widely used by criminals, isn’t true and never has been true."

The most recent research about "assault weapon" use in crimes against civilians and the police is a March 1997 report from the Urban Institute, under contract from the U.S. Department of Justice. The study looked at data from January 1992 through May 1996. There were 276 officer homicides, of which 20 (seven percent) were verified to have involved an "assault weapon." In the first half of 1996, there were no "assault weapon" homicides, a fact which some would interpret to suggest that the "assault weapon" ban is working.

On the other hand, there were also no "assault weapon" homicides of police in 1992, a year when there was no federal ban in place.

Indeed, almost half (9 of 20) of the "assault weapon" shootings occurred in 1994. In that year, the ban went into effect in September, but President Clinton and gun prohibition lobby were generating "assault weapon" publicity throughout the year.

We know that television shows such as Miami Vice pique interest in particular exotic models of firearms. Is it possibility that all the publicity that President Clinton, Attorney General Reno, and others gave to "assault weapons" in 1994–making wild claims about what great "cop-killer" weapons they were–may have attracted the interest of some potential cop killers?

The Urban Institute report concluded, "In sum, police officers are rarely murdered with assault weapons." The study noted that "assault weapons" were more likely to be used in murders of police officers than in other murders, but not have sufficient information to conclude why this was so. ("Cop-killer" publicity is certainly one possibility.)

The study said that it was possible, but not proven, that the Clinton gun ban might affect the proportion of "assault weapons" used in police homicides. The study did not attempt to investigate whether any possible shift from "assault weapons" to other guns had resulted in fewer law enforcement deaths.

If "assault weapon" bans did work, it is unlikely that police or the public would be safer. The federal "assault weapon" law does not define "assault weapons" based on rate of fire, velocity, bullet weight, or any other measure of lethality. Rather the ban is based on cosmetic features, such as whether the gun has a bayonet lug, or whether the a rifle’s pistol grip protrudes "conspicuously."

If criminals were bayoneting police officers, banning bayonet-capable guns might have some impact. But an aesthetic exercise like the federal "assault weapon" ban is unlikely to make a real difference on the streets.

More fundamentally, the fact that some criminals use a particular type of gun against the police is no justification for banning the possession of that gun by law-abiding citizens. In contrast to "assault weapons," handguns really are used in many attacks against police. But the misuse of handguns by criminals is no reason to disarm the 99% of handgun owners who are law-abiding–any more than the occasional misuse of guns by criminal police officers is a reason to disarm law-abiding police.






Also thought you might find this interesting, this is how Nazi Germany used to license firearms.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Weapons_Law

Offline Raulmarrio2000

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #17 on: December 31, 2007, 02:49:13 AM »
I voted I OPPOSE GANS CONTROL. I like guns for collection, and self-defense if neccesary. I was thinking on buying a portable gun. But here in Argentina you need plenty of permissions to HAVE it, and it's nearly impossible to be allowed to take it with you. You can have it at home with luck. And when you travel? It's much more neccesary, but you are rarely allowed to get a permission to take it. Tat's why my mother decided not to buy a gun. She felt safe at home at that time in this town, and she only wanted it for the event of being attacked in the streets......

kellymaureen

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #18 on: December 31, 2007, 11:55:53 AM »
I support everyone who can handle the responsibility AND is of age to own a gun.  I dont have a problem with keeping guns from people who have no control over themselves, this is only common sense.   I also think people who own one should know how to use it properly.


Kiwi

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Re: Do you support or oppose gun control?
« Reply #19 on: December 31, 2007, 07:31:06 PM »
I support everyone who can handle the responsibility AND is of age to own a gun.  I dont have a problem with keeping guns from people who have no control over themselves, this is only common sense.   I also think people who own one should know how to use it properly.



100% agree  O0