I'm a young guy, I have a girlfriend and we want to marry!

[Salty German]

No. I attended a single gender school. What is your opinion on these establishments?

I believe that there is some merit in single-gender schooling, e.g. less sexual interest and more time for bonding with one's own gender (vital for being able to succeed in life), studying, doing sports etc.  Uniforms can also help prevent colour-coding and inequalities which can result in bullying.

No single type of school system is perfect but single-gender schools have a lot going for them.  (There is plenty of time to explore the other gender at college or university, or even just after school hours ...)

Did you enjoy your time at an all-boys school?

[OdKahaneChai]

Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?

Not allowed no matter what. Show your Jewish girldfriend this video

http://kolyakov.org/rav_mizrachi.html
"01/08/08 Intermarriage"

Let her watch something a bit shorter first...

What do you mean? What else is their to watch? Anyway the link I posted is very good and allways gives good facts. Most others many times talk nicer and use politically correct things and may not allways show the "frightining" aspects of the consequences. Learning from Rabbi Mizrahi you get the facts even if they seem scary, but the truth is the truth, he brings down the sources and after one sees he and she can still decide, BUT they will be aware about the deep consequences about their evil actions. 

I just don't think Rav Mizrachi's videos are very good for outreach because they're very interesting - but they're very, very long.  A person who doesn't want to listen to a long Shiur isn't going to watch the whole thing.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?

Not allowed no matter what. Show your Jewish girldfriend this video

http://kolyakov.org/rav_mizrachi.html
"01/08/08 Intermarriage"

Let her watch something a bit shorter first...

What do you mean? What else is their to watch? Anyway the link I posted is very good and allways gives good facts. Most others many times talk nicer and use politically correct things and may not allways show the "frightining" aspects of the consequences. Learning from Rabbi Mizrahi you get the facts even if they seem scary, but the truth is the truth, he brings down the sources and after one sees he and she can still decide, BUT they will be aware about the deep consequences about their evil actions. 

I just don't think Rav Mizrachi's videos are very good for outreach because they're very interesting - but they're very, very long.  A person who doesn't want to listen to a long Shiur isn't going to watch the whole thing.

Maybe, but listining to a 2 hour Shiur by the Hacham, for something that that influence one for the rest of their life is well worth it, and in reality is not a lot of time to spend. Its just 2 hours, and very interesting, insightful, and extremly necessary. Giving a quick short answer doesn't allways do it for some people, but listining in (even if no tthe whole thing) brings down many of the sources and the vital information.  + people spend most of their time in non-sense and no-one can say that they dont have 2 hours to spend, instead of watching a movie one can watch the video instead (its just the Yetzer Hara which tries to convince one that they dont have time, expecially when it comes to Spirituality, but when its other things like eating and movies or sports, etc. people make all the time they want).

[dibblah]

Hi Salty,

I agree with you on many of your points... and yes I think most people who have a single-sex education have benefited from it and had a great education- I had some of my best times in a Catholic boys school and laterly in an all-boys grammar school in the UK. However I did also spend time in other schools -(British Embassy School et. al.) as we moved around different countries ect..

OdKahaneChai - Thank you for your concern, and it is much appreciated- The video was quite long and involved. However, I think we both got the message...this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do. Interestingly, after she has talked with her parents they have now agreed that what has been said here is the truth and what they did not say earlier has been laid out here. -Funny old world...why didn't they say something before then?

-I'm now out on this subject guys, it has taught me a thing or two, but thank you anyway, all of you, for your advice. It has been much appreciated.

[OdKahaneChai]

Hi Salty,

I agree with you on many of your points... and yes I think most people who have a single-sex education have benefited from it and had a great education- I had some of my best times in a Catholic boys school and laterly in an all-boys grammar school in the UK. However I did also spend time in other schools -(British Embassy School et. al.) as we moved around different countries ect..

OdKahaneChai - Thank you for your concern, and it is much appreciated- The video was quite long and involved. However, I think we both got the message...this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do. Interestingly, after she has talked with her parents they have now agreed that what has been said here is the truth and what they did not say earlier has been laid out here. -Funny old world...why didn't they say something before then?

-I'm now out on this subject guys, it has taught me a thing or two, but thank you anyway, all of you, for your advice. It has been much appreciated.

Your very welcome, and may Hashem bless you.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Hi Salty,

I agree with you on many of your points... and yes I think most people who have a single-sex education have benefited from it and had a great education- I had some of my best times in a Catholic boys school and laterly in an all-boys grammar school in the UK. However I did also spend time in other schools -(British Embassy School et. al.) as we moved around different countries ect..

OdKahaneChai - Thank you for your concern, and it is much appreciated- The video was quite long and involved. However, I think we both got the message...this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do. Interestingly, after she has talked with her parents they have now agreed that what has been said here is the truth and what they did not say earlier has been laid out here. -Funny old world...why didn't they say something before then?

-I'm now out on this subject guys, it has taught me a thing or two, but thank you anyway, all of you, for your advice. It has been much appreciated.

 I dont understand, so you are breaking up then? When you said "this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do" - did that imply that you wanted to get a conscience approval, of what you want to do, or that you learned the answers and now are changing your plans?

[dibblah]

As a final note we have been close for over a year now and both get on well with both sets of parents...There did not seem to be any objections, though I did feel a bit of an "outsider" at times..but not in an unfriendly way...

We got to talking (have discussed many times) about moving things forward in our relationship and naturally marriage, children were discussed. At first flush, it seemed that we were both keen on doing this. We then started to look at the nitty-gritty and it started to look like a move we would have to look more deeply into. As a JTF member already, and as a bit of a long shot, I threw the question out there for a response from respected members of the Jewish community; perhaps hoping to circumvent the need to talk/see a Rabbi or Priest.- I hope this clarifies.

Dibblah.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

As a final note we have been close for over a year now and both get on well with both sets of parents...There did not seem to be any objections, though I did feel a bit of an "outsider" at times..but not in an unfriendly way...

We got to talking (have discussed many times) about moving things forward in our relationship and naturally marriage, children were discussed. At first flush, it seemed that we were both keen on doing this. We then started to look at the nitty-gritty and it started to look like a move we would have to look more deeply into. As a JTF member already, and as a bit of a long shot, I threw the question out there for a response from respected members of the Jewish community; perhaps hoping to circumvent the need to talk/see a Rabbi or Priest.- I hope this clarifies.

Dibblah.

Not completly, are you still together, its a simple yes or no? Also did the lady watch the video I posted about assimilation?

[MarZutra]

I think she will enjoy Rabbi Kahane's video: "Why Be Jewish?" http://www.kahane.org/video.htm 
Within he speaks about intermarriage and assimilation...

[dibblah]

Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...

[MarZutra]

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Actually brother, most were Hellenists before, and even for a fair time after Constentine made Catholocism/Christianity the Empire's Official Religion.  Have you ever read about the early "Christians" that followed John the Baptist?  Early Christianity was far different after the Council of Nicea in 325 or even the Council of Trent 1545...then the Reformation and counter Reformation...  Whoa, what a interesting history...

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...

  , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabb-t and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).

[DownwithIslam]

Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...

  , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabbat and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).

I agree. Jews need to marry jews. Intermarriage is severely hurting world jewry and I believe the marriage will be doomed if it is allowed to progress. All the cases of intermarriage that I have seen were not successful.

[dibblah]

Thank you, thats about it.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...

  , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabbat and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).

I think he realizes that, but I don't think bombarding the girl with soooo much rhetoric against intermarraige will work in our favor. Like he said, if you push her too hard, she will reject Judaism and be against it for all the suffering it caused her. Dibblah needs to break up with her carefully and still leave her with a Jewish yearning. The point against intermarraige should be made, but stuffing it down her throat seems to much for her now. I think she gets it, but both he and she need some time to sort themselves out.

Yea, but I assume that if "they are together" they are at least touching eachother, at the veryyy least (G-d forbid they should do more). From his standpoint, it is wronge and he isn't allowed to be with her or give her the false impression. He doesn't need to bombard her, just simply break up. What she does next isn't his problem but completly hers, just as long as their not together. If he wants he can direct her to that important video, so she can correct her foolish ways and have a change for true repentence.

[Dr. Dan]

Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?

IF you two truely love each other, then let her marry a Jew and you marry a Catholic. Love between two people doesn't just mean getting married to them.

If you want to do the right thing, marry someone who sees Gd the same way as you, as a Catholic..and she should do the same with a Jew.

[Dr. Dan]

Falling in love....Sounds like someone fell into a hole while walking and not paying attention.....

Oh i like that one!

[Dr. Dan]

Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...

  , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabbat and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).

I think he realizes that, but I don't think bombarding the girl with soooo much rhetoric against intermarraige will work in our favor. Like he said, if you push her too hard, she will reject Judaism and be against it for all the suffering it caused her. Dibblah needs to break up with her carefully and still leave her with a Jewish yearning. The point against intermarraige should be made, but stuffing it down her throat seems to much for her now. I think she gets it, but both he and she need some time to sort themselves out.

Yea, but I assume that if "they are together" they are at least touching eachother, at the veryyy least (G-d forbid they should do more). From his standpoint, it is wronge and he isn't allowed to be with her or give her the false impression. He doesn't need to bombard her, just simply break up. What she does next isn't his problem but completly hers, just as long as their not together. If he wants he can direct her to that important video, so she can correct her foolish ways and have a change for true repentence.

Tzvi, stay out of it, you're not helping.

[Raulmarrio2000]

The problem with keeping in touch with her, is that the longer you are together, the more difficult it'll be to break up. And even if you don't care of the religious ban on intermarriage, that relation will mostly likely bring suffering, not happiness. However you must not bash her with Hallachic reasons, since you don't keep Torah Hallacha, and you'll sound just as an hypocrite. She may think, he cares about Judiasm for me, but he, himself is not a Noahide. Since Catholic reasons against intermarriage are different. You'd better use rational arguments about the problems it'll bring for children education, home life and so on. And even better just break up, or avoid meeting often, and when you do see each other, just talk like friends. You can also say that you are simply not sure if you really were in love with her.

[dibblah]

Thank you all for the advice. I know what to do.

[dibblah]

That was a very inspirational and meaningful vid.

-Thank you for the link.

-BTW, he had bags of character and came across as a genuine, reasonable man.

-God bless him he is making me think in a fundamental way about how I should conduct my life.

This is one of the main reasons why I joined the JTF forum....to be inspired.

[dibblah]

It is time for me to come clean and explain everything...

The situation I have portrayed to date does not descibe me or any situation I'm involved in. I have been posting questions on other peoples behalf.

-This enquiry was done on behalf of a friend of mine that is in exactly this position and has asked me for insights from the Jewish community as to what his prospects were with his girlfriend as regards marriage. At all times I have been an honest reflection of his (and hers) position on this issue and have communicated the response from fellow JTF'ers in the same way.

I care deeply that this couple find happiness as it is all too rare in this day and age.

The truly useful thing from this is that she has now gone and spoken with her Rabi in North London and decided that she should only marry a Jewish man.

He, who is my cousin and a Catholic, is very upset but is reasonable enough to understand her position on this. BTW some, (if not all) of the responses I posted were directly from him and her so this in effect is me acting by proxy for them.

They both asked me to do this for them as they knew I was a JTF'er. BTW they found some of the responses very extreme, but some very honest and which struck a chord with them both in a deep way.

-Thank you all for your advice..... It has been life changing in this instance for these two people. I happen to agree that as a rule of thumb Jews should marry Jews and Catholics the same. As for Muzzies, well they shouldn't even be here!

-Thank you guys for making a real difference in this instance.

VBR,

Dibbz

[dibblah]

Mills- you again

I was cutting and pasting their e-mails most of the time.

The others were phone conversations.

What amazed me was the reluctance of my cousin's girlfriend to come on line and make her case. Obviously she knew in advance that as a Jew she would have an unsympathetic audience here. I tried to tell her that this was not the case but she (quite reasonably) said that her Rabi would find out and tell her parents.

-Live and learn et al. didn't mean to be disingenuous, but this was my cousin so I had to help.

Thanks again for all the advice.

VBR,

Dibbz.

[newman]

The problem with a half-Jew, half-catholic is they have to burn their own houses down on good friday.

[dibblah]

This is true, but only when they have Romans leaning over them