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Christianity and why I support JTF

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Allen-T:
I would like to say some things in regard to why I, Allen-T, a very flawed human being who is also a Christian supports JTF. From time to time I read things on this forum by some Jewish people that really bother me and generally I just let them go. But I have felt for awhile that it might be a good idea to write an open letter about why I support this organisation. I would like all of my friends here at JTF to know me a little better and also to give my perspective about Christian-Jewish relations. I want to say first that in the 11 years I have been a Christian I feel more comfortable and have a sense of being amongst friends on this forum then in most church circles. I feel that I have found an opportunity to use my talents and time here at JTF that is both vital and fulfilling. I have encountered alot of "politics" & "egos" in churches that have sometimes gotten me down. My understanding of Torah Judaism basically comes from listening to Chaim. Chaim has said that in Torah Judaism there is the belief that righteous gentiles will inherit a place in the world to come. According to this teaching there is no need for Jews to try to convert gentiles or vice versa. My understanding of the totality of scripture has led me to another conclusion, and of course that is that there is no salvation apart from Jesus Christ. This is the most basic teaching of Christianity. I think everybody knows this. It seems to me that there are some people amongst my Jewish brothers and sisters that believe that if christianity teaches this, and a christian wants close fellowship with Jews it MUST be to try to convert them. I cannot speak for anyone but myself, but I want to say in that regard, it is not my PURPOSE to convert any Jew to Christianity within JTF. Of course I desire that every Jew accept Christ, I pray for this to occur. But holding that as a personal belief and desire and actively scheming to bring it about under false pretenses is two different things. I believe that JTF has a program for making this world a better place that is compatible with Biblical Christianity. We differ in that Judaism, as I understand it, believes that good works will facilitate the redemption. My belief is that I am saved by the blood of Christ, works are relative to heavenly rewards, not redemption. I am of the Christian school of thought that things are only going to get worse and worse as we move towards the end of the age, but we still have a responsability to fight evil and do what we can, as things collapse, to promote righteousness as much as we can. I know in my heart of hearts that standing by my Jewish brothers and sisters NO MATTER WHAT is what G-d wants from every true Christian. I guess the thing I want most to be communicated here is that we as Christians are compelled to preach the gospel, it is a commandment. But we are respectful people that understand that it is possible to work with others for a common good and respect their feelings about our beliefs. I resent some of the comments I have read here from time to time suggesting all christians have this conversion motive up their sleeve and if not for that they wouldn't help us at all. I am well aware that alot of evil things have been done to Jewish people in the name of Christ. These crimes were perpetuated by evil men that were not acting on any commands of Jesus, but rather their own selfish lusts. Nowhere in the Christian scriptures can one find justification for anti-semitism. If people have been to lazy to study and taken things out of context they did so at the devils direction, not Jesuses. I am grateful and blessed that most of my brothers and sisters here on the forum already know what I am talking about and all is cool and productive and G-d willing these things will muliply and then some, for everyone's benefit.  : ;D             

Fruit of thy loins:
Hello Allen-T.

I don't get the same karma off you that I do off many Christians.  I was greatly helped as a child by a Christian teacher without whom I think I would not have got into university, and it turns out he was a Messianic Jew who had converted. You said you are Christian for 11 years now - does that mean you converted from some other faith?

dawntreader:
Thanks for your very thoughtful letter Allen-T.

Just so you know, I personally have no quarell with the majority of American Christians. (I do not believe a majority of catholics are Christians. I have a problem with them because they seem to be obvious idoloters. They pray to statues, they pray to dead people and the list could go on and on.)

However, there are a lot of Christians who are exactly as you describe. Most of them seem to be evangelicals...and not necessarily the regular denominations like Babtists, Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians etc.

Some of the Jews here (Not me) but some are a tad hypocritical. They don't like the idea of conversion etc. but there are Jewish groups who actively engage in proselytizing amongst us Jews too. The big difference is who you happen to think the Messiah is.

The Lubavitchers have adopted a surprising resemblance to some Christian theology...they took their Rebbe's house apart and moved it to Israel and rebuilt it..basically making it a shrine. They also think their Rebbe is going to rise again. (Ala Jesus)

But hey, I guess they are legit cause they are born Jews, they supposedly keep Torah and of course they've got all the trappings of Jewish tradition.

Or is it that a resurrection from the Dead has always been a part of Jewish theology? If so, then we Jews shouldn't have that big of an issue with those who want to say Jesus is the Messiah. Otherwise it's a bit hypocritical.

Allen-T:

--- Quote from: Fruit of thy loins on April 06, 2007, 04:29:51 PM ---Hello Allen-T.

I don't get the same karma off you that I do off many Christians.  I was greatly helped as a child by a Christian teacher without whom I think I would not have got into university, and it turns out he was a Messianic Jew who had converted. You said you are Christian for 11 years now - does that mean you converted from some other faith?



--- End quote ---

My upbringing was Catholic. Although I believe that there are some saved Catholics, I don't believe that the institution is Christian in any biblical sense. My favorite book after the Bible is The Two Babylons by Alexander Hislop. My journey was basically a rejection of Catholicism and in effect G-d, a period where all I cared about was sex, a period where I thought Charles Manson was the smartest man that ever lived, followed by a period of self-hating white insanity where I was reading stuff like Soul On Ice and Ntozake Shange. During this period I got involved with a black woman from the Caribbean and I have a 14 year old son as a result. My life was decimated by the family court and I was rendered homeless, living in a van for two years because it was the only way I could save the few pennies I had left. During this time I came to accept Christ, and my life has only gotten better since. I met 2 christians during the "van days" one guy named John[actually we met before the van experience], and my beautiful wife, Elizabeth. I left the country at one point because it wasn't possible to work, although I did continue to do my record business from my van!! I lived in the Czech Republic for 5 years with my wife, came back in 2003 and have resumed a relationship with my son, although he has picked up alot of "black-isms" that make things difficult, as you can imagine. But since I have become a Christian I have only become more and more confident it's the truth and like I said my life has been more stable and fulfilling on every level. My wife is wonderful beyond anything I deserve.  ;D[and yes fruit, she's white :-*]

Allen-T:

--- Quote from: dawntreader on April 06, 2007, 04:31:05 PM ---Thanks for your very thoughtful letter Allen-T.

Just so you know, I personally have no quarell with the majority of American Christians. (I do not believe a majority of catholics are Christians. I have a problem with them because they seem to be obvious idoloters. They pray to statues, they pray to dead people and the list could go on and on.)

However, there are a lot of Christians who are exactly as you describe. Most of them seem to be evangelicals...and not necessarily the regular denominations like Babtists, Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians etc.

Some of the Jews here (Not me) but some are a tad hypocritical. They don't like the idea of conversion etc. but there are Jewish groups who actively engage in proselytizing amongst us Jews too. The big difference is who you happen to think the Messiah is.

The Lubavitchers have adopted a surprising resemblance to some Christian theology...they took their Rebbe's house apart and moved it to Israel and rebuilt it..basically making it a shrine. They also think their Rebbe is going to rise again. (Ala Jesus)

But hey, I guess they are legit cause they are born Jews, they supposedly keep Torah and of course they've got all the trappings of Jewish tradition.

Or is it that a resurrection from the Dead has always been a part of Jewish theology? If so, then we Jews shouldn't have that big of an issue with those who want to say Jesus is the Messiah. Otherwise it's a bit hypocritical.

--- End quote ---

The Lubavitchers Rebbe was Menachem Schneerson, am I correct? I used to see his pictures around Great Neck alot, in fact my landlord has pictures of him in their home.

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