Ku Klux Klan Endorses Obama

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

U guys keep guns.


Gun are bad, mmkay?

Mo, a Jew MUST have a gun, it is a MUST.

I don't think so. I believe Hashem protects his children and if we get killed because we are Jewish, then it's a tremendous zechus.

I'm not saying security isn't important or anything, but an average Jew doesn't need a gun compared to someone like Chaim or Rav Kahane.

If G-d did not want people to own guns there would be no guns to own....G-d gave man everything they need to survive in this world... Is up to man to use the things at their disposal in a responsible way.... Yes in the end G-d will protect his chosen people but why does the end have to come for some at the hands of some filthy animal.... I am sure G-d would far rather see a G-d fearing Jew walking the earth rather then some animal that was out to do evil things ....As in most cases the Rav was on the money.  Like the old adage says... G-d helps them that help themselves!

Yeah but then EVERYBODY will have a gun and crazy things will happen.

I don't understand.  Why do 'crazy things' happen just from having a gun?

Btw, you ever been on a settlement?  People are walking around strapped with guns including soldiers regularly.  Even in general Israeli society, soldiers who are enlisted have to carry their guns around.  So you will cross the street and have soldiers randomly walking around with guns strapped to their backs.  Or on the bus, plenty of soldiers riding the bus with heavy weapons.  "Crazy things" don't seem to happen.   It just seems foreign in american (especially northeast and ny and urban/suburban areas) society and what you're used to seeing.    I was also shocked to see this the first time, but the shock subsides quickly.

Some Jews are terrible and deserve to be killed anyways.

But we are speaking here about members of the forum, not traitors and evil people.  You said generally that good Jews should not have guns.  I don't understand this.

Peace comes easier by NOT owning weapons. 

How so?   The enemy has weapons and the criminals have weapons.  So how does it help for potential victims to be defenseless?  That only encourages further crimes to be committed by those armed criminals who see vulnerability and act on it.

No attacks, no need for protection. Obviously not realistic. But I think pepper spray is better.

Exactly, it's not realistic.  That's why a gun is needed.  For self-defense.  Because muggers exist, thugs exist, criminals exist... etc.   They don't just target dangerous and "crazy" Jews like Chaim.  Actually, they target the defenseless even more than they will dare target a "crazy" Jew like Chaim.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The right to bear arms is of essential importance to people living in America, and especially members of a certain ethnicity (ahem, Jewish) which has been targeted in the past for violent attacks and are most vulnerable and need to protect themselves.   But every American should cherish this right.  The day this right erodes is the day America is completely unsafe and Jews better run for the hills if they haven't already by that point.

[Ari Ben-Canaan]

A Jew owning a gun and knowing self-defense [like Israeli Krav Maga!] has nothing but common sense.

From the FBI: 2008 Hate Crimes based on religion.

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/hc2008/victims.html

Religious bias

Of the 1,732 victims of anti-religious hate crimes:

    * 66.1 percent were targeted because of an offender’s anti-Jewish bias.
    * 7.5 percent were victims because of an anti-Islamic bias.
    * 5.1 percent were victims because of an anti-Catholic bias.
    * 3.6 percent were victims because of an anti-Protestant bias.
    * 0.8 percent were targeted because of an anti-Atheist/Agnostic bias.
    * 12.8 percent were victims because of a bias against other religions (anti-other religion).
    * 4.0 percent were victims because of a bias against groups of individuals of varying religions (anti-multiple religions, group). (Based on Table 1.)

[Keep in mind Jews are around 2% of the population in the US.]
 [There were about 3,500 attacks on blacks who represent 14% of the US population.  Per individual, a Jew is most at risk in the US.]

Guns reduce crime.  Plain and simple.

http://www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/493636.html

http://www.nraila.org/Issues/FactSheets/Read.aspx?id=206&issue=007

http://www.nraila.org/legislation/read.aspx?id=5857

http://www.fff.org/freedom/fd0210e.asp

[IsraeliGovtAreKapos]

Gun Control quotes:

”The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose.”
- James Earl Jones

"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars.”
- Unknown

"To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them.”
- George Mason

"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass.”
- Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto

"No law ever prevented a crime.”
- Anonymous

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity.”
- Sigmund Freud

"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a slave"
- Unknown

"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.”
- Wayne LaPierre

"When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away.”
- Phillip Van Cleave

[IsraeliGovtAreKapos]

I fully support the import of the Second Amendment to Israel.

[The One and Only Mo]

Mo, let's say an armed burglar comes into your house and you don't know what he wants to do to you, would you wait for the army/police to save you and your family?

See. That's the problem. The armed burglar has a gun. Shouldn't be allowed in the first place.

[The One and Only Mo]

Mo, you're young.  When I was your age, I used to think as you currently do.  But with all due respect, you're mistaken. 

I strongly recommend that you read the book "The Seven Myths of Gun Control" by Richard Poe. 

The author writes Switzerland, and how they have (or used to have) a strong gun culture, and how that was the reason they were never invaded by the Nazis during WWII. 

He also wrote about how the Japanese first wanted to invade the U.S. during World War II. 

“You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass.” – Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto, (Japanese Navy)

On another note, I suggest you Google Channon Christian and Chris Newsome (and I hope you have a strong stomach.)  While you're at it, Google the Wichita Massacre. 

Here's another example which might be closer to home for you, Mo.  There was a case last year, I think of some Asian man who went crazy on a bus in Canada.  He repeatedly stabbed the young man sitting next to him, then chopped off his.  Everyone ran off the bus except for the killer.  The police came, and the killer was still inside, dangling the severed head of his victim for all to see.  If some those passengers were armed, that young man might have had a fighting chance to live. 

Yes, I heard that story.

[The One and Only Mo]

U guys keep guns.


Gun are bad, mmkay?

Mo, a Jew MUST have a gun, it is a MUST.

I don't think so. I believe Hashem protects his children and if we get killed because we are Jewish, then it's a tremendous zechus.

I'm not saying security isn't important or anything, but an average Jew doesn't need a gun compared to someone like Chaim or Rav Kahane.

If G-d did not want people to own guns there would be no guns to own....G-d gave man everything they need to survive in this world... Is up to man to use the things at their disposal in a responsible way.... Yes in the end G-d will protect his chosen people but why does the end have to come for some at the hands of some filthy animal.... I am sure G-d would far rather see a G-d fearing Jew walking the earth rather then some animal that was out to do evil things ....As in most cases the Rav was on the money.  Like the old adage says... G-d helps them that help themselves!

Yeah but then EVERYBODY will have a gun and crazy things will happen.

I don't understand.  Why do 'crazy things' happen just from having a gun?

Btw, you ever been on a settlement?  People are walking around strapped with guns including soldiers regularly.  Even in general Israeli society, soldiers who are enlisted have to carry their guns around.  So you will cross the street and have soldiers randomly walking around with guns strapped to their backs.  Or on the bus, plenty of soldiers riding the bus with heavy weapons.  "Crazy things" don't seem to happen.   It just seems foreign in american (especially northeast and ny and urban/suburban areas) society and what you're used to seeing.    I was also shocked to see this the first time, but the shock subsides quickly.

Some Jews are terrible and deserve to be killed anyways.

But we are speaking here about members of the forum, not traitors and evil people.  You said generally that good Jews should not have guns.  I don't understand this.

Peace comes easier by NOT owning weapons. 

How so?   The enemy has weapons and the criminals have weapons.  So how does it help for potential victims to be defenseless?  That only encourages further crimes to be committed by those armed criminals who see vulnerability and act on it.

No attacks, no need for protection. Obviously not realistic. But I think pepper spray is better.

Exactly, it's not realistic.  That's why a gun is needed.  For self-defense.  Because muggers exist, thugs exist, criminals exist... etc.   They don't just target dangerous and "crazy" Jews like Chaim.  Actually, they target the defenseless even more than they will dare target a "crazy" Jew like Chaim.

The reason these evil people have guns is because guns exist. Once guns exist, bad people obtain them, and then the good people must obtain them just to remain in the balance of power and it's a vicious spiral. Remember the world before nuclear weapons and WMDs even existed? My point wasn't necessarily anti-owning a gun, more just outright frustration about the increase in violence that our society has faced since the early 1900s. 

[The One and Only Mo]

If every person buys a gun, we will all have guns, and the power will be canceled out. My suggestion? A mega-laser 

[IsraeliGovtAreKapos]

Mo, let's say an armed burglar comes into your house and you don't know what he wants to do to you, would you wait for the army/police to save you and your family?

See. That's the problem. The armed burglar has a gun. Shouldn't be allowed in the first place.

Let's say the burglar doesn't have a gun. He's armed with a knife or a baseball baton or whatever. What will you do then? there is a seconds difference between life and death, the police is a lot of minutes away.

The military and the police own guns. It's very easy to steal them or get them illegaly like they do in Israel. We have strict gun laws in Israel and yet quarter of the popularion is armed illegaly. You can't get rid of guns (what's the problem with guns?? are you so emotionally afraid?? what's the difference between them and a knife?). What then?

You can't blame cars for accidents, you can't blame pens for bad spelling - you can only blame the people because people kill, not guns.

[IsraeliGovtAreKapos]

If every person buys a gun, we will all have guns, and the power will be canceled out. My suggestion? A mega-laser 

Yes, you really wanna fight with a guy with a gun with a high rate of getting killed. Get real.

[mord]

If you look here muzzies,nazis, and communists as well as soros all have connections





http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php/topic,48763.0.html

[Ulli]

Mo, let's say an armed burglar comes into your house and you don't know what he wants to do to you, would you wait for the army/police to save you and your family?

See. That's the problem. The armed burglar has a gun. Shouldn't be allowed in the first place.

Mo, Muslims and Nazis don't care about the law of the land. Beside from this Ron is right. In my country they carry mostly knifes or baseball bats.

[Ithaca-37]

"Yeah but then EVERYBODY will have a gun and crazy things will happen. Some Jews are terrible and deserve to be killed anyways. Peace comes easier by NOT owning weapons. No attacks, no need for protection ....."

Sadly, this is not the first time that I've read this kind of utterly ridiculous dreaming on this site.  It's beyond comprehension how anybody can believe that vulnerability is a positive, whether at the personal level or in the realm of national defense.

Look no further than Chicago (Obama's hometown) if you want to see the folly of gun control:  Chicago has some of the strictest gun control laws in the nation, and it has a murder rate roughly equivalent to a small nation during a civil war.  Look no further than the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina to see how the government fails to enforce civility.

That's at the personal level.  As for a national level, let me alarm some dreamers with the truth about the Second Amendment:  It's the only thing that puts teeth in the other amendments.  It's not there for hunting, nor even to protect from street criminals, but it's there as a last resort to (gasp) force the rule of law on the political class if all else fails.

Somebody on this board referred to this blind faith in weakness as a 'Cossack mentality'.  Whatever, it's how entire nations volunteer for slavery to the state.  It's the kind of thinking that allows people to walk obediently into gas chambers.

If you want a profound quote, try this one, about the passage of a sweeping gun control law in Europe a few years ago:  "From this moment forward, our streets will be safer, our police work more efficient ......"  Adolf Hitler, German Chancellor

37

[christians4jews]

This shows that nazis are anti white.

They bang on about hitler, but hitler was also anti white, killing 6 million white jews, 20 million white russions and millions of white UK and US men..oh and theres serbia.

These guys will burn in hell for there self hatred towards their race.

Frauds...

[Spiraling Leopard]

I thought Switserland didn't get attacked during ww2 because that's where all the elitists have their bankaccounts...

[MassuhDGoodName]

Re:  "I thought Switserland didn't get attacked during ww2 because that's where all the elitists have their bankaccounts... "

In addition to Switzerland having an armed citizen army and providing secret bank accounts, there are other reasons she was not invaded during WWII:

- Switzerland is at too high an altitude to enable an easy invasion (no longer true today in the age of jet engines which were not in use during WWII, but definitely true in the age of propeller airplanes).

- Switzerland has long remained officially "neutral" during world conflicts, and this is very important when combatants need a base for Red Cross activities, diplomatic contacts between nations which severed diplomatic relations, etc.... (still true today)

- In addition, neutral Switzerland's renowned "secret" banking industry has long been valuable for nations and leaders seeking to safely "stash" away large amounts of funds from their national treasuries as well as when they wish to conceal their personal assets. (no longer as true today)

Remarkable FACT:  Switzerland long ago tunneled out nuclear proof "cities" inside her Alpine Mountains, and fully stocked them with all necessary provisions, so that the entire Swiss population and Swiss military can be kept alive underground in comfort with food, hospital services, and with water and electric power, ready to emerge unscathed after an international conflagration and continue their civilization.  Even bicycles have been stocked in these shelters for the citizenry to use for transportation should there be no petrol fuel.

To my knowledge Switzerland is the only country in the world which has had the foresight and will to protect its entire citizenry in the event of disaster.

Maybe Israel could conduct a "government exchange program" with Switzerland for six months?

NO!

Forget that.

No way the intelligent Swiss would allow incompetent fools to govern them; not even for six months!

[AsheDina]

Switzerland has always been a safe place.  I know a person that lives there and he loves it.  May be the only safe place for Jews outside of where I live : )

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The reason these evil people have guns is because guns exist.

Yeah, but you can't turn back the clock because they already do exist.

Once guns exist, bad people obtain them, and then the good people must obtain them just to remain in the balance of power and it's a vicious spiral. Remember the world before nuclear weapons and WMDs even existed? My point wasn't necessarily anti-owning a gun, more just outright frustration about the increase in violence that our society has faced since the early 1900s. 

If it wasn't guns, criminals would be attacking and robbing with swords and knives instead.   And it would be

Every Jew a Kogarasamaru

For every Jew, the Kenjutsu

Every Ivri, a Kodachi


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tant%C5%8D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenjutsu
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodachi


The ancient Jews were warriors, and Jews have always had to protect themselves.  Somewhere in the Talmud there is a machloketh over whether a man's sword is considered a component of his garment for the sake of discussion about carrying on Shabbath.   I believe this reflects the commonality of the armed Jewish male.

[MassuhDGoodName]

Every Yid should carry a firearm at all times and know how to use it.

I would like to see Judaism embrace a major tenet of the Sikh faith:

Sikh men are commanded to always wear a sword and be ready at any moment to draw it in defense of their faith.

More modernized Sikhs living in the West often can still be observed to wear some type of sword, or knife, even a very tiny one like on a charm bracelet, as a symbolic gesture of obeisance to the rules demanded of all Sikhs.

(I've always liked the Sikh people - their faith was born in the midst of Muslim persecutions in India which were carried out by the Afghan Muslim invaders, and their founders suffered martyrdom at the hands of the Muzzies rather than renounce their faith, which is a unique blend of monotheistic elements drawn from the religions of India.
When you see a man wearing a turban who has a long beard, and you're worried that he might be a muzzie, look and see if he's wearing an iron bracelet ring around one wrist.
If so, then he's a Sikh, and Sikhs hate Muzzies as much as we do.)

[JTFenthusiast2]

Gun Control quotes:

”The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose.”
- James Earl Jones

"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars.”
- Unknown

"To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them.”
- George Mason

"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass.”
- Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto

"No law ever prevented a crime.”
- Anonymous

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity.”
- Sigmund Freud

"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a slave"
- Unknown

"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.”
- Wayne LaPierre

"When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away.”
- Phillip Van Cleave

Nice quotes, Ron