judaism views on peace treaties

[Dr. Dan]

We know that it is a sin to give a piece of Israeli conquered land for peace even if it is genuine.

What if it was not land but just peace and cooperation? What if it was something like today's Jordan (which is technically biblical Israel) and Israel had not conquered any land nor was there an Exchange for land in a deal...just peace?  Are we permitted to do such things?
If Israel controlled territory which isn't biblical Israel, are they allowed to do land for peace and exchanging populations?

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

We know that it is a sin to give a piece of Israeli conquered land for peace even if it is genuine.

What if it was not land but just peace and cooperation? What if it was something like today's Jordan (which is technically biblical Israel) and Israel had not conquered any land nor was there an Exchange for land in a deal...just peace?  Are we permitted to do such things?
If Israel controlled territory which isn't biblical Israel, are they allowed to do land for peace and exchanging populations?

 Not sure about all the questions perhaps I will try to give (at least my opinion) on  a few.
-I believe peace and cooperation is not a sin. In fact when the other party is genuine and its a win-win situation we can and should cooperate, BUT in these situations it should definitly be in the interests of the Jewish people and for the sanctification of G-D's name (as with everything else).
- i believe that Solomon did make treaties, cooperated and made trade with many different nations. Also about land, it is not 100% clear but he did give to a ruler some independence in exchange of certain goods to be used for the Temple. Its in the "Land for Peace" shiur by Rav Bar-Hayim- If you want and can't find it, let me know I'll link it.

[edu]

Quote from Dr. Dan

What if it was not land but just peace and cooperation? What if it was something like today's Jordan (which is technically biblical Israel) and Israel had not conquered any land nor was there an Exchange for land in a deal...just peace?  Are we permitted to do such things?

In the last year of Moshe's life, the nation of Israel conquered the territory which would later become the tribal portion of Reuven, Gad, and half of Menashe.
When it sounded like the tribes of Reuven and Gad were suggesting, that we be content with the part of Israel we captured and do no more to get all the territory that we are supposed to get, Moshe accused those tribes of committing a crime similar to the crime of the spies. See Bamidbar/Numbers chapter 32 for details.
Moshe was upset with the attitude of the tribes of Reuven and Gad, even though they were not giving up on anything they already conquered and even though the plan would have "bought short term peace" with the 7 nations of Canaan, who were temporarily too frightened to start up with the nation of Israel.
In the long run, Moshe knew that leaving the 7 nations of Canaan in any part of Israel would ultimately lead to the security problems mentioned in Bamidbar/Numbers 33 verses 55 and 56.
And in case, it was against G-d's will to leave those Gentiles that deny the truth of Torah in the land of Biblical Israel.

[Dr. Dan]

Quote from Dr. DanIn the last year of Moshe's life, the nation of Israel conquered the territory which would later become the tribal portion of Reuven, Gad, and half of Menashe.
When it sounded like the tribes of Reuven and Gad were suggesting, that we be content with the part of Israel we captured and do no more to get all the territory that we are supposed to get, Moshe accused those tribes of committing a crime similar to the crime of the spies. See Bamidbar/Numbers chapter 32 for details.
Moshe was upset with the attitude of the tribes of Reuven and Gad, even though they were not giving up on anything they already conquered and even though the plan would have "bought short term peace" with the 7 nations of Canaan, who were temporarily too frightened to start up with the nation of Israel.
In the long run, Moshe knew that leaving the 7 nations of Canaan in any part of Israel would ultimately lead to the security problems mentioned in Bamidbar/Numbers 33 verses 55 and 56.
And in case, it was against G-d's will to leave those Gentiles that deny the truth of Torah in the land of Biblical Israel.

So in the case of land not conquered already but belongs to Israel biblically, not permitted to have a peace pact if it is genuine..not land for peace...obviously.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

So in the case of land not conquered already but belongs to Israel biblically, not permitted to have a peace pact if it is genuine..not land for peace...obviously.

 I would also like to add to your question to those who might know- what is concidered the land of Israel? I know their is a promise of the Nile to the Euphrates, but I also believe that their are levels of conquering Eretz Yisrael. I believe that in the "land of Canaan" or what was known of it before we could not have a peace treaty at all and its a Milhemit Mitzwah to fight for it, but their are and were areas after that where King Dawidh Alaw Hashalom conqured which was a Milhemit Reshut (optionary war) ex- Aram Tzova and Aram Naharaim. I would like to know where exactly is it a Mihemit Mitzwah even without a defensive war (which is also a Milhemit Mitzwah regardless of location- for example in ancient Persia where they wanted to annihilate Jews, but with the help of G-D the enemies of the Jews got killed instead).

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

I think you should move this to the Torah section (I will remove this comment afterwards Bli Neder.)

[Dr. Dan]

Can we have it here in the general discussion because I think this discussion might be helpful for the righteous gentiles to understand.