JTF.ORG Forum
Israel => Save Israel => Topic started by: Johnson Brown on August 27, 2006, 04:48:00 PM
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Why not?
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who said not? thats what actually is being made! only that each apeal to the supreme court by the "Israeli" arabs stops it or disrupts it for some time, making changes to favor the palestinians. israel has a high-teck fence surounding most of its borders, only that the "Yehuda Ve Shomron" erea is still open in some places. by the way, the arabs smuggle terrorists even through guarded gates in the fence. why there are these gates u ask? ah, thats because our "moral" government cant allow arab muslim workers to be unemployed, so they give them jobs in Israel, such as construction and agriculture, to save money instead of hiring high cost Israeli workers. hope that answered your question.
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While you have good intentions you have the wrong idea.
A wall is not a good defense for a nation against a hostile enemy. Remember the French built the Magniot Line after WW1 against the Germans, and it was cut right through.
The Israelis after the 1967 6 day war built a similar line across the Sinai and in 1973 during the Yom Kippur War the Egyptians tore right through it.
The best defense is a good mobile offense. A wall will not stop rockets and missiles as we see in Gaza which is completly walled off. All it does is send the message that the Jews are scared and the rest of the Middle East belongs to the Muslims.
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but the currant most important threat is infiltration of terorrists from the west bank, not actual military vs military fights. the hizballah rockets dont fire constantly, the qassams dont do nearly as much damage, as opposed to terorrists, who constantly try to get in to Israel. israel actually is developing the nautilus system to shoot down small range rockets, however, funny enough, the funding stopped before the war in lebanon.
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the currant most important threat is infiltration of terorrists from the west bank,
Forget the West Bank look at Israel's Muslim population they are the enemy from within.
At the end of the day Israel in order to survive will have to do what Rabbi Kahane said which is too expel them. As for the West Bank it belongs to Israel if you don't accept Biblical reasoning then realize Israel cannot survive with borders 6-10 miles wide they need to expand.
The wall is the idea pushed by Kadima and fake rightists who don't want to see Israel's religious Jewish population grow as they resettle into ancient Biblical lands.
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the currant most important threat is infiltration of terorrists from the west bank,
Forget the West Bank look at Israel's Muslim population they are the enemy from within.
At the end of the day Israel in order to survive will have to do what Rabbi Kahane said which is too expel them. As for the West Bank it belongs to Israel if you don't accept Biblical reasoning then realize Israel cannot survive with borders 6-10 miles wide they need to expand.
The wall is the idea pushed by Kadima and fake rightists who don't want to see Israel's religious Jewish population grow as they resettle into ancient Biblical lands.
listen, im trying to be realistic; until we get the whole Eretz Israel, complete with the west bank, and do the transfer idea (which absolutely isnt gonna happen in the next 20 years or so it will take arabs to be the majority here), i would like to be sure no terrorist infiltrates my country, from the outside. i fully support the kahanist ideas, most of them at least, but you need to be realistic for the near future prospects and the close term dealing with terror here. only a small fracture of self hating Jews dont want to have the transfer done, but the government is simply to weak, leftish and extreme liberal.
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You do realize the wall will further help the self-hating Jews goal of eliminating all settlements and giving back the West Bank?
because our "moral" government cant allow arab muslim workers to be unemployed, so they give them jobs in Israel, such as construction and agriculture, to save money instead of hiring high cost Israeli workers. hope that answered your question.
And as you say yourself the wall will not bring an end to Muslim bombers just merely delay them as self-hating Jews continue to let them in for work.
israel actually is developing the nautilus system to shoot down small range rockets, however, funny enough, the funding stopped before the war in lebanon.
No missile system is perfect and this system is far from even effective so by building a wall now all we do is give back land, which allows Muslims to fire rockets deeper into Israel. The only good I can see in that is hopefully the Jews will wake-up when they realize all of Israel is not safe, but I fear that instead they will pack there bags and just leave.
The wall just makes our ultimate goal more difficult.
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Why not?
It is a waste of taxpayer money. It declares borders which are smaller than the land of Israel and it is an uneffective means to keep terrorists out. Something more effective would be mines and snipers. Something that should be done on Israel's border and also the US border.
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A wall around Israel May sound like a great way to Lock out the bad guys but I can help to think that a Wall around our home would just Lock us in instead...
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A wall around Israel May sound like a great way to Lock out the bad guys but I can help to think that a Wall around our home would just Lock us in instead...
A wall would lock them out, not you. You'd be free to come and go.
But why would you want to go where they are anyway?
A wall is not the answer. It won't stop Katyushas coming in.
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edit sp.
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A wall would be a great idea if we were talking about the Mexican border, but in this case, nothing short of expulsion of the enemy population is the best solution.
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A wall is not the answer. A wall sends an anti-social message to the world and a wall would only keep people on foot and wheels out... Israel has bigger concerns these days if the rockets Hezbollah fired into the north is any indication of where things are headed. As time goes on Rockets will become more advanced and tel aviv and jersualem would be a likely target... there needs to be another answer other than a wall.
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Jewishron said: "A wall sends an anti-social message to the world..."
Are you a liberal? Because I think only a liberal could come up with something like that.
The world wants Israel gone and Jews dead. Who cares what message a self-protecting wall sends them?
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Jewishron said: "A wall sends an anti-social message to the world..."
Are you a liberal? Because I think only a liberal could come up with something like that.
The world wants Israel gone and Jews dead. Who cares what message a self-protecting wall sends them?
yeh! i join you here!
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How about just throw the animals out of the country?
Maybe even kill them all first!
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hehe, wanna hear smolmert laughing? say it to him!
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Jewishron said: "A wall sends an anti-social message to the world..."
Are you a liberal? Because I think only a liberal could come up with something like that.
The world wants Israel gone and Jews dead. Who cares what message a self-protecting wall sends them?
Labels bore me to be honest.
Am I a liberal. Who I am and what I believe is really none of your business. However labeling me or anyone is just posturiing on your part. Am I suppose to defend myself against your accusation that I am a Liberal? Well I am not. I dont owe you or anyone an escuse for my point of view.
Now back to the issue. "I care" that building a wall sends an anti-social message to the world. I care that by building a wall Jews will be cut off from the rest of the world. I dont believe that as you say "the world wants israel gone and jews dead". If that were the case guess what we would all be dead because we, jews, are not in the majority of any census in anywhere in the world except for israel which ironically suffers the most jewish carnage other than anywhere else in the world... Saying the "world" wants all jews dead is paranoid political posturing on your part with the desried effect of support... Dont get me wrong I am well aware of the great mass of anti-semitism out there, the same way there is racism, and bigotry towards others as well.
A very impotant lesson in any diplomatic venture is to anticipate the possible reaction to an action. What would the response and results be from builiding a wall? I dont know myself I am putting the question out there...
And to have a completely Jewsih state rich with nothing but Jewish citizenry, wouldnt that get a little boring after a while? Dont we want to meet people from other cultures and dare I say embrace them as friends? wouldnt a wall prevent this?
Terrorists should be killed on sight, the problem is figuring out who they are folks.
Please dont come back with a repsonse like "just nuke all Arab Countires and be done with it. I am sure someone out there is temepted to write such a suggestion.
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#1. Labels are bad? What's wrong with labels? You mean the "liberal" word? Are you Torah observant? I bet not. I will bet you are not a religious Jew at all... you sound like a self-hating Jew who wants what he wants.
#2. When Israel built the walls in ancient times... were they sending an anti-social message to the world? Is it anti-social to separate from people who want to kill you?
#3. The people you want to be diplomatic to... is that possible? I mean SERIOUSLY. Is that a possibility? Has diplomacy ever helped over there? Ever? Isn't history worth looking at?
#4. Make friends??? Have you ever been there?? Are you on the same planet? This is earth.
#5. Boring if it's all Jews? Are you serious? Are Jews boring or have they ever been boring? That's a pretty lame argument.
Look, I'm not for the wall idea... I think we should handle this with a some military "diplomacy"... like crush them if they attack and take the Biblical land from them every time. This way, we don't need a wall. They won't attack if they know they'll all be dead or - at the least - lose more land.
You don't like to hear that because it's not "NICE". Look, that would actually save the most lives. Instead of wars carrying on for thousands of years, it would be over. You don't think that's important? THINK for yourself... and let go of the "too nice for your own good" mentality. That immoral and stupid ideology kills Jews.
Why no wall? I'd be up for the wall if it was the entire Biblical land of Israel but this wall they are building is a little short on land.
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A wall would lock them out, not you. You'd be free to come and go.
That is what the Bolsheviks like to tell you.
But why would you want to go where they are anyway?
The wall would not surround the true Israel and this land is our land.
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A wall would be a great idea if we were talking about the Mexican border, but in this case, nothing short of expulsion of the enemy population is the best solution.
Nothing but the expulsion of the enemy population here in America would be the best solution also!
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A wall would be a great idea if we were talking about the Mexican border, but in this case, nothing short of expulsion of the enemy population is the best solution.
Nothing but the expulsion of the enemy population here in America would be the best solution also!
I agree. But could you elaborate on exactly who the enemy is?
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I think a wall should be built surrounding all of Israel from the river to the sea. Let's have an all out war with the winner taking all and the loser leaving.
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I think a wall should be built surrounding all of Israel from the river to the sea. Let's have an all out war with the winner taking all and the loser leaving.
O.k war! good idea Daniel! Suit up and get your kids and all the children in your family to suit up and go to war... Lead the way daniel! Hundreds of thousands of innocent Jewish people and most importantly jewish children will be killed because of you idiotic suggestion.
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This is a complex situation. A wall will solve nothing. In the end a truly Jewish state, not just a state of Jews, will solve the problem.
Rabbi Meir Kahane, ZT"L, had concrete answers for the basic problem facing Israel today -- Arabs.
Arabs are ger toshav, resident strangers, under halacha (Jewish law). As a hostile anti-Semitic people their expulsion is a mandatory obligation. Israel never had a substantial indigenous Arab population, much less a "Palestinian" people. We need to shine a light on this fact intellectually rather than with emotional drivel. Also, the ideology (Islam) that motivates the Arabs to behave so ruthlessly must be exposed and vigorously condemned. Once you are aware of the truth disseminate it. The next step would be to act upon the truth. Anybody who knows what Islam is and what the end-game of Muslims is will be repulsed and outraged.
Jewish Ron: Open your eyes and just face reality. Who are the enemies of America? Anyone who is un-patriotic and works to destroy this country. That would include most politicians (sadly), Muslims and extreme leftists. That is a truncated list by the way.
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Yirmiyahu said: "Jewish Ron: Open your eyes and just face reality."
Liberals can't. They are divorced from reality. That's why they are liberal.
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Yirmiyahu said: "Jewish Ron: Open your eyes and just face reality."
Liberals can't. They are divorced from reality. That's why they are liberal.
HaHa I am not a liberal in this regard I just dont agree with you. apparently that is beyond your comprehension... Can two people who are for the most part conservative in their ideas disagree without one being called a liberal or the other term that is thrown around this forum like a frisbee on a beach "self hating jew". It doesnt seem so. If an idea is expressed that doesnt gell with you ideas I am accused of being a liberal or self hating jew... who are you people to determine anything about anyone really? very self rightous of you
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Jewishron wrote: "who are you people to determine anything about anyone?"
You come here and express your views. We read and draw our conclusions.
Seems equitable enough.
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who are you people to determine anything about anyone really? very self rightous of you
Ummm... so how then do you determine anything about anyone (like calling people self-righteous)? Are you self-righteous that you can determine anything but others can't? Can you even spell righteous (see quote)?
Obviously you aren't religious... you have a bunch of cliche things you believe from television that contradict... you insult the people in the forum who condemn evil behaviour... your leanings are completely opposite this group... and you haven't written much other than insults and high-and-mighty, ignorant condemnations.
Why are you posting in here? Are you just trying to stir up trouble? You won't even answer my questions... probably because you can't because your views easily break down under scrutiny or closer examination.
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A wall would be a great idea if we were talking about the Mexican border, but in this case, nothing short of expulsion of the enemy population is the best solution.
Nothing but the expulsion of the enemy population here in America would be the best solution also!
I agree. But could you elaborate on exactly who the enemy is?
The enemy is Islam and don't say "oh i know some nice Muslims in my life"
Yes of course the Muslims will act nicely to you in person NOW. However when they are the majority and feel secure hold onto your head because it will be on the chopping block.
As for your comments on the boredom of an all Jewish State. Do you enjoy being a minority dihimmtude?
Is your family boring because they are all from the same ethic background?
The fact is people naturally gravitate and belong to certain communities. Jews in order to be truly secured need to have a sovereign nation where they are the majority.
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A wall would be a great idea if we were talking about the Mexican border, but in this case, nothing short of expulsion of the enemy population is the best solution.
Nothing but the expulsion of the enemy population here in America would be the best solution also!
I agree. But could you elaborate on exactly who the enemy is?
The enemy is Islam and don't say "oh i know some nice Muslims in my life"
Yes of course the Muslims will act nicely to you in person NOW. However when they are the majority and feel secure hold onto your head because it will be on the chopping block.
As for your comments on the boredom of an all Jewish State. Do you enjoy being a minority dihimmtude?
Is your family boring because they are all from the same ethic background?
The fact is people naturally gravitate and belong to certain communities. Jews in order to be truly secured need to have a sovereign nation where they are the majority.
nothing worng with jews having soveirgnty over their own state. however a little diversity doesnt hurt
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A wall would be a great idea if we were talking about the Mexican border, but in this case, nothing short of expulsion of the enemy population is the best solution.
Nothing but the expulsion of the enemy population here in America would be the best solution also!
I agree. But could you elaborate on exactly who the enemy is?
The enemy is Islam and don't say "oh i know some nice Muslims in my life"
Yes of course the Muslims will act nicely to you in person NOW. However when they are the majority and feel secure hold onto your head because it will be on the chopping block.
As for your comments on the boredom of an all Jewish State. Do you enjoy being a minority dihimmtude?
Is your family boring because they are all from the same ethic background?
The fact is people naturally gravitate and belong to certain communities. Jews in order to be truly secured need to have a sovereign nation where they are the majority.
nothing worng with jews having soveirgnty over their own state. however a little diversity doesnt hurt
Non-Jews can live in Israel as long as they follow the Noachide Laws, which are laws all Jews already have to follow but are not all the laws they follow the non-Jews can keep their identity.
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I think a wall should be built surrounding all of Israel from the river to the sea. Let's have an all out war with the winner taking all and the loser leaving.
O.k war! good idea Daniel! Suit up and get your kids and all the children in your family to suit up and go to war... Lead the way daniel! Hundreds of thousands of innocent Jewish people and most importantly jewish children will be killed because of you idiotic suggestion.
Ron, it is GOING to happen inevitably...WAKE UP!!! The Western World has enjoyed unprecedented peace since the end of WWII. The kind of thinking that you exhibit is the product of a peaceful life. Oh how wonderful it would be if this fantasy of freedom and security could go on forever. It cannot.
All the white babies that have been murdered in the name of abortion (feminist selfishness) have--in effect--signed our death warrant. Islam is claiming Europe and Mexico is doing the same in America. Killing--unfortunately--is human nature. It is human nature to feel closer to those that are similar to yourself. The one-world, borderless, giant love-boat scenario only works on T.V.