JTF.ORG Forum

The Worldwide Crisis of Islam => The Truth About Islam => Topic started by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 07:47:19 PM

Title: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 07:47:19 PM
I respect Judaism and all that..so I'm not going to say anything about your religion/belifs.. I just wanted to sign up on this forum for no apperent reason, just to tell you how sick you people are..and no I am not a Muslim, I am Catholic..
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 07:53:11 PM
Tell us, in what way are we sick?

Insulting without explanation is called defaming, and is most definitely not a good thing to partake in.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 07:56:36 PM
Im sorry if it came across as defaming..but (even if I cannot blame you) This site is totatly Bias. Sure, many(many) suicide bombers are islamic and only wish to bring hatred in a warped perception of "religion", but taking that and calling Islam a World Crisis, I find that sick.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:06:07 PM
To understand why we say that Islam is evil, read some of the quran (the following link eads to a muslim website with the quran sorted by topic for convenience): http://islamicity.com/mosque/TOPICI.HTM

If you want to understand quite why we say it's a world crisis, look at the figures (84 were killed by muslims today): http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:10:46 PM
To understand why we say that Islam is evil, read some of the quran (the following link eads to a muslim website with the quran sorted by topic for convenience): http://islamicity.com/mosque/TOPICI.HTM

If you want to understand quite why we say it's a world crisis, look at the figures (84 were killed by muslims today): http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html

Actually, they were killed by terrorists, and that is horrible...but did the entire Islam community support that, definetly not, they aren't all evil you know...sure, you guys have valid points, and anyone who attacks you directly does not have a right to do so, I just wish people with views such as your could only look at the Islamic world in a different way
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:16:37 PM
Lets look at a few verses from the quran:

Qur’an:9:5   “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

Qur’an 9:71   “O Prophet, strive hard [fighting] against the unbelievers and the Hypocrites, and be harsh with them. Their abode is Hell, an evil refuge indeed.”

Qur’an 8:59   “The infidels should not think that they can get away from us. Prepare against them whatever arms and weaponry you can muster so that you may terrorize them.”

I'll find a few more if you want me to.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: cjd on October 23, 2006, 08:17:51 PM
To understand why we say that Islam is evil, read some of the quran (the following link eads to a muslim website with the quran sorted by topic for convenience): http://islamicity.com/mosque/TOPICI.HTM

If you want to understand quite why we say it's a world crisis, look at the figures (84 were killed by muslims today): http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html

Actually, they were killed by terrorists, and that is horrible...but did the entire Islam community support that, definetly not, they aren't all evil you know...sure, you guys have valid points, and anyone who attacks you directly does not have a right to do so, I just wish people with views such as your could only look at the Islamic world in a different way
Hello mike tell me why Muslim civilians were dancing in the street of New York after 9-11
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:18:25 PM
Lets look at a few verses from the quran:

Qur’an:9:5   “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”

Qur’an 9:71   “O Prophet, strive hard [fighting] against the unbelievers and the Hypocrites, and be harsh with them. Their abode is Hell, an evil refuge indeed.”

Qur’an 8:59   “The infidels should not think that they can get away from us. Prepare against them whatever arms and weaponry you can muster so that you may terrorize them.”

I'll find a few more if you want me to.

As I am not that good on Muslim Religion, may I ask when most of the Qur'an was written, it was a long time ago correct?
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:19:48 PM
Quote
Hello mike tell me why Muslim civilians were dancing in the street of New York after 9-11
Quote

 
Quote
Actually, they were killed by terrorists, and that is horrible...but did the entire Islam community support that, definetly not, they aren't all evil you know...sure, you guys have valid points, and anyone who attacks you directly does not have a right to do so, I just wish people with views such as your could only look at the Islamic world in a different way


There are sick and evil people in this world, and everyone sins...but your are stereotyping :-\
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:20:47 PM
the quran was written a long time ago, about 600AD, however, a key belief in the Islamic religion is that the quran is the final word of Allah, that there is a copy on earth and a copy in heaven and they are one and the same, therefore, either a Muslim believes that these verses apply to him today, or he is not a Muslim.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:27:20 PM
It was a long time ago, about 600AD, however, a key belief of Muslims is that the quran is the final word of G-d, that there is a copy on earth and a copy in heaven and they are one and the same, therefore, either a Muslim believes that these verses apply to him today, or he is not a Muslim.

This is their religious text, written , like you said about 600AD. In that time there were many wars or racial/religious conflicts, as in that time rulers were often religious ones. But besides those verses in the Qur'an, there is much more that ordinary Muslim people follow. Can't you except that just because it was written in a time that is very unlike ours, and by people of different mindset, that it is not completely evil. When  Joshua led the Israelites into Canaan, did they not slaughter and burn every city in their path? It was in the Bible, and in mine they have a little excerpt, stating why this was acceptable, and it argued that the  time difference was a key to understanding this. Just because It is in their scripture means that it is an evil book? I think not
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:31:02 PM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conficts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they belive that this is the final word of Allah.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: kahaneloyalist on October 23, 2006, 08:32:26 PM
To understand why we say that Islam is evil, read some of the quran (the following link eads to a muslim website with the quran sorted by topic for convenience): http://islamicity.com/mosque/TOPICI.HTM

If you want to understand quite why we say it's a world crisis, look at the figures (84 were killed by muslims today): http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html

 I just wish people with views such as your could only look at the Islamic world in a different way

The reason Jews view Muslims as we do is we lived with them and under them for thirteen hundred years of hell on earth. We did not learn about Muslims/Arabs from a seminar at whatever University you've gone too but through first hand experience and what Al Queda does is what Muslims/Arabs have always done and will always do so long as they follow their ideology of death.

Let me put Islam into perspective according to the UN there are currently 30 world conflicts going on, of those thirty 28 involve Muslims.

It was a long time ago, about 600AD, however, a key belief of Muslims is that the quran is the final word of G-d, that there is a copy on earth and a copy in heaven and they are one and the same, therefore, either a Muslim believes that these verses apply to him today, or he is not a Muslim.

This is their religious text, written , like you said about 600AD. In that time there were many wars or racial/religious conflicts, as in that time rulers were often religious ones. But besides those verses in the Qur'an, there is much more that ordinary Muslim people follow. Can't you except that just because it was written in a time that is very unlike ours, and by people of different mindset, that it is not completely evil. When Joshua led the Israelites into Canaan, did they not slaughter and burn every city in their path? It was in the Bible, and in mine they have a little excerpt, stating why this was acceptable, and it argued that the time difference was a key to understanding this. Just because It is in their scripture means that it is an evil book? I think not

The difference is that Muslims have never stopped murdering and destroying everything in their path. Besides which the Torah is from Hashem and eternal it is as applicable today as when it was revealed and yes that includes the rules of war. There are specific times and places to be merciless as the Ramban says: "For it is through the mercy of fools that all justice is lost". For example when a Goyish nation wages war against the Jewish people it is a great Mitzvah to wipe them out that is and will always be true. But in Judaism there is no obligation to forcibly convert all non-believers like in Islam.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:34:22 PM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conficts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they belive that this is the final word of Allah.

I beleive it is commanded in the Ban to kill all survivors, women and children in a city, burn possesions,live stock, everything...
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: cjd on October 23, 2006, 08:34:46 PM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conficts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they belive that this is the final word of Allah.
Exactly and for vast majority of Muslims follow this to the letter!!
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:36:26 PM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conflicts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they believe that this is the final word of Allah.

I believe it is commanded in the Ban to kill all survivors, women and children in a city, burn possesions,live stock, everything...
In a specific case. One particular event, not a general command, that is one of the key differences.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:36:35 PM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conficts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they belive that this is the final word of Allah.
Exactly and for vast majority of Muslims follow this to the letter!!

vast majority?
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:38:11 PM
To understand why we say that Islam is evil, read some of the quran (the following link eads to a muslim website with the quran sorted by topic for convenience): http://islamicity.com/mosque/TOPICI.HTM

If you want to understand quite why we say it's a world crisis, look at the figures (84 were killed by muslims today): http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html

 I just wish people with views such as your could only look at the Islamic world in a different way

The reason Jews view Muslims as we do is we lived with them and under them for thirteen hundred years of hell on earth. We did not learn about Muslims/Arabs from a seminar at whatever University you've gone too but through first hand experience and what Al Queda does is what Muslims/Arabs have always done and will always do so long as they follow their ideology of death.

Let me put Islam into perspective according to the UN there are currently 30 world conflicts going on, of those thirty 28 involve Muslims.

It was a long time ago, about 600AD, however, a key belief of Muslims is that the quran is the final word of G-d, that there is a copy on earth and a copy in heaven and they are one and the same, therefore, either a Muslim believes that these verses apply to him today, or he is not a Muslim.

This is their religious text, written , like you said about 600AD. In that time there were many wars or racial/religious conflicts, as in that time rulers were often religious ones. But besides those verses in the Qur'an, there is much more that ordinary Muslim people follow. Can't you except that just because it was written in a time that is very unlike ours, and by people of different mindset, that it is not completely evil. When Joshua led the Israelites into Canaan, did they not slaughter and burn every city in their path? It was in the Bible, and in mine they have a little excerpt, stating why this was acceptable, and it argued that the time difference was a key to understanding this. Just because It is in their scripture means that it is an evil book? I think not

The difference is that Muslims have never stopped murdering and destroying everything in their path. Besides which the Torah is from Hashem and eternal it is as applicable today as when it was revealed and yes that includes the rules of war. There are specific times and places to be merciless as the Ramban says: "For it is through the mercy of fools that all justice is lost". For example when a Goyish nation wages war against the Jewish people it is a great Mitzvah to wipe them out that is and will always be true. But in Judaism there is no obligation to forcibly convert all non-believers like in Islam.

I am a sophmore in highschool, and before you say anything, I undertsand completely that every single one of you is more knowledegable on this subject that I, But I never came here to debate that, just to simply find out why you stereotype the entire Islamic Culture, Religion, and people..
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:42:28 PM
This site, run by an ex-muslim puts it pretty well: http://www.faithfreedom.org/faq.htm
(note, I do not agree with everything that he says)

Of particular note is this page: http://www.faithfreedom.org/challenge.htm
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: cjd on October 23, 2006, 08:43:28 PM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conficts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they belive that this is the final word of Allah.
Exactly and for vast majority of Muslims follow this to the letter!!

vast majority?
Yes vast majority. Most Muslim people if not actively participating in terrorism have full sympathy for it.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:53:14 PM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conficts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they belive that this is the final word of Allah.
Exactly and for vast majority of Muslims follow this to the letter!!

vast majority?
Yes vast majority. Most Muslim people if not actively participating in terrorism have full sympathy for it.



Sympathetic, in what ways? I believe every side has a sympathy, bias u can call it, towards their own people, even in terrible acts, but that does not mean they support them..most don't even want to be associated with them. Look, this can go on forever, all I was tryign to get at is why can you not be sympathetic to those muslims who have nothing agianst you, those that work to stop terrorism, or for the better of the united states...I see a thread in this forum titled " Muslim on U.S Senate...oh no" or something along those lines..It all comes down to the same question, Why stereotype EVERYSINGLE Muslim...
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:56:48 PM
The organisation "Council on American Islamic relations" is often put forward as condemning terrorist attacks, and being peaceful etc, however, it is bow well known that they are funded by the terrorist organisation "Hamas", ever heard of fifth column tactics, how do you know that all "peaceful" Muslims are not the same?
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 08:57:36 PM
The organisation "Council on American Islamic relations" is often put forward as condemning terrorist attacks, and being peaceful etc, however, it is bow well known that they are funded by the terrorist organisation "Hamas", ever heard of fifth column tactics, how do you know that all "peaceful" Muslims are not the same?

I don't, but neither do you
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 23, 2006, 08:59:03 PM
....if they are following their religion, they are, that is the thing.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 09:01:38 PM
....if they are following their religion, they are, that is the thing.

if they follow their religion they support terrorism? By funding their religion they must be doing so just to fund terrorism? I really can't argue on this point as I am not that familiar with this..but your saying that every muslim organization leads back to terrorism, which Is not true..
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: cjd on October 23, 2006, 09:02:37 PM
Most Muslims that I have come in contact with leave me with the impression that terrorism on the scale of 9-11 was a justifiable act. Even if they don't come right out and say it it comes out in couched phrases such as I don't " really agree with stuff like that but what can you do" .  People of other religious followings were horrified after 9-11 and other major terrorist attacks. Their should be no hemming and hawing about it.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 09:06:15 PM
Most Muslims that I have come in contact with leave me with the impression that terrorism on the scale of 9-11 was a justifiable act. Even if they don't come right out and say it it comes out in couched phrases such as I don't " really agree with stuff like that but what can you do" .  People of other religious followings were horrified after 9-11 and other major terrorist attacks. Their should be no hemming and hawing about it.

So you suspect them because they say things like that? I know many American Christians, and even my Jewish friends, say similiar things..Sure, we can mourn, support those people effected, but theres nothing we can really do about it. If some Muslim believes his G-d wants him to blow himself up, I don't think anyones going to be able to stop him, save killing him (obviously)..
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: kahaneloyalist on October 23, 2006, 09:11:35 PM
Mike, the reason I stereotype every Muslim is, as I said before, the Jews lived under Islamic rule for centuries and it was centuries of unending suffering at the hands of our overlords. Of countless murders and pogroms, did you know that in Yemen there has been a law for the last thirteen hundred years that is enforced to this day that if a Jew dies, any children they leave behind who ae under 13 are forcibly converted to Islam. That is right out of the Koran.

I'll try to put it in perspective for you I hate and stereotype every Nazi, because these people Nazis and Muslims have accepted a ideology that requires them to be evil.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: cjd on October 23, 2006, 09:12:36 PM
Most Muslims that I have come in contact with leave me with the impression that terrorism on the scale of 9-11 was a justifiable act. Even if they don't come right out and say it it comes out in couched phrases such as I don't " really agree with stuff like that but what can you do" .  People of other religious followings were horrified after 9-11 and other major terrorist attacks. Their should be no hemming and hawing about it.

So you suspect them because they say things like that? I know many American Christians, and even my Jewish friends, say similiar things..Sure, we can mourn, support those people effected, but theres nothing we can really do about it. If some Muslim believes his G-d wants him to blow himself up, I don't think anyones going to be able to stop him, save killing him (obviously)..

What kind of religion expects people to blow themselves up along with innocent civilians?
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 09:15:32 PM
Mike, the reason I stereotype every Muslim is, as I said before, the Jews lived under Islamic rule for centuries and it was centuries of unending suffering at the hands of our overlords. Of countless murders and pogroms, did you know that in Yemen there has been a law for the last thirteen hundred years that is enforced to this day that if a Jew dies, any children they leave behind who ae under 13 are forcibly converted to Islam. That is right out of the Koran.

I'll try to put it in perspective for you I hate and stereotype every Nazi, because these people Nazis and Muslims have accepted a ideology that requires them to be evil.


What about those Muslims inside the United States, who live as Americans, side by side with your people, and mine?


But You do not understand how much I can respect your views, even if I am agiasnt them somewhat..and I am really not here to argue I must confess, I am working on a presentaion on the way Judaism and Islam view each other, And I think I have enough from this site, I thank you guys for your discussion, and know that I am not, or will not be bashing or defaming you in my presentation.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 09:18:04 PM
Most Muslims that I have come in contact with leave me with the impression that terrorism on the scale of 9-11 was a justifiable act. Even if they don't come right out and say it it comes out in couched phrases such as I don't " really agree with stuff like that but what can you do" .  People of other religious followings were horrified after 9-11 and other major terrorist attacks. Their should be no hemming and hawing about it.

So you suspect them because they say things like that? I know many American Christians, and even my Jewish friends, say similiar things..Sure, we can mourn, support those people effected, but theres nothing we can really do about it. If some Muslim believes his G-d wants him to blow himself up, I don't think anyones going to be able to stop him, save killing him (obviously)..



What kind of religion expects people to blow themselves up along with innocent civilians?


I don't think the Qur'an, or most Muslim religious communites expect people to explode themselves to prove their faith or kill "non-believers" If they did, I don't think there would be so many Muslims, agian I ask about those living side by side with us in the U.S
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: kahaneloyalist on October 23, 2006, 09:19:01 PM



What about those Muslims inside the United States, who live as Americans, side by side with your people, and mine?


My brother-in-laws father lived with Arabs/Muslims in Iraq and the Jews and Arabs/Muslims lived side by side together for years. When the Iraqis launched their pro-Nazi coup, called the Farhud, it was my brother-in-law's father's neighbor who tried to kill him and his family. They had know each other for years and were, so the Jews though, good friends.

Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 09:21:25 PM



What about those Muslims inside the United States, who live as Americans, side by side with your people, and mine?


My brother-in-laws father lived with Arabs/Muslims in Iraq and the Jews and Arabs/Muslims lived side by side together for years. When the Iraqis launched their pro-Nazi coup, called the Farhud, it was my brother-in-law's father's neighbor who tried to kill him and his family. They had know each other for years and were, so the Jews though, good friends.



In Iraq , although you gave a gave a good example of radicalism at its worst, I don't think that happens within the United States as it happens over there in that hate filled country..
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: cjd on October 23, 2006, 09:26:22 PM
Most Muslims that I have come in contact with leave me with the impression that terrorism on the scale of 9-11 was a justifiable act. Even if they don't come right out and say it it comes out in couched phrases such as I don't " really agree with stuff like that but what can you do" .  People of other religious followings were horrified after 9-11 and other major terrorist attacks. Their should be no hemming and hawing about it.

So you suspect them because they say things like that? I know many American Christians, and even my Jewish friends, say similiar things..Sure, we can mourn, support those people effected, but theres nothing we can really do about it. If some Muslim believes his G-d wants him to blow himself up, I don't think anyones going to be able to stop him, save killing him (obviously)..



What kind of religion expects people to blow themselves up along with innocent civilians?


I don't think the Qur'an, or most Muslim religious communites expect people to explode themselves to prove their faith or kill "non-believers" If they did, I don't think there would be so many Muslims, agian I ask about those living side by side with us in the U.S
Nothing is 100% however as I said most Muslim folks I have dealt with leave me with the impression that whatever evil is done to none Muslims is justified even if they themselves take a more moderate stance on things.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 09:27:54 PM
Most Muslims that I have come in contact with leave me with the impression that terrorism on the scale of 9-11 was a justifiable act. Even if they don't come right out and say it it comes out in couched phrases such as I don't " really agree with stuff like that but what can you do" .  People of other religious followings were horrified after 9-11 and other major terrorist attacks. Their should be no hemming and hawing about it.

So you suspect them because they say things like that? I know many American Christians, and even my Jewish friends, say similiar things..Sure, we can mourn, support those people effected, but theres nothing we can really do about it. If some Muslim believes his G-d wants him to blow himself up, I don't think anyones going to be able to stop him, save killing him (obviously)..



What kind of religion expects people to blow themselves up along with innocent civilians?


I don't think the Qur'an, or most Muslim religious communites expect people to explode themselves to prove their faith or kill "non-believers" If they did, I don't think there would be so many Muslims, agian I ask about those living side by side with us in the U.S
Nothing is 100% however as I said most Muslim folks I have dealt with leave me with the impression that whatever evil is done to none Muslims is justified even if they themselves take a more moderate stance on things.

well then you have an interesting opnion, however I am done here, i wish you all the best and hope that nothing violent ever comes because of your words.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: kahaneloyalist on October 23, 2006, 09:28:48 PM
There are no moderate Muslims there are those who practice Takiya, the Muslims obligation to lie to the infidel to make Muslim world conquest easier, and those who are honest.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mike? on October 23, 2006, 09:30:22 PM
There are no moderate Muslims there are those who practice Takiya, the Muslims obligation to lie to the infidel to make Muslim world conquest easier, and those who are honest.

personally i find that incredibly bias, pathetic, and slightly ignorant, but it doesnt matter...
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: cjd on October 23, 2006, 09:36:52 PM
There are no moderate Muslims there are those who practice Takiya, the Muslims obligation to lie to the infidel to make Muslim world conquest easier, and those who are honest.

personally i find that incredibly bias, pathetic, and slightly ignorant, but it doesnt matter...
Whatever our minds are made up. Its you that seem to be slightly ignorant and should worry about being harmed we know what to watch out for.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: kahaneloyalist on October 23, 2006, 09:47:08 PM
Ignorant? why? By your own admission you know nothing about Islam I actually know what Islam teaches to declare that truth you dont like is ignorant shows a mind which is not ignorant, which you probably are, but a fool who is locked into pc thinking and refuses to be confused with the facts.

But I'll tell you what if you can prove that there are moderate Nazis who dont want to see Jews dead, or relegated to a slave race. I will accept the possibilty of moderate Muslims. Since it is a central tenant of Islam to lie to the infidel i wont accept Muslim claims to peacefullness. So thats your challenge bring actual evidence against someone instead of name calling.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Mishmaat on October 23, 2006, 10:05:26 PM
Mike, how did you find out about JTF? I got your message on MySpace.

Why is Islam a demonic cult? Read the Koran and Hadith (they go hand in glove). Look at an Islamic terrorist in action. Knee-jerk emotional responses are meaningless if you can't back it up with hard facts. Islam is like Nazism. It must be defeated.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: MasterWolf1 on October 24, 2006, 12:41:22 AM
Mike I am Catholic as well and Muslims have massacred a lot of Chrisitans and Catholics on the soul basis that they are not Muslim.  You as a Catholic must face up to reality the fact that you do not follow Sharia law you are concidered the enemy of the Koran.  Mike the Islamic toilet paper Koran calls all Kaffirs (Non Muslims) monkeys and dogs and must be wiped out to full fill the obligation to Allah spit be upon him to have Islam as the supreme. It is a hideous cult Mike. Unless you are Muslim and giving Takiya then I suggest you read the Koran.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Shlomo on October 24, 2006, 12:45:33 AM
personally i find that incredibly bias, pathetic, and slightly ignorant, but it doesnt matter...

There are no Arab "moderates" (Part 1 of 2)
http://jtf.org/israel/israel.arab.moderates.part.one.htm

There are no Arab "moderates" (Part 2 of 2)
http://jtf.org/israel/israel.arab.moderates.part.two.htm
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: oobleck on October 24, 2006, 08:54:51 AM

New to this forum here.  Awesome stuff.   A couple of more things.  Islam doesn't mind what religion you are, as long as it is Islamic.   Or on the verge of converting to Islam, which is what a non-believer technically is.  And then G-d forbid that someone convert *from* Islam.  The worst fires are reserved for them.

And then, I haven't seen this myself, although I've heard this interpretation from A Christian Arab that seems *in the know* about both Islam and Arabia.  But supposedly, all statements and promises are non-binding if made with a non-Muslim.  Or at least that is how some fundamentalists are preaching it.  Can anyone shed any light on this one?

And lastly, from this very site,  the heads of various Islamic entities (especially Abbas for the PLO) keep using the word Salaam, which gets translated to peace here in the US, but which means only ceasing the hostilities.   Presumably to be resumed later.  Even if they used the correct word,  I still wouldn't trust them, but at least the correct idea would have been expressed.

Ger.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: mord on October 24, 2006, 10:20:03 AM
Quote
Or at least that is how some fundamentalists are preaching it.  Can anyone shed any light on this one?
Yes that is true moslems are allowed in fact encouraged considerd a fine trait to lie to infidels
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: kahaneloyalist on October 24, 2006, 10:49:55 AM
oobleck the idea of a muslim being allowed to lie is called Takiya, it means to lie to the infidel to make Muslim world conquest easier. That is what Muslims are practicing when they talk about peace
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Na Na on October 24, 2006, 11:48:05 AM
Nowhere in the bible does it give a general command to kill all non-believers, the conficts in the bible are always specific cases, in the quran on the other hand, the orders are general rather than specific, they are general commands to kill or convert all non-believers. And they belive that this is the final word of Allah.

well maybe it is...

that religion has as much "chance" of being true as any other...
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Rhuan on October 24, 2006, 04:54:16 PM
Read the quran, and you will realise why it isn't....

Or if you can't be bothered, here you go:

The person who wrote the quran evidently thought that the christian trinity = father mother and son, rather than father son and holy spirit:

5:116
Quote
And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah ? he saith: Be glorified! It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then Thou knewest it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy Mind. Lo! Thou, only Thou, art the Knower of Things Hidden ?

The author of the quran also thought that the Jews acknowledge Ezra as the son of God:

9:30
Quote
And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they!

The quran's author also thought that mary the mother of Jesus was the sister of Aaron:
19:27-28
Quote
Then she brought him to her own folk, carrying him. They said: O Mary! Thou hast come with an amazing thing. O sister of Aaron! Thy father was not a wicked man nor was thy mother a harlot.
(nice confusion of mary and miriam there...

I'll find more if you want.
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Na Na on November 02, 2006, 07:01:16 PM
Read the quran, and you will realise why it isn't....

Or if you can't be bothered, here you go:

The person who wrote the quran evidently thought that the christian trinity = father mother and son, rather than father son and holy spirit:

5:116
Quote
And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah ? he saith: Be glorified! It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then Thou knewest it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy Mind. Lo! Thou, only Thou, art the Knower of Things Hidden ?

The author of the quran also thought that the Jews acknowledge Ezra as the son of G-d:

9:30
Quote
And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they!

The quran's author also thought that mary the mother of Jesus was the sister of Aaron:
19:27-28
Quote
Then she brought him to her own folk, carrying him. They said: O Mary! Thou hast come with an amazing thing. O sister of Aaron! Thy father was not a wicked man nor was thy mother a harlot.
(nice confusion of mary and miriam there...

I'll find more if you want.

This argument relies solely on your assumption that Christianity is correct, and none of these disprove Islam. Try harder... I have picked a hole in your argument... you like that don't you!
Title: Re: Wow...
Post by: Raptorman on November 03, 2006, 10:44:15 PM
Im sorry if it came across as defaming..but (even if I cannot blame you) This site is totatly Bias. Sure, many(many) suicide bombers are islamic and only wish to bring hatred in a warped perception of "religion", but taking that and calling Islam a World Crisis, I find that sick.

All suicide bombers are Islamic.

Fixed it for you.