JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: ChabadKahanist on June 02, 2017, 06:52:24 AM
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http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/jared-ivanka-an-embarrassment-to-judaism/?fb_action_ids=786654554846283&fb_action_types=og.comments
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The embarrassment is keep attacking Jared and Ivanka over NOTHING!
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The embarrassment is keep attacking Jared and Ivanka over NOTHING!
They brought upon themselves by claiming to be "orthodox" Had they not made such a claim & said they were anything else it would not be an issue.
Orthodox means following halacha what they did is not within halacha.
If Jared & Ivanka ate a ham & cheese sandwich on TV It would be a big deal also same thing here!!!!
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The embarrassment is keep attacking Jared and Ivanka over NOTHING!
You are oversensitive about this. Did something strike a nerve?
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The embarrassment is keep attacking Jared and Ivanka over NOTHING!
Instead of getting triggered, you should try reading the article instead. It is measured and very well reasoned. Maybe you'll learn something new.
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Instead of getting triggered, you should try reading the article instead. It is measured and very well reasoned. Maybe you'll learn something new.
Getting triggered. :::D Oh no. :::D Not you too Kahane -Was Right- BT.
Maybe, Joe is just giving his opinion.
From the article:
Roy Disney once said “When your values are clear to you, making decisions becomes easier.” It is an axiom that the Kushners would do well to learn so that they don’t continue to be an embarrassment to those who try to live their Jewish values truthfully every day.
Why would people who try to live their Jewish values truthfully everyday care about the Kushner's Jewish values. Aren't people responsible only for their own actions?
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Getting triggered. :::D Oh no. :::D Not you too Kahane -Was Right- BT.
Maybe, Joe is just giving his opinion.
From the article:
Roy Disney once said “When your values are clear to you, making decisions becomes easier.” It is an axiom that the Kushners would do well to learn so that they don’t continue to be an embarrassment to those who try to live their Jewish values truthfully every day.
Why would people who try to live their Jewish values truthfully everyday care about the Kushner's Jewish values. Aren't people responsible only for their own actions?
Did you read the rest of the article?
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Getting triggered. :::D Oh no. :::D Not you too Kahane -Was Right- BT.
Maybe, Joe is just giving his opinion.
His "opinion" was clearly very emotional and disconnected from the content of the article.
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This couple chooses to give the world the impression that "Orthodox Judaism" permits everything. But that isn't true. That is a disgraceful portrayal of the religion, wouldnt ya say? I think it is.
It's the rest of us peons who deal with the consequences of that.
They should just not claim to be practicing orthodox if they aren't.
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Did you read the rest of the article?
Yes. I did. Do the Kushners trumpet and wear their Orthodox Judaism as a badge of honor?
I don't think that most people even know that they practice Orthodox Judaism.
I try not judge other people's relationship with G-d. Sometime the people who do 'practice' their religion strictly are not the best people to portray it anyway. I can tell you that from observing my own family and how they practice their Christian faith.
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Yes. I did. Do the Kushners trumpet and wear their Orthodox Judaism as a badge of honor?
I don't think that most people even know that they practice Orthodox Judaism.
This is rich.
They put out articles saying mystery Rabbi permitted them to fly on plane and that they are Orthodox. How is it not known?
The Trump supporter's first response in social media to the claim that Trump Admin is insensitive to antisemitism is "Donald's daughter is an orthodox Jew and he has Jewish grandchildren, he can't possibly hate Jews."
Are you really claiming people don't know?
I try not judge other people's relationship with G-d. Sometime the people who do 'practice' their religion strictly are not the best people to portray it anyway. I can tell you that from observing my own family and how they practice their Christian faith.
This is a Jewish thing and it's really not the point. There are plenty of Jewish congressman or officials who do not observe the faith strictly and no one badgers them on it. Because they don't claim to be something they are not.
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You are oversensitive about this. Did something strike a nerve?
Maybe because he himself is a mechalel shabbos?
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This thread is ridiculous. It's like old lady gossip. Watching paint dry is more exciting.
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This thread is ridiculous. It's like old lady gossip. Watching paint dry is more exciting.
And yet here you are commenting. It must be exciting to you in some way.
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And yet here you are commenting. It must be exciting to you in some way.
Oh yeah, it's very exciting. It's like wow, man!
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This is rich.
They put out articles saying mystery Rabbi permitted them to fly on plane and that they are Orthodox. How is it not known?
The Trump supporter's first response in social media to the claim that Trump Admin is insensitive to antisemitism is "Donald's daughter is an orthodox Jew and he has Jewish grandchildren, he can't possibly hate Jews."
Are you really claiming people don't know?
This is a Jewish thing and it's really not the point. There are plenty of Jewish congressman or officials who do not observe the faith strictly and no one badgers them on it. Because they don't claim to be something they are not.
Ivanka [on becoming an Orthodox Jew]: “I always shied away from it being a public conversation because it’s such a personal thing... We’re pretty observant, more than some, less than others. I just feel like it’s such an intimate thing for us... It’s been such a great life decision for me. I am very modern, but I’m also a very traditional person, and I think that’s an interesting juxtaposition in how I was raised as well. I really find that with Judaism, it creates an amazing blueprint for family connectivity.”
http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Ivanka-Trump-and-Shabbat-Pure-family-time-472181
Doesn't sound to me like she is pretending to be something that she is not.
She doesn't purport to follow all strictures of Orthodox Judaism here.
She's Jewish. Why shouldn't it be noted by the administration.
But I really don't care either way. We are just going around in circles.
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the author of this article makes valid point. Except, like most of us, we don't know the full picture either. Not saying to give the benefit of the doubt to Jared and Ivanka. It looks much more wrong than right and if it is true that a rabbi said they could travel on shabbat, why and how is that possible?
Whether Jared broke rules or not, the deal he made with the Saudis was dumb and stupid and terrible and lacks common sense for a person if he were a good Jew would know better to do the right thing.
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And yet here you are commenting. It must be exciting to you in some way.
Hard to argue with this.
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By Yair Davidy:
Q:
Why is J. Kushner considered an Orthodox Jew (by news outlets), when he does not wear a hat (even a fedora) and travels on the Sabbath?
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Answer by Yair Davidiy:
The head-covering is not really mandatory though we now usually take it to be.
Concerning Shabat:
Presumably he is driven by others (again we assume by a non-Jew) and does not drive himself.
If his presence is required for a decision or advice on a matter that has the slightest chance of involving the saving of life then there is no problem.
All reports of Jared and Ivanka traveling on Shabat were concerned with matters of state and not of pleasure.
The presence of Ivanka, alongside Jared, due to the circumstances might also have been of importance.
So too, a doctor can allow himself to be driven to hospital or to drive himself when there is no other option.
In fact if he does not do so he would be considered a transgressor.
A more technical answer of interest is provided by Daniel Freedman:
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-J-Kushner-considered-an-Orthodox-Jew-by-news-outlets-when-he-does-not-wear-a-hat-even-a-fedora-and-travels-on-the-Sabbath
(http://i2.cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/170402133713-02-ivanka-trump-jared-kushner-02-2017-exlarge-169.jpg)
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Jared is, Ivanka's not a Jew, and the real embarrassment is the out pour of support for them despite this.
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The Heavenly Beth Din follows the ruling of the Earthly Beth Din, even if it errs!
Did it err in this conversion?
Despite her lapses, Ivanka is still darn more observant than many a Russian Goya converted by the Israeli Beth Din!
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Jared is, Ivanka's not a Jew, and the real embarrassment is the out pour of support for them despite this.
According to the RCA Ivanka had a valid conversion & the Israeli Chief Rabbinate concurs.
This only enforces my conviction that stricter standards are needed particularly for female converts & Ivanka's mode of dress & desecration of shabbos is living proof of that!!!
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Drop this issue already! This IS FAKE NEWS!
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Drop this issue already! This IS FAKE NEWS!
The democrats use "fake news" to mean what they disagree with and Trump does too, but that's not the definition.
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Yes. I did. Do the Kushners trumpet and wear their Orthodox Judaism as a badge of honor?
I don't think that most people even know that they practice Orthodox Judaism.
I try not judge other people's relationship with G-d. Sometime the people who do 'practice' their religion strictly are not the best people to portray it anyway. I can tell you that from observing my own family and how they practice their Christian faith.
Modesty and covering one's head is something people of a traditional persuasion do, and it would be good to consider this older universal wisdom. Here are women of the Russian Starovery, or, the ''Old Believers'', for example;
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e6/Te_Deum_Elizarovo_Guslitsa_8484.jpg
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Drop this issue already! This IS FAKE NEWS!
Dang broham, you hella triggered
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What happened to the proposal of the Palestinian state, didn't it fail? God will have his own timing, man really is not in control.
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What happened to the proposal of the Palestinian state, didn't it fail? God will have his own timing, man really is not in control.
It passed in the UN. It doesn't mean much, the UN makes many paper tigers against Israel. Man is in control of whether he'll follow Hashem and his laws or his own, and force Hashem to keep sending punishments.