JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Trumpeldor on January 12, 2008, 07:58:19 PM
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In a previous broadcast, Chaim stated that they were. This is factually inaccurate. Like many fascist groups at the time, they were socialists who despite sharing many communist beliefs, were vehemently opposed to communists.
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They were high taxing socialists
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They had a lot of similarities though. They were called the National Socialists after all. Another system based on Social Darwinism and Godlessness.
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could you put the link up here for me to either hear or read about this. I thought they were nazis too; but a socialist is just as bad in some ways and in others they are worse, because they hide behind fake smiles and kisses.
Digital Photo
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could you put the link up here for me to either hear or read about this. I thought they were nazis too; but a socialist is just as bad in some ways and in others they are worse, because they hide behind fake smiles and kisses.
Digital Photo
Certainly some communists could and did sympathize with the Nazis.
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;)
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In a previous broadcast, Chaim stated that they were. This is factually inaccurate. Like many fascist groups at the time, they were socialists who despite sharing many communist beliefs, were vehemently opposed to communists.
Actually, you are right and wrong in the same breath Trumpeldor. Nazism differs from Fascism and also Communism but Nazism is more closely linked to Communism than Fascism. For example, if one compares Nazi Germany to Stalin's Soviet "Socialist" Republic one will find the bare minimum of difference. In all actuality the only differance between Hitler's Nazism and Stalin's form of Communism is the pagan/gnostic theology injected into Nazism. Aside from that Communism is a mirror image to Nazism.
If you research Hitler's history you will find that he was a member of the German Communist Party until they threw him out for which is why he had so much contempt for them, aside from Communism being a "Jewish invention" like Christianity, in his views. Further you will also find that he literally took many key communist platforms and adapted them to the Nazi Party and too within "Mein Kempf".
I can write forever on this subject but I feel it akin to beating a dead horse. If one wishes to pose questions or ask for good book titles I'll be glad to comply.
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Sure, who built Communism, funded the building of Soviet Russia and arranged for Lenin to come to power? Who financed and advanced Hitler and Nazi Germany? Who today, keeps Castro in power as well built China, a second world nation into a "super power"?
Nazism, like Communism was an internatioanlist ideology where it is based on subversion, power and expansion while Fascism, like Italy, was for the most part Socialist-Communistic type principles but solely confined within the borders of Italy. Fascism is a Nationally based egalitarian ideology while the others are not. There was nothing "national" about the "National Socialist" Party in all actuality. The minute they came to power they expanded internationally... ;)
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ROEHM OF THE BROWNSHIRTS WAS A SOCIALIST AND A HOMO
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May I ask your opinions on Fascist Leader Mussolini?
Did he protect or persecuted the Jews from Italy??
Thanks.
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May I ask your opinions on Fascist Leader Mussolini?
Did he protect or persecuted the Jews from Italy??
Thanks.
i DON'NT THINK HE WENT OUT OF HIS WAY TO PERSECUTE THEM PLUS THE iTALIAN PEOPLE WOULD'NT COOPERATE WITH PERSECUTING THE JEWS
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May I ask your opinions on Fascist Leader Mussolini?
Did he protect or persecuted the Jews from Italy??
Thanks.
i DON'NT THINK HE WENT OUT OF HIS WAY TO PERSECUTE THEM PLUS THE iTALIAN PEOPLE WOULD'NT COOPERATE WITH PERSECUTING THE JEWS
But the Germans would? Both were Roman!
Germans were Roman :o
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There certainly was something "National" about the Nazis! They believed their distinct nation harbored the best humans in the world and were willing to take on the entire world to prove their rabid Nationalism. Once again in conflict with Communist "ethics" 8;)
What you are speaking of is Racialism not "Nationalism". If it were Nationalism like American Patriotism, one's nation comes first and does not have any desire to expand its borders. American Nationalists/Patriots do not want to invade, conquer and annex Canada. I hope this clearifies the fact that there was no "Nationalism" in the "National Socialism". Racialism yes as per their quest towards Pan-Germania but nationalism not at all... none. Like all other Leftist political and social platforms, all are based on lies, propaganda and the quest for power... :)
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We can agree for sure on your last statement. I wish you'd come conquer Canada but I'll place my reservations on Mexico...lol At least then I will be able to listen to Michael Savage, buy a bottle of scotch at the corner store, buy a gun for my protection without getting on some sort of fascist list....but then again...we couldn't have cuban cigars. How about conquering Cuba instead of Mexico? I'd take a Coheba over a bottle of Tequilla...lol ;)
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Done! WAKEY...WAKEY.... That's one question I always found applicable. Granted there is no oil in Cuba but Ghorge Bush says they are "spreading democracy" in Iraq....should they not start off, for practice, a few miles off the shores of Florida? :-\
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We can agree for sure on your last statement. I wish you'd come conquer Canada but I'll place my reservations on Mexico...lol At least then I will be able to listen to Michael Savage, buy a bottle of scotch at the corner store, buy a gun for my protection without getting on some sort of fascist list....but then again...we couldn't have cuban cigars. How about conquering Cuba instead of Mexico? I'd take a Coheba over a bottle of Tequilla...lol ;)
Ever tried Cohiba Siglo II?
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Done! WAKEY...WAKEY.... That's one question I always found applicable. Granted there is no oil in Cuba but Ghorge Bush says they are "spreading democracy" in Iraq....should they not start off, for practice, a few miles off the shores of Florida? :-\
After the Bay of Pigs blunder and the humiliation the U.S. experienced in L America as a consequence we've been pretty much hands off with Cuba, not to mention the rest of the region that has become increasingly anti-American since.
It's time to do something about Chavez.
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They had a lot of similarities though. They were called the National Socialists after all. Another system based on Social Darwinism and Godlessness.
Actually Social Darwinism (Natural Selection, survival of the fittest) is completely opposite to what Socialism is. I don't agree with Socialism either though.
The Soviet Union was no paradise either compared to Nazi Germany. How many Jews do you think were killed in the Soviet Union? I dislike Communists as much as I do Nazis.
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I think it is time for America to liberate Cuba... Yes I've tried Cohiba Siglo II but I prefer VI. The Sublime and Piramide are nice but most often I usually get the Churchill Esplendidos or the Double Corona... Hurry up and liberate Cuba.
The way I see it, Castro and the entirety of Cuba owes America greatly since Castro "Flushed the toilets of Cuba" in 1988 sending hordes of criminals, sexual degenerates, the sick to the shores of Florida..... Albeit there were some righteous Cuban Political "traitors": aka Nationalists...
When I was living in Philly, I used to have my mother send me down boxes of Cohiba's which I'd sell through my lawyer to other lawyers, politicians etc. It was almost akin to the bootlegging days of the '30's..lol... O0
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I think it is time for America to liberate Cuba... Yes I've tried Cohiba Siglo II but I prefer VI. The Sublime and Piramide are nice but most often I usually get the Churchill Esplendidos or the Double Corona... Hurry up and liberate Cuba.
The way I see it, Castro and the entirety of Cuba owes America greatly since Castro "Flushed the toilets of Cuba" in 1988 sending hordes of criminals, sexual degenerates, the sick to the shores of Florida..... Albeit there were some righteous Cuban Political "traitors": aka Nationalists...
When I was living in Philly, I used to have my mother send me down boxes of Cohiba's which I'd sell through my lawyer to other lawyers, politicians etc. It was almost akin to the bootlegging days of the '30's..lol... O0
Miami is like a third world toilet, good thing I live in Northwest Florida.
Didn't a few people try coups on Cuba and a few other Caribbean islands? Don Black (founder of StørmFrønt) had plans in the 80's to try and take over Dominica for a white nationalist homeland, apparently it was stopped before it ever started by the fed's. More information here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Red_Dog
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I think it is time for America to liberate Cuba... Yes I've tried Cohiba Siglo II but I prefer VI. The Sublime and Piramide are nice but most often I usually get the Churchill Esplendidos or the Double Corona... Hurry up and liberate Cuba.
The way I see it, Castro and the entirety of Cuba owes America greatly since Castro "Flushed the toilets of Cuba" in 1988 sending hordes of criminals, sexual degenerates, the sick to the shores of Florida..... Albeit there were some righteous Cuban Political "traitors": aka Nationalists...
When I was living in Philly, I used to have my mother send me down boxes of Cohiba's which I'd sell through my lawyer to other lawyers, politicians etc. It was almost akin to the bootlegging days of the '30's..lol... O0
I tried a Trinidad cigar this New Year.
Didn't know what was happening, man.
I will check the Siglo VI.
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Good choice Amb O0 I think the best for the bucks are the Esplendidos ;) You are absolutely right Cohen... 100%. I lived VERY briefly in Southbeach but I used to visit my friend very often when he lived in both Orlando and then Jacksonville. Such a shame what has happened to America. Even I asked my mother what the West would have been like today if there had never been slavery and open borders... A 70+ year old looks at me and gives the old O0
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National Socialism = KKKommunistic SSocialism the same thing, few things differed, even KKKommunists in Russia were anti-semetic.
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The nazis were NATIONAL socialists. They were not marxists. The nazis were not fascists either. Fascism is not national socialism. Nazism is a racist dictatorship, but fascism is a corporate dictatorship. Mussolini and Hitler did not see each other as ideological cousins.
On the other hand, Marxism is an anti-corporate ideology that promotes class warfare.
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The nazis were NATIONAL socialists. They were not marxists. The nazis were not fascists either. Fascism is not national socialism. Nazism is a racist dictatorship, but fascism is a corporate dictatorship. Mussolini and Hitler did not see each other as ideological cousins.
On the other hand, Marxism is an anti-corporate ideology that promotes class warfare.
This subject, re: aforementioned posts, has been beaten into a pulp. There was nothing "National" about so called National Socialism. Mein Kempf itself demands expansion and the first thing Hitler did after gaining his power was to invade other nations, violate the treaty of versilles and expand internationally.
You must also note that the base of Nazism is, in fact, Communism. Hitler was a member of the German Communist Party before he was kicked out later entering the Thule Society where Nazism acquired its Blavatsky/Theosophy Germanic Paganist dogma. VIDEO: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3014581497309209211
Another good example of the similarities was the fact that Hitler gained much of his knowledge from the teachings of Lenin. For example to ascertain their similarites of both persona and ideological specificites compare the base quotes to which both Nazism and Communism are based: "A lie told often enough becomes the truth. " - Lenin; "The great masses of the people... will more easily fall victims to a great lie than to a small one." - Hitler.
Compare Germany's concentration camps, medical experimentations, forced labor etc. with the Gulag system. The two centralized power based systems are nearly identical with main exception being the injection of the Germanic/Nordic Paganism/Mythology.
The best book on this subject to date is by a Frenchmen named Jean-Michel Angebert - "The Occult and the Third Reich: The Mystical Origins of Nazism and the Search for the Holy Grail". Combine that with Hannah Newman's work; "The Rainbow Swastika": http://www.somebodyhelpme.info/ebooks/ebooks.html and one will gain a fabulous understanding of what drove the mind of Adolf Hitler and his Thule Society cohorts.
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Nazism is not Marxism, it may be socialistic, but Hitler focused more on the National Part than the Socialist part. Neither is socialism "communism." Socialism is just a left-wing dictatorship, and communism is the abolition of private party.
The nazis were racial nationalists who were willing to expand at the expense of the Jewish and Gentile people's of Eastern Europe.
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Nazism is not Marxism, it may be socialistic, but Hitler focused more on the National Part than the Socialist part. Neither is socialism "communism." Socialism is just a left-wing dictatorship, and communism is the abolition of private party.
The nazis were racial nationalists who were willing to expand at the expense of the Jewish and Gentile people's of Eastern Europe.
You must not have read Mein Kempf nor known that Hitler invaded, expanded his power internationally soon after gaining his dictatorial power. This negates the "National" aspect within "National Socialism". It was an internationalist ideology akin to Communism albeit as aforementioned combined with a contortion of Blavatsky's Theosophy promulgated by Rudolf von Sebottendorff's Thule Society and later by Houston Stewart Chamberlain; author of "The Foundations of the Nineteenth Century" .
Both Nazism and Communism followed Marx's philosophy of revolution, propaganda, subversion, suppression, brute force, concentration camps, extermination ect. to become the dominant private party of the day... Hitler gained a great mass of his political drive and "education" through being member of Germany's Communist Party.
In this case you are denying Karl Marx's own views on Socialism as well as Leninism which is slightly different than Marxism albeit with the same conclusion. Karl Marx himself stated "I'm not a Marxist." ;) Vladimir Lenin "The goal of socialism is communism".
You might research the objective of Lenin's Perestroika or better, read "The Perestroika Deception" by Anatoliy Golitsyn. O0
I see what you are trying to say but must however disagree with the base of your arguement brother... :)
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You must not have read Mein Kempf nor known that Hitler invaded, expanded his power internationally soon after gaining his dictatorial power.
You must not have read my post because your reply is idiotic in context with what I originally said. Hitler was a racial nationalist and yes, I have read parts of Mein Kampf.
Vladimir Lenin "The goal of socialism is communism".
No. You are quoting out of context. The goal of socialism is communism according to Marxist theory, but not all socialists have the goal of communism. Secondly, in Marxist theory, socialism and communism are two separate and distinct stages.
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I'll repeat.
Fascism = Corporate dictatorship
Nazism = Racist dictatorship
Socialism = left-wing dictatorship
Communism = the abolition of private policy
Marxists believe that capitalism must be replaced with socialism, but then that socialism must be replaced with Communism. They are not one in the same, and Hitler did not have the goal of replacing socialism with communism, neither did he fully implement socialism.
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Brother please do not insult me. I disagree with you. You are saying that Lenin didn't know about Socialism as per his quote. How do you think Hitler came to power? His tactics were akin to the Bolshevik Revolution. I'm not argueing about your theories about "race" and Nazism simply explaining where these racial dogmas came from. You have read parts of Mein Kempf but not the whole. By your statement about Communism you only outline one precept of the Communist ideology/goal.
Communism is as far to the Left wing as one can get. National Socialism is, solely by the title and without the racial dogma is akin to Fascism. International Socialism is akin to Communism. There was a difference between traditional Marxism and Leninism but the end goal is the same.
I fully realize what Marxism is and have read all of Karl Marx's works. Socialism is, as aforementioned, only a step towards Communism. Shitler's Germany and Stalin's Communist Russia were very very similar in nature. Not once did I say that Communism IS Nazism but without the Racial undertone, which I explained earlier, they are very similar ideologies. To deny that is to deny reality... I have not insulted you so please do not insult me. Thank you... MZ
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Hitler came to power more democratically than the Bolsheviks did. Russia was a third world nation at the time and it was determined via war, whereas Hitler legally took power, and then declared martial law.
Fascism believes in supporting the corporate class and supporting business interests. Hitler did not. But he didn't speak of class warfare either. What Hitler tried to do was unite people of German racial background regardless of class, and expand geographically. It's neither fascism nor communism, though it may have some socialistic influences, they were not the main goals of the regime.
Socialism leads to communism according to marx, but plenty of socialists are not communists, and Hitler was at most a Socialist and not a Communist. He had no goal of Communism, even for just German people. On economic issues, he was more moderate than the Bolsheviks.
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Ok, we agree to disagree... http://www.somebodyhelpme.info/ebooks/ebooks.html Antony Sutton has some fabulous books on this subject. Enjoy ;)
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Hitler came to power more democratically than the Bolsheviks did. Russia was a third world nation at the time and it was determined via war, whereas Hitler legally took power, and then declared martial law.
Fascism believes in supporting the corporate class and supporting business interests. Hitler did not. But he didn't speak of class warfare either. What Hitler tried to do was unite people of German racial background regardless of class, and expand geographically. It's neither fascism nor communism, though it may have some socialistic influences, they were not the main goals of the regime.
Socialism leads to communism according to marx, but plenty of socialists are not communists, and Hitler was at most a Socialist and not a Communist. He had no goal of Communism, even for just German people. On economic issues, he was more moderate than the Bolsheviks.
(http://www.umc.org/atf/cf/%7BDB6A45E4-C446-4248-82C8-E131B6424741%7D/umns_514_071009_468.jpg)
Russia was a third world nation at the time ... = 1917
yeah right...
(http://www.select-a-tour.com/Tours/Highlights-of-Russia/StPete1.jpg)
(http://www.eage.org/images/cms/the-cathedral-ofthe-resurre1.gif)
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Your are correct Ambrioix. Russia was far from what we know as a "Third World Nation". It had its wealthy and its poor as did Germany. Russia was not on the "enlightened" and "educated" level of Germany nor at the hight of Germany's Industrial complex, although after the Treaty of Verseilles, Germany, with American/British Financial assistance did do immense business developing Russia's Industrial complex, especially Germany with respect to its Armorments Industry to evade this treaty.
You are correct in many ways. Remeber "The Beer Hall Putsch" which was a failed coup d'état that occurred between the evening of Thursday, November 8 and the early afternoon of Friday, November 9, 1923, when the Nazi party's leader Adolf Hitler, the popular World War I General Erich Ludendorff, and other leaders of the Kampfbund, unsuccessfully tried to gain power in Munich, Bavaria, and Germany. This attempt was akin to Lenin's Bolsheviks and was also financed-assisted by many of the same sources...
;)
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We Flemish and Jews from Antwerp , fleeing for the spanish invaders in 1585, established the Golden Age of the Nation of Holland, and made the cities of Amsterdam, New York (nieuw-Amsterdam) were developed by them.
The Russian tsar Peter the Great, learned to build ships in Holland,
and thus established the first Russian marine.
This a special connection we and the Russians have, and Russians are very thankful and respectful to our small nation for providing them this technology.
All marine-words in Russian are Dutch. Even the Russian words for chair and kitchen,... change to the Dutch words, when in a ship!
Russia today is in a terrible state. Negative birth-rate, alcoholism, ruzism, muslims, china wanting to invade Siberia, USA/NATO/EU increasingly hostile, but at the other hand, Moscow is the fastest developing city in Europe.
The country side and the farmer-class has been destroyed by the evil communists,
the genetic composition of the Russian people is even affected by the horrors of the Revolution , the World Wars, and the horrors of Leninism, Stalinism.
The good thing is , that the Russian have no "pussification" as here, and in the USA.
So, probably, they will emerge as more powerful, and stable country, once West-Europe is in total decline due to the collapse of the states here under muslim-pressure.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/d/d4/PetertheGreat_statue.JPG/451px-PetertheGreat_statue.JPG)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4a/Sankt_Petersburg_Peter_der_Grosse_2005_a.jpg/398px-Sankt_Petersburg_Peter_der_Grosse_2005_a.jpg)
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Russia fought WWI using a very weak army, even using swords. Russia was not an industrialized nation until Stalin forcibly modernized it.
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I think they are worse than an average commie! Despite both of them being restrictive (best word I could use) forms of government, National Socialism (Nazis) are worse! They create bigger governments than huge communist governments and they enforce harsher restrictions on basic rights! :'(