JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Masha on October 15, 2008, 03:46:40 AM
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I hope and pray that I am wrong. But I have a really bad feeling that if Osama is elected, this will be the end of freedom and democracy in the U.S. People on this board are saying things like "the voters will get mad if Osama is elected; people will revolt and vote the majority of Republicans into the office; if Osama wins, Sarah Palin might be the next candidate in 2012;" etc., etc... But are you sure THERE WILL BE THE NEXT ELECTION??? That there will be two parties in their present form? That there will be any form of serious political opposition? That a forum like this will be allowed to exist in 4 years' time? If you do, you are optimists.
Personally, I have a feeling that we are undergoing a kind of "velvet revolution." Our rights and democratic freedoms are being slowly eroded and are disappearing. Was there some fault with the original constitution, I wonder? It was very clever and foresightful in its system of checks and balances. But even a very clever group of people cannot forsee everything. Perhaps the problem is that it allowed for the creation of activists judges who could interpret the constitution "creatively."
Anyway, we are briskly marching toward socialism even without Osama. The government has just partly nationalized the banks. The banks! The lynchpin of a free, capitalistic market system.
I am a pessimist. I am afraid that this might be the last real election in which we are participating (remember, they had "democratic" elections in the Soviet Union as well). I don't know how much longer we will have the luxury of finding like-minded people on the Internet. How much longer before political blogs and forums will be closed down?
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You have some points there. Since we give the blacks everything, what's going to stop us from giving them the govt.
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You have some points there. Since we give the blacks everything, what's going to stop us from giving them the govt.
I hope I'm wrong, but I have a gut feeling that a historical era for the U.S. is coming to an end with irreversible consequences. Whenever people say, "but look, we have the constitution, we have guaranteed rights, what you are saying is impossible," I reply, "did you know that the Soviet Union had its own constitution? Did you know that the freedom of speech and freedom of assembly were guaranteed in their constitution? Did you know that the communist leaders were not appointed, but were "freely" elected? Did you know that they had all governmental abuses of power were supposed to be checked by courts whose task was to oversee that the Soviet constitution was enforced?" Most people have no idea. They think that the Soviet Union was officially a dictatorship. Not so. On the face of it, it had all the formal trappings of a democratic and free regime. I'm afrain the same thing is coming here. It has been, in fact, coming for a while with all the "hate laws" and such. But I'm afraid it'll be here full force. :'(
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Aliyah
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Aliyah
Now that's the Idea... :clap:
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If you made this statement a year ago I would have said you were off the wall. In light of the way things have been going in the past 6 months or so I think many aspects of what you say could well be the case. I am very concerned with two things. The first is the fact that most people just don't care or really understand what the government is up to as long as the lights and TV come on its all good. The fact that a creature like Obama has got this close to the presidency and most people have little or no concern only proves this. The second thing is the fact that Obama will be president with a one party majority. With Obamas leanings this could be a very dangerous situation. Laws could very easily put into place that could change society greatly and not much could be done to stop it. If you think that Obama's presidency will only affect America think again. Look at last week when the American economy started to slide how quickly all the others followed right down the tubes.
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Look this is important.
He can't take away all of the freedoms immediately. That would be impossible. So what you have to look out for and guard against is his ability to take away personal rights bit by bit. There are certain freedoms that once they are gone, they are gone permanently. Do not let him pass a law the prohibits criticism of religion! And just as important, do not let him take away your guns. If either of these things happen, then I think we will see the type of situation you are imagining. But Obama will not be able to dismantle all of America's political systems in one shot.
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Its all over, all over.
What a legacy, what a legacy.
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If you made this statement a year ago I would have said you were off the wall.
I would not have made this statement a year ago. :'( I am not paranoid (I think!). Neither am I a conspiracy theorist. But there are some new realities we have to contend with. And my scenario, I am afraid, is not science fiction any longer. :'(
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Look this is important.
He can't take away all of the freedoms immediately.
We have to be vigilant. But if evil activist judges interpret the freedom of speech in a new, highly restrictive way (which they are already doing in Europe and Canada!!!) then what are we to do? We'll be helpless under such new draconian laws.
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i heard that peoples votes don't mean anything in the election its the electoral ones that really count just like in last presidential elections bush won by electoral but people chose al gore
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i heard that peoples votes don't mean anything in the election its the electoral ones that really count just like in last presidential elections bush won by electoral but people chose al gore
The electoral votes are based on the vote within each state. This protects rural voters from being overrun with urban voters. Believe me in this election the electoral college is a good thing.
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Well, I'm voting from a liberal state, so, in my case, it doesn't matter who I vote for. It's already pre-decided it's Obama, no matter what I do. It doesn't seem like a good system to me.
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I AM NOT READY TO GIVE UP YET!!!!!!!!!
:o
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Before you criticize Masha's post, something for you to think about:
It's likely that the Democrats will pick up 9 seats in the Senate, which will give them a filibuster-proof majority. Obama will pass legislation that Pelosi and Reid want and they'll write legislation that he wants.
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Remember the video when young children were told to sing about Obama? They were being indoctrinated.
Remember the video when a teacher had his students marching and reciting slogans of the Obama campaign? They were being indoctrinated.
That's communism.
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Well, I'm voting from a liberal state, so, in my case, it doesn't matter who I vote for. It's already pre-decided it's Obama, no matter what I do. It doesn't seem like a good system to me.
I understand what you mean, but people like you are the only ones who can eventually turn blue states into red ones.
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Aliyah
Best solution ever! :dance:
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Aliyah
Best solution ever! :dance:
Aliyah? I'd love to, but look at what's happening there! I don't want to go to Israel to die, I want to go there to live, as a Jew, a normal Jew who feels no guilt about existing or living as a free person on my own land. Can the leaders of Israel today make such a claim?
I don't know what the answer is. Ideally, I'd like to depose the current government in Israel and put up a Kahanist government, that will look out for the interests of Jews. How do we get there? That's what I'm not so sure about. But I'm not going to make aliyah, knowing that the land I will live on will be taken from me and given to an arab who wants to kill me.
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Apropos aliyah, I suspect there will be an "aliyah" for European-Americans as well. I think we might see the largest white emigration yet in the history of the U.S. Where will they go? Perhaps socialist Canada, which nonetheless has a lot of underpopulated areas. They might form white enclaves there. Perhaps Australia and New Zealand. Perhaps Eastern Europe. I wouldn't be surprsed if many will go to China.
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There's nowhere to run. We make our stand here in the United States or we make it nowhere.
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I grew up in a white, middle class, clean and safe neighborhood where people worked hard and took care of their families. We were the only Jews in this predominately Christian neighborhood and we were all friends and remain friends to this day. Even the public schools were decent. Of course I look back with rose-colored glasses, but it really was the American dream where, if you played by the rules, you could lead a decent and even rewarding life.
With Obama on the verge of being elected, I believe it's the beginning of the end of the American dream. America is becoming more third world every day, with changing demographics, socialism, and more government control. Leftist Christianophobes have always hated this country and wanted it destroyed. Obama is their tool for hastening the process. I'm particularly upset with all the self-hating Bolshevik Jews who are voting for Obama. Are they insane?! :o
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Remember the video when young children were told to sing about Obama? They were being indoctrinated.
Remember the video when a teacher had his students marching and reciting slogans of the Obama campaign? They were being indoctrinated.
That's communism.
Yup. If he wins he will flood this country with African, Muslim and Hispanic immigrants, then your vote won't mean anything. It will be like voting as a white person in South Africa.
Obama's Chicago circle has a lot in common with the ANC, IRA and PLO. Communist terrorist organizations that bombed their way to power and now use the poltical process to carry out their ideals.
There may be controls over "smears" on the internet and Fox news and right wing radio may be shut down.
Expect "common sense gun control" and "equlaity in education."
We may not survive an Obama presidency.
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Shalom,
Anyone see the movie Brazil? I think America is turning into the Brazil of the movie...
muman613
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil_movie
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That was a good movie Muman. The small office that he has reminds me of my job. :::D
I feel like America has also become like the movie
"They Live" too.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/They_Live
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....and Robocop.
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OK, so all of you Jews run off to Israel and leave us poor gentiles here???
It is about time for that most famous of battle cries. I say "WOLVERINES!!!!!!!!"
(http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o44/swmoores/wolverines.jpg)
(http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn184/airsoftman52/dwwdwd.jpg)
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Sorry guys it is not over till Nov. 4. I am not throwing in the towel.
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There's nowhere to run. We make our stand here in the United States or we make it nowhere.
Yes, I agree that staying and fighting is the right thing to do. It's the moral imperative. Still, I predict that there will be for the first time in history white emigration from America. Highly educated professionals will start looking for greener pastures. And what would these be? I don't think there will be entirely "green" pastures, only somewhat greener pastures, such as countries with a better than 50% white ratio (and it will become 50% under Obama, I am afraid). Also, as I said above, I don't exclude a possibility that China would want to attract U.S. professionals
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Sorry guys it is not over till Nov. 4. I am not throwing in the towel.
I agree, we should not throw in the towel. These are just idle speculations. Who knows what might happen? Maybe they'll prove his Kenyan birth - a tantalizing possibility.
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Remember one thing, 3 weeks before the election they had Kerry defeating Bush from all the so called experts, all the polls and turned out otherwise. Do not fall victim to the media who are trying to stage this election, work on the poll I sent out. I saw the result they are complete oppostite of what these media whores are saying.
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zachor ve kavod -
"Aliyah? I'd love to, but look at what's happening there! I don't want to go to Israel to die, I want to go there to live, as a Jew, a normal Jew who feels no guilt about existing or living as a free person on my own land"
i look whats happening here , i live here .
so should i run off to america ?
man , i'm from ashkelon , just a few months ago my city was bombarded by katyusha's and rockets ... so should i run man ?
of course not brother , this is our land , there is nothing that can rip us out of it ... nothing ... this is the land of abraham , isaac and jacob ... not of mohamad the pig .... G-d ordered us to live here , its not a request man , and this land is great belive me , Its worth fighting for
i'm not asking you to come to israel to die , but to live here
the galut is a cemetery , a punishment ... the galut is over now , and jews must return here ... this is the only place in which you can really be "a normal Jew who feels no guilt about existing or living as a free person on my own land"
Israel is the only place in the world in which you can fully fulfill your jewish potential . israel is the only place in the world in which you can really feel like your "home" .
usa is a great place to live (in the normal places) , but its not home man , its not , its still the galut , its still the punishment
a jew which is inlove living in usa ,or any other country is inlove with the punishment of the galut
jews can only fulfill their true potential in here , in israel , this is where we should really live ... when g-d took us out of eygpt , he didn't say now go wherever you want ... he told us to go to israel and live there , and not anywhere else..
because he wants us to build "mamlechet kohanim ve goy kadosh" ,a kingdom of g-d worship (kohanim are the ones carrying the holy work in the temple) and holy nation .... the torah was not given to be kept everywhere , but in israel , in fact , The sole reason we were to keep doing mizvoth in the galut , is so they wont be new to us when hashem will bring us back to the land , On which , the mizvoth are to be kept in the first place , The whole point of israel is being a holy nation with a holy torah in a holy land ...am israel torat israel and eretz israel
although there is a rotten arev rav goverment and court , we have the power to change this man , but if ever israel would become what you want it to be , It must be done through hard work of the people of the land , To take back our throne .... If after 2000 years we never gave up hope for taking back our land , WE SHOULDN'T GIVE UP HOPE FOR HAVING A GOOD JEWISH GOVERMENT !
its just a matter of time , We will prevail . and when we do ... Those muslims will learn the most ancient lesson in history , you dont mess with g-d of the hebrews , and when you do , There's a price to pay , in blood
man , People are doing tshuva by tousands , each and every month , we are already a majority among jews , In ten years we will own this place man !
and if you and more like you would come here now , This could be in just one year man !!!
i know its hard asking someone to literly change is whole life , But g-d will help you , "haba lehitaer msayin lo" , he who come to purify will be helped , as the sages said ... by your effort , you will be given g-d's help
i'm not promising easy going life , But a fullfiling one , Somthing you can only find here man , And when you will see your grandchildren will rome the streets here , it will bring you pride that because of you they now never needed to feel outsiders out of their own home , the real home , israel
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shamgar - "OK, so all of you Jews run off to Israel and leave us poor gentiles here???"
I'm not telling them to make aliyah to "run" out of america , but to come to their real land , somthing america isn't , even if some would like to belive it is
i just thougth its feating to answer in that word "aliyah" , didn't called no one to "run" though
Gentiles who support israel , Have nothing to worry from the gentiles who are against israel ... Because g-d of israel will make his enemies fall
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Hebrewhonor, I hope you have 10 years. I pray for your safety. God bless and God speed.