JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Irish Zionist on December 23, 2009, 09:49:42 AM
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(IsraelNN.com) The Vatican has released a statement claiming that moving Pope Pius XII closer to sainthood is not a hostile act against the Jewish people. Pius was pope during World War II and has been criticized for alleged complicity in the Holocaust. Many Jewish groups raised concerns after Pope Benedict XVI signed a decree on Pius’s virtues, which allows the deceased former pope to be beatified. The Vatican statement argued that the decree should not be an obstacle to dialogue between Jews and the Catholic Church.
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/177085
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I don't think that Jews should intervene in the decision making of the Church. However I take it as a sign that the Vatican is... still the same old Vatican.
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They still need to excommunicate Hitler.
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They still need to excommunicate Hitler.
If someone is already dead he/she can't be excommunicated.
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They still need to excommunicate Hitler.
If someone is already dead he/she can't be excommunicated.
So to the pope Hitler is in heaven enjoying the fruits of all the Jews which died by his hands. This is another reason the Catholic church is so hideously evil... Does anyone wonder why I hate the pope, and the church? They will all burn in hell...
Besides the point that the pope said nothing, did nothing, and still is being made a saint by this evil church? G-d Almighty will reckon with these two-bit evil popes and bishops.
(http://freethinker.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/bishops-salute-hitler.jpg)
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They still need to excommunicate Hitler.
If someone is already dead he/she can't be excommunicated.
So to the pope Hitler is in heaven enjoying the fruits of all the Jews which died by his hands. This is another reason the Catholic church is so hideously evil... Does anyone wonder why I hate the pope, and the church? They will all burn in hell...
Besides the point that the pope said nothing, did nothing, and still is being made a saint by this evil church? G-d Almighty will reckon with these two-bit evil popes and bishops.
(http://freethinker.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/bishops-salute-hitler.jpg)
From my point of view, the deceleration of sainthood etc. means zero. The whole concept that a mortal can judge a soul and decide to make it a saint, whatever it means, seems to me quite absurd. But whatever, the pope can play god why should I care.
I think the Vatican is actually entrapped in its own primitive traditions and rituals. The pope is not necessarily evil. He is bound by some tradition that he can't break without severing the source of his own authority.
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They still need to excommunicate Hitler.
If someone is already dead he/she can't be excommunicated.
So to the pope Hitler is in heaven enjoying the fruits of all the Jews which died by his hands.
No...
Well, I'm not interested in "defending the catholic church" (and I didn't mean to do that with my previous post) and since I'm quite shy and my english sucks, but I can tell you that the "purpose" of excommunication is not to declare "directly" that a specific person or a group of people "will go to hell, and that's it". Therefore not excommunicating someone, even if he's the incarnation of evil, doesn't mean they think that "he's going to heaven" at all as you suggest above.
Anyway both my english and my knowledge aren't good enough to talk about details of excommunications and I'm sure nobody here is interested in them so...
I just wanted to point out that the fact that a dead person can't be excommunicated has a lot to do with the original purpose of excommunication and the fact that they didn't excomunicate Hitler when they could is indeed quite shameful.
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Daniele.from.Italy, You're English totally doesn't suck.
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They still need to excommunicate Hitler.
Yep.
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:-X
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בס"ד
=/
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If they can't excommunicate him posthumously, why don't they make a declaration absolutely condemning him and his actions? Half-baked apologies put out in the past just are not good enough. They never condemned him on a personal level.
I've found a very interesting quotation from a Catholic web site:
"As the baptized cease, at death, to belong to the Church Militant, the dead cannot be excommunicated. Of course, strictly speaking, after the demise of a Christian person, it may be officially declared that such person incurred excommunication during his lifetime. "
Source:
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05678a.htm
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Making that bum a saint is the Catholic church giving the middle finger to Jews everywhere. It's simply disgusting.
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You guys do notice that you are only promoting the atheist claim that Christians are responsible for Hitler and WW2.
Hitler didn't go to Catholic church and promoted anti-catholicism, so I don't see that excommunicating him would of even effected him at all.
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You guys do notice that you are only promoting the atheist claim that Christians are responsible for Hitler and WW2.
Hitler didn't go to Catholic church and promoted anti-catholicism, so I don't see that excommunicating him would of even effected him at all.
At least it would demonstrate that they did not consider him a Catholic in good standing, as he is to this day...
Do you not punish a wrongdoer just because it would not affect his behaviour? I do...
http://www.jewsforjudaism.org/library/library-primary-228/missionary-tactics/339-the-vatican-and-two-millenia-of-denial
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You guys do notice that you are only promoting the atheist claim that Christians are responsible for Hitler and WW2.
Hitler didn't go to Catholic church and promoted anti-catholicism, so I don't see that excommunicating him would of even effected him at all.
I think if he truly believed in anything, it was in increasing his own power using any tools possible. However Muman has a great point that it's important that the RCC take the step of publicly condemning Hitler so that it's not assumed that he's still in good standing. It's incredible, incredible hypocrisy for them to excommunicate a teen girl that is forced or coerced into getting an abortion because it's murder, yet Hitler was not excommunicated.
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They still need to excommunicate Hitler.
If someone is already dead he/she can't be excommunicated.
So to the pope Hitler is in heaven enjoying the fruits of all the Jews which died by his hands.
No...
Well, I'm not interested in "defending the catholic church" (and I didn't mean to do that with my previous post) and since I'm quite shy and my english sucks, but I can tell you that the "purpose" of excommunication is not to declare "directly" that a specific person or a group of people "will go to hell, and that's it". Therefore not excommunicating someone, even if he's the incarnation of evil, doesn't mean they think that "he's going to heaven" at all as you suggest above.
Anyway both my english and my knowledge aren't good enough to talk about details of excommunications and I'm sure nobody here is interested in them so...
I just wanted to point out that the fact that a dead person can't be excommunicated has a lot to do with the original purpose of excommunication and the fact that they didn't excomunicate Hitler when they could is indeed quite shameful.
You should post more often. Your english is fine. :)