JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: muman613 on December 08, 2010, 06:02:05 PM
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This is completely insane. But we all know that the Israeli leaders have their heads on backwards, and often do things against their constituents better interest. I am beginning to think that the current crop of Israeli leaders are robots working toward the destruction of the Jewish state. How can they even consider apologizing to people who are attacking them? Turkey was obviously behind the flotilla. Why should Israel have to apologize for defending herself? Only in a Nazi world is the victim forced to apologize to the victimizer.
When will the Jewish people stand up against the evil which is rising against it? If we do not wake up our brothers and sisters shortly there will be nothing left to fight for...
http://israelmatzav.blogspot.com/2010/12/israel-may-apologize-for-mavi-marmara.html
Israel may apologize for Mavi Marmara incident
Play whatever semantic games you want - the bottom line is that Israel is negotiating an 'apology' for the Mavi Marmara incident. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm outraged at the prospect.
The website of the Hurriyet daily reported on its website that Turkish Foreign Ministry Undersecretary Feridun Sinirlioğlu, who at the beginning of the week held talks on the matter in Geneva with Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu's envoy Yosef Ciechanover, was expected to bring a proposal drawn up in those talks to the Turkish prime minister.
According to Hurriyet, there has been a debate about whether Israel would issue a state apology or a humanitarian one for the raid on the ship trying to break the Gaza blockade. Nine people were killed after IDF commandos lowered onto the ship, organized by the Turkish Humanitarian Relief Foundation IHH, an organization listed by a number of countries as a terrorist group, came under attack.
Hurriyet, which said Israel wanted to use words such as "regret" or "sorry" in a statement, rather than "apology," quoted Erdogan as saying late Tuesday that "there is no such distinction as 'the people' or 'the state.' They [the Israelis] must apologize to the Republic of Turkey." In Jerusalem, meanwhile, it is widely assumed that Israel would only agree to a formula in which it was clear that Israel acted in self defense, that it retains its right to act in self defense in the future, and that it had no intention of harming the passengers of the ship.
Netanyahu is sure to come up against push-back from some in his own cabinet, including foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman, if he agrees to anything resembling an apology, and also from the families of soldiers involved -- and wounded -- in the incident.
Nahman Cohen, the father of the commando seriously wounded when he was thrown from the upper to the lower deck of the ship, said the idea that the country would apologize or pay compensation was inconceivable and that he would fight any agreement.
Sources close to Lieberman, meanwhile, said Tuesday that an apology to Turkey would be tantamount to "surrender to terrorism." "Israel needs to ask for a Turkish apology, and for it to pay compensation for the aid it gave those supporting terrorists and the IHH," the sources said.
I know this post is sure to elicit comments from whiny Turks - both on the blog and on Twitter - but I'm with Lieberman on this. Dhimmi Netanyahu should be fought if he insists on going through with this. The Turks are a bunch of terrorists. I won't set foot in that country again - not even to change planes in Istanbul (which I have done). And I hope none of you will either. What a s****y country. No apologies for fighting terrorists - now or ever.
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Ronald Reagan once said that politics is the world's second oldest profession, and that it bears a striking resemblance to the first oldest profession (just paraphrasing here).
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What a disgrace!! Turkey should apologize to Greece and Armenia for killing millions of their people.
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its like in Saudi Arabia that rape victims get executed for adultery. the victim becomes the criminal
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I hope Netanyahu didn't apologize to Turkey. It would be a sign of weakness to a radicalized aggressive country.
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Israel needs elections now.
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Ronald Reagan once said that politics is the world's second oldest profession, and that it bears a striking resemblance to the first oldest profession (just paraphrasing here).
Appropriate quote in this case ! I don't know if I should laugh or cry though...
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It would be a grave humiliation for Israel if Netanyahu apologized. I guess he’s going to sugarcoat his statement, saying he « regrets » or even « deeply regrets » the « loss of life », so he can pretend he is not pandering to Erdogan.
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Israel needs elections now.
Elections? And who will do better? Everyone seems a hardliner during the campaign and then befriends the enemy. Politicians are all alike and we cannot expect much of them. They only do something good when the People demands it. And Israelies are very quiet since long ago. If you forbid Muslims to go to Mecca, thousands of'em would riot, but Israel is forbidding Jews to pray in Jerusalem and I don't hear any Jewish uprising.
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What a disgrace!! Turkey should apologize to Greece and Armenia for killing millions of their people.
+1
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Why doesn't Turkey apologise for being so ugly?
That's one thing them and the disgusting self hating Jews that run the country have in common
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Yes yes yes, it's all Lewinsky's fault. The people of Israel have no free will, and are completely helpless, and mentally retarded, and have absolutely no control over their thoughts and actions. ::) ::) ::)
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Yes yes yes, it's all Lewinsky's fault. The people of Israel have no free will, and are completely helpless, and mentally retarded, and have absolutely no control over their thoughts and actions. ::) ::) ::)
They don't because they're as easily manipulated as sheep. The Left needs a powerful "hawkish" leader - it doesn't need to care about the public opinion.
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This time you're wrong. The Israeli public is against this specific treason.
And the Sinai ethnic cleansing and surrender, and the banning of HaRav Meir Kahane, and the lynching of Yigal Amir and the desecration of the memory of Dr. Goldstein, and the ethnic cleansing of Gaza, and pardoning the butchers of Shalhevet Pass and Tali Fahuel, and freeing Samir Kuntar, Mohammed Jabarra, and thousands of others of convicted butchers, and the Nazi stormtrooper assault on the Peace House, and always putting Arab "civilians" above everything else? The Israeli public was/is "against" those too?
I support Israel but that doesn't mean I will pretend to like the people if they don't deserve to be liked. I don't kiss anybody's butt. I love Chaim of course but I really think JTF/Hayamin needs to call out the nation for its sins rather than act like the people are helpless victims of an evil regime with no free will of their own. Victims, yes--helpless, no.
The reason why Kahanists are not in power right now is very simple--at the present time the Israeli people care more about what the world thinks of them, early retirement, legalized baby-murder, and cheap labor than their own survival. Is that pretty? No. Does it need to be said? Yes. The only way this will change is if they are confronted with the grave and ugly reality of their own sin and repent. Or, do you all really think that if Peepee woke up tomorrow and decided to just expel all Arabs, execute all Arab prisoners, and retake the Sinai that the people would just support him? Newsflash, they wouldn't. They would refuse to obey any of those orders and the Bolshevik military would probably mutiny against him.
If acknowledging all this makes me a bad JTFer, so be it. I would rather call a spade a spade than distort reality to fit a certain agenda.
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DBF For President or PM of Israel!
You tell em!
Actually I am being sarcastic... It is not as easy as you make it seem DBF... If it were that easy then Rabbi Kahane, may his blood be avenged, would have succeeded. Jews are not an easy bunch, we were called 'Stiff-Necked' by Hashem in Dueteronomy. Read the Torah and learn about Korach, and the complaining in the desert, the 12 spies, etc. etc.... Our history does not often produce strong leaders. After many years of galut, we once again have that 'slave mentality' which is described by the sages as to explain why the Jewish people were complaining. Those who witnessed the plagues and the parting of the sea were destined to die in the desert.
I know that doesn't explain it... But think about it...
"And the nation quarreled with Moshe and said, If only we had died the death of our brethren before G-d! Why have you brought G-d's congregation to this desert, to die there – we and our cattle? And why did you bring us up from Egypt, to bring us to this evil place – not a place of seed, or of figs, or of grapes or pomegranates; nor is there any water to drink." (20:3-5)
“If I have found favor in your eyes my G-d, please, G-d, walk in our midst, for they are a stiff-necked people, and forgive our sins and our iniquities and you will inherit us.” (Shemot 34:9)
"And you should know that not because of your righteousness does G-d, your L-rd, give you this good land to possess it, for you are a stiff necked people". (Devarim/Deuteronomy 9:6)
http://www.lidrosh.com/Default.aspx?tabid=57&vpRetTbId=37&vpCtId=33&vpPrId=304
http://www.darchenoam.org/discussion/anava4.htm
http://www.vbm-torah.org/pesach/ai-slave.htm
The Israelites are used to living as slaves. Slaves are provided with rations so that they can work. The Egyptians made sure that they had food. What do the Israelites remember? They remember only that they were cared for there and provided for. The fact that they were getting slave rations, is for some reason overlooked. But when they find themselves hungry with no means of provision, they are immediately lost. Like a child without his mother, they simply cry. A simple need unfulfilled is a crisis for the slave.
It would seem that the mind of the slave is limited to these narrow horizons of immediate material fulfillment. The slave lives for the moment. He does not have the luxury of planning the future; his role is simply to survive the present. The hallmarks of the slave generation which is leaving Egypt can be felt throughout the parasha. G-d does not lead the Israelites "by way of the Land of the Pelishtim although it was nearer, for G-d said, 'If they encounter war, the people may have a change of heart and return to Egypt'" (13:17-18). The people still see Egypt as a protective secure environment. They need the security; they need its order and comforting predictability. Egypt is an environment where decisions are made for them, where they know the rules of life. In the outside world, they are lacking in confidence.
PS: Sorry for constantly re-editing this post... This is it...