JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: fibrogirl on March 04, 2015, 01:25:14 PM
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This sounds a bit overly serious for Purim, but it isn't important. It is just something I am curious about.
During a political disussion my brother claimed that Rabbi Kahane wanted to get rid of all democracy.
My brother said that Kahane wanted to get rid of all voting and institute a kind of dictatorship run by himself or a group of people on Halachic ideals.
I answered that I read he would take the vote away from Arabs and non Jewish citizens while keeping their basic rights. My brother still argues that Kahane wanted to take the vote away from everyone and that Kahane was on ads saying "democratia - ani lo frier"
Translated="Democracy, I am no sucker."
So Who is correct? Me or my brother?
If he is wrong then where is did this idea come from that Kahane wanted a total dictatorship?
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It came from leftists who made up all types of smears and lies about him. Rav Kahane ZTL HYD did in theory object to Democracy as THE solution and as an ideal, BUT he openly stated that he will respect and follow the Democratic process because the alternative is worse- the alternative being that their would be a civil war between Jews. And he gave his word to and for that. We all know what Rav Kahane said and said he would do or not do he meant.
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It came from leftists who made up all types of smears and lies about him. Rav Kahane ZTL HYD did in theory object to Democracy as THE solution and as an ideal, BUT he openly stated that he will respect and follow the Democratic process because the alternative is worse- the alternative being that their would be a civil war between Jews. And he gave his word to and for that. We all know what Rav Kahane said and said he would do or not do he meant.
This is my understanding based on listening to his words and from others who knew his writings.
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I think that this was his reaction to the claim that his transfer program is undemocratic. As you probably know Rabbi Kahane presented the dilemma of facing an Arab take over and ultimate destruction of Israel by democratic means. So when it comes to choosing between a safe Jewish state and a 'Jewish and Democratic' state that is doomed to be destroyed Kahane was very clear. Back in the day his opponents always refused to answer his question because they pretended to be zionists so they couldn't say yes let the Arabs or the Arabs + Leftists take over by election and destroy Israel. Nowadays allot of "post zionists" would openly admit they have no problem with that scenario.
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So Kahane's policy on this subject in a nutshell was:
-Transfer of Arabs
-Those Arabs who want to stay can vote for the local council but not nationally
-He would follow the democratic process and uphold the right for Jews to vote because the alternative is worse even if he conceded that democracy is not perfect.
Tell me if I am wrong.
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This sounds a bit overly serious for Purim, but it isn't important. It is just something I am curious about.
During a political disussion my brother claimed that Rabbi Kahane wanted to get rid of all democracy.
My brother said that Kahane wanted to get rid of all voting and institute a kind of dictatorship run by himself or a group of people on Halachic ideals.
I answered that I read he would take the vote away from Arabs and non Jewish citizens while keeping their basic rights. My brother still argues that Kahane wanted to take the vote away from everyone and that Kahane was on ads saying "democratia - ani lo frier"
Translated="Democracy, I am no sucker."
So Who is correct? Me or my brother?
If he is wrong then where is did this idea come from that Kahane wanted a total dictatorship?
Rabbi Kahane wanted to have a referendum where people would vote on whether they wanted a halachic state. If it would pass, he would construct the govt based on Torah but I don't think it removed voting power from all things. I'm not sure exactly how it works.
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The main thrust of his attack on democracy was that arabs could not be allowed to vote the Jewish state out of existence. He was going to make it a Jewish state in the sense that arabs could not vote unlike a democracy, regardless of how the halachic state referendum turned out. That was what he meant when he said we have to choose between Jewish state and democratic stae. Because it cannot possibly be both.