More signs that the arson attack on the Duma Baby was an internal Arab Feud

[edu]

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/215265

A fire burned a home Wednesday in a Palestinian Arab village where an arson attack by suspected Jewish extremists a year ago killed a toddler and his parents, residents and authorities said.

Israeli police said they were investigating the cause, but that they had so far not found any evidence of a Jewish extremist attack.

But inhabitants of the village of Duma in Samaria and a PA official immediately said they suspected another attack, but Palestinian firefighters had not commented on the cause.

The blaze damaged the home of Mohammed Dawabsha, located near the house that was firebombed on July 31 last year.

Dawabasha and his wife suffered smoke inhalation, but there were no other injuries.

Dawabsha said he and his wife heard noises outside their home in the middle of the night.

"We went outside and afterwards we heard an explosion in the bedroom and saw huge flames," he said.

Neighbors assisted them in moving to safety.

Last year's July 31 attack on a family home in the village killed 18-month-old Ali Saad Dawabsha and fatally injured his parents.

Five-year-old Ahmed was the sole survivor from the immediate family.

Mohammed Dawabsha is part of the same clan but is not an immediate relative of the family.

The 2015 attack sparked a crackdown by Israeli authorities on alleged Jewish extremists, though most of those arrested were not connected to the firebombing.

In January, a court charged two Jewish extremists over the firebombing.

However, theories have persisted that their confessions may have been forced, due to harsh interrogation methods used.


Moreover, a string of unexplained fires both before and after July 31 incident, together with rumors of internal clan feuds in the village, have fueled the intrigue surrounding the case, as have numerous incidents of Palestinian exposed fabricating "Jewish attacks."

In March, another fire burned the Duma home of a key witness to the arson attack, but the cause was not clear. Israeli authorities said at the time they were investigating.

[Zelhar]

I wish that was true but it is extrrmely likely that the perps were jews. Spreading these theories doesn't help our cause. Think how riddiculous it sounds when muslims claim the Jews did 9-11.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I wish that was true but it is extrrmely likely that the perps were jews. Spreading these theories doesn't help our cause. Think how riddiculous it sounds when muslims claim the Jews did 9-11.

Too bad we have evidence of who did 9/11 but we have no evidence who did Duma, just tortured teenagers.  Shabak gave credibility to alternative and why are there so many houses burning down in this village?

[Zelhar]

There is evidence that is perhaps inadmissable in court. Information was extacted from the defendants using torture under the pretex that it is neceaasry to prevent immeinent attacks. The procecution wants to use it as evidence.

The fact that there have been other arsons is highly circumstancial. There are stronger circumstances pointing to a Jewish terror group. There is probably one or more shabak informants who gave the two suspects away.

Too bad we have evidence of who did 9/11 but we have no evidence who did Duma, just tortured teenagers.  Shabak gave credibility to alternative and why are there so many houses burning down in this village?

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

There is evidence that is perhaps inadmissable in court. Information was extacted from the defendants using torture under the pretex that it is neceaasry to prevent immeinent attacks. The procecution wants to use it as evidence.

The fact that there have been other arsons is highly circumstancial. There are stronger circumstances pointing to a Jewish terror group. There is probably one or more shabak informants who gave the two suspects away.

This is insane.  The torture lasted for weeks including kids not even connected to the event because they had alibi.  It is scientifically proven that torture produces false confessions.  Accept scientific fact!

Admissible or inadmissible is a sideshow, and even the falsely produced confessions are inconsistent which only points to their being false.

[Zelhar]

Look non of us know the facts. That confession under torture should be inadmisable we both agree. That an admission extracted through torture can be false we both agree. If the interrogator's purpose is to extract confession no matter the truth they will get it. However torture can also be used to extract true information.

I see here the following possibilities:

1. The investigators chose scapegoats and extracted confession out of them. The interrogators have no interest in getting the truth but only to lay the blame on the Tag Mechir group.

my opinion about option 1: not likely.

2. The investigators have some evidence or information against the suspects. Maybe they don't want to reveal their informants, as Moshe Yaalon has indicated. They pursued to interrogate the suspects using 'legal toruture method'. In my opinion, this is the likely scenario. Now what follows this:

2.A The suspects are innocent. The informants gave false information. But the investigators are convinced otherwise, and they are so eager to prove themselves correct that they extract false confessions. If that is true the investigators only got admission as well the scenario with they forced the suspect to admit to. It includes only information known to the investigators as well as made up information they forced the suspect to admit to.

2.B The investigators broke the suspects through torture. They were able to extract from them not only admission but further incriminating evidence such as details that only the purpetrators could know, leftovers from their preparation of the molotov cocktail etc.

This is insane.  The torture lasted for weeks including kids not even connected to the event because they had alibi.  It is scientifically proven that torture produces false confessions.  Accept scientific fact!

Admissible or inadmissible is a sideshow, and even the falsely produced confessions are inconsistent which only points to their being false.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

1 is highly likely and 2b is a joke.  You are way too trusting of people who have done nothing to earn trust and everything to erode their credibility and demonstrate improper and tyrannical motivations.

I'm sure some tag mechir people out there have made molotov cocktails before , no connection to this crime, that is some of the flimsiest "evidence" I've ever heard.
Remember all the burnt prayer rugs the govt tore kria over?

[edu]

I agree with Kahane-Was-Right BT
I will also add the fact that after many months of administrative detention of "suspects" suspected of the Duma arson, they released some of them and admitted they were innocent, once they found their scapegoat.
This proves they were not relying on a reliable informant, but were just out to terrorize the true right or set up the public mood to allow themselves to get away with future evil actions against the settlers without risking a public outcry.

[Zelhar]

That was just a quick example I thought of, I don't know what information they provided the inquisitors.

Why do you think scenario 1 is highly likely? Do you think shabak agents are willing to conspire and frame completely innocent people? manufacture evidence, risk having one of their own snitch on them, risk that the accuser will produce a solid alibi etc. The more people involved in a conspiracy the more likely it is to be unvocvered.

1 is highly likely and 2b is a joke.  You are way too trusting of people who have done nothing to earn trust and everything to erode their credibility and demonstrate improper and tyrannical motivations.

I'm sure some tag mechir people out there have made molotov cocktails before , no connection to this crime, that is some of the flimsiest "evidence" I've ever heard.
Remember all the burnt prayer rugs the govt tore kria over?

[edu]

You don't like conspiracy theories so I will take a case that is well known and agreed upon.
The Shabak operated agent Avishai Raviv to entrap the right wing and to "take credit" for crimes which the Left-wing government than used as a excuse to punish the settlers.
What punishment happened to Avishai Raviv and his handlers when the whole story was exposed? Nothing!

[Zelhar]

It is fact that Avishai Raviv was an agent provocateur. He organized a show for the Israeli news where he leads a supposedly underground jouth organisation. They wore masks but it is known that he was the guy I think he also admitted. He and his operators escaped justice.

I don't know how much he was involved in the assasination of Rabin. As far as I know Yigal Amir doesn't claim that Avishai Raviv incited him, nor that he provided him weapon and ammunition.

If there is anything you need to know before you join a Jewish underground, it is that there are  snitchers and agents everywhere, maybe as many as real members. If they have 3 members one is probably a snitch. There are snitch rabbis and snitch yeshiva heads and if somebody tries to recreuit you by all likelihood this is a shabak agent. That is why all undergrounds get caught. Only lone operators have some chance of escaping like, alegedly, Jack Titel.

You don't like conspiracy theories so I will take a case that is well known and agreed upon.
The Shabak operated agent Avishai Raviv to entrap the right wing and to "take credit" for crimes which the Left-wing government than used as a excuse to punish the settlers.
What punishment happened to Avishai Raviv and his handlers when the whole story was exposed? Nothing!

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

That was just a quick example I thought of, I don't know what information they provided the inquisitors.

Why do you think scenario 1 is highly likely? Do you think shabak agents are willing to conspire and frame completely innocent people? manufacture evidence, risk having one of their own snitch on them, risk that the accuser will produce a solid alibi etc. The more people involved in a conspiracy the more likely it is to be unvocvered.

It is already proven yes that they will and have done these things!

One of the boys kept in administrative detention DID produce an alibi, his parents stated he was with them at the time of a supposed crime, and they continued keeping him hostage and torturing him, ignoring their claims.  I know because I cited the article in a thread here.  There arent that many people involved in this conspiracy because of its tyrannical format and because the executioners align to the same politics driving this.

[edu]

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/19265

“I saw Sa'ad and Reham burning on the ground. Next to them were TWO masked men, one beside each of them. They were dressed in jeans and black long-sleeved shirts…“Their faces were covered with a balaclava, with only the mouth and eyes visible. The street light  shone directly on them. I was horrified by what I saw. They saw me and I was frightened and ran back home. I told my brother Bishar to get help and returned to Sa'ad’s house where I no longer saw the TWO masked men – Eye-witness account of Duma arson attack by Ibrahim Dawabsheh, a relative of the victims, Amira Hass, Haaretz,  July 31, 2015.

According to the charge sheet, [on] the night of the attack on the Dawabsheh home, Ben-Uliel decided to proceed with the arson ALONE...He allegedly searched for a home that was inhabited and used his first firebomb on a two-storey building that turned out to be uninhabited. He then proce[e]ded to the Dawabshehs' home, prepared his firebomb in the yard and spray-painted graffiti on the walls, before throwing the firebomb into the house and fleeing on foot. –Chaim Levinson and Barak Ravid, Haaretz Jan. 3, 2016.
A year ago—almost to the day—on July 31, 2015, the entire country was horrified by reports of three members of the Dawabsheh family from the village of Duma being burnt to death in an arson attack on their home.  Graffiti, in Hebrew script painted on the walls of the burnt out residence, led to the precipitous conclusion that the act was committed by “Jewish terrorists”. Since that deplorable attack, at least three more houses of the Dawabsheh clan have been torched –as were two prior to it--without any hint of involvement of “Jewish extremists.

But more on that later

Rabid reverse racism?

The ghastly tragedy ignited a flurry of self-righteous handwringing and sanctimonious self-recrimination across wide sections of Israeli society—and almost all sections of the mainstream media.  In a stroke, all external threats to the nation faded into near insignificance. Attention was no longer focused on the looming specter of a nuclear Iran, or the threat of radical Islam pressing against the country’s beleaguered frontiers. Suddenly the existential threat facing Israel was that of “Jewish terror”—the “menace” of a few dozen, marginalized, scraggly youth that inhabit the desolate windswept hilltops of Judea-Samaria.

Without a shred of evidence to corroborate their accusations, journalist after journalist seemed to compete in the levels of acrimony in which they attacked the assumed perpetrators. With unquestioning confidence--as unequivocal as it was unsubstantiated--regarding the collective identity of the perpetrators, and the collective guilt of Israeli society at large for the heinous nature of the act, they launched into a savage frenzy of self-flagellation.
Thus, barely two days after the arson attack, in an astounding piece of rabid reverse racism entitled “We're no better than our enemies”, Yediot Aharonot’s Sima Kadmon lamented: “…let no one say that this is a lone incident… Jewish terrorists are just the messengers; there is a well-oiled system of incitement behind them… it's time to tell the truth, the heartbreaking but inevitable one: After a generation of right-wing rule, we have developed a race…[n]ot proud, not generous, but definitely cruel…”   

“Israelis identical with ISIS”

In a flash, all distinction between Israelis and ISIS was erased.

Think I am exaggerating? Think again! Here is a sampling of the” anguished” soul-searching that became the fashionable journalistic ritual in the mainstream media.

On the very night of the dreadful crime, Ynetnews’s Ron Ben Yishai had already solved the case. In “How to stop Jewish jihad” he determined--definitively “…this is religious-messianic terrorism, committed by people who view themselves as acting according to God's true will. In simpler words - this is Jewish jihadism, identical in every detail to Islamic jihadism”.

In her previously mentioned piece, Sima Kadmon concurred in “agonized” agreement: “It's over. If we thought it couldn’t happen among us, that we're not like that, that Jews don’t do such things, that only they can murder children, go into houses and shoot a baby point blank, burn families, execute murderous terror – that's it, it's over. We are, we can and we do. Burn children alive, execute murderous, inhuman, incomprehensible terror. And no, we're no better than them.”

It did not take long for this barrage to bear bitter fruit.  Panicked by the media assault, the political echelons and the security forces threw due process to the wind.

“Little but accusations of thought-crimes”?
Within days, administrative arrests were made. Meir Ettinger, Eviatar Slonim, and Mordechai Meir were incarcerated without trial, reportedly on suspicion of involvement in the Duma arson.


One after the other, the detainees were eventually released- Meir in early January, Slonim early February, and Ettinger in June this year.
The arrests were accompanied by ominous warnings of the impending perils to the nation, entailed in the nefarious deeds, both past and planned, of the detainees, who were held incommunicado for extended periods, without any specific charges being brought against them.  Persistent rumors of the use of harsh interrogation techniques abounded—but no charges were ever brought.

One after the other, the detainees were eventually released- Meir in early January, Slonim early February, and Ettinger in June this year.
 

The case of Ettinger particularly reeks of needless mean-spiritedness.  In April, in a ruling upheld by the Supreme Court, he was denied—after months in detention—permission to attend the circumcision ceremony (brit mila) of his newly born son. The grounds for the denial were that he still remained “a security threat to the public”. Yet barely a month later, it was announced that he would be released—without charge!

The fate of the detainees—unsurprisingly but depressingly—has led to little or no outrage from the usually strident defenders of human rights.  Indeed, what is looking increasingly like draconian abuse of power, arbitrary violation of civil liberties and a troubling incarceration for little more than “thought crimes” has been greeted with deafening silence by the vociferous chorus of left-leaning voices, always eager to denounce any hint of excess use of governmental power.

Indeed, later developments are not more reassuring.

In early December 2015, the Israeli authorities detained 21 year old  Aviram Ben-Uliel, by administrative arrest. After keeping silent for almost 3 weeks, Ben-Uliel was, for reasons yet unclear, declared a “ticking time bomb” (i.e. a source of clear and present danger), and subjected to torture to extract a confession. On the basis of this confession, an indictment was filed (January 3, 2016) against him—and another unnamed minor, charged with aiding Ben-Uliel, but not of actually perpetrating the arson.
 

Based on the confession obtained under duress—which he subsequently retracted—the indictment against Ben-Uliel is troubling for a number of reasons. For as Chaim Levinson of Haaretz points out, it is significantly at odds with the eyewitness accounts of what took place on the night of the lethal arson.

Disturbing discrepancies 

All of these accounts refer to multiple assailants—at least two— as reflected in the opening excerpt from Ibrahim Dawabsheh, described as a “key witness” in the case. Yet in the confession-based indictment, Ben-Uliel is accused of acting alone!

Moreover, initial accounts mention the use of a motor vehicle—and some arrests were even made on the basis of those accounts – see “Jewish terror suspects indicted, but convictions, if any, will be long in the making” – Haaretz, January 4, 2016.

Accordingly, it is difficult to resist raising the troubling question that, if the initial determinations in this case (multiple perpetrators, involvement of a motor vehicle) have apparently proved “unfounded”, could it not be within the bounds of possibility that other aspects of the original assumptions might prove equally unfounded, including not only the number of assailants, and their mode of mobility, but also their identity, and even, heaven forfend... their ethnicity?