Author Topic: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.  (Read 46289 times)

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Offline Trumpeldor

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2007, 01:48:23 AM »
Chaim, with all due respect, I cannot agree with you.

By your own logic, someone who is kind to the wicked will be wicked to the kind. Huckabee has proven that in spades. He is in love with wetbacks, black rapists, drug dealers
Chaimfan

The rapist who he set free was white, Chaimfan.

Regardless, Chaim knows all this and is not endorsing Huckabee. I think he will make it explicitly clear that we are supporting Huckabee as the lesser of the evils because we have no choice.

A Hillary or Obamuslim presidency is rather inevitable should Huck fail.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2007, 01:50:27 AM »
UGGH... I am just not sure I can do this. The man disgusts me more than all the other GOP candidates combined.

UGGH.  8;) :o >:(

Offline Trumpeldor

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2007, 01:53:57 AM »
UGGH... I am just not sure I can do this. The man disgusts me more than all the other GOP candidates combined.

UGGH.  8;) :o >:(

No one is forcing you, Chaimfan, to support Huck as the lesser of the evils. You can have a difference of opinion with JTF. Your position not to gamble on this Huckster may turn out to be the principled one...

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2007, 01:57:19 AM »
I just can't stomach it. There is a wonderful, righteous man on the ballot, and I can't bring myself to vote for a scumbag even if there's no way he can win.

I'm not saying for sure I won't vote for Huckster... just that right now I cannot countenance it in the least.

Offline JTFFan

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2007, 08:46:07 AM »
Well, judging by all the other candidates that might have a chance Giuliani and Huckabee, and if Huckabee fail's Giuliani would be my choice. I know, it's alot to stomache this has happened many times in elections, where are the righteous candidates? :o ???

Offline RationalThought110

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #30 on: December 06, 2007, 11:52:58 AM »
Joe Farah's view:

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=59047

His article is accurate.  I think both Huckabee and Rick Warren are more liberal pastors.  Warren believes in global warming.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 12:19:24 PM by RationalThought110 »

Offline Dr. Dan

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2007, 12:08:38 PM »
Joe Farah's view:

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=59047

His article is accurate.  I think both Huckabee and Rick Warren are more liberal pastors.  Warren believes in global warming.


Nice article.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 12:15:19 PM by RationalThought110 »
If someone says something bad about you, say something nice about them. That way, both of you would be lying.

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Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2007, 12:31:05 PM »
UGGH... don't get me started on Rick Warren and his Saddleback Church. He is best friends with Obama and thinks the greatest crisis on earth is AIDS in Africa.

Offline Dr. Dan

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2007, 12:34:23 PM »
UGGH... don't get me started on Rick Warren and his Saddleback Church. He is best friends with Obama and thinks the greatest crisis on earth is AIDS in Africa.

Maybe Huckabee looks favorably on Barak Hussein Osama...
If someone says something bad about you, say something nice about them. That way, both of you would be lying.

In your heart you know WE are right and in your guts you know THEY are nuts!

"Science without religion is lame; Religion without science is blind."  - Albert Einstein

Online Chaim Ben Pesach

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2007, 07:39:49 PM »
UGGH... don't get me started on Rick Warren and his Saddleback Church. He is best friends with Obama and thinks the greatest crisis on earth is AIDS in Africa.

Maybe Huckabee looks favorably on Barak Hussein Osama...

Now we're getting carried away. Obama is a black Muslim Jew-hater who has always been anti-Israel. Huckabee is the first major presidential candidate in history to state that he opposes any Israeli territorial retreats. Huckabee's position distinguishes him from the other establishment candidates, and from the establishment view since 1948 that tiny Israel must commit national suicide for "peace".

People here have spoken about Huckabee as if Israel is the only issue in which there is a big difference. People are forgetting that on energy independence, which is ESSENTIAL to the survival of America and the Western world, Huckabee is also clearly distinguishing himself from the other candidates. Huckabee is the ONLY candidate saying the right things about energy. He has made it a huge part of his campaign and has promised that it is the very first thing he will deal with as president. He has promised that he will make America energy independent within 10 years, while ALL of the other candidates only promise to REDUCE our dependence on foreign oil, which is the same meaningless baloney that we have gotten from Bush.

And Huckabee is the ONLY major candidate to propose completely eliminating the income tax, the IRS, and taxes on savings and investments. That would be a HUGE change that would greatly benefit America and the whole world. The other establishment candidates all favor keeping the IRS and the income tax, which means in my view, that they are economic Bolsheviks.

On the critical issue of Supreme Court appointments, and appointments to the other federal courts, if Huckabee is being truthful about being pro-life, that could lead to Roe v. Wade being overturned which would dramatically reduce the number of abortions in America.

And if Huckabee is being truthful about his strong commitment to the Second Amendment (the right to bear arms), that could protect a vital Constitutional right that is being taken away little by little from American citizens.

On the homosexual Sodomite issue, Huckabee also claims to be against the pro-homosexual laws that Romney and Giuliani strongly supported in Massachusetts and New York.

On immigration and crime, Huckabee is a disaster. But so are Romney, Giuliani, McCain, Thompson and all of the establishment candidates. We will have a big fight on our hands on immigration no matter who is elected president.

Finally, people are forgetting that the polls currently show Hillary Sodom Clinton narrowly beating the Republicans. Romney the flipflopping Mormon opportunist is not going to beat Clinton. And Giuliani may cause a third party conservative candidacy that will split the Republican vote. With Huckabee, the Republicans will be united and enthusiastic against Clinton, which will give us a chance to win. Even with Huckabee, we will have a very tough fight against Clinton, but at least we'll have a chance. I think a Huckabee-Clinton race would be close with Americans divided almost 50-50 just like in the past two presidential elections of 2000 and 2004. In a Romney-Clinton race, I think Clinton would win easily.

If we support Huckabee, we could begin a major campaign of videos and of posting responses to all of the Huckabee videos, in order to try to influence things.

Offline Trumpeldor

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #35 on: December 06, 2007, 07:45:55 PM »
Chaim

When I read your posts, it's almost as if I hear your voice reading the words to me.

Does anyone else have that?

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #36 on: December 06, 2007, 08:14:52 PM »
Chaim, I have brought up that several times that Huckster's insane views that Jesus wants us to be merciful to hardcore criminals and that Jesus wants us to aid illegal immigrants in every way illustrate that he is kind to the cruel and therefore surely the reverse will show itself to be true soon enough.

I proposed that it is possible that he claims to unconditionally support Israel because he wants to get Christian votes. Maybe I am wrong. However, given his warped ideas of mercy and justice in other areas, can you demonstrate to me why he would not be likely to declare (likely after getting elected) that "Jesus loves the P-words"? He would be the exact type to go that route. There already are a lot of so-called Christian leaders today, even evangelical ones, that make this claim.

Also, what does he want to do about Jonathan Pollard? If he, like 99.9% of the other so-called pro-Israel Republicans out there, professes to "support Israel but Jonathan Pollard is a convicted traitor" (like Tom DeLay and the entire GOP House), then I think we can safely discard anything positive he has to say on any Israeli issue.

As to your other points:

1: It is extremely unlikely that a president, without the support of Congress or at least the overwhelming weight of public opinion, can get us energy independent in ten years. Basically the only way he could even attempt to do this would be via executive order, and this would allow all of his opponents to accuse him of being a dictator and likely run him out of office in four years.

This is assuming he's even sincere about it, which I think is debatable.

2: See above for the likelihood he'll accomplish anything on taxes.

3: It is more likely that he will be able to appoint pro-life justices, but seriously--how likely is any president to be able to replace the entire Court short of Scalia and Thomas?

Please note, Chaim, that I am not saying I for sure won't vote for Huckster. I'm just declaring that it would be very difficult to do so.

Chaimfan

PS: I did not assert that Huckabee supports Obama. I said he is friends with the politically-correct, people-pleasing pastor of a large megachurch out here (Rick Warren) who is in love with that animal.


« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 08:22:41 PM by C.F. »

Online Chaim Ben Pesach

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #37 on: December 06, 2007, 09:11:39 PM »
Right now, Huckabee's position on Israel is better than the other candidates. He could have said the same thing that Romney, Giuliani, McCain and the others are saying, namely that he supports a PLO-Hamas state in Judea and Samaria but only if the Arab Muslim Nazis stop engaging in terrorism, and the Christians and Jews stupidly would have been satisfied with that answer. You never see anyone criticizing the establishment candidates for their stand on Israel. But Huckabee chose to break away from that establishment view, and said that he is against tiny Israel giving up land. Whether he sticks to that position is something I can't predict. But right now he clearly is the best candidate on Israel.

On energy, I disagree with you CF. Creating a crash program to achieve energy independence in 10 years is very realistic if you have a president who will make it a major national priority. I believe that most Americans want energy independence and would strongly support a crash program. This would enable a president to get such a program through the Congress. This issue alone would have enormous implications. I think Huckabee really wants to do this. Unfortunately, he wants this also for silly "environmental" reasons. But the end result would be a devastating blow to the Muslim world.

CF, you're right about Huckabee having mercy on the cruel. That's his number one flaw. That's why he takes such insane positions on immigration and crime. He believes that he has to do this as a Christian, which is absurd. But on these issues, all of the candidates with any chance of winning are terrible. I do believe that Huckabee is the lesser of the evils on immigration compared to Clinton or Obama, because the Republican and conservative base overwhelmingly opposes amnesty and will try to keep Huckabee in check. The Democrat and leftist base of Clinton and Obama overwhelmingly support amnesty and open borders, so there will be no check on a Clinton or Obama presidency.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #38 on: December 06, 2007, 09:46:57 PM »
Dearest Chaim,

I am enjoying this discussion/debate. I think this shows the world that JTF members are free to differ from you and that we can keep these differences extremely civil and intellectual. For the record, I am not positive that all I am saying is correct, but merely want you to consider the other side of the coin on all of your points.

A. Israel

1. How can we be sure that he is sincere on Israel? Considering his warped, twisted theology--which is not found in the New Testament--I think it is fair to consider whether he may be using Israel as an issue by which to corner the Christian vote amidst a terrible pack. I am certain you will agree with me that the vast majority of professing Christians who share his views on immigration, race, crime, terrorism, and Third World nations tend to also believe in the notion of a Fagestinian Race and hate Israel. I made a thread about several of these so-called believers to give some background.

2. Where does he stand on Jonathan Pollard?

3. Doesn't Duncan Hunter unconditionally support Israel also?

B. Energy Independence

1. Perhaps I should have qualified--it will be very difficult to push this through if he is sincere. If he is not, then it is a nonstarter. We all saw what happened to Bush's grand plan to privatize Social Security. He pretty much bailed on it a week after he proposed it. He even failed in his goal of legalizing all the wetbacks, and that was the very heart and soul of his presidency. Becoming energy independent will be more difficult than abolishing Social Security or legalizing the cucarachas. Do I believe that a very popular president who makes it his top priority will be able to pull it off? Yes. Will it be difficult? Yes. Do I think that someone going into this halfheartedly will be able to pull it off? Absolutely not.

2. Just recently, Huckabee did propose a border-enforcement plan that looks quite good on paper. This is obviously very contrary to where we know he stands on the issue. Since this is obviously a sham and a vote-getting stunt, how do you know his energy-independence plan is not?

3. Even if he is real right now on this, how do you know what would happen when he realizes you need Big Oil to pay your way into the White House?

C. Immigration
I concede to you that Huckabee's views on immigration are not really worse than the other candidates', and in fact perhaps you could give him credit for being honest about it. At the same time, the fact that he is doing this out of heartfelt religious zeal, rather than crony politicking, could make him more dangerous and determined than the mainstreamers.

D. Abortion
So, he says he will appoint only pro-life judges. What president has actually followed through with that? Every Republican promises to outlaw abortion in the primaries, in order to placate the party base, but as soon as the general comes around quickly backtracks and throws in a million exceptions for when he believes abortion should be permitted.

For the record, Chaim, if I could be positive that all of your optimistic projections about his good qualities were true, there is a very good chance I would vote for him.

Chaimfan

Offline takebackourtemple

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #39 on: December 06, 2007, 10:20:02 PM »
   I'm still routing for Rudy. He might not be perfect, but I have seen first-hand how he cleaned up New York and would like to see the same done for the rest of the country. If Rudy doesn't win than Huckabee will be my second choice. I want Rudy to choose Bob Ehrlich as his vice presidential running mate, but considering that probably won't happen, I hope that Rudy chooses Huchabee.
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Offline Christian Zionist

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #40 on: December 06, 2007, 11:01:29 PM »
   I'm still routing for Rudy. He might not be perfect, but I have seen first-hand how he cleaned up New York and would like to see the same done for the rest of the country. If Rudy doesn't win than Huckabee will be my second choice. I want Rudy to choose Bob Ehrlich as his vice presidential running mate, but considering that probably won't happen, I hope that Rudy chooses Huchabee.

I concur takebackourtemple.

Evangelicals without any discernment trusted George Bush and now he is a disaster.  He has done a job of thousands of muslim mullahs by repeatedly declaring islam as a religion of peace.  This is one of the reasons Pat Robertson endorsed Rudy Giuliani.   South Dakota voters rejected ban on all abortions.  However the supreme court has ruled in favor of banning partial birth abortion.  So in this culture it is not practically possible to ban all abortions.  For Pat Robertson supreme court approving the ban of partial birth abortion is "mission accomplished" when it comes to the issue of abortion.  Regarding homosexuality again is not possible to pass an amendment to define that marriage should be between a man and a woman with more number of liberals likely to get elected in the future senate elections.  With all these things in mind Pat Robertson endorsed Rudy Giuliani.   Pat Robertson also believes that Rudy Giuliani is the ideal candidate to kick U.N. out of America.    Right now we need a candidate who can really wage a global war against islam.  To achieve this goal I believe Rudy is the ideal candidate.

Dear Chaim,

We have a lot of self-hating Christians in our midst like self-hating Jews in the Jewish community.  We are our worst enemies.  Huckabee could be come a "compassionate" conservative like George Bush after getting elected.   We never know, his compassion might also reach out to homosexuals and muslims. With the bitter experience we had with the so-called Evangelical Christian George Bush we have to be very cautious about supporting Huckabee.  Like Chaim Fan pointed out if Huckabee brings pseudo-Christian leaders like Rick Warren, Chuck Colson and other Israel haters into his inner circle they will definitely mislead him.  Pat Robertson, who is 78 years old now knows very well about all Christian leaders. I trust Pat Robertson's judgment.

Shalom
Christian Zionist


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Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #41 on: December 06, 2007, 11:11:53 PM »
Chuck Colson is a Jew-hater? I did not know that.  >:(

Offline JR-Obilic

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #42 on: December 06, 2007, 11:12:20 PM »
i think all politics are bollocks.  these people just get ur hopes up then let u down.

at the same time, i've been watching the debates and so far i definitelly like Huckabee.  In fact, he's the only one i can stand.
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Offline Christian Zionist

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #43 on: December 06, 2007, 11:25:14 PM »
Chuck Colson is a Jew-hater? I did not know that.  >:(

Yes he is.  He does not believe in the restoration of Israel.
Isaiah 62:1 -  For Zion's sake I am not silent, And for Jerusalem's sake I do not rest, Till her righteousness go out as brightness, And her salvation, as a torch that burns.

Offline MasterWolf1

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #44 on: December 06, 2007, 11:33:39 PM »
How is Huckabee's stance on Islamic terror?? Thats a very big issue with me and that includes Iran
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Offline JTFFan

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #45 on: December 06, 2007, 11:36:33 PM »
Chuck Colson is a Jew-hater? I did not know that.  >:(

Yes he is.  He does not believe in the restoration of Israel.

Yes he is a jew-hater. >:(

Offline MasterWolf1

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RIGHT WING AMERICAN AND PROUD OF IT. IF YOU WANTED TO PROVE YOU WEREN'T A "RACIST" IN 2008 BY VOTING FOR OBAMA, THEN PROVE IN 2012 YOU ARE NOT AN IDIOT FOR VOTING AGAINST OBAMA!

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #47 on: December 07, 2007, 02:41:45 AM »
I know that he (Huckster) has b**ched about alleged torture of al-Qaeda suspects. So... don't expect him to win in Iraq or anywhere else anytime soon.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #48 on: December 07, 2007, 02:54:29 AM »
As for Chuck Colson, I found this:

http://www.watch.org/showart.php3?idx=55020&rtn=/index.html&showsubj=1&mcat=1

His is the first op-ed piece on the page. He spouts the same two-state crap that everybody else on the planet does. Is he a deliberate Jew-hater or just a suck-up phony? Hard to say.

Since he was one of Nixon's cronies, it isn't hard to picture the former, though.

The sad truth is that the majority of Christians--and probably at least half of evangelical ones--subscribe to his views.  :(

Offline RationalThought110

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Re: Should JTF Support Huckabee? I Think So.
« Reply #49 on: December 07, 2007, 12:57:37 PM »
What do you think of the speech that Huckabee gave to the Council on Foreign Relations:

http://www.cfr.org/publication/14335/


He did mention energy independence:

"The first thing I will do as president is send Congress my comprehensive plan for energy independence, which we will achieve by the end of my second term. To those who say it will take twenty years, I compare the lackadaisical pace of work when you bring your car in for service with the urgent, concentrated effort made when a NASCAR driver pulls up for a pit stop. We must view becoming energy independent like a pit stop where every second counts, not like dropping off the family station wagon for Goober and Gomer to work on.  We will explore, we will conserve, and we will pursue all avenues of alternative energy – nuclear, wind, solar, hydrogen, clean coal, ethanol and other biomass, and biodiesel."