Author Topic: I'm a young guy, I have a girlfriend and we want to marry!  (Read 38900 times)

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Offline dibblah

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I'm a young guy, I have a girlfriend and we want to marry!
« on: January 24, 2008, 11:10:28 PM »
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
« Last Edit: October 16, 2008, 05:45:50 PM by Jasmina »

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2008, 11:12:43 PM »
A Jew cannot marry a non-Jew. Sorry I know it's tough but there you have it.

If you do anyway, what religion will you raise the children as?

Offline KansasJew

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2008, 11:39:16 PM »
I would have to ask the following question.
Is She Orthodox, Conservative, or Reformed from that point. More questions can follow.
Remember there has to be strong silent men on the walls at night to protect the people. Be Strong but not aggressive. Be Peaceful but not weak. Defend the Jewish People at all cost.

Offline OdKahaneChai

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2008, 11:49:01 PM »
As Newman said, a Jew cannot marry a non-Jew.  You can talk to a local Rabbi who can explain it to you in depth.

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Offline KansasJew

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2008, 11:53:38 PM »
This is true Jews are forbidden to marry outside of their religion. However in the Reformed Movement and I am not sure of the Conversative. They have no issue of Non Jews and Reformed Marrying.
Remember there has to be strong silent men on the walls at night to protect the people. Be Strong but not aggressive. Be Peaceful but not weak. Defend the Jewish People at all cost.

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2008, 12:49:08 AM »
Thank you all for your comments and suggestions. They are much appreciated.

-*Mills* Thanks for your insights, I appreciate what you're saying, but yes she is definately from a full Jewish family although they are not the most conservative as they would have never allowed her to date a gentile in the first place!

Please bear in mind though that when we met we had no idea of each others religion/faiths until at least the 3rd date!

I would have no problem at all in bringing my children up as Jewish if it meant we could be married. This does not come lightly to me as I am from an Irish Catholic family, going back for many Centauries.

However, my mother brought me up from an early age (along with a few licks of the spatula) to respect and understand Judaism as the bedrock of our faith (and in our view it is also ours in the form of the Tanach.) Moreover, the strength of Jewish family bonds, unity and support, throughout the Jewish community has always been an inspiration to her in the pulling together of her own family.

My girlfriend does not know I am a JTF member...she is fairly liberal but knows the strength of my beliefs..she does not know I am posting here, but it seems appropriate that I should ask advice from fellow members of a cause I deeply believe in.

I think its best that we see how it goes as neither of us would ever give up our religion (and I would never want it so). Are there any alternatives?- we would not have a civil marriage. I would dearly welcome your advice.

-Thank you.

Offline KansasJew

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2008, 01:10:48 AM »
I will tell you something my Orthodox friends and Rabbi would tell you. If you convert to Judaism for the sake of Marriage. This is not allowed. You have to want to convert because YOU have a desire to convert for yourself not for your future spouse.

It may sound harsh but centuries of Traditions and experiences have taught us well to abstain for intermarriages.
Remember there has to be strong silent men on the walls at night to protect the people. Be Strong but not aggressive. Be Peaceful but not weak. Defend the Jewish People at all cost.

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2008, 01:11:45 AM »
Thank you Mills...I know you're speaking sense and the truth of it. It is a hard one though, we are very much in love...

I think I'll show her these posts now to try and bring this to a head.

Thank you so much for taking the time I've been at a bit of a loss so far.

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2008, 02:30:37 AM »
This issue is very difficult. I know what you are saying in my heart, in rational thought and in religous ethics is the truth; however it is difficult to accept outright.

Sometimes there is such a thing as doing what you feel is right. I suppose that I am trying to build up an argument to defy what you have said but at every turn, in truth, I cannot do it.

I showed her these posts from yesterday and she cried, but she did not say that anything that was stated was wrong or lies. Although from a very liberal Jewish family she (when push comes to shove) would not forego her faith, as I would never convert to Jadaism, not because I have any great objections, but when you believe, you believe....The fact remains though that I dont think her family would object to the union. We are well suited and we want the same things... a big family, house in the country ect...

The strange thing here is that although my mother thinks she is a great girl, my mother also says that ultimately I should marry a good catholic girl from an Irish family. I think she thinks this year-long relationship will somehow just fizzle away. This is despite the fact that she brought me up all my life to view the Jewish people as brothers and sisters (we have many Jewish family friends) and she has always lauded their sense of family and unity as one to be aspiring to- by everyone!.

I'm starting to think that the elders of both religions are striving to protect the integrity of their people. This may not be such a bad thing, but it does cause a degree of dis-unity when we should be joining to fight the common enemy- Islam.

It may well be that the romantic element in all this will not stack up against what is clearly a huge mountain. It is very sad. The thing is (as far as I know)Catholics are not forbidden to marry Jews, so why the other way around?

Whatever comes of this relationship, it will not matter to me in the bigger scheme of things...my absolute devotion to the cause of trying to protect and defend the holy land of Israel for the Jews (because it is our spiritual holy land too) will never diminish. Moreover we have a huge battle on our hands in which all us must play a part. We must stand united for as long as it takes until there is never again any Muslim threat to our peoples.

I do not think that in the end we will now marry. The seed of doubt has been planted and this is usually enough. You know how it is though, two people meet and fall in love but family, religion and beliefs are 3 very hard things to fly in the face of with little or no regard to the consequences.

I want to thank you guys very much for your candid, honest and wise counsel on this matter. After all, history has already proven you right.

God bless.

Offline Merkava

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2008, 08:37:27 AM »
"And loving them should be active, not passive.



hehehehehe .....Iakov you naughty boy.  ^-^
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Offline Vito

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2008, 11:56:39 AM »
Western "falling in love" is false. If you can "fall in love", then you can "fall out of love". The real way to find love is pick a person and decide you want to get to know them. And loving them should be active, not passive.



"Fall in love" is a term, of course it's not passive, I don't think anyone thinks of it as passive except for Hollywood scum.

Offline Tina Greco - Melbourne

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2008, 07:39:56 PM »
Western "falling in love" is false. If you can "fall in love", then you can "fall out of love". The real way to find love is pick a person and decide you want to get to know them. And loving them should be active, not passive.



Western ideas are false  :::D :::D

Some of this I love you business every 5 seconds yes I agree, but others no.

Offline KansasJew

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2008, 07:55:03 PM »
Falling in love....Sounds like someone fell into a hole while walking and not paying attention.....
Remember there has to be strong silent men on the walls at night to protect the people. Be Strong but not aggressive. Be Peaceful but not weak. Defend the Jewish People at all cost.

Offline Tina Greco - Melbourne

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2008, 07:57:19 PM »
Falling in love....Sounds like someone fell into a hole while walking and not paying attention.....

Well its pretty much it  ;)

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2008, 10:00:06 PM »
Hey *Mills*,

-Thank you very much, and for sharing your own experiences on this issue and for your very objective views. I realise as a Jewish lady this cannot be an easy thing in this context. Also, I appreciate your support for a Catholic family that has been brought up to love the Jewish people as brothers and sisters. I think you will find that this is a fairly common theme in many Catholic families, particularly in Ireland and Italy. O0 O0- God bless.


-Also to: "There are no Israeli Arabs"- (Aint that the truth!)  ;)

Thank you for the historical/biological perspective!- -Much appreciated...

- If its any consolation to the conservatives... we have not gone to a Rabbi for counsel, she did not want to. She said that what would be said would be the same as posted here. The only way would be for me to convert to Judaism and that would take up to 2 years and circumcision...I told her I wasn't in the market for that and I would never deny Christ..on pain of death.

I think we both realise that what we wanted was not possible in this day and age. I'm an idealist though..one day I hope that the union in marriage of a Catholic and a Jew would not be so bad...(It certainly does not seem that way to me). -Mixed emotions in truth, but thank you for your advice.

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2008, 05:09:13 PM »
Dear Sir,

She is certainly not an orthodox Jew but I will ask her to talk to her Rabbi on this subject next time she goes to Temple. I will show her your post.

If at the end of all this what you are saying can and may happen, then this is truly a good thing; no matter what religion. -I think that we will miss each other but ultimately we may both benefit in the long run. I can't help thinking though: What a strange place the Jews and Catholics are in......?

Offline OdKahaneChai

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2008, 07:25:15 PM »
Dear Sir,

She is certainly not an orthodox Jew but I will ask her to talk to her Rabbi on this subject next time she goes to Temple. I will show her your post.
Have her talk to an Orthodox Rabbi.  He is the only reliable source of information on this subject.  Where do you live?

One does not deal with terrorists; one does not bargain with terrorists; one kills terrorists.
- Rabbi Meir Kahane ZT"L, HY"D

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2008, 07:52:40 PM »
London.

Offline OdKahaneChai

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2008, 08:08:18 PM »

One does not deal with terrorists; one does not bargain with terrorists; one kills terrorists.
- Rabbi Meir Kahane ZT"L, HY"D

Offline MarZutra

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2008, 08:20:52 PM »
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
It would appear that you understand and practice your faith while it is obvious that your girlfriend does not.  I would suggest that either she learn her faith and you as well, or the other way round.  In future, where children are concerned there may be a major conflict and/or friction as they decide to either pick a faith or abandon it entirely for "progressive" socialistic "humanist" ideal...
"‘Vehorashtem/Numbers 33:53’: When you burn out the Land’s inhabitants, you will merit to bestow upon your children the Land as an inheritance. If you do not burn them out, then even if you conquer the Land, you will not merit to allot it to your children as an inheritance." - Ovadiah ben Yacov Sforno; Italian Rabbi, Biblical Commentator, Philosopher and Physician.  1475-1550.

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #20 on: February 06, 2008, 08:27:45 PM »
Dear "There are no Israeli Arabs"

I have had my own reasons for joining this website, mainly because I saw and watched the links of David and Chaim on LiveLeak and Utube which were provided to me as links from the BNP website.- The only UK party that stands by Israel, has a remit to protect the Judaic/Chritsian tradition of the UK and evict the Muslim fachsits from our shores. I am a party member, a Catholic and pro Israeli; no more or less than how I have been brought up by my parents- having had the benefit of a good education, travel and life experience, I can now choose my own qualified path that I firmly believe in.

I believe that I would be failing in my duty to my ancestors, God and the desire for a peaceful world if I did not stand up and be counted.- That is why I am here on this JTF forum. It is purely incidental that my girlfriend happens to be Jewish.

TBH the fact of who my girlfriend was (her religion et. al.) 3 months ago, had no bearing on anything, it just simply did not matter to us. Other than cautionary words from both our sets of parents, we were simply just late 20-30's people on the dating game. We are both fairly succesful, have good jobs and have dreams to match. It was a subject that we knew existed and probably had to be confronted at some point as the relationship grew more serious, but one that we sidelined as much as we could. I am sure we are not alone in this.

In truth I have been quite taken aback by the level of belief, Tannach and feeling on this subject against our union. However I do understand that you wouldn't want your daughter to be bringing a Catholic boy back to the family to be betrothed any more than probabaly my elders would. -(Although I know in fairness that my mother is a hopeless romantic and would welcome her if I told her I loved her.)

Allright, so now we have a date for this Friday.. a drink, but not a meal-which is unusual. I think either she or I will end it at this stage, it will not be a pleasant event.  I will reccomend that she speak to an Orthodox Rabbi.- This I promise. I know in her heart that she is very fundamentaly Jewish. She may or may not take my advice, but I think at that point I will have done my duty.

I have done my best to preserve the respect between both religions. I can do no more.. and at what cost???- I only hope that it is worth it in the final analysis.- Shalom.

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #21 on: February 06, 2008, 08:33:53 PM »
North London,-Southgate.- Why do you ask?

Offline MarZutra

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #22 on: February 06, 2008, 08:36:15 PM »
Hello Dibblah, You are in a rock and a hard place as I had been a few years ago and my Aunt (67) and uncle (80) are in today.  She's Jewish (Deformed) and he's (Catholic).  She's an ignoramus on Judaism but loves to preach the "line" while he knows his faith and much of the time it ends in an arguement.  

I think, nothing against her or you, it makes things a hell of a lot easier if both parties were of the same basic beliefs.  Perhaps is why one doesn't see "right wingers" marrying, or even talking to, "left wingers"...unless it is in a debate, arguement or brawl...lol

You are doing the right thing brother, Jews can support Catholics and Catholics can support Jews.  When it comes down to it in the end, I think you'll wish to be with one that is akin to you both ideologically and spiritually.  

No need to start off behind the 8 ball brother... :)
"‘Vehorashtem/Numbers 33:53’: When you burn out the Land’s inhabitants, you will merit to bestow upon your children the Land as an inheritance. If you do not burn them out, then even if you conquer the Land, you will not merit to allot it to your children as an inheritance." - Ovadiah ben Yacov Sforno; Italian Rabbi, Biblical Commentator, Philosopher and Physician.  1475-1550.

Offline dibblah

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #23 on: February 06, 2008, 08:47:50 PM »
Thanks MarZutra,

-For putting a human face on it and a sense of humour.

I have to say though, I realy, realy hate these divivions, but I cannot deny them. But for the acknowledgement of Christ as the son of God (or otherwise) we would be the same people... Imagine that...how one thing can change everything, for so many people. - What a great shame, to all of us.

However we can both, in true faith, look to Moses to lead us to where we all need to be.

What a wonderful life!

Offline MarZutra

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Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
« Reply #24 on: February 06, 2008, 08:55:21 PM »
Thanks MarZutra,

-For putting a human face on it and a sense of humour.

I have to say though, I realy, realy hate these divivions, but I cannot deny them. But for the acknowledgement of Christ as the son of G-d (or otherwise) we would be the same people... Imagine that...how one thing can change everything, for so many people. - What a great shame, to all of us.

However we can both, in true faith, look to Moses to lead us to where we all need to be.

What a wonderful life!
Similar to that of Bavel (The Tower of Babble), if G-d wanted everyone to be the same, would you not consider that he'd have made us all the same?  Perhaps, this egalitarian thought, that is so propagated today via every progressive avenue, was invented by man while G-d has a very different agenda? 
"‘Vehorashtem/Numbers 33:53’: When you burn out the Land’s inhabitants, you will merit to bestow upon your children the Land as an inheritance. If you do not burn them out, then even if you conquer the Land, you will not merit to allot it to your children as an inheritance." - Ovadiah ben Yacov Sforno; Italian Rabbi, Biblical Commentator, Philosopher and Physician.  1475-1550.