Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
Who wrote the Zohar - Rashbi or Moshe de Leon?
q_q_:
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on November 10, 2008, 01:57:26 PM ---
--- Quote from: q_q_ on November 08, 2008, 07:17:18 PM ---There is a kabbalistic idea that the heavenly torah is written with black fire upon white fire. Do you seriously think it's talking about black holes?
--- End quote ---
Actually, that idea is from the midrash (Midrash Tanchuma), and it is quoted by Rashi in his commentary on the Chumash. (Parashat vzot ha'bracha). It was a comment on the words of the Torah: "aish da'at" which was explicit in the Parasha describing Hashem's "fiery law" (or 'law of fire?' The translation I have is 'fiery law'), which he gave to the Jewish people.
--- End quote ---
From what you've written, it looks like you are talking about a different or only a similar idea. So I don't want to think about what you are thinking when you write "that idea".
There really is a kabbalistic idea that the torah is written with black fire upon white fire. Apparently in the zohar.
Kahane-Was-Right BT:
--- Quote from: q_q_ on November 10, 2008, 02:19:57 PM ---
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on November 10, 2008, 01:57:26 PM ---
--- Quote from: q_q_ on November 08, 2008, 07:17:18 PM ---There is a kabbalistic idea that the heavenly torah is written with black fire upon white fire. Do you seriously think it's talking about black holes?
--- End quote ---
Actually, that idea is from the midrash (Midrash Tanchuma), and it is quoted by Rashi in his commentary on the Chumash. (Parashat vzot ha'bracha). It was a comment on the words of the Torah: "aish da'at" which was explicit in the Parasha describing Hashem's "fiery law" (or 'law of fire?' The translation I have is 'fiery law'), which he gave to the Jewish people.
--- End quote ---
From what you've written, it looks like you are talking about a different or only a similar idea. So I don't want to think about what you are thinking when you write "that idea".
There really is a kabbalistic idea that the torah is written with black fire upon white fire. Apparently in the zohar.
--- End quote ---
No, I'm not. It's not from zohar. It's from Midrash Tanchuma. Look it up. The Torah is written in black fire on white fire. That's what the midrash says, and Rashi cites this midrash in his explanation of the pasuk that includes "aish da'at" - If the zohar repeated it, great, but I'm telling you where the idea actually came from.
I'm also not sure what you are implying when you say "I don't want to think about what you are thinking when you write.... " - what does this mean?
"From what I've written" it looks precisely like I am talking about the same idea, and now I've repeated it for you.
q_q_:
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on November 10, 2008, 03:31:29 PM ---
--- Quote from: q_q_ on November 10, 2008, 02:19:57 PM ---
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on November 10, 2008, 01:57:26 PM ---
--- Quote from: q_q_ on November 08, 2008, 07:17:18 PM ---There is a kabbalistic idea that the heavenly torah is written with black fire upon white fire. Do you seriously think it's talking about black holes?
--- End quote ---
Actually, that idea is from the midrash (Midrash Tanchuma), and it is quoted by Rashi in his commentary on the Chumash. (Parashat vzot ha'bracha). It was a comment on the words of the Torah: "aish da'at" which was explicit in the Parasha describing Hashem's "fiery law" (or 'law of fire?' The translation I have is 'fiery law'), which he gave to the Jewish people.
--- End quote ---
From what you've written, it looks like you are talking about a different or only a similar idea. So I don't want to think about what you are thinking when you write "that idea".
There really is a kabbalistic idea that the torah is written with black fire upon white fire. Apparently in the zohar.
--- End quote ---
No, I'm not. It's not from zohar. It's from Midrash Tanchuma. Look it up. The Torah is written in black fire on white fire. That's what the midrash says, and Rashi cites this midrash in his explanation of the pasuk that includes "aish da'at" - If the zohar repeated it, great, but I'm telling you where the idea actually came from.
I'm also not sure what you are implying when you say "I don't want to think about what you are thinking when you write.... " - what does this mean?
"From what I've written" it looks precisely like I am talking about the same idea, and now I've repeated it for you.
--- End quote ---
the summary you wrote before didn't mention the full idea, just a fiery torah.
You have now written the full idea. Very good.
I was only referring to your summary since I don't have the source in front of me. That is why I said "From what you've written..."
Kahane-Was-Right BT:
"That idea" was a response to your comment where you said "there is an idea" which you described as 'black fire on white fire' I don't think it could have been any clearer.
q_q_:
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on November 11, 2008, 04:05:58 PM ---"That idea" was a response to your comment where you said "there is an idea" which you described as 'black fire on white fire' I don't think it could have been any clearer.
--- End quote ---
It was clear..
All i'm saying was that from the way you initially summarised it, it didn't look like the same idea. You were very good though in stating the source, and where it is commonly found, and so on. You are always clear.
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