Author Topic: This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying  (Read 856 times)

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Moshe92

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This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying
« on: May 24, 2009, 08:57:33 PM »
http://www.newsweek.com/id/199147?from=rss

By Fareed Zakaria | NEWSWEEK
   
Everything you know about Iran is wrong, or at least more complicated than you think. Take the bomb. The regime wants to be a nuclear power but could well be happy with a peaceful civilian program (which could make the challenge it poses more complex). What's the evidence? Well, over the last five years, senior Iranian officials at every level have repeatedly asserted that they do not intend to build nuclear weapons. President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has quoted the regime's founding father, Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, who asserted that such weapons were "un-Islamic." The country's Supreme Leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, issued a fatwa in 2004 describing the use of nuclear weapons as immoral. In a subsequent sermon, he declared that "developing, producing or stockpiling nuclear weapons is forbidden under Islam." Last year Khamenei reiterated all these points after meeting with the head of the International Atomic Energy Agency, Mohamed ElBaradei. Now, of course, they could all be lying. But it seems odd for a regime that derives its legitimacy from its fidelity to Islam to declare constantly that these weapons are un-Islamic if it intends to develop them. It would be far shrewder to stop reminding people of Khomeini's statements and stop issuing new fatwas against nukes.


 
A Photographic Journey
The Changing Face of Iran
Video: Isfahan Diary—The Terror Victim
Video: Of the Qu'ran and Quarks
Video: The Laughing Radical
Photos: Emerging Iran
Zakaria: What You Know About Iran is Wrong
On the Road in Iran
Obama Chief of Staff Emanuel Rahm: Israel, Iran
Iran's Next President?
Khatami: 'The Country Can Be Run Better'
ElBaradei: Iranians 'Are Not Fanatics'   
Following a civilian nuclear strategy has big benefits. The country would remain within international law, simply asserting its rights under the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, a position that has much support across the world. That would make comprehensive sanctions against Iran impossible. And if Tehran's aim is to expand its regional influence, it doesn't need a bomb to do so. Simply having a clear "breakout" capacity—the ability to weaponize within a few months—would allow it to operate with much greater latitude and impunity in the Middle East and Central Asia.

Iranians aren't suicidal. In an interview last week, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described the Iranian regime as "a messianic, apocalyptic cult." In fact, Iran has tended to behave in a shrewd, calculating manner, advancing its interests when possible, retreating when necessary. The Iranians allied with the United States and against the Taliban in 2001, assisting in the creation of the Karzai government. They worked against the United States in Iraq, where they feared the creation of a pro-U.S. puppet on their border. Earlier this year, during the Gaza war, Israel warned Hizbullah not to launch rockets against it, and there is much evidence that Iran played a role in reining in their proxies. Iran's ruling elite is obsessed with gathering wealth and maintaining power. The argument made by those—including many Israelis for coercive sanctions against Iran is that many in the regime have been squirreling away money into bank accounts in Dubai and Switzerland for their children and grandchildren. These are not actions associated with people who believe that the world is going to end soon.

One of Netanyahu's advisers said of Iran, "Think Amalek." The Bible says that the Amalekites were dedicated enemies of the Jewish people. In 1 Samuel 15, God says, "Go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass." Now, were the president of Iran and his advisers to have cited a religious text that gave divine sanction for the annihilation of an entire race, they would be called, well, messianic.

Iran isn't a dictatorship. It is certainly not a democracy. The regime jails opponents, closes down magazines and tolerates few challenges to its authority. But neither is it a monolithic dictatorship. It might be best described as an oligarchy, with considerable debate and dissent within the elites. Even the so-called Supreme Leader has a constituency, the Assembly of Experts, who selected him and whom he has to keep happy. Ahmadinejad is widely seen as the "mad mullah" who runs the country, but he is not the unquestioned chief executive and is actually a thorn in the side of the clerical establishment. He is a layman with no family connections to major ayatollahs—which makes him a rare figure in the ruling class. He was not initially the favored candidate of the Supreme Leader in the 2005 election. Even now the mullahs clearly dislike him, and he, in turn, does things deliberately designed to undermine their authority. Iran might be ready to deal. We can't know if a deal is possible since we've never tried to negotiate one, not directly. While the regime appears united in its belief that Iran has the right to a civilian nuclear program—a position with broad popular support—some leaders seem sensitive to the costs of the current approach. It is conceivable that these "moderates" would appreciate the potential benefits of limiting their nuclear program, including trade, technology and recognition by the United States. The Iranians insist they must be able to enrich uranium on their own soil. One proposal is for this to take place in Iran but only under the control of an international consortium. It's not a perfect solution because the Iranians could—if they were very creative and dedicated—cheat. But neither is it perfect from the Iranian point of view because it would effectively mean a permanent inspections regime in their country. But both sides might get enough of what they consider crucial for it to work. Why not try this before launching the next Mideast war?

© 2009

Offline muppet

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Re: This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2009, 09:13:22 PM »
Moshe I can't help but think when reading that..

Would you like another cup of Taqiyya with that Sir  >:( ..

All they're trying to do is deflect attention, the devil soothes with a smile and destroys with a kiss..

Offline 4International

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Re: This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2009, 09:36:30 PM »
http://www.newsweek.com/id/199147?from=rss

By Fareed Zakaria | NEWSWEEK
   
Everything you know about Iran is wrong, or at least more complicated than you think. Take the bomb. The regime wants to be a nuclear power but could well be happy with a peaceful civilian program (which could make the challenge it poses more complex). What's the evidence? Well, over the last five years, senior Iranian officials at every level have repeatedly asserted that they do not intend to build nuclear weapons. President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has quoted the regime's founding father, Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, who asserted that such weapons were "un-Islamic." The country's Supreme Leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, issued a fatwa in 2004 describing the use of nuclear weapons as immoral. In a subsequent sermon, he declared that "developing, producing or stockpiling nuclear weapons is forbidden under Islam." Last year Khamenei reiterated all these points after meeting with the head of the International Atomic Energy Agency, Mohamed ElBaradei. Now, of course, they could all be lying. But it seems odd for a regime that derives its legitimacy from its fidelity to Islam to declare constantly that these weapons are un-Islamic if it intends to develop them. It would be far shrewder to stop reminding people of Khomeini's statements and stop issuing new fatwas against nukes.


 
A Photographic Journey
The Changing Face of Iran
Video: Isfahan Diary—The Terror Victim
Video: Of the Qu'ran and Quarks
Video: The Laughing Radical
Photos: Emerging Iran
Zakaria: What You Know About Iran is Wrong
On the Road in Iran
Obama Chief of Staff Emanuel Rahm: Israel, Iran
Iran's Next President?
Khatami: 'The Country Can Be Run Better'
ElBaradei: Iranians 'Are Not Fanatics'   
Following a civilian nuclear strategy has big benefits. The country would remain within international law, simply asserting its rights under the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, a position that has much support across the world. That would make comprehensive sanctions against Iran impossible. And if Tehran's aim is to expand its regional influence, it doesn't need a bomb to do so. Simply having a clear "breakout" capacity—the ability to weaponize within a few months—would allow it to operate with much greater latitude and impunity in the Middle East and Central Asia.

Iranians aren't suicidal. In an interview last week, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described the Iranian regime as "a messianic, apocalyptic cult." In fact, Iran has tended to behave in a shrewd, calculating manner, advancing its interests when possible, retreating when necessary. The Iranians allied with the United States and against the Taliban in 2001, assisting in the creation of the Karzai government. They worked against the United States in Iraq, where they feared the creation of a pro-U.S. puppet on their border. Earlier this year, during the Gaza war, Israel warned Hizbullah not to launch rockets against it, and there is much evidence that Iran played a role in reining in their proxies. Iran's ruling elite is obsessed with gathering wealth and maintaining power. The argument made by those—including many Israelis for coercive sanctions against Iran is that many in the regime have been squirreling away money into bank accounts in Dubai and Switzerland for their children and grandchildren. These are not actions associated with people who believe that the world is going to end soon.

One of Netanyahu's advisers said of Iran, "Think Amalek." The Bible says that the Amalekites were dedicated enemies of the Jewish people. In 1 Samuel 15, G-d says, "Go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and donkey." Now, were the president of Iran and his advisers to have cited a religious text that gave divine sanction for the annihilation of an entire race, they would be called, well, messianic.

Iran isn't a dictatorship. It is certainly not a democracy. The regime jails opponents, closes down magazines and tolerates few challenges to its authority. But neither is it a monolithic dictatorship. It might be best described as an oligarchy, with considerable debate and dissent within the elites. Even the so-called Supreme Leader has a constituency, the Assembly of Experts, who selected him and whom he has to keep happy. Ahmadinejad is widely seen as the "mad mullah" who runs the country, but he is not the unquestioned chief executive and is actually a thorn in the side of the clerical establishment. He is a layman with no family connections to major ayatollahs—which makes him a rare figure in the ruling class. He was not initially the favored candidate of the Supreme Leader in the 2005 election. Even now the mullahs clearly dislike him, and he, in turn, does things deliberately designed to undermine their authority. Iran might be ready to deal. We can't know if a deal is possible since we've never tried to negotiate one, not directly. While the regime appears united in its belief that Iran has the right to a civilian nuclear program—a position with broad popular support—some leaders seem sensitive to the costs of the current approach. It is conceivable that these "moderates" would appreciate the potential benefits of limiting their nuclear program, including trade, technology and recognition by the United States. The Iranians insist they must be able to enrich uranium on their own soil. One proposal is for this to take place in Iran but only under the control of an international consortium. It's not a perfect solution because the Iranians could—if they were very creative and dedicated—cheat. But neither is it perfect from the Iranian point of view because it would effectively mean a permanent inspections regime in their country. But both sides might get enough of what they consider crucial for it to work. Why not try this before launching the next Mideast war?

© 2009



This certainly is no reflection on you brother Moshe92, but anybody who would believe a word of what the leftist liberal Newsweek tells you about the nuclear program of Iran [or any other issue involving muslim Nazi regimes] would need to have their head examined by a qualified neurosurgeon.

Newsweek is the same liberal outfit that told us in 1999 that there was a Holocaust in Kosovo perpetrated by the Serbs with "500,000 Kosovars [Albanian muslims] feared dead"

In 1995 Newsweek also told us the massive whopper of a Goebbels Nazi-style Big Lie that 250,000 Bosnian muslims were killed by the Serbs since 1992.

Offline Historical Truth

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Re: This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2009, 10:28:20 PM »
 This is the same idiot who said we (the infidels) need to learn how to "live with" Islamic Terrorists.

You live with them Fareed, I'll live in my country and fight anyone who tries to destroy it.

Moshe92

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Re: This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2009, 10:55:37 PM »
This is the same idiot who said we (the infidels) need to learn how to "live with" Islamic Terrorists.

You live with them Fareed, I'll live in my country and fight anyone who tries to destroy it.

I remember that. My school library gets newsweek. I remember walking by the shelf with the magazines in the library and seeing the title "how to live with radical Islam" on newsweek magazine. The article was written by Fareed Zakaria. Fareed Zakaria is the kind of guy whom the media portrays as a "moderate" Muslim, but he defends terrorists.

Offline arksis

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Re: This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2009, 08:30:32 AM »
Moshe I can't help but think when reading that..

Would you like another cup of Taqiyya with that Sir  >:( ..

All they're trying to do is deflect attention, the devil soothes with a smile and destroys with a kiss..

My thoughts EXACTLY Muppet!
---Never, ever deal with terrorists. Hunt them down and, more important, mercilessly punish those states and groups that fund, arm, support, or simply allow their territories to be used by the terrorists with impunity.
Meir Kahane

Offline Debbie Shafer

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Re: This Is What the "Moderate" Muslims Are Saying
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2009, 10:29:24 AM »
My opinion of Iran has not changed.  They are going to try and Nuke their enemies.  They are trying to hasten the Islamic Messiah, I know this from other website chats. 

 The Middle east will become catastrophic if they proceed on the same course, with Pakistan, N. Korea, India, and other volatile countries.