Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
Earth at the Center of the Universe
jdl4ever:
This thread also depresses me to see delusional people here.
1. Mifletzet, you claim that all the great scientists like Einstein and all the modern physicists think the sun really goes around the Earth? This is INSANE. All the scientific community is in universal agreement that the earth revolves around the sun and has been this way for at least 200 years. Einstein himself also believed that the Earth went around the Sun as does every scientists to this day. Don't believe me? Walk into Queens College and ask every mathematics or physics professor in there. Better yet, go to your bookstore and open up any modern physics test, read the daily published research in physics, read any text written by Hawking. Go to NASA and discover the various space missions they went on using calculations from this model of the universe. Ask any expert in relativity if Einstein thought like you did. Every single mathematics and physics professor knows that the earth goes around the Sun, since this is very basic mathematics and physics. Every elementary school kid knows this since it is basic mathematics and physics. And most of these professors at the Collages understand relativity and would easily tell you off for not understanding this simple concept that is simply a supplement to newtonian motion. The only exception is one Lubovitcher physicist you talk of and he is the lone exception.
2. You say that Moses thought the Sun went around the earth and the Bible said this. WRONG. Show this to me. It never says in the Bible anywhere that the Sun goes around the earth and it never says that Moses said this.
3. The Talmud says that the Rabbis admitted to the scientiests in a debate that Earth moves and the stars do not which is basically saying that the Earth goes around the Sun. It is you who are arguing with the Talmud and not me. I am simply arguing with the Rambam, and the Talmud takes preference over him. And you know as well as I do that the Rambam was using the best scientific knowledge of his time and he knew that much of it would change.
4- You don't understand basic mathematics and physics, or the basic scientific method so don't try to understand even basic relativity. Your mind is not working logically at all since you have no basic understanding of the sciences. The basis of science is the scientific method which uses evidence to prove things. It doesn't matter how the sun appears to us, or the possibilities based on appearance, what matters is the proof that one possibility is correct. Every single scientific discovery first involved several possibilities based on an observation and an experiment was done to prove mathematically that one of these possiblities was correct. This is simple scientific method. I at least have a chemistry degree, took one year of physics and 2 years of mathematics in college so I at least know something.
Mifletzet:
Relativity says that it is impossible to refute the Earth going round the Sun, or the Sun going round the Earth: both are mathematically and physically equivalent, and are equally correct.
Relativity does not state that the universe has no center. It states that we cannot determine where that center is.
When Moshe Rabbeinu states that the sun rose and set, we believe this to be literally, not phenomenalogically true. Otherwise you'll start saying that shabbat, tefilllin, kashrut, creatio ex nihilo, splitting of the Yam Suf, conquering Eretz Yisrael etc are also not literally true!
You have still not quoted us this purported Heliocentric Talmud: do so, verbatim please, or admit that there is none.
These papers prove that there is no physical difference between the Geocentric Model and the Modern Heliocentric View
Barbour and Bertotti, 1977. Il Nuovo Cimento B, 38:1.
Brown, G. B., 1955. Proceedings of the Phys. Soc. B, 68:672.
Thirring, H., 1916. Phys. Z. 19:33.
Lense, J. & Thirring, H., 1918, Ibid. 22:29.
Gerber, P., 1898. Zeitschr. f. Math. u. Physik, 43:93.
Mרller, C., 1952. The Theory of Relativity, (Oxford: Clarendon Press), pp. 318-321.
Moon, P. & Spencer, D. E., 1959. Philos. of Science, 26:125.
Rosser, W. G. V., 1964. An Intro. to the Theory of Relativity, (London: Butterworths), p. 460.
For rotation see: P. F. Browne, 1977. "Relativity of Rotation," Jrnl. of Physics A: Math. & Gen. Relativity, 10:727.
These papers just scratch the surface.
They led Sir Fred Hoyle, who was knighted for his cosmological expertise, to proclaim:
"We know that the difference between a heliocentric theory and a geocentric theory is one of relative motion only, and that such a difference has no physical significance."
Sir Fred Hoyle in Astronomy and Cosmology, 1975
Joe Schmo:
Did we figure out the answer yet? :D
Mifletzet:
http://www.galileowaswrong.com/
jdl4ever:
Someone has their head screwed on backward. If you think the Sun goes around the earth in the year 2007 then I got nothing to say to you. The least you can do is stop saying lies about relativity. Everything you say about relativity is completely wrong. I am not going to repeat myself again, you obviously are not reading my posts that explain what relativity is and explain the basic scientific method. You are like a 2 year old constantly repeating that 4 plus 5 is one, and I keep explaining to you that it is 9 but you refuse to listen to logic and keep repeating that it is one. I'm wasting my time with fools who don't know the first thing about basic science bragging that they discovered the hidden meaning of relativity that the scientists of the world have missed. Fools. What a desecration to G-d's name to have Gentiles reading this and laughing that the smartest nation on Earth has fools who still think the Sun goes around the Earth.
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