Author Topic: Italians and Jews  (Read 10781 times)

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Offline mord

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2010, 05:09:47 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf
   

https://www.commentarymagazine.com/viewarticle.cfm/the-holocaust-14968?page=all
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/1992/nov/05/holocaust-heroes/
Thy destroyers and they that make thee waste shall go forth of thee.  Isaiah 49:17

 
Shot at 2010-01-03

Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #26 on: June 07, 2010, 05:10:17 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf

You got it

http://www.amazon.com/Third-Reich-New-History/dp/080909326X
https://www.yeshiva.org.il/wiki/index.php?title=%D7%A9%D7%95%D7%90%D7%AA_%D7%99%D7%94%D7%95%D7%93%D7%99_%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94

Offline mord

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #27 on: June 07, 2010, 05:16:18 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf

You got it

http://www.amazon.com/Third-Reich-New-History/dp/080909326X
https://www.yeshiva.org.il/wiki/index.php?title=%D7%A9%D7%95%D7%90%D7%AA_%D7%99%D7%94%D7%95%D7%93%D7%99_%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94

The first link in English has very little to do with Italy.The second link in Herew can be explained in this section of link             

http://histclo.com/Country/it/min/im-jew.html
Thy destroyers and they that make thee waste shall go forth of thee.  Isaiah 49:17

 
Shot at 2010-01-03

Offline Yaakov Mendel

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #28 on: June 07, 2010, 05:16:45 AM »
I agree that a vast majority of Italians are not antisemites, unlike other European nations.
However, Italy, just like all the rest of Europe, is unfortunately subject to widespread anti-Israel propaganda and this is taking its toll...

Offline mord

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #29 on: June 07, 2010, 05:17:24 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf

You got it

http://www.amazon.com/Third-Reich-New-History/dp/080909326X
https://www.yeshiva.org.il/wiki/index.php?title=%D7%A9%D7%95%D7%90%D7%AA_%D7%99%D7%94%D7%95%D7%93%D7%99_%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94

The first link in English has very little to do with Italy.The second link in Herew can be explained in this section of link             

http://histclo.com/Country/it/min/im-jew.html
    Mussollini and the Fascists

Mussolini and the Fascists seized power in Italy. The Fascists were not initially ravidly anti-Simetic. Mussollini in fact had Jewish supporters. This Gradually changed. Gradually German influence grew. The Fascists enacted the Falco Laws which abrogated article 8 of the Italian constitution guaranteeing religious freedom. Mussolini coming under increasing NAZI influence issued the Manifesto of Italian Racism and declared the Italians to be part of a "pure race" (1938). The Jews were excluded from the pure Italian race. The Fascists proceeded to expell Jews from all public services, including government posts, the army and public schools. Italian Jews began leaving Italy, but as with Jews fleeing the NAZIS, it was hard to find countries to accept them.
The Holocaust

Mussolini was not strongly committed to anti-semitism. Mussolini only imposed the first anti-Jewish regulations in 1938, after prompting from Hitler. Italy had a relatively small Jewish popularion of only about 45,000 people. The Italian people and Catholic clergy, however, managed to hide most of their Jews fron the NAZIs and Fascists. Italian Jews were thus spared the full force of the Holocaust and many managed to survive. The worst time came after Mussolinin was deposed and Italy surrenderedc to the Allies. The Germans quickly disarmed the Italian Army and occupied the country. They used the opportunity to begin rounding up and transporting Jews to the death camps. The Germans only managed to deport and kill about 15 percent of Italy's Jews, the lowest ratio in among occupied countries. This is especially surprising given the fact that Italy was an Axis partner. The lack of commitment on the aprt of Mussolini to genocide and the realtively short paeriod of German occupation are factors in the survival of Italian Jews. Considerable controvery surrounds the role of Pope Pious XII. Despite considerable anti-semitism among Catholic clerics, the clergy played a major role in saving Italian Jews. Ilalian priests, nuns, and monks hid Jews in monasteries, convents, schools, and churches. Jewish families were sheltered and fed at great risk to the individuals involved. One historain describes "massive support" on the part of the clergy often without orders from their superiors for the rescue effort.
Post-war Italy

Unlike many European countries, most Italian Jews survived the War. They were hidden by neigbors, friends, strangers, nd the Church. Few of those deported by the NAZIs survived to return. Jews in Italy weith the defeat of the Fascists were rstored as full citizens. Many Italian Jews emmigrated to Isreael after it was founded (1949). Other Jews remained in Italy to attempt to reconstruct their lives. Here it was easier than in many other countries as most Jews had surviving family members and neighbors. The Catholic Church's attitude toward Jews began to change with Pope John XXIII and Vatican II. The Church absolved Jews of any responsibility for the death of Jesus and renounced the centuries old claim that Jews had been rejected by God.
Thy destroyers and they that make thee waste shall go forth of thee.  Isaiah 49:17

 
Shot at 2010-01-03

Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #30 on: June 07, 2010, 05:24:11 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf

You got it

http://www.amazon.com/Third-Reich-New-History/dp/080909326X
https://www.yeshiva.org.il/wiki/index.php?title=%D7%A9%D7%95%D7%90%D7%AA_%D7%99%D7%94%D7%95%D7%93%D7%99_%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94

The first link in English has very little to do with Italy.The second link in Herew can be explained in this section of link             

http://histclo.com/Country/it/min/im-jew.html

The first link is a book that if you're honest with yourself intelectually you will buy it and study it, because it refutes the points you made in the articles above.

http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%9E%D7%97%D7%A0%D7%94_%D7%94%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9B%D7%95%D7%96_%D7%A4%D7%95%D7%A1%D7%95%D7%9C%D7%99
http://he.bukisa.com/topics/%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94-%D7%91%D7%AA%D7%A7%D7%95%D7%A4%D7%AA-%D7%94%D7%A4%D7%A9%D7%99%D7%96%D7%9D
etc........................
Can't deny the fact that Fascist Italy was made of the Italian PEOPLE and not Italian Fascists only, the army, the police, etc. Thinking otherwise is thinking like a Commie.

Offline Masha

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #31 on: June 07, 2010, 06:41:23 AM »
Thanks for the link to this article.

From time to time, there arise debates on this forum as to whether Jews are a distinct ethnicity. This article proves this definitively.

Offline nessuno

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #32 on: June 07, 2010, 07:12:33 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf

You got it

http://www.amazon.com/Third-Reich-New-History/dp/080909326X
https://www.yeshiva.org.il/wiki/index.php?title=%D7%A9%D7%95%D7%90%D7%AA_%D7%99%D7%94%D7%95%D7%93%D7%99_%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94

The first link in English has very little to do with Italy.The second link in Herew can be explained in this section of link             

http://histclo.com/Country/it/min/im-jew.html

The first link is a book that if you're honest with yourself intelectually you will buy it and study it, because it refutes the points you made in the articles above.

http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%9E%D7%97%D7%A0%D7%94_%D7%94%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9B%D7%95%D7%96_%D7%A4%D7%95%D7%A1%D7%95%D7%9C%D7%99
http://he.bukisa.com/topics/%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94-%D7%91%D7%AA%D7%A7%D7%95%D7%A4%D7%AA-%D7%94%D7%A4%D7%A9%D7%99%D7%96%D7%9D
etc........................
Can't deny the fact that Fascist Italy was made of the Italian PEOPLE and not Italian Fascists only, the army, the police, etc. Thinking otherwise is thinking like a Commie.
You have no idea what was in the heart of the Italian people in Fascist Italy.
I do have some idea.
My mother was a child during World War II in Italy.  My father served in the European Theater in World War II.
My father is an Italian American.  We are Catholic.  I have never heard any anti semitism within my home, extended family or church.  I have heard countless recountings of those times.  From many different living sources.  Not from a book that is aligned with your opinions.  I never hear anti semitism.  In fact, I hear the opposite.  My father had a knock down drag out fight with a very close relative who is a holocaust denier. 
What makes your sources the definitive ones as opposed to Mords?  I am exposed to people who live and breathed during that period in history.
Place the blame for those atrocities at the feet of the correct people.  Take it up with Hitler and Mussolini.

You have bigger enemies in this world then the Italian or Catholic people.
Be very CAREFUL of people whose WORDS don't match their ACTIONS.

Offline Ben m

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #33 on: June 07, 2010, 07:26:51 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf

You got it

http://www.amazon.com/Third-Reich-New-History/dp/080909326X
https://www.yeshiva.org.il/wiki/index.php?title=%D7%A9%D7%95%D7%90%D7%AA_%D7%99%D7%94%D7%95%D7%93%D7%99_%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94

The first link in English has very little to do with Italy.The second link in Herew can be explained in this section of link             

http://histclo.com/Country/it/min/im-jew.html

The first link is a book that if you're honest with yourself intelectually you will buy it and study it, because it refutes the points you made in the articles above.

http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%9E%D7%97%D7%A0%D7%94_%D7%94%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9B%D7%95%D7%96_%D7%A4%D7%95%D7%A1%D7%95%D7%9C%D7%99
http://he.bukisa.com/topics/%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94-%D7%91%D7%AA%D7%A7%D7%95%D7%A4%D7%AA-%D7%94%D7%A4%D7%A9%D7%99%D7%96%D7%9D
etc........................
Can't deny the fact that Fascist Italy was made of the Italian PEOPLE and not Italian Fascists only, the army, the police, etc. Thinking otherwise is thinking like a Commie.
You have no idea what was in the heart of the Italian people in Fascist Italy.
I do have some idea.
My mother was a child during World War II in Italy.  My father served in the European Theater in World War II.
My father is an Italian American.  We are Catholic.  I have never heard any anti semitism within my home, extended family or church.  I have heard countless recountings of those times.  From many different living sources.  Not from a book that is aligned with your opinions.  I never hear anti semitism.  In fact, I hear the opposite.  My father had a knock down drag out fight with a very close relative who is a holocaust denier. 
What makes your sources the definitive ones as opposed to Mords?  I am exposed to people who live and breathed during that period in history.
Place the blame for those atrocities at the feet of the correct people.  Take it up with Hitler and Mussolini.

You have bigger enemies in this world then the Italian or Catholic people.

don't worry.i don't think anyone here is a definite anti italian.i am myself a fond of italian and roman culture.
enemies:negroes,musulmans and commies/liberals.
alleis:israel,united states,canada,european union,greater serbia,russia,australia and new zealand and japan/south korea and india.togheter we maight win this war.

Offline JewishAmericanPatriot

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #34 on: June 07, 2010, 07:40:30 AM »
OMG! Many many Italians have an outright HATRED towards Jews. Many are still today taught at Catholic schools that Jews were the murderers of Jesus. And "Jew" is used by many Italians to describe a greedy person or a swindler. BTW: This is the same as in Turkey. "yahudi" also means swindler and greedy person in Turkey, while "yahudilik" (Jewishness) means fraudulent behaviour or lack of loyalty... Once again, Italy and Turkey have something in common.

Really? You mean the changes of Vatican 2 did not affect Italian Catholic schools? That's news to me, esp. since half my family is Italian and Catholic, and most of them attended Catholic schools, and not one is antisemitic. I grew up in a neighborhood that was Italian, Jewish and Irish, and the only antisemitism I ever experienced was from the Irish (esp. the Irish Catholic girls who beat me up, calling me "christ killer"). The Italian kids always came to my aid, I noticed.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2010, 07:46:03 AM by JewishAmericanPatriot »
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Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #35 on: June 07, 2010, 07:45:17 AM »

You have no idea what was in the heart of the Italian people in Fascist Italy.
I do have some idea.
My mother was a child during World War II in Italy.  My father served in the European Theater in World War II.
My father is an Italian American.  We are Catholic.  I have never heard any anti semitism within my home, extended family or church.  I have heard countless recountings of those times.  From many different living sources.  Not from a book that is aligned with your opinions.  I never hear anti semitism.  In fact, I hear the opposite.  My father had a knock down drag out fight with a very close relative who is a holocaust denier. 
What makes your sources the definitive ones as opposed to Mords?  I am exposed to people who live and breathed during that period in history.
Place the blame for those atrocities at the feet of the correct people.  Take it up with Hitler and Mussolini.

You have bigger enemies in this world then the Italian or Catholic people.


So Mussolini and the Fascist movement served in the army? in the police? in the death and concentration camps? in the banks? etc etc etc..............

If your father truly denounced anti-Semitism he's no way a Christian because he just claim the opposite of what is claimed in your book.

About your last sentence - I will do so the day you blame only Ahmedinejad, Muhammad, Arafat and Saadam for the atrocities they made against other religions and peoples, and not the Muslims generally.

Hitler killed 0 Jews by himself - but those who obeyed his commands (the German people) murdered millions. Stop with his mercy upon the cruel. The German civilization is to blame for the Holocaust, not only the leaders it has chosen for its war against the Jewish people.

Offline JewishAmericanPatriot

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #36 on: June 07, 2010, 07:55:53 AM »
Let's not forget the RCC and the Pope's crimes against the the Jews during, before and way before the Holocaust. Let's not forget Fascist Italy too.
[/quuote] The Italian Fascists were hardly anti semitic some of the most prominent Fascists in the beggining of the Fascist movement in Italy were Jewish.Hitler told Mussolini to be anti semitic.Even with all Hitlers prompting wherever the Italian Army were they saved Jews in Croatia for example they raided the Croatians to save Jews google it if you don't believe me.

The Italians worshipped Mussolini who was Hitler's best friend, sent Jews to Auschwitz and even led the concentration camps in Croatia where Jews from Italy, Northern Africa and Hungary were murdered. Italy had its own Nurenberg laws and the fact that they were Jews in the Fascist movement means nothing because they were WAY MORE Jews in the Communist party as well. The Italians glorified the Roman Nazi Empire and if Jews took part in it it just shows how self-hating they are.

Stop looking for the love of the Gentile.
You sure you want to stand by that statement?

Yup
alright then 

http://www1.yadvashem.org.il/odot_pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%204803.pdf

You got it

http://www.amazon.com/Third-Reich-New-History/dp/080909326X
https://www.yeshiva.org.il/wiki/index.php?title=%D7%A9%D7%95%D7%90%D7%AA_%D7%99%D7%94%D7%95%D7%93%D7%99_%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94

The first link in English has very little to do with Italy.The second link in Herew can be explained in this section of link             

http://histclo.com/Country/it/min/im-jew.html

The first link is a book that if you're honest with yourself intelectually you will buy it and study it, because it refutes the points you made in the articles above.

http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%9E%D7%97%D7%A0%D7%94_%D7%94%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9B%D7%95%D7%96_%D7%A4%D7%95%D7%A1%D7%95%D7%9C%D7%99
http://he.bukisa.com/topics/%D7%90%D7%99%D7%98%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%94-%D7%91%D7%AA%D7%A7%D7%95%D7%A4%D7%AA-%D7%94%D7%A4%D7%A9%D7%99%D7%96%D7%9D
etc........................
Can't deny the fact that Fascist Italy was made of the Italian PEOPLE and not Italian Fascists only, the army, the police, etc. Thinking otherwise is thinking like a Commie.
You have no idea what was in the heart of the Italian people in Fascist Italy.
I do have some idea.
My mother was a child during World War II in Italy.  My father served in the European Theater in World War II.
My father is an Italian American.  We are Catholic.  I have never heard any anti semitism within my home, extended family or church.  I have heard countless recountings of those times.  From many different living sources.  Not from a book that is aligned with your opinions.  I never hear anti semitism.  In fact, I hear the opposite.  My father had a knock down drag out fight with a very close relative who is a holocaust denier. 
What makes your sources the definitive ones as opposed to Mords?  I am exposed to people who live and breathed during that period in history.
Place the blame for those atrocities at the feet of the correct people.  Take it up with Hitler and Mussolini.

You have bigger enemies in this world then the Italian or Catholic people.


I agree. You know, my mother (obm) was raised an Italian Catholic; she attended Catholic school until about 8th grade, then went to public school. She converted to Torah Judaism when she was 18, and then met (and later married) my father when she was 21. My mother converted to Judaism during World War Two, not exactly a great time to announce you want to be Jewish. For most of her life she was the only convert she knew. She wound up being far more frum than my Jewish grandparents, something they disliked her for (can you imagine?)

I'm pretty sure she did not have an antisemitic bone in her body, not with all she had to endure first to become Jewish, but also to survive as a frum Yid, because she was always having stumbling blocks put in her way by my BORN Jewish grandparents.

Her family were not the most devout Catholics, but knowing them as I did, even if they had been I doubt they would have hated Jews. They made accomodations all the time for my mom, me, my sister, my dad, even getting kosher food for us. This was back in the day when nobody did this, long before "ecumenical" became a trendy term in the world.

I am just as proud of my Italian heritage as I am of my Jewishness, and I am glad to know of others here who are Americans of Italian descent, esp. fellow Jewtalians!  ;D

(And remember, Mussolini was only one man, driven by a lust for power, not a true hatred of Jews. His mistress was Jewish, and he often ridiculed Hitler behind his back because he didn't understand why Hitler hated Jews so much. Mussolini was also a Zionist, a friend of Jabotinsky, and helped Jabotinsky to a point.) Nevertheless my mother (and her family) hated Mussolini with a passion.)


NOTE: I bolded what I said because I can't figure out how to keep what I'm saying separate from the quoted part!
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Offline angryChineseKahanist

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #37 on: June 07, 2010, 08:27:19 AM »

I've met Italians who didn't like Jews.
But its more like annoyance than hatred.

And even if they do hate, is it the same as muslim hatred?
Are they known for killing Jews?

Shouldn't think this way.
U+262d=U+5350=U+9774

Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #38 on: June 07, 2010, 08:30:55 AM »
And even if they do hate, is it the same as muslim hatred?
Are they known for killing Jews?

Fascist Italy is. Don't know any Italian Americans so I can't judge.

Offline nessuno

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #39 on: June 07, 2010, 08:45:54 AM »

I've met Italians who didn't like Jews.
But its more like annoyance than hatred.

And even if they do hate, is it the same as muslim hatred?
Are they known for killing Jews?

Shouldn't think this way.

I have met Jews that didn't like Italians.  ::)
Ahem, Arise Judah and Muman.
I'm sure they think for very good reason.
I think their overwhelming hatred of the Gentile clouds their judgement though.
No matter how much we would like for things to be black and white.  In more ways then one  8;)!  They are not.

Arise Judah - I guess I would do what I could to have my family survive.  I am not one that blames all Muslims for the actions of their leaders.  Take that up with somebody else.   
I don't need you to approve of my people.  You don't matter a hill of beans to me.  I am here supporting my Jewish allies and Israel.  For I know, they way Israel goes America is next to follow.  Israel is like the canary in the mine for me.  If people don't wake up here.  We are doomed.  See where your anti catholoism and anti Italian rhetoric gets you.  You are causing great people to leave or never join JTF.  Shame on you.
Be very CAREFUL of people whose WORDS don't match their ACTIONS.

Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #40 on: June 07, 2010, 08:50:21 AM »
Currently, you're the one flaming endlessly without no serious response to the arguments me and Muman make. I wish I wouldn't laugh when I read your whininig.

People here know my views on Christianity and I will never hide it. America will be doomed as long as the enemies of the Jewish people, among them them Italy as a country (not specifically Italian Americans who are AMERICANS and not Italians, and if they feel sympathy with their Hitler-co-operating brothers, their problem and their doom), will be praised. I wouldn't wonder if it will end up like Germany - roasted and crippled from the inside, until the final blow of the pigs of Jihad.

Offline Rubystars

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #41 on: June 07, 2010, 08:51:58 AM »
Italians are wonderful people and I'm really glad we have so many people of Italian descent on JTF.

I wonder how many good people will be driven away from this board by piggish behavior of certain members.

Offline Ben m

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #42 on: June 07, 2010, 08:55:26 AM »
Italians are wonderful people and I'm really glad we have so many people of Italian descent on JTF.

I wonder how many good people will be driven away from this board by piggish behavior.
me too.i love italians! VIVA ITLAIA.VIVA EUROPA.VIVA ISRAEL.VIVA UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
enemies:negroes,musulmans and commies/liberals.
alleis:israel,united states,canada,european union,greater serbia,russia,australia and new zealand and japan/south korea and india.togheter we maight win this war.

Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #43 on: June 07, 2010, 09:08:36 AM »
Italians are wonderful people and I'm really glad we have so many people of Italian descent on JTF.

I wonder how many good people will be driven away from this board by piggish behavior.
me too.i love italians! VIVA ITLAIA.VIVA EUROPA.VIVA ISRAEL.VIVA UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

Butt kisser.

Offline Hyades

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #44 on: June 07, 2010, 09:09:18 AM »
Sorry, but it is ridiculous to say Italo-Americans are Italians. They aren't. I spend lots of my holidays in Italy. My sister is married with an Italian. And it was HE and his brothers who showed me their school books stating clearly that "INFIDEL JEWS WERE TO BLAME FOR THE DEATH OF JESUS CHRIST". And for Italians it is always strange to see people having another belief than Christianity. One reason may be that Italy has until recently never had any huge religious minorities. The only minority in Italy was a tiny community of Jews. Now with the enormous influx of Muslims into Italy (there were mere 10,000 in the 1980's and the number rose to 1.2 million today), this opinion is shifting away from the Jews towards Muslims - but now with a real hostility! Milan and Turin have real problems and no-go areas which have turned into Muslim ghettos. This surely takes the attention of the Italians away from the Jews in direction of the Muslims. This also reflects in Italian opinions on Israel. Italy is everytime less critic about Israel's actions, since they are now experiencing the "blessings" of Islam themselves! The old "blessings" are long ago and have already been forgotten.
Southern Italy, however, still has more anti-Semitism than Northern Italy. And as I said before, "Jew" is still an offensice expression in Italy.

Offline nessuno

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #45 on: June 07, 2010, 09:11:13 AM »
Currently, you're the one flaming endlessly without no serious response to the arguments me and Muman make. I wish I wouldn't laugh when I read your whininig.

People here know my views on Christianity and I will never hide it. America will be doomed as long as the enemies of the Jewish people, among them them Italy as a country (not specifically Italian Americans who are AMERICANS and not Italians, and if they feel sympathy with their Hitler-co-operating brothers, their problem and their doom), will be praised. I wouldn't wonder if it will end up like Germany - roasted and crippled from the inside, until the final blow of the pigs of Jihad.
You can laugh when you read my posts, Arise Judah.   
I don't really care.  You think that your childish dig will hurt me.  I don't have to make a serious response to you.  You blew off those by other members.  You and Muman are inconseqential.
I'm whining.  OK - go right ahead with your constant anti christianity posts.  See where it gets JTF - here in America.  Let the chips fall where they may.


Be very CAREFUL of people whose WORDS don't match their ACTIONS.

Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #46 on: June 07, 2010, 09:14:24 AM »
Lol whatever

Offline mord

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #47 on: June 07, 2010, 09:19:19 AM »
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/italytime.html 








1942 — The Italian military commander in Croatia refuses to hand over Jews in his zone to the Nazis.

1943 — January: the Italians refuse to cooperate with the Nazis in rounding up the Jews living in the zone of France under their control. In March, they will prevent the Nazis from deporting Jews in their zone.

February: Italian military authorities in Lyons force the French to rescind an order for the deportation of several hundred French Jews to Auschwitz. Ribbentrop complains to Mussolini that "Italian military circles. . .lack a proper understanding of the Jewish question."

September 8: Italy switches her allegiance in the war, declaring an armistice with the Allies; Allied forces enter Italy from the south; N Italy is under German control; Jews flee southward; Rev. Aldo Brunacci of Assisi , under the direction of his bishop, Giuseppe Nicolini, saved all the Jewish who sought refuge in Assisi.

October 16: Raid of the ghetto in Rome.

November: Rabbi Ricardo Pacifici of Genoa, 200 members of his congregation, and 100 Jewish refugees from northern Europe who found shelter in Genoa, are deported and gassed at Auschwitz.

Nazis raid Pitigliano and deport all the Jews; 238 people are deported from Florence, and the synagogue is looted and desecrated.

1944 —The Nazis take 260 Jews living on the island of Crete to Candia and board them on a ship with 400 Greek hostages and 300 Italian soldiers. The ship is taken out to sea and scuttled. All are drowned.

1945 — March: The Jewish Brigade under the command of General Ernest Benjamin, goes into action in north Italy as part of the British Eighth Army.

April: Benito Mussolini is caught and killed by Italian partisans; Hitler commits suicide.

August: It is estimated that 7,500 Italian Jews were victims of the Holocaust (See Lucy Dawidowicz, 1981)
Thy destroyers and they that make thee waste shall go forth of thee.  Isaiah 49:17

 
Shot at 2010-01-03

Offline Rubystars

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #48 on: June 07, 2010, 09:19:54 AM »
He doesn't give a damn what happens to JTF in America. I think he wants America to go to hell.

Offline IsraeliGovtAreKapos

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Re: Italians and Jews
« Reply #49 on: June 07, 2010, 09:25:14 AM »
He doesn't give a damn what happens to JTF in America. I think he wants America to go to hell.

So now I exist, Ruby? I surely don't care if you go to hell, but I love Americans such as Dan Ben Noah.