Author Topic: omniscience vs. free will  (Read 2084 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Meerkat

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1426
  • Yemach Shmam to Egypt and Iran
omniscience vs. free will
« on: September 14, 2010, 03:37:10 PM »
this is just an idea

we know that god knows everything and we know that he allows free will.

we all heard the argument that theres no point in free will if god knows what you will do ahead of time.

is it possible that he doesn't "know" the future at all times but can access the knowledge to it at all times?
to simplify this concept, lets say theres a wikipedia article with information. you have access to that info but don't have it on you. perhaps a better way to think about it is if you remember something but keep it in the very  back of your head until you need that information.

is this in any way possible? let me hear your thoughts.

Offline HiWarp

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1867
Re: omniscience vs. free will
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2010, 06:33:31 AM »
This is an interesting topic.

To expand on it, do you think that G-d is aware of all things in the universe at a high level (i.e. there's going to be a tsunami in the Indian Ocean that kills over 200,000 people, there's a star in the 2nd quadrant of the Milky Way that is going to explode, there's a comet that's going to collide with Jupiter) or do you think that G-d is occupied with every minuscule happening in the universe (i.e. little Tommy in Minnesota wants a toy fire engine and his life will be ruined if he doesn't get one, a pothole in Manhattan will flatten Ahmed's taxi cab's right front tire, Xwerqi on Rigel 4 will break two of his arms requiring him to go on the disabled list since six arms are necessary to play criguequay, HiWarp on Earth is engaging in ridiculous speculation again instead of doing something worthwhile with his life)?
"When the people fear their government, there is tyranny;
when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”
---Thomas Jefferson

Offline edu

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1866
Re: omniscience vs. free will
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2010, 02:25:59 AM »
point 1 to remember: Even though G-d knows the future, he doesn't judge us based on that but rather based on our present level.
So for example when Yishmael the son of Avraham{Abraham} was in danger of death due to a lack of water, G-d chose to supply him with water, due to the merits he had at that particular time when he was in danger, even though, had he been judged on his evil impact on the future he would not have merited to get the water, see Rashi's commentary to Breishit/Genesis21:17 for more details.
There is "a fundamental principle that G-d does not judge the world according to his knowledge but according to the system that he desired and designed for this purpose". (quoted from the Way of G-d by Moshe Chaim Luzzatto as translated by Aryeh Kaplan page 154, Feldheim Publishers, year,5748-1988)
point 2 Time is a creation and G-d is outside of time. Just as someone observing someone else from a distance doesn't affect the free will of the other party, so too, G-d observes from outside of time all the segments of time and the actions we do in those segments. His observation doesn't affect our free will actions.
Not everyone easily grasps this second point, but it makes sense to me and that's how I have been taught.