Holland to ban Jewish slaughter of animals but not Halal

[mord]

Because in Halal you are allowed to stun the animals    


http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/143456      









Holland Likely to Pass Ban on Kosher Ritual Slaughter
 
by Chana Ya'ar
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Holland appears set to enact a ban this week on shechita, the practice of kosher ritual slaughter.

Despite an appeal to Prime Minister Mark Rutte and protests from Jewish groups, a proposed ban on the practice is likely to pass in the Dutch parliament, according to a report in the European Jewish Press.

Some 45,000 Jews live in Holland at present, many of whom may be affected by the legislation.

The proposal, advanced by the pro-animal party, claims there is evidence the practice of kosher slaughtering causes animals unnecessary pain and suffering. In most regular meat processing plants, animals are usually stunned prior to slaughter. Both Jewish and Muslim groups are actively opposing the legislation.

The extreme-right Party for Freedom (PVV) led by Geert Wilders is also likely to support the ban, according to political observers, due to the perception that it will restrict Muslim halal butchering.

However, in a letter to the Dutch prime minister ahead of the vote, European Jewish Congress (EJC) President Moshe Kantor noted that Muslim ritual slaughter does not prohibit pre-slaughter stunning of animals. Thus, the legislation would really affect only the Jewish community, which does not allow stunning.

Kantor wrote in his letter that the bill would violate Article 9 of the European Convention on Human Rights – the right to freedom of religious practice.

“I can speak for the Dutch Jewish community and I think for the wider Jewish world, that this law raises grave concerns about infringements on religious freedom, said Ruben Vis, spokesman for the Netherlands' NIK, an umbrella group for Jewish organizations. “What's worse is that there is no conclusive scientific evidence that slaughter without stunning is more harmful or painful for animals,” he said.

An anti-shechita amendment to the European Union's food labeling laws was rejected late last year by the European Council of Ministers. However, the Rabbinical Center of Europe (RCE) warned the issue might yet come up again for another vote this year as well.

Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Finland, the Baltic nations and Switzerland have had a ban against shechita in place since before World War II.

New Zealand recently outlawed the practice of Jewish ritual slaughter as well. The ban is being challenged by the Jewish community there.



You can stun in Halal so it effects only Kosher slaughter

http://www.pathofislam.net/2010/united-ummah/meat-from-stunned-animals-is-halal/

[Maimonides]

The extreme-right Party for Freedom (PVV) led by Geert Wilders is also likely to support the ban, according to political observers, due to the perception that it will restrict Muslim halal butchering.

If Geert Wilders supports this then there is truly no hope left for Europe!

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Holland is telling the small number of remaining Jews there, to "Get out!"    What a slap in the face.

[muman613]

This is another sign that the real Torah Jews return to Israel. The assimilated ones will probably not care about Kashrut.

[angryChineseKahanist]

Halal world.

[syyuge]

I think it may or may not be halal because Nato is also slaughtering the animals in libya after stunning them.

[mord]

I think it may or may not be halal because Nato is also slaughtering the animals in libya after stunning them.

[eb22]

If the bill truly did restrict Muslim halal butchering,    one can easily imagine the reaction of Muslims in the Netherlands.     Because this involves the Jews,   the Dutch ' leaders'  believe they can get away with a ban on Kosher slaughter.       While I don't condone the deadly and other physically damaging acts the Muslims use,    they do stand up for what they believe in.       It's time for non-Muslims to deal from strength,   not weakness.

[TheCoon]

I am ignorant to the laws governing kosher butchering. Why does it not allow stunning? I am curious why you could not stun the animal and then slit it's jugular, esophagus and carotids. Is stunning forbidden because it can possibly damage the animal's organs pre-slaughter?

[muman613]

I am ignorant to the laws governing kosher butchering. Why does it not allow stunning? I am curious why you could not stun the animal and then slit it's jugular, esophagus and carotids. Is stunning forbidden because it can possibly damage the animal's organs pre-slaughter?

Of course Chabad has your question answered here:

http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/222246/jewish/Whats-Wrong-with-Stunning.htm

What's Wrong with Stunning?

"Stunning" refers to the methods of attempting to render an animal or bird unconscious prior to slaughter. The main methods used in the general slaughtering industry for cattle and sheep are:

• captive bolt gun: a steel bolt is shot into the skull at the front of the animal’s brain.

• electric shock: electrodes are clamped to the animal's head/heart and the animal is electrocuted.

These methods are contrary to Jewish law, because an animal intended for food must be healthy and uninjured at the time of shechita. The above stunning methods injure the animal, making it treifa (non-kosher and thus prohibited). If the stunning kills the animal it makes it neveila (an animal which has not been shechted) and is forbidden as food for Jews.

With these methods, during the delay between the stun and sticking or cutting, the animal can regain consciousness, as has been reported by animal welfare groups. The stun effected by shechita is irreversible and there is no delay. Shechita therefore, is humane and efficient.

Apart from the halachic prohibition against the above methods of stunning, there is no conclusive evidence that these methods render an animal insensible to pain. There is evidence that they are only paralyzed, and thus prevented from displaying their pain. Furthermore when the captive bolt method fails, as it does in a significant percentage of cases, it causes considerable additional suffering and distress to the animal. In such cases, the conscious animal is in acute pain as the captive bolt gun is reloaded and reapplied, or the electrical tongs reapplied to re-stun the animal. Shechita avoids these problems of ineffective stunning, since there is no mechanical or electrical appliance to be misapplied or go wrong. Shechita produces an effective and irreversible stun as well as being a humane and efficient slaughter method.

[Masha]

That is RIDICULOUS.  Kosher slaughter kills the animal the quickest with the least amount of pain possible.  It cuts their carotid artery, jugular, esophagus, and trachea all at once with a knife so sharp and so quick they don't even know what hit them until it's all over with.  And there is evidence that it causes the animal no pain.  The stunning method is actually more cruel because it just makes them unconscious so it's possible they can still be alive when they are cut up for consumption.  The Dutch know or care nothing about the shchita process and are just using anti-Semitism to formulate policy.

It's definitely not anti-semitism. It's the sentimental animal-rights attitude that is prevalent today. A friend of mine lost her fur business.

[TheCoon]

I take it there is a difference of opinion between certain scientists and halachic scholars as to whether kosher slaughter is in fact the most painless way to kill an animal.

[Zelhar]

If you are going to "mass produce" animal flesh for human consumption there is going to be suffering involved and I think the final moment of slaughter is not the worst that these poor animals have to endure in their miserable lives.

Regarding shchita- I am not convinced that it causes the least suffering. Then again I think stunning the animal with electricity or with a head trauma is not particularly merciful. If they are really after painless slaughter they should use some anesthetic like N2O. Perhaps Jewish halacha could also approve such use since it doesn't injure the animal nor stops the heart.

[Meerkat]

schita may be painful because of the initial slice, but it is magnitudes more humane than the standard method, the stun doesnt work a lot of the time and the animal ends up being processed alive.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I do think that anyone who claims a stungun is not painful is simply delusional.

[Masha]

If they are really after painless slaughter they should use some anesthetic like N2O. Perhaps Jewish halacha could also approve such use since it doesn't injure the animal nor stops the heart.

Yes, it's a good venue to explore. I am sure in this day and age it's possible to find some scientific invention that would be found halahic and will be acceptable to these animal rights crazies.

Where I live, a beautiful park where people used to go for picnics and sommer concerts is completely destroyed by the excrements of Canada geese. They are completely infested by these species. They have made this park uninhabitable and drove out all other water fowl, including domestic geese. But nobody does anything to them because of their crazy animal rights ideas. And these are supposed to be an engangered species. Anyone who has seen huge flocks of these geese that invade everything knows very well that they are not endangered.

We live in crazy times. I won't be surprised if they make meat illegal one day. Then kosher slaughter will no longer be a problem at all.

[Zelhar]

Yes, it's a good venue to explore. I am sure in this day and age it's possible to find some scientific invention that would be found halahic and will be acceptable to these animal rights crazies.

Where I live, a beautiful park where people used to go for picnics and sommer concerts is completely destroyed by the excrements of Canada geese. They are completely infested by these species. They have made this park uninhabitable and drove out all other water fowl, including domestic geese. But nobody does anything to them because of their crazy animal rights ideas. And these are supposed to be an engangered species. Anyone who has seen huge flocks of these geese that invade everything knows very well that they are not endangered.

We live in crazy times. I won't be surprised if they make meat illegal one day. Then kosher slaughter will no longer be a problem at all.

I am pro animal rights so I would take the side of the geese in this case.

[syyuge]

The stunning of animals and the halal, both are politically correct. So Jewish slaughter of animals might be banned.

[Masha]

I am pro animal rights so I would take the side of the geese in this case.

You think that people should literally lose a beautiful park because it became overrun and destroyed by huge swarms of geese??? 

I don't think any rabbi would agree with you on that or on the idea of animal rights. How un-Jewish! How come animal have rights? A right comes from the idea of a "social contract"? Do we have a social contract with the geese? Have they asked for rights? Have we and the geese signed a rights declaration? 

[Zelhar]

You think that people should literally lose a beautiful park because it became overrun and destroyed by huge swarms of geese??? 

I don't think any rabbi would agree with you on that or on the idea of animal rights. How un-Jewish! How come animal have rights? A right comes from the idea of a "social contract"? Do we have a social contract with the geese? Have they asked for rights? Have we and the geese signed a rights declaration? 

I don't think you lose anything. Where are the geese going to go if you take the park away from them ? You don't care if they die and become extinct ?

Look for example Israel is a bottleneck spot for migrating birds and large flocks of rare and endangered birds like gray cranes  camp here for a while en route between Europe and Asia to Africa and back, especially in the Hula valley. They "steal" some fishes from fish farms and fields. It is illegal to shoot the birds here and on recent years there is a program of distributing food for them at some areas so the won't damage the fish farms. Lots of people even tourists from abroad come especially to watch this large concentration of rare birds.

[Spiraling Leopard]

Some experts in martial arts can knock a human unconcious without touching them. So there is a way to knock animals out without them feeling any pain.

[mord]

[Masha]

I don't think you lose anything. Where are the geese going to go if you take the park away from them ? You don't care if they die and become extinct ?

Look for example Israel is a bottleneck spot for migrating birds and large flocks of rare and endangered birds like gray cranes  camp here for a while en route between Europe and Asia to Africa and back, especially in the Hula valley. They "steal" some fishes from fish farms and fields. It is illegal to shoot the birds here and on recent years there is a program of distributing food for them at some areas so the won't damage the fish farms. Lots of people even tourists from abroad come especially to watch this large concentration of rare birds.

I have lost the park, where I can no longer go for walks and have picnics. The geese are not anywhere close to extinction. There are billions of them. On the contrary, they have driven out and made extinct local geese!!! The local geese were in balance with their envuironment. There were never too many of them. These Canada geese are native to the North American continent, not to us. Now I haven't seen a single native gray goose for many years. This is the problem with liberalism. They kill the very thing they aim to protect.

[Rubystars]

It's definitely not anti-semitism. It's the sentimental animal-rights attitude that is prevalent today. A friend of mine lost her fur business.

I don't have anything to do with fur because I believe it's inhumane to electrocute animals that are farmed or to trap wild animals in leg traps.

I saw a horrific video where animals who had their skins pulled off were still alive, shuddering and blinking. This was done without even killing them first

[Dr. Dan]

So the dutch will get food poisoning.  Let dutch jews in galut make aliyah