2012: Moshiach vs Hawking

[wonga66]

American Kabbalist in Tzefat advocates a 2011-2014 Geulah from Zohar and Science, & flays British atheist physicist Stephen Hawking to boot!

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Advocates a Geulah?   What does that mean?


He's offering ideas on ways to unseat the anti-Jewish regime from power?   He's offering meaningful ways for the Jewish settlements to defend themselves against expulsion and prepare for self-defense against the Muslim hordes who will follow right behind the Yassamniks against anyone who wont leave?   He's offering solutions to the problems facing Jewish settlers in light of the war being waged against them by the Israeli regime?   He's giving ideas about how to undermine the Oslo Peace Suicide being led by Bibi Netanyahu?   

What?  What's that you say?  He's offering NONE OF THESE THINGS?!     Oh, so he's not an advocate of Geulah, he's a mystic engaged in wishful thinking and yet another meaningless intellectual exercise!   Wow!

[edu]

I didn't have the patience to go beyond the first of 5 parts of the talk, seeing the direction it was going in.
I agree with the criticism offered by Kahane-Was-Right BT . In general, Rabbi Kahane preferred actions to bring about, the political conditions favorable to the Jewish people rather than waiting for something on the outside to turn things around.

[muman613]

Well, Im not going to condemn anyone who wants to believe that Moshiach is coming next year.

I am prepared that he may come at any time. This means always checking the level of my Emmunah and my Bitachon, and checking the level of my observance of mitzvot, and checking the level of my preparedness for any struggle which may arise.

To me it is like riding a wave, I always move forward looking toward Moshiachs arrival, and if I fall off this wave I will get up on the next wave. I think it is important for Jews to always have the vision of the world with Moshiach and yearn for it... Without this vision I think it would be difficult {at least for me personally} to go through every day filled with such tragedies which I witness. But I thank Hashem for each miracle I witness and have absolute emmunah that Hashem will send the promised redeemer of the Jewish people.

[wonga66]

One Messianic scenario has the Moshiach coming as a physical man and a human-constructed 3rd Temple, according to the Ramchal.

The other extreme has no human Moshiach, Hashem Himself being the Redeemer, and the 3rd Temple coming down from Heaven ready-made, according to Hillel and Rashi.

This fellow obviously tends to the latter case.

There are all sorts of intermediate scenarios and permutations thereof, depending on the Jews' merits or demerits.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

according to Hillel and Rashi.

Hillel?

[edu]

It is the way of Rashi to offer explanations to explain the viewpoints, even of opinions not accepted as Halacha.
So Rashi offers the explanation that the Temple will come down from Heaven ready made, to explain a difficulty within the opinion that holds, that "new grain is permitted to be eaten on the morning of the 16th of Nissan, when there is no Temple".
But halachicly, we hold that new grain is forbidden to be eaten on the entire day of the 16th of Nissan, when there is no Temple.
And Rashi himself, in his commentary to Yechezkel/Ezekiel 43:11 indicates that Jews will construct the Temple by their own hands in the future.

[wonga66]

In this instantly playing 5 minute audio link American Kabbalist clarifies re Rashi on Yechezkel 43:11 & a Beis Hamikdash descending from Shamayim http://www.zshare.net/audio/919972123b72ac49/

[edu]

The Audio that Wonga66 links to, contends, that Rashi says we should have just a theoretical knowledge of how to make the 3rd Temple, but we don't have to actually make it.
I believe he is wrong for several reasons.
1] Rashi in Yechezkel 43:11 says we should learn the measurements so that we know how to do them at the end time, namely, at the time of the building. If Knowledge was just enough he wouldn't  have to add at the end time, because Knowledge is always a good thing and not dependant on the end time.
2] When Rashi uses the Hebrew words לעשות  or לעשותם the term implies action and not just Knowledge.
So for example, in Dvarim / Deut. 18:9 When G-d tells us "When you come into the land that Hashem your L-rd gives you, don't learn to do like the abominations of those Gentiles." Rashi comments, you shall not learn to do (in Hebrew לעשות) but you shall learn in order to understand and instruct, that is to say to understand how corrupt their actions are and to instruct your sons, do not do such, for it is the manner of the Gentiles. See also Vayikra 26:3 where Rashi seems to be using the word לעשותם to denote actual performance in contrast to just theoretical knowledge of the Mitzva / Commandment which is described by another word.
3 The Talmud quoting Bar Kappara in Tractate Ketuvot page 5, says that the work of the Tzaddikim (righteous individuals)  is greater than the creation of the Heaven and the Earth.
The source used by Bar Kappara to prove this, is that a verse in Yishayahu/Isaiah 48:13 describing G-d's creation of the Heaven and the Earth, attributes the creation of each one of them to G-d's hand (in the singular);  while in the book of Shmot/Exodus 15:17 it says, "The Mikdash of G-d, your hands (in the plural) have established".
Rashi comments there:The Mikdash is the action of the hands of the Tzaddikim.
4]Finally, According to the Vilna Gaon as recorded by his discipe in Kol Hator chapter 5, the ultimate rectification of the sin of the spies, Meraglim, will be by the building of the Mikdash. This implies to me, physical action by the righteous, because only by this are we demonstrating as opposed to the Meraglim, that our obedience to G-d to conquer and settle the land of Israel outweighs and overrides our fear of the Gentiles. We would not get the same spiritual rectification by just "Learning About the Temple" and making G-d do all the hard work.

[muman613]

The Audio that Wonga66 links to, contends, that Rashi says we should have just a theoretical knowledge of how to make the 3rd Temple, but we don't have to actually make it.
I believe he is wrong for several reasons.
1] Rashi in Yechezkel 43:11 says we should learn the measurements so that we know how to do them at the end time, namely, at the time of the building. If Knowledge was just enough he wouldn't  have to add at the end time, because Knowledge is always a good thing and not dependant on the end time.
2] When Rashi uses the Hebrew words לעשות  or לעשותם the term implies action and not just Knowledge.
So for example, in Dvarim / Deut. 18:9 When G-d tells us "When you come into the land that Hashem your L-rd gives you, don't learn to do like the abominations of those Gentiles." Rashi comments, you shall not learn to do (in Hebrew לעשות) but you shall learn in order to understand and instruct, that is to say to understand how corrupt their actions are and to instruct your sons, do not do such, for it is the manner of the Gentiles. See also Vayikra 26:3 where Rashi seems to be using the word לעשותם to denote actual performance in contrast to just theoretical knowledge of the Mitzva / Commandment which is described by another word.
3 The Talmud quoting Bar Kappara in Tractate Ketuvot page 5, says that the work of the Tzaddikim (righteous individuals)  is greater than the creation of the Heaven and the Earth.
The source used by Bar Kappara to prove this, is that a verse in Yishayahu/Isaiah 48:13 describing G-d's creation of the Heaven and the Earth, attributes the creation of each one of them to G-d's hand (in the singular);  while in the book of Shmot/Exodus 15:17 it says, "The Mikdash of G-d, your hands (in the plural) have established".
Rashi comments there:The Mikdash is the action of the hands of the Tzaddikim.
4]Finally, According to the Vilna Gaon as recorded by his discipe in Kol Hator chapter 5, the ultimate rectification of the sin of the spies, Meraglim, will be by the building of the Mikdash. This implies to me, physical action by the righteous, because only by this are we demonstrating as opposed to the Meraglim, that our obedience to G-d to conquer and settle the land of Israel outweighs and overrides our fear of the Gentiles. We would not get the same spiritual rectification by just "Learning About the Temple" and making G-d do all the hard work.

I agree that we must lean in order to do but at this time it seems virtually impossible to actually build it. I have full faith that we will see a time when it is rebuilt and I fully support the building of the vessels and the preparation of the kohanim, and the search for the Red Heifer which we read about this Shabbat.

One reason I feel that Moshiach just may have to come in order to redeem us is because it seems that we have sunk so low. I have heard it said that the future redemption will in some ways mirror the redemption from Mitzrayim. I certainly hope that I can take part in rebuilding the Temple because we all know what the sages said about a generation which does not rebuild it {being as bad as those who destroyed it}. Without some obvious divine assistance I find it hard to see redemption any time soon. I often recall the concept that the Children of Israel in Egypt had sunk to the 49th level of tumah, and if they sunk any more they would have totally assimilated. This is one of the explanations given as to why they were suddenly sent out after the plague of death of the firstborn.

I am of the opinion it is best to be prepared for anything to happen. In truth all we need to worry about is doing the mitzvot which we all should do, and all make plans to make aliyah to Israel {and the intention to carry out the plan}.

As I stated earlier it is essential to my 'sanity' to always have hope that the redeemer will come soon. I dont run around preaching that he is here, and I don't consume my day thinking about it. But I always do have hope that he will come soon so that the wicked in the world will fall. And I want to be a part of the unity which will be felt in the age of Moshiach.

[muman613]

I mentioned the Temple Institutes work on building the kaylim/vessels for the Temple service:

[edu]

Muman613 stated:

but at this time it seems virtually impossible to actually build it.

Please clarify, why you believe this.
Because Bibi Netanyahu is the Prime Minister of Israel or because of some deeper reason?