Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
Fitting the 6 days of Creation into current scientific theory
edu:
After quoting from a Web site which details some of R. Slifkin's views that the events of Biblical day 5 do not in his opinion, fit in with the chronological order of things as held by Science, Prof. Aviezer responded to those viewpoints in the following way.
--- Quote ---On the Fifth Day of Creation, the Torah reports the appearance of (i) the large “tanninim”, (ii) marine species (most marine species are NOT fish), and (iii) winged creatures.
In the chapter “Fifth Day – Part III” in my book, “In the Beginning”, I present a detailed discussion of each group of animals. Since the criticism of Rav Slifkin that you mentioned refers only to the third group of animals, I will limit the discussion to the “winged creatures”.
I understood the earliest “winged creatures” to mean the insects (p. 84), writing: “The biblical commentator Radak emphasizes that the phrase ‘every winged creature’ refers to all winged creatures, including the insects (almost all insects have wings) as well as the birds… It is certainly to be expected that the biblical account of the formation of the animal kingdom would mention the all-important insects.”
In reference 28 (p. 88), I expanded on this, writing: “Rashi and other Commentators make a similar statement, but Radak is most explicit. This important point has also been noted by Rav E. Munk (“Seven Days in the Beginning,” p. 79).”
Rav Slifkin claims that this understanding of the Torah words is in error and “winged creatures” refer only to the birds. In this claim, he dismisses the views of Radak, Rashi and the other major Rishonim whom I quoted. I believe that I am in good company.
The final point to be made is that the major Commentators who understood the Torah words “winged creatures” to also mean the insects did not do so to avoid embarrassing questions related to the fossil evidence. In their day, there was no fossil evidence. The Commentators were presenting the true meaning of the Torah words.
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Kahane-Was-Right BT:
--- Quote from: muman613 on February 15, 2012, 09:37:57 PM ---Many people do not believe in Hashem simply because there is no science which can prove that he exists. If science is the ultimate truth then why has no scientist ever proven that Hashem's existence in the world is the truth? Most people are willing to trust scientists who say that there is no Hashem simply because the word 'scientist' is associated with their title..
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"The ultimate truth?" That is something you said, not something I said.
muman613:
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on February 17, 2012, 12:40:27 AM ---"The ultimate truth?" That is something you said, not something I said.
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It was a theoretical statement, "If A then B'...
If everything which exists is observable according to science, and that which is not observable must not exist or we do not have the ability to observe it at this time. It is part of Jewish belief, according to my understanding, that Hashem will always be hidden in this world {which is why we call this world 'Olam' which also means hidden}. We learn about 'Hester Panim' the hidden face of Hashem...
If Hashem will always remain hidden then there is no science which will be able to prove his existence, and thus everything which we observe has no creator and thus no purpose other than random mutation. If this is extended to the logical conclusion then there is no way a person who calls himself a scientist could accept the commandments of Hashem. We learn about the kinds of laws which our Torah contains. These are Mishpatim, Chokim, and Mitzvot. Remember that Chokim are laws which do not have a rational explanation. How could a rational person perform laws which are not rational?
I don't want to argue with you because I understand where you are coming from. I do not accuse you of putting 'faith' in Science. I am sorry if you feel I do that.
I believe in science to the point that I must be able to understand the data, the theory, and the conclusions. In Physics and Chemistry I do have faith that these are sciences based on our understanding of natural laws. When it comes to being able to project these laws into the future or into the past then I start to doubt that science. I understand the complexity of systems, as a software engineer who has worked on some very complex real-time software responsible for decoding video and audio streams for display on HDTV screens. I understand that the human is a limited creature who has limitations which were given to us in order for us to learn about our relation with our G-d.
Anyway, just take this as my opinion...
--- Quote ---http://www.torah.org/learning/maharal/p1m1part3.html
The Torah is composed of three types of laws: mishpatim (laws that are logical and which man can figure our for himself) chukim (laws that do not have any rational reason that is accessible to us), and mitzvoth (laws that need to be revealed by G-d, but that we can then find reason for). The Anshei Knesset HaGedolah gave instructions that cover the range of Torah laws. "Be deliberate in judgement" refers to the rational laws, of which monetary judgements are the quintessential ones. Having many students improves the quality of the Torah study, facilitating our ability to better understand the reasons for the Mitzvoth that we study. Creating fences around the Torah is especially important for the laws about which we lack any understanding. (Yes, the Midrash does tell us that it was the fact that reasons were given for certain laws that led Shlomo Hamelech to violate them with confidence that the reasons didn't apply to him. But the intention of the Maharal here is that the better we understand a law the less likely an added stringency may be to ensure that we faithfully adhere to the letter of the law.)
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