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The Ancient Hebrew Ktav Ivri script used during the First Temple Period

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edu:
I saw an interesting article on the net by Chaim Clorfene on the ancient Hebrew Ktav Ivri script used during the First Temple period.
http://www.jewishmag.com/160mag/original_hebrew_script/original_hebrew_script.htm
Here is a quote from his article:


--- Quote ---Since both proofs offered by Rabbi Elazar are rejected, we are left with two views:

1.) The Torah was originally written by Moses in Paleo-Hebrew (Ivri). It was changed to Ashuri script by Ezra during the Babylonian Exile and has remained so ever since.

2.) The Torah was written by Moses in Ashuri script. It was changed to Ivri towards the end of the First Temple period and then changed back again to Ashuri by Ezra.

This discussion is of monumental significance since it includes the writing of the Ten Commandments, "the two Tablets of Testimony, stone tablets inscribed by the finger of G-d." The Jerusalem Talmud maintains that the Ten Commandments were written in Ivri. The Babylonian Talmud says that they were written in Ashuri.

In the end, we find that the Talmudic discussion leaves us with a doubt concerning which script was the original. But we can possibly resolve this by considering a ceremony performed with the Kohen Gadol (High Priest) and the kings of the House of David.

The Mishna tells us that the Kohen Gadol must be consecrated by anointing with shemen hamischa, the anointing oil made by Moses. This is one of the 613 commandments of the Torah. A small amount of the oil is poured on the High Priest's head and applied between his eyes by a finger drawing the form of an X, the letter Tav, the 22nd letter of the Alef-Bet in Ivri script. And when the kings of the Davidic dynasty are anointed, the same oil is used, but applied in the shape of a crown, the vertical zigzag lines of a W, the form of the letter Shin, the 21st letter of Ivri script. Neither of these two shapes is found in our familiar Ashuri script.

Since Aaron, the High Priest, and King David appear to have been anointed with forms of letters of Ivri script, we can presume that Ivri was the script used during the early generations of the Children of Israel, and that Ashuri script was developed later. According to the opinion of Mar Zutra, it was a thousand years later during the Babylonian Exile.

My personal reflection on this subject is to avoid the mistake of thinking that if Paleo-Hebrew was the original, then it must be the holier of the two scripts. The fact is that Ezra, the father of Ashuri script, was the author of three books of the Hebrew Scriptures and worked with ruach hakodesh, a form of prophecy. The Hebrew letters that came from his hand contain some of the deepest and most mystical teachings of the Torah. These letters have sustained the Jewish people for 2500 years and will undoubtedly continue to do so in the future. But at the very least, the re-discovery of Ivri or Paleo-Hebrew suggests that we live in a new era, one that is struggling to synthesize the past with the present so as to become greater than both.
--- End quote ---

I myself have not researched the subject sufficiently to come to any firm conclusions, however, I am interested in knowing if other members of this forum agree or disagree with Chaim Clorfene and if so, on what are you basing your opinion.

muman613:
Here is a chart which compares the two scripts side by side:

muman613:
According to the Talmud the Ten Commandments MUST have been written using the Ashura script. Otherwise the Talmud Mesechet Shabbat 104a doesn't make any sense.

Remember that this Talmud says that the center of the Mem and the Samech were suspended in mid-air.... In the paleo-hebrew script this is not the case..

http://halakhah.com/shabbath/shabbath_104.html


--- Quote ---
....
it['s sanctity] is enhanced, for R. Hisda said: The mem and the samek which were in the Tables stood [there] by a miracle.1  But as for a closed letter which is written open, it['s sanctity] is diminished, for R. Jeremiah-others state, R. Hiyya b. Abba-said [The double form of] manzapak2  was declared by the Watchmen [prophets].3  (But, is that reasonable: surely is is written, These are the commandments,4  [teaching] that a prophet may henceforth [i.e., after Moses] make no innovations! — Rather they were in existence, but it was not known which were [to be used] medially and which finally, and the Watchmen came and fixed [the mode of their employment]). But still, 'these are the commandments' [teaches] that a prophet may henceforth make no innovations?5  — Rather they had forgotten them, and they [the Watchmen] reinstituted them.6

It was stated above, R. Hisda said: The mem and the samek which were in the Tables stood [there] by a miracle. R. Hisda also said: The writing of the Tables could be read from within and without,7  e.g., nebub [hollow] would be read buban; — behar [in the mountain] [as] rahab; saru [they departed] [as] waras.8
.
.
.

1)  The engraving of the Tables went right through from side to side. Consequently the completely closed letters, viz., the mem and the samek, should have fallen out, and the fact that they did not was a miracle. This assumes that only the closed mem was then in use, for it is now assumed that the employment of distinct medial forms was a later innovation. Hence if one writes a closed mem instead of an open one, he enhances its sanctity, since that is the older form. This is historically correct: the present medial forms were probably introduced in order to make it possible to join them to the next letter, and since this was unnecessary in the case of final letters, they were left in their original state. V.J.E., art. Alphabet, Vol. 1, 443.

--- End quote ---

edu:
Muman it is more appropriate to say that Rabbi Hisda of the Talmud Bavli believes that the Mem and Samech of the Ten Commandments were suspended by a miracle, since within the Talmud Bavli several conflicting viewpoints are brought about to which extent was the ancient Hebrew, Ktav Ivri script used.
I did not see the text directly that speaks about it, but I read that according to Talmud Yerushalmi it was the letter ayin written in Ancient Hebrew Ktav Ivri script, which was suspended by a miracle in the tablets of the ten commandments and not Mem and Samech.
I am told that currently the oldest verses of the Bible that have so far been found by archaeologists, from the First Temple period, are the verses containing Bircat Cohanim, (the priestly blessing, Bamidbar/Numbers 6 verses 24-26) and the text found was written in the ancient Hebrew Ktav Ivri script.
This of course does not prove, which script was used for the Ten Commandments, but it does shed light on some other issues.

muman613:

--- Quote from: edu on April 10, 2012, 05:16:26 PM ---Muman it is more appropriate to say that Rabbi Hisda of the Talmud Bavli believes that the Mem and Samech of the Ten Commandments were suspended by a miracle, since within the Talmud Bavli several conflicting viewpoints are brought about to which extent was the ancient Hebrew, Ktav Ivri script used.
I did not see the text directly that speaks about it, but I read that according to Talmud Yerushalmi it was the letter ayin written in Ancient Hebrew Ktav Ivri script, which was suspended by a miracle in the tablets of the ten commandments and not Mem and Samech.
I am told that currently the oldest verses of the Bible that have so far been found by archaeologists, from the First Temple period, are the verses containing Bircat Cohanim, (the priestly blessing, Bamidbar/Numbers 6 verses 24-26) and the text found was written in the ancient Hebrew Ktav Ivri script.
This of course does not prove, which script was used for the Ten Commandments, but it does shed light on some other issues.

--- End quote ---

You are correct... The Talmud often presents several opinions and I did not research the other opinions. I have heard the idea that the mem and samek were the letters which were suspended by a miracle.

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