Author Topic: Revava  (Read 21804 times)

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Offline JTFrulez

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Re: Revava
« Reply #50 on: October 29, 2006, 06:55:38 AM »
Jsullivan is the only one RIGHT ON THE SPOT here.

Chaim Ben Pesach DENIED the story told by Yekutiel that Marzel and Kach Board were fired by Rabbi Kahane.
Yekutiel on his forum blames Marzel, Itamar Ben Gvir and David HaIvri for being destructive.
Chaim Ben Pesach and other high ranking KACH officials all say Yekutiel was the main reason for the split.

UNITY is a great concept. But at the end of the day someone has to GIVE UP SOME GROUND
to another so UNITY can be formed, and some people's PRIDE just can't let them do that.

Offline Nahum

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Re: Revava
« Reply #51 on: October 29, 2006, 10:37:26 AM »
that is bull. yekutiel never said anyone was fired. you hear only what you want to fulez.  he said rabbi kahane quit kach and attempted to dismantle the board and marzel  itamar etc... decided to stay on. he never made mention that marzel nor itamar were destructive.  you are making things up that are false and pitting people against each other.  people like you scare me.  people that instigate fights from within ar truley frighting.  last thursday i was picked up and interrogated by the shin bet.  among other things, they were trying to egg me on, pit me on, and antagonize me against my enemies.  even those whom i despite and hate with boiling blood i would never discuss with the shin bet.  the leader of the shin bet was famous for what he did to th plo. he caused such in fighting and splits that it weakened the organization. this is what they are trying to do to us. this is why elisha from the revava forum is most likely an agent.  he is doing the exact same thing you are doing except on a much higher level where it actually effects what we do.  causing more infighting like what you are trying to do is very hurtful and is not beneficial what so ever. i do not believe that you are an agent what so ever and i honestly believe that you have good intentions at hand. 

yekutiel has only good words to say about chaim and the jtf.  what your organization represents is vital to the lifeline of jews in america.  keep on and stay positive. 

Offline JTFrulez

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Re: Revava
« Reply #52 on: October 29, 2006, 11:02:08 AM »
LIES are always the wrong way to go.
Here you have been exposed as a liar, Mr. Nahum.

A) Yekutiel ALWAYS tells the story about Marzel being fired. Rejecting this FACT
is ILLOGICAL and only hurts your cause.

B) Yekutiel DID SAY Baruch Marzel and Itamar Ben Gvir actions were destructive.
On his own forum he wrote "I was opposed to that TV interview that HaIvri gave and
to the other interviews given by Ben Gvir and Marzel concerning the shul. I saw them as destructive.

C) Who is causing FIGHTING and SPLITS ? ALL KACH or Kahane Chai officials including Chaim Ben Pesach himself
say Yekutiel was the one responsible for FIGHTING and SPLITS. By your logic Yekutiel is a SHin Bet agent.

D) LIES never work. Everyone knows about bad language some people speak about good and decent
activists who sacrifice their FREEDOM for the CAUSE such as Noam Federman. Denial is futile.

THOSE WHO COVER THEIR SINS SHALL NOT SUCCEED, THOSE WHO REPENT ARE FORGIVEN.

Offline Yekutiel

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Re: Revava
« Reply #53 on: October 29, 2006, 01:04:10 PM »
Ask me one question at a time and I will answer it as best I can.

I dont think Marzel and Itamar are destructive. I think they are God fearing wonderful Jews. Do I agree with them on every issue? No.

Was Marzel and the Kach staff fired in Oct 1990? I am afraid so. It was supposed to be implemented Dec 1990. That is a fact. Period.

Was Itamar fired in 1990? How could he have been fired, he was probabaly in diapers. Learn the facts.

Did Rav Kahane split form his staff and board of Directors in Oct 1990? Absolutely.

Was it the first time Rav Kahane had problems with the board of directors of movements he started? No. Chaim can give you more deatils on various JDL plots and times that Rav Kahane left or was removed from JDL.

Am I telling the truth? Yes. Can I prove it? I sure can. Why are Kach people who were fired upset when I remind them? Well, wouldnt you be upset if you were fired and people reminded you of that unpleasnat fact?

Offline TorahZionist

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Re: Revava
« Reply #54 on: October 29, 2006, 01:27:46 PM »
Was Itamar fired in 1990? How could he have been fired, he was probabaly in diapers. Learn the facts.

According to wikipedia, Itamar was born in 1977.
Is this information incorrect or are you claiming that he was wearing diapers when he was 13?

Offline Yekutiel

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Re: Revava
« Reply #55 on: October 29, 2006, 01:49:05 PM »
Concerning the shul and the media insanity. Basically, at an early stage of the building of the shul in Tapuach West, HaIvri, Marzel and Itamar Ben Gvir decided to take advantage of the lovely photo ops they can have from the huge shul being built on the hill. They all decided to place interviews and to give the SCOOP to various reporters. You see that's how it owrks with the media and with thoe who thrive on media coverage and gimmicks. You give info to teh media, and they give you info and a picture and a headline.

Suddenly I hear about the interviews and their content. The right wing extremists are building a college where Jews will be taught to kill Arabs or whatever. I remember hearing about How Marzel and Ben Gvir would be professors in teh college when i turned on the radio. I was building a shul in memory of the Kahanes and did plan on setting up an international center. I did not plan on giving the authorities false and exagerated information that they could use to bury us at that stage. People who had nothing to do with the shul, the planning, the goals decide on their own to make headlines at the expense of the unfinished project. I thought it was wrong and destructive.

I dont blame them for the destruction. The Israeli government neeed to be blamed. That does not mean that I dont feel their behavior was wrong, and it does not mean that I dont think their behavior was destructive. When you chasse cameras you tend to get burned, from time to time. If you chase cameras on your own projects, that is your judgement call. In thi scase it was not their call. This is one of the reasons that I limit their involvment in the planning stages of important and major projects that I organize. And when I dont, I always learn to regret it.

I am looking to do things, not to read about it. Yossie Dayan once gave a lecture and Marzel supported his conclusions when he said, if you did something and nobody read about it in the papers then you did nothing. But if you did nothing and people think you did something, then you did something.

I wanted to build a Kahane center not to have a shortlived gimmick or headline. Sorry, I dont agree with their philosophy. Sure, Rav Kahane used the media and gimmicks but that was not his essence. The moment people get carried away with the fame and the lights an dthe camera it comes at the expense of getting things done, especially in Israel,where the vultures will cut us down whenever they can.

I know the truth hurts. However, it hurts more when the deception blows up in ones face.

I believe in doing. For five years we supplied dogs to vulnerable towns and trained canines and volunteer handlers as well as security people from all over Yesha. We even gave 3-4 dogs to Noam Federman. Tjis was not a media gimmick. This was real life and is real life in spite of the government raids and confiscations. We prevented terrorist attacks, with God's help. It is a program on the ground. I  am not bragging and i will be the frist to tell you it is a small project but a real project. It survives because of the dedication of people who truly wish to save lives in Israel. It is boring to clean sh..t all day.

The referendum is another project on the ground. Over 100,000 Jews participated thus far. It is longterm and boring, but more and more Jews will sign on to "overthrow" the government through a referendum. It is a platform for us to articulate the Jewish alternative.

I am not opposed to gimmicks but that does not mean that I think that the gimmick approach is teh only approach. It doe snot mean that I wish to forfeit the programs that we are active in implementing on the   ground. I respect Marzel, Revava, and the others but that does not mean it is my way or that I should stop these programs that were initially launched by Rav Kahane, because Marzel or others are convinced that Rav Kahane was wrong on the referendum etc..

On this one, I prefer to side with Rav Kahane and his approach. Dont accuse me of making a aplit. Accuse rav Kahane.

Offline Yekutiel

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Re: Revava
« Reply #56 on: October 29, 2006, 01:50:34 PM »
yes he was not wearing diapers in 1990, but he also was not chairman of the board of Kach, or a staff member at 13. Did he ever meet Rav Kahane?

Offline JTFrulez

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Re: Revava
« Reply #57 on: October 29, 2006, 02:30:44 PM »
Yekutiel says KACH board was fired by Rabbi Kahane?
Yekutiel claims Chaim Ben Pesach is a LIAR when he decisively says the opposite?

We also know that different conspiracy theories surfaced some time after the murder of Rabbi Kahane
claiming Rabbi Kahane was not murdered by a VICIOUS ARAB NAZI SCUMBAG El-Sayyid Nosair but by the
KACH BOARD which was allegedly fired by the Rabbi just before the murder.

Who was the instigator of these rumors that caused such vicious and baseless accusations?

Offline nikmatdam

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Re: Revava
« Reply #58 on: October 29, 2006, 03:04:53 PM »
whoa back up guys... start from the beg. what went down and who did what when...? line up all the factions and the characters in this drama on one page and describe what they did and who they are trying to be today... nik.
"i am nikmatdam... humble and imperfect servant of Hashem... and i yearn for redemption but i absolutely ache for Divine justice and vengeance..."

Offline jsullivan

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Re: Revava
« Reply #59 on: October 29, 2006, 04:01:54 PM »
At a time when Israel is in such grave danger, I don't think we should be wasting so much time on this bickering.  I bet that if Chaim saw this thread, he would ask Yacov or me to lock it.

JTF has made its position clear.  We disagree with what Yekutiel did after the Rabbi's murder.  We support the former Kach movement. 

On the other hand, Yekutiel has made his position clear.

What else is there to add?  People can decide for themselves whom they agree with.

We do not want to continue this endless argument, and we hope that Yekutiel feels the same way.

We have differences of opinion with Yekutiel, but he is a good Jew.  We have no desire to keep feuding about the past.

Let's start focusing on what we can do to save Israel.

At least, that's my opinion.

Offline Nahum

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Re: Revava
« Reply #60 on: October 29, 2006, 04:15:05 PM »
amen!

Offline YMC

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Re: Revava
« Reply #61 on: November 15, 2006, 05:51:58 PM »
Dear All,

       At least if you want to bad mouth me let me know, so I can get a good laugh.  If you really have something to say then call me up we'll meet, I'll buy you coffee, (the Shabak gives me a coffee allowance).  It no fun discovering this a month later.

       I have a great business idea.  Let's make a twist-a-plot book ex:if you like haivri turn to page 34 if not then page 76.  Or if you think the referendom is good move back 4 pages if not go ahead four pages.  Or if you a kahanist turn to page 12 if not use the provided knife in the back of the book to kill yourself.

       You guys are great!!!

Yisroel Meir Cohen