Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
Whats Yonah really about?
Ephraim Ben Noach:
What if it is a hint to the final redemption... If the whole world repented, fasted, and humbled themselves before the Lord, it would bring the final redemption, or during the redemption the whole world even the animals( lion will lay with the lamb). Will repent, fast, and humble themselves before the Lord.
"You are sorry for the plant for which you have neither labored, nor made it grow; which came up in one night and perished in the next; shall I not then, spare Nineveh, the great city, wherein more than twelve times ten thousand people live who do not know how to discern between their right and their left hand (i.e. children), and many animals in addition?"
^ To me it seems HaShem is telling Jonah that he is being selfish. G-d is saying... " you care about a plant that I created, because it benefits you, but you don't care about all of my other creations, because it does not... They don't know what they are doing, now go out and get all of my creations to repent and come closer to me."
Remember, I'm just making this stuff up.
Ephraim Ben Noach:
Also, I don't think Jews believe this, but I do... I believe animals go to the spirit world, and souls are reincarnated in humans and animals. So that could explain how an animal could repent...
Israel Chai:
--- Quote from: אפרים בן נח on September 15, 2013, 10:22:44 PM ---Also, I don't think Jews believe this, but I do... I believe animals go to the spirit world, and souls are reincarnated in humans and animals. So that could explain how an animal could repent...
--- End quote ---
Repentance is illogical without free-will.
Ephraim Ben Noach:
--- Quote from: LKZ on September 15, 2013, 11:19:24 PM ---Repentance is illogical without free-will.
--- End quote ---
Ok, what about this... Man influences his animals. If a man is bad, his animals have a bad disposition. If he is a good man, his animals have a good disposition.
If the owner repents, maybe his animals will too.
How many dogs are evil, because their owner made them that way...
Israel Chai:
--- Quote from: אפרים בן נח on September 15, 2013, 11:43:25 PM --- Ok, what about this... Man influences his animals. If a man is bad, his animals have a bad disposition. If he is a good man, his animals have a good disposition.
If the owner repents, maybe his animals will too.
How many dogs are evil, because their owner made them that way...
--- End quote ---
Any sin one causes a child, or an animal to do is on his head. An apology entails a higher path that the person chose not to pursue instead of another one. When anything is incapable of making a choice, it is free of blame. A gun does not need to apologize, even if it was sentient. If someone imprisons you in a suit that you are weaker than, and the suit kills someone but you have no option to commit suicide, or your corpse is in the suit, you are not a murderer.
What is evil for a dog? Wild dogs, or if a powerful breeds of dog was loosed in the wild, they would be more brutal and vicious than trained ones. It is their nature, and it exists for a reason beyond their control, and they have no option to do otherwise. G-d created them to behave this way, and they can't become Jews, nor can they choose any other destiny from what their instincts and environment make them.
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