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The Egyptian that Moshe Killed - Would Not Father Future Converts

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muman613:
Moshe was chosen from birth to be the redeemer of Israel. We see this from various things the sages say about Baby Moses...

First Baby Moses face shone from birth, he would not nurse from a non-Jewish woman, there is the midrash about how in Pharoahs home the necromancers had suggested that baby Moses was the predicted (by their astrology) redeemer of the Jewish people and Pharoah placed Moses before a lump of hot coals and a pile of gold coins, the angels redirected baby Moses who was reaching for the gold to grasp the coals and place them against his lips (causing him to have the speech impediment he struggled with).

Maybe he was not a 'prophet' before the incident of the burning bush... But he surely was a chosen one long before that incident.

Tag-MehirTzedek:

--- Quote from: Zelhar on December 16, 2013, 03:00:58 PM ---Tag Mehir, wouldn't it be easier if our sages simply included a warning: "Don't try this yourselves, you are not Moshe !". I want to think that if they came up with this midrash they found meaning to it that is beyond any specific time or historical circumstances.

--- End quote ---

 As Edu said in the beginning not everyone agreed to it to begin with. I don't know for certain but perhaps their was a need at the time to do soo. + as now as well I did and do hear some people who bring this Perush and they use it to then say about how we should be careful in making judgment and to see the generations to come from that person and how they can get affected.

Tag-MehirTzedek:

--- Quote from: muman613 on December 16, 2013, 04:28:58 PM ---Moshe was chosen from birth to be the redeemer of Israel. We see this from various things the sages say about Baby Moses...

First Baby Moses face shone from birth, he would not nurse from a non-Jewish woman, there is the midrash about how in Pharoahs home the necromancers had suggested that baby Moses was the predicted (by their astrology) redeemer of the Jewish people and Pharoah placed Moses before a lump of hot coals and a pile of gold coins, the angels redirected baby Moses who was reaching for the gold to grasp the coals and place them against his lips (causing him to have the speech impediment he struggled with).

Maybe he was not a 'prophet' before the incident of the burning bush... But he surely was a chosen one long before that incident.

--- End quote ---

 Either way he wasn't a Prophet yet. In fact even at the burning Bush the Prophecy he reached was on a lower level (through an Angel) then what he eventually reached later on where it was directly from G-D. Soo for certain at this stage he didn't receive a Prophet revelation yet. therefore this cannot be the Pshat of the incident.

muman613:
Here is some background on the birth of Moses brought from the medrashim...


http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/111874/jewish/The-Birth-of-Moses.htm

THE LITTLE PROPHETESS

Life had become very difficult for the children of Israel in Egypt. Every day brought with it a new and more cruel decree from King Pharaoh, making life very miserable for the poor and, enslaved Hebrews. But there was at least one family which kept up its spirit and brought hope and courage to the others. That was the family of Amram, the son of Kehot great grandson of Jacob. He and his wife Jocheved, had two small children called Miriam, and Aaron.

One day Miriam went around in the house clapping her hands and saying, "I am going to have a little brother who will save our people from the hands of the Egyptians!"

And Miriam's words soon came true.

On the seventh day of Adar a baby boy was born to Amram and Jocheved, and immediately, the house became full of light. The clouds cleared and the sun shone more brightly than ever before. Amram came to his little daughter and kissed her, saying, "My darling daughter, I see now that you were right. Your new brother is not an ordinary baby. He will be the salvation of us all."

For three months the happy parents hid the newly-born baby from Pharaoh's officers who were going around from house to house, searching for Jewish babies, in order to throw them into the river, on orders from the king. At the end of three months, the officers began to search Amram's house very carefully, and Amram and Jocheved knew that they could not hide the little baby any longer. And so, Jocheved said, "I cannot protect my baby any longer, only G-d can. I will entrust my baby into His hands."

Saying this, Jocheved made a little basket of light weed, and covered it with pitch from without to make it watertight. "Let my baby not suffer from the smell of the pitch," she said, and that is why she did not pitch the basket from within. She then placed the baby into the water-tight basket, and took it down to the River Nile. She hid the basket among the papyrus reeds growing on the bank of the river.

II.

THE FATEFUL DAY

With tears in her eyes, she came back home. But little Miriam remained by the river's brink to see what would happen to her little brother.

At that very time, the Angels assembled before G-d and pleaded for the little baby. "Oh G-d," they said, "Thou hast promised that the day would come when the children of Israel would be delivered from Egypt and given Thy sacred Torah on the sixth day of Sivan. Today is the sixth of Sivan, wilt Thou let this child succumb to starvation and exposure in the waters of the Nile?"

Immediately, G-d ordered the sun to blaze away with might and main and cause all the Egyptian women and children to flock to the river to bathe and refresh themselves in the cool waters of the Nile.

Princess Bithiah, King Pharoah's daughter, called her maids and also went down to bathe in the river.

Suddenly, the princess noticed a little basket in the reeds by the river's brink. She sent one of her maids to fetch it, but her wicked maid said, "Why bother, princess, with a little basket where surely a Hebrew baby is hidden? Has not our mighty king ordered all the children to be thrown into the river without pity?"

Now the princess had lost the use of her arms through illness, and thought: "If only I could use my hands, I would fetch the little basket myself." No sooner did that kind thought flash through her mind than a wonderful thing happened to her. She suddenly felt that her hands were well and strong again. The princess went down among the reeds and picked up the little basket with her own hands.

When she opened the basket, she found there a little baby with a bright face that shone like the sun. The princess took pity on the baby and said, "Surely this is one of the unfortunate Hebrew babies. I will not be as cruel as my father; I will save him."

III.

IN HIS MOTHER'S ARMS

The princess ordered one of her Egyptian maids to feed the child. But as soon as the woman took the baby in her arms, he began to cry pitifully, and refused to be fed. The princess ordered another maid to feed the baby, but again with no success.

All this time, Miriam was standing only a little distance away, watching closely all that was happening to her little brother, but saying nothing. When she heard her little brother cry, she came forth and said to the princess: "Shall I call someone to feed the child?"

"Please do," said the princess, "and I will reward you amply."

Miriam hastened home to her mother, and told her all that had happened on the river's brink. "Hurry, mother," she said, "the princess is waiting, and the baby is hungry! "

Jocheved, rushed to the river and no sooner did she take the little baby in her arms, than it stopped crying and began to smile happily. The princess could not help smiling too, and she said to Jocheved, "I will pay you two shekels each day if you will nurse the baby for me."

"I shall be most happy to do so," Jocheved said.

"Good. I will entrust you with the baby for two years," the princess said, "but remember, that at the end of two years, you must bring the child to me at the palace safe and sound!"

"He will be the apple of my eye," Jocheved said, and carried the baby away to her home.

IV.

THE, SEVEN NAMES

Jocheved kept her promise, and at the end of two years, she brought the baby to the princess. Bithiah was delighted to see the baby. She had never seen such a beautiful and adorable child in all her life.

"What name do you call this child by?" Bithiah asked.

"We gave him six names," the mother said. "Jered, Chaver, Jekuthiel, Avigdor, Avi-Socho, and Avi-Zonoach!"

"I will give him a seventh name," Bithiah said. "I will call him Moshe (Moses), because I drew him out of the water."

And G-d said, "Because Bithiah was so kind and merciful, the child will be called by the name that she gave him."

From that day on, Moses remained in the palace and the princess loved him dearly, as though he were her own son. Everyone who came to the palace and saw Moses, admired the unusual beauty and good manners of the child. Even the cruel King Pharaoh and Queen Alpharaohnith loved him and played with him.


I am not suggesting he had 'face-to-face' prophecy before the incident of the burning bush... I am just suggesting that Moses was, from birth, destined to be the redeemer...

muman613:
Some of the Talmudic sources regarding Moses...

http://www.webshas.org/torah/bichtav/tanach/mitzraim.htm

Moses's Family and his Birth
Amram, Moshe's father, was the leader of his generation: Sotah 12a
Yocheved, Moshe's mother, was born when the Jews entered Egypt: Sotah 12a
Amram returned to his wife, Yocheved, on the advice of his daughter, Miriam: Sotah 12a
Amram's rationale in separating from Yocheved, and Miriam's response: Sotah 12a
When Amram and Yocheved separated, so did everyone else: Sotah 12a
When Amram reunited with Yocheved, he did so with great fanfare: Sotah 12a
When Amram reunited with Yocheved, her youth was restored to her even though she was 130 years old: Sotah 12a
Yocheved was pregnant with Moses from before she and Amram had separated, and so the Egyptians, counting from their reunion, were off by three months. As such, Yocheved was able to hide Moses for three months: Sotah 12a
The birth of Moses was painless for Yocheved, due to her righteousness: Sotah 12a
Date of Moses's Birth: Megillah 13b; Kiddushin 38a; Sotah 12b
Moses was born in a leap year: Sotah 12b
When Moses was born, the house was filled with light: Megillah 14a; Sotah 12a, 13a
When Moses was born and the house filled with light, Amram kissed Miriam's head and said, "Your prophecy is fulfilled!" Then when Moses was thrown into the sea, Amram slapped her and said, "Daughter, where is your prophecy now?!": Sotah 13a
Miriam's prophecy on the birth of Moses, and its fulfillment: Megillah 14a; Sotah 11b, 12b-13a
Moses was fit for prophecy at birth: Sotah 12a
Moses was born circumcised: Sotah 12a
They used reeds, rather than wood, for Moses's ark either because the righteous are very careful with their money, so that they won't come to theft, or because soft material would withstand harsh and soft forces: Sotah 12a
The lining of the ark was arranged so that Moses wouldn't smell the foul-smelling materials: Sotah 12a
Moses was either placed in Yam Suf, or just in a reedy area: Sotah 12a-b
Moses was termed a "youth [adolescent]" in the ark either because of his deep voice or because of a wedding canopy his mother made for him in the ark, fearing she would never see him get married: Sotah 12b
Miriam waited for an hour to see whether her brother Moses would be all right (in his ark on the river), and so the Jewish people waited seven days for her while she had tzaraat, and did not travel without her: Sotah 9b, 11a
When the Torah describes how Miriam waited to guard Moshe on the water, the verse also refers to Gd's Manifestation [Shechinah] being there, too: Sotah 11a
When Moses was put into the sea, Pharaoh's astrologers told Pharaoh there was no more need to throw children into the sea: Sotah 12b
Moses was put into the sea on the 21st of Nisan, and the angels protested that he shouldn't suffer on the water on the date when he was destined to sing to Gd by the Sea: Sotah 12b
Moses was put into the sea on the 6th of Sivan, and the angels protested that he shouldn't suffer on the water on the date when he was destined to receive the Torah: Sotah 12b
Moses refused to nurse from the Egyptian women, as they had eaten non-Kosher food, and so Miriam could suggest that a Jewish woman be brought for him: Sotah 12b
Gd gave Moshe the Torah because he weaned himself from non-Kosher milk: Sotah 12b

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