Israeli woman chases down flasher in Massachusetts

[ChabadKahanist]

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/266606

[Hrvatski Noahid]

A Jewish woman shouldn't be jogging.

[angryChineseKahanist]

A Jewish woman shouldn't be jogging.

Huh?  Why not?
Women are supposed to stay unhealthy fat blobs?

[Hrvatski Noahid]

Huh?  Why not?
Women are supposed to stay unhealthy fat blobs?

Jewish (and Gentile) women are obligated to dress and act modestly.

[ChabadKahanist]

Jewish (and Gentile) women are obligated to dress and act modestly.

Here in Israel loads of religious ladies who are modestly dressed jog

[Hrvatski Noahid]

Here in Israel loads of religious ladies who are modestly dressed jog

I need not explain to an Orthodox Jew that a woman who jogs doesn't act modestly, regardless of her dress.

[ChabadKahanist]

I need not explain to an Orthodox Jew that a woman who jogs doesn't act modestly, regardless of her dress.

I get your jist

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Jewish (and Gentile) women are obligated to dress and act modestly.

Jogging is good for the health, the Torah encourages being healthy

[Israel Chai]

A Jewish woman shouldn't be jogging.

It depends on her chest size. If she is more endowed in said region, everything on the street stares. There are specific clothes that make this better. If it is to chase down and beat up a flasher, it is an exception, 1st kidush Hashem, 2nd attention isn't on her. We have gyms for women only where they can jog.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

It depends on her chest size. If she is more endowed in said region, everything on the street stares. There are specific clothes that make this better. If it is to chase down and beat up a flasher, it is an exception, 1st kidush Hashem, 2nd attention isn't on her. We have gyms for women only where they can jog.

Jogging is usually done outdoors. If a man exposed himself to her while she was jogging, she was attracting attention. Of course, women only gyms are exceptions.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

Jogging is good for the health, the Torah encourages being healthy

I doubt women jog outdoors for the health benefits. They jog to attract male attention.

[ChabadKahanist]

I doubt women jog outdoors for the health benefits. They jog to attract male attention.
[/quote
Sure they jog for health benefits.
It is also a good way to lose weight

[Hrvatski Noahid]

Sure they jog for health benefits.
It is also a good way to lose weight

And attracting male attention has nothing to do with it? You can argue that mixed dancing and mixed swimming is a good way to lose weight, too. 

[ChabadKahanist]

And attracting male attention has nothing to do with it? You can argue that mixed dancing and mixed swimming is a good way to lose weight, too.

This is completely different & not in a mixed setting just jogging by herself instead of walking.

[angryChineseKahanist]

This woman is SEXY!
When I saw her jogging,  I got all HOT!
She's just asking for it.

[Israel Chai]

Jogging is usually done outdoors. If a man exposed himself to her while she was jogging, she was attracting attention. Of course, women only gyms are exceptions.

A woman jogging is not a justification to let it flop out. It is not her fault that he was publicly exposing himself. If you want to make a comparison, jogging can be done for a good reason, maybe she was running to do a mitzvah, whereas exposing yourself publicly is pretty hard to imagine as a good thing under any circumstance. There are clothes that allow any woman to jog outside and be modest. If there is a case where a non-Jewish woman is running outside and it is immodest, it is not really a crime for her, no lashes even, whereas for him it is an issue.

It is a mitzvah to take care of your health. Rambam considers physical exercise to be a fundamental mitzvah that the others are dependent upon, in a similar way to how the Alter Rebbe considers joy to be a precursor to other mitzvot.

In alot of Jewish communities, women don't get enough exercise because it's hard to find a place to do it, and they might not have the right clothes to do it, or they are uncomfortable in them. It is not ideal for girls to wear shorts and run around every religious area. Women in the day could go jog in the woods and were fine. This is another challenge of big city living, and the solution when it is found will be magnificent.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

A woman jogging is not a justification to let it flop out. It is not her fault that he was publicly exposing himself. If you want to make a comparison, jogging can be done for a good reason, maybe she was running to do a mitzvah, whereas exposing yourself publicly is pretty hard to imagine as a good thing under any circumstance. There are clothes that allow any woman to jog outside and be modest. If there is a case where a non-Jewish woman is running outside and it is immodest, it is not really a crime for her, no lashes even, whereas for him it is an issue.

It is a mitzvah to take care of your health. Rambam considers physical exercise to be a fundamental mitzvah that the others are dependent upon, in a similar way to how the Alter Rebbe considers joy to be a precursor to other mitzvot.

In alot of Jewish communities, women don't get enough exercise because it's hard to find a place to do it, and they might not have the right clothes to do it, or they are uncomfortable in them. It is not ideal for girls to wear shorts and run around every religious area. Women in the day could go jog in the woods and were fine. This is another challenge of big city living, and the solution when it is found will be magnificent.

I am glad you mentioned Rambam. Here is what he wrote in Ishut 13:11:

"It is uncouth for a woman always to leave home - this time to go out and another time to go on the street. Indeed, a husband should prevent a wife from doing this and not allow her to go out more than once or twice a month, as is necessary. For there is nothing more attractive for a woman than to sit in the corner of her home, as [implied by Psalms 45:14]: "All the glory of the king's daughter is within." https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/952887/jewish/Ishut-Chapter-Thirteen.htm

He should not have exposed himself and she should not have been jogging. By her action the woman was a partner in the sin.

HaShem punishes immodest Gentile women. Of course immodesty is a crime for them.

[ChabadKahanist]

Huh?  Why not?
Women are supposed to stay unhealthy fat blobs?

I think our friend is referring to the dual floppies!!!!
That is his objection for modesty reasons!!!

[Hrvatski Noahid]

I think our friend is referring to the dual floppies!!!!
That is his objection for modesty reasons!!!

If my wife went jogging, I would whip her.

[ChabadKahanist]

If my wife went jogging, I would whip her.

I would consult with a qualified rav before ruling it out one way or another.
I assume your  objection is to the dual floppies bouncing here,there & everywhere on  some women.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

I would consult with a qualified rav before ruling it out one way or another.
I assume your  objection is to the dual floppies bouncing here,there & everywhere on  some women.

The dual floppies are part of the problem. Her behind bouncing up and down doesn't help. 

I don't want my wife to go jogging. I know I am not allowed to say that in this day and age, but I have standards and expectations.

[ChabadKahanist]

The dual floppies are part of the problem. Her behind bouncing up and down doesn't help. 

I don't want my wife to go jogging. I know I am not allowed to say that in this day and age, but I have standards and expectations.

Very admirable to have standards so few  people do nowadays!!!!!

[Israel Chai]

I am glad you mentioned Rambam. Here is what he wrote in Ishut 13:11:

"It is uncouth for a woman always to leave home - this time to go out and another time to go on the street. Indeed, a husband should prevent a wife from doing this and not allow her to go out more than once or twice a month, as is necessary. For there is nothing more attractive for a woman than to sit in the corner of her home, as [implied by Psalms 45:14]: "All the glory of the king's daughter is within." https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/952887/jewish/Ishut-Chapter-Thirteen.htm

He should not have exposed himself and she should not have been jogging. By her action the woman was a partner in the sin.

HaShem punishes immodest Gentile women. Of course immodesty is a crime for them.

There are two separate things here. No indication he was exposing himself as a reaction to her jogging, or he would be exposing himself quite frequently. If you are living in a muslim country, leaving the house as a woman is a life risk at best, I would say Rambam is being lenient there. Today when both in a married couple have to work and she's not going to be kidnapped and forcibly "married" and left in a basement, this isn't enormously relevant. Besides, the tiny apartments people live in don't have enough stimulation for anyone, the woman will become a t.v. junkie or develop one of numerous psychological disorders from sitting in a house all day, like the one where you think everyone is in a conspiracy against you in the house (not psychosis) or agoraphobia.

Also, fat girls are considered attractive in Middle Eastern and African countries, means you don't have to work in the farm all day and you have food. I am uninterested in marrying them, as are most in the Western world, besides the fact that they die earlier and suffer more health problems, they have to exercise like normal people to increase their chances of marriage.

Gentiles are not required to follow the same levels of modesty as Jewish women are, sex crimes are crimes for them, immodesty leads to it and should be avoided. In extreme cases you are quite right.

If my wife went jogging, I would whip her.

This is a crime outside of muslim countries, so can't do that. She will have to agree with you for intellectual and spiritual reasons.


The sum here is, first to back up our Noachide friend, no one could imagine their rebetzin running around in a sweater, and on the other side, exercise is important and there are ways to do it in a kosher way.

Back to the article though, the girl kinda rocks for hunting the flasher down, we can talk about whether she is good or not after we deal with that.

[angryChineseKahanist]

If my wife went jogging, I would whip her.

So, you own her?

Seriously where do get the idea?  Are you saying that in jest?  Or would you actually lay a hand on her?

Does she go to a doctor?  Eventually we all get fat.  Eventually her doctor will tell her jog or die of a heart attack from fat.

I'm middle age. I'm slightly overweight.  my cholesterol is borderline. My doctor says: get some exercise.  And being the cheapskate I am, I walk and jog.  Hey, its free. What's cheaper than that?

And why are we blaming women?  What about the predators?  Are they innocent?   Oh, they're just horny.  Gotta put that thing somewhere.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

There are two separate things here. No indication he was exposing himself as a reaction to her jogging, or he would be exposing himself quite frequently. If you are living in a muslim country, leaving the house as a woman is a life risk at best, I would say Rambam is being lenient there. Today when both in a married couple have to work and she's not going to be kidnapped and forcibly "married" and left in a basement, this isn't enormously relevant. Besides, the tiny apartments people live in don't have enough stimulation for anyone, the woman will become a t.v. junkie or develop one of numerous psychological disorders from sitting in a house all day, like the one where you think everyone is in a conspiracy against you in the house (not psychosis) or agoraphobia.

Also, fat girls are considered attractive in Middle Eastern and African countries, means you don't have to work in the farm all day and you have food. I am uninterested in marrying them, as are most in the Western world, besides the fact that they die earlier and suffer more health problems, they have to exercise like normal people to increase their chances of marriage.

Gentiles are not required to follow the same levels of modesty as Jewish women are, sex crimes are crimes for them, immodesty leads to it and should be avoided. In extreme cases you are quite right.

This is a crime outside of muslim countries, so can't do that. She will have to agree with you for intellectual and spiritual reasons.


The sum here is, first to back up our Noachide friend, no one could imagine their rebetzin running around in a sweater, and on the other side, exercise is important and there are ways to do it in a kosher way.

Back to the article though, the girl kinda rocks for hunting the flasher down, we can talk about whether she is good or not after we deal with that.

Bro, he saw the woman jogging and exposed himself to her. What more indication do you want?

If Rambam wrote it, it is enormously relevant. There is no Torah source that a wife has to work outside the house. Following ways of modesty is a positive aspect of the Noahide prohibition of forbidden relations. Yes, it is forbidden to hit her, but it is allowed to divorce her.

I agree there are kosher ways to exercise.