Author Topic: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites  (Read 3395 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2019, 01:18:11 AM »
They are actually a mix of Haman and Antiochus. They hate their own people but their hatred for Judaism and forced secularization is more like Antiochus. The Jews fled the Soviet Union and its forced secularization. He wants to bring Soviet secularism to Israel. What an ugly monster.


Offline Ulli

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 10946
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2019, 03:27:55 AM »
They are actually a mix of Haman and Antiochus. They hate their own people but their hatred for Judaism and forced secularization is more like Antiochus. The Jews fled the Soviet Union and its forced secularization. He wants to bring Soviet secularism to Israel. What an ugly monster.

Exactly right. This behaviour from refugees is in general common. I don't want to blame everybody, but you see this in lots of countries. I.e. Japan has a Korean miniority that worshippes Kim Yong Un. In Europe you have refugees from Syria that worship political Islam. In USA you have lots of Immigrants from Southern and Middle America that believe in Socialism. If a political Ideology is obviously failing and the circumstances in a country become unbearable BECAUSE OF IT and you have to leave, then you should learn from it. I don't understand it.  ???
"Cities run by progressives don't know how to police. ... Thirty cities went up last night, I went and looked at every one of them. Every one of them has a progressive Democratic mayor." Rudolph Giuliani

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2019, 09:59:44 PM »
Dude, I'm sorry.  They may be a lot of things.  They may be jerks.  Maybe even traitors who would help the Arab enemy with a peace deal.  Maybe they resent Judaism and that's really bad.  There are plenty of Jews like that.  But the fact that they want to cut down on handouts to full-time learning Israeli yeshiva men and keep haredi parties out of the govt coalition to do so, does NOT make them Amalekites. 

Offline ChabadKahanist

  • Ultimate JTFer
  • *******
  • Posts: 4987
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2019, 11:54:31 PM »
Dude, I'm sorry.  They may be a lot of things.  They may be jerks.  Maybe even traitors who would help the Arab enemy with a peace deal.  Maybe they resent Judaism and that's really bad.  There are plenty of Jews like that.  But the fact that they want to cut down on handouts to full-time learning Israeli yeshiva men and keep haredi parties out of the govt coalition to do so, does NOT make them Amalekites.
The vast majority of American Jewry are just like them!!!!!

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2019, 05:14:26 PM »
Many Haredi MKs agree on calling them Amalek. We all remember when Rabbi Ovadiah Yosef called Yossi Sarid Haman.


Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2019, 07:08:55 PM »
Many Haredi MKs agree on calling them Amalek. We all remember when Rabbi Ovadiah Yosef called Yossi Sarid Haman.

LOL, do you take your ethical guidance from Haredi MKs?

It is not Amalek to say that haredim should be participating in society in some way and not just receiving handouts.  They call anyone who suggests that as Amalek.  It's moronic.

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2019, 11:07:16 PM »
LOL, do you take your ethical guidance from Haredi MKs?

It is not Amalek to say that haredim should be participating in society in some way and not just receiving handouts.  They call anyone who suggests that as Amalek.  It's moronic.


Liberman said that they should learn Jewish subjects only after Secular subjects. At most, they should be equal, but he thinks Judaism is less important. We have more in common with Haredim than Russians that act like Russian goyim or that actually are Russian goyim.

Lapid is a known Judaism hater. If you hate the Jewish religion, it's the same as hating your own people. It's just like being Anti-Israel is equal to being Anti-Semitic. Lapid's father had the Shinui Party, which was based on the sole purpose of hating Judaism. The current Lapid created the Ein Atid Party and tried to make it kosher by having self-hating rabbis join the party, one which became Education Minister. I remember Chaim mentioned that Lapid used religious Jews in his party to make it sound kosher when I asked him about it on Ask JTF.


Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2019, 11:22:02 PM »
I know Lapid is an empty headed scoundrel who hates religion (maybe not as much as his father), but it really doesn't support your point or the haredi MK point.   These MKs and sometimes the gadolim whose message they propagate, use inflammatory language and dishonest language because they are threatened by ANY effort to curtail handouts to the kollel system and ANY effort to better integrate haredi men into society (be it by national service, army, work, secular education, or anything else besides the haredi powers' artificially designed and now excessively bloated and unsustainable 'learn all day and get paid by govt' system).  Any such effort is inaccurately called as "Amalek."

If a good Jew who has absolutely no hatred for religion advocated any type of change to the status quo to enable haredim into the workforce, they'd call good Jews "Amalek" too.   Even the few haredim who serve in the army get mobbed and attacked in their communities by all these haters calling them sickening names.  Where do you think they get this idea from?

It's time that the masses of religious Jews, like you and me and people with common sense, stop coddling and giving lip service to this improper behavior just because we are all, ostensibly, under the banner of Torah. 
They wouldn't hesitate to call you and me all kinds of names because we are Zionist.   So why should I tolerate their BS culture of hatred and welfare handouts and be their little lap dog?   At least what I believe in (zionism) has support from the Torah.  Moses would have killed Jews who refused to contribute to the army or to the overall society, let alone tolerate their BS and say I can't say boo about it.   

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2019, 11:30:26 PM »
Korach was a gadol.  Look what Moshe did to him.

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2019, 10:41:31 AM »
If religious Jews want Haredim to work, then religious Jews should say so, without advocating for buses on Shabbat, non-kosher food, and whatever the Russian goyim, self-hating Russian Jews, and Lapid people want. If they use anti-religious points, they loose any legitimacy. Lieberman doesn't just want Haredim to work and serve in the IDF. He wants to destroy the Jewish character of the State.

If they want Haredim to serve, then there should be Haredi units and the IDF should operate according to Halacha, not according to "humane" values that put our soldiers in danger out of concern for enemy "civilians". Until then, people can't be forced to serve. Israel doesn't need extra soldiers. They wouldn't integrate into the IDF. Many Left Wing Jews don't serve also. Israel has more than enough people serving. Israel should just get a professional army. Why waste money on having soldiers to unnecessary things? If Lapid cares about money and handouts, then he shouldn't support the IDF wasting money on unnecessary stuff.


Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #11 on: September 23, 2019, 01:07:55 PM »
If religious Jews want Haredim to work, then religious Jews should say so, without advocating for buses on Shabbat, non-kosher food, and whatever the Russian goyim, self-hating Russian Jews, and Lapid people want. If they use anti-religious points, they loose any legitimacy. Lieberman doesn't just want Haredim to work and serve in the IDF. He wants to destroy the Jewish character of the State.

It is not just religious Jews who are justified in wanting haredim to work, serve, and contribute to society.  All the Jewish taxpayer money is getting siphoned to support the kollel welfare system.  All the Jewish people who are required to serve in the army by being a citizen are fulfilling those responsibilities while the haredim shirk them.  It is incredibly ungrateful and a disgraceful stance to suggest that only religious Jews should have any say in demanding ethical behavior from haredi citizens. 

When secular Israelis make these arguments about the financially unsustainable haredi society, they have a valid point because the truth is the truth even if it's not being said by a religious Jew that you view as "pure."

Quote
If they want Haredim to serve, then there should be Haredi units and the IDF should operate according to Halacha, not according to "humane" values that put our soldiers in danger out of concern for enemy "civilians". Until then, people can't be forced to serve. Israel doesn't need extra soldiers. They wouldn't integrate into the IDF. Many Left Wing Jews don't serve also. Israel has more than enough people serving. Israel should just get a professional army. Why waste money on having soldiers to unnecessary things? If Lapid cares about money and handouts, then he shouldn't support the IDF wasting money on unnecessary stuff.

There ARE Haredi units.  Nachal Haredi was designed so that haredim could serve in the army without having to compromise their practices.  They largely protest and boycott this unit.  It is filled mostly with more rightwing chardal people, and a few haredim who are OTD or very outside the box exceptions in their community.  Very few haredim serve in these units. 

You talk about all these things to change policies, all to serve the selfish demands of haredim.   The policy debate is valid only insofar as it's logical to change policy for reasons that help the country better and make it better able to fight the enemy.  Policy debate over the army as a way to cater to the haredi refusal to take responsibility, refusal to integrate into society, refusal to get off the welfare drip, is just another way of being their lapdog and carrying water for the corrupt haredi MKs. 

Do you ever read what haredi gedolim say?  None of them are opposed to the army on grounds that the Purity of arms rules are too strict and endanger soldiers.  They are opposed to the army on the grounds that they believe haredis will go OTD from the cultural influences by serving, that haredi men are meant to LEARN TORAH and only Learn Torah, full time, and taking away from that in any way is an averah, and in general that the Torah cannot be used to make halachic rulings about the army because it's not in Shulchan Aruch and we can't pasken from Tanach, all of which is just proof that we are not allowed to HAVE an army in this time before moshiach (Just as we are not allowed to have a state, really, but we live here like we live in any other place because the land has kedusha and there is so much learning here, we didn't create the state - that's your averah).  But all you frei chilonim go on ahead and protect us every day from the arab terrorist animals because you don't follow halacha anyway, but we can't soil ourselves with any activity like that, certainly not take away from Torah learning to do so.  And of course no gratitude at all for protecting because afterall, it's Hashem and the Torah learning which does the protecting, you guys are just doing a fake "going through the motions" hishtadlus but none of your military efforts are actually achieving anything, it's our learning.
This is what they say.    Not what you say.   It's absolutely a disgrace.

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2019, 10:51:34 PM »
If Lieberman wants to say that, he should leave out the part about buses on Shabbat and whatever [censored] infested goyim want him to say. Once he attacks Judaism, the rest of what he says is irrelevant. The fact that he wants to hold an entire country hostage makes him the enemy. If he cares about wasting money, why did he force an unnecessary election? Is Israel going to have 4 elections a year now? It's like the Democrats that want to give money to poor people but raise millions of dollars just for their political campaigns rather than donating the money to poor people or when Bernie Sanders is a billionaire but he wants others to pay high taxes when he could donate his own money to help people he claims he wants to help.


Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #13 on: September 24, 2019, 01:08:43 PM »
The fact that people are voting for Lieberman (and a big chunk of the support for Blue and White is also based on the anti-haredi premise, which is why they have Lapid) shows that it's not just Lieberman's personal grievance against haredim, it's a lot of the Jewish populace that agrees on these matters and do NOT want haredi parties in the ruling coalition because they want things changed.   The haredi stubbornness to change only strengthens these forces in society and empowers the left.  You encourage it by saying it's just a veiled attack on Judaism, rather than taking stock of the situation and objectively acknowledging the wrongdoing of haredi leadership and politicians.

There are many like you who don't have the fortitude to even state clearly that Yes, the haredi shirking of responsibility and milking the secular Jewish taxpayer money for their own selfish purposes while smearing the secular Jews with dishonest labels and defensively ascribing them to (false) evil motivations is unfair.   Why won't you acknowledge that?  Why does it have to be some kind of anti-Judaism conspiracy to point out these facts?

Many people won't say this because they are afraid to say something that they think goes against the stances of the "gedolim"

What a sad state of affairs.  Rabbi Kahane ZTL had no problem going against any stance the endangered the Jewish people and the Jewish state, and he readily went against any establishment rabbi who promoted bad ideas.   How far we've fallen as a kehilla without leadership like that.   The religious Orthodox Jews of today are trembling in fear to dare say something that goes against the "orthodoxy" (for lack of better word) stance of worshiping the kollel system.   Because "Daas Torah" said ____ . This perspective is widespread in our communities.

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #14 on: September 25, 2019, 10:01:49 AM »
If non-religious Jews want to criticize Haredim for not working, they can do it without the attacks on Judaism in general. Self-hating Jews are a minority in Israel. The ones that vote for Lapid and Lieberman are part of the problem. If you remove the 13 Arab MKs, the Right has a majority in the Knesset. Also, if you remove the Russian goyim that voted for Lieberman, you get an even greater majority.

The Left has more a problem than just hating Judaism. They also hate The Land of Israel. Enabling Left Wing parties for the sake of attacking Haredim also enables people who want to hand over The Land of Israel to the Muslim Nazis.

Also, not all Haredim don't work. Who do you think works in the businesses in their neighborhoods? Also, the government is part of the problem. In Israel, Lishkat HaAvodah (employment agency) doesn't allow students to apply for jobs. If they quit the yeshiva and go to Lishkat HaAvodah, they will get unemployment money until they find them a job. Otherwise, they will continue receiving unemployment money but won't be allowed to be students. I guess they don't want to waste time not studying in order to follow the Bolshevik rules regarding jobs. Also, they don't let them work unless they go to the army first. Yeshiva is supposed to be instead of the army. The answer is to let them go to work without being in the army. We don't need them in the army. There are enough people serving.

The bottom is according to Wikipedia.

Quote
Studying in a Yeshiva might allow the postponement of the recruitment in six months, and after that one might more easily be granted a postponement for an additional six months and so on, without any limitations, as long as the student continues his studies in the Yeshiva (for men only). This exemption is called Torato Omanuto and is enshrined in the Tal Law.

If they are not continuously learning in yeshiva, they will get drafted. If the Leftists really cared about money being wasted on them, they would allow them to work rather than serve. This way they can be self-reliant and the army won't be paying them either.


Offline Yehudayaakov

  • Pro JTFer
  • *****
  • Posts: 740
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #15 on: September 25, 2019, 12:57:19 PM »
Not just them, anyone who use his jewishness to gain control over other jews are too.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #16 on: September 25, 2019, 11:57:17 PM »
If they are not continuously learning in yeshiva, they will get drafted.

I see that you continue to drink the kool aid and be the loyal servant for the haredi establishment.  You push all their same talking points.  It's too bad how disingenuous they are. 

Why would learning in a yeshiva exempt someone from being drafted? 
In general, they mostly all stay in yeshiva indefinitely and into ADULTHOOD where it's simply name changed to Kollel rather than yeshiva. 
Yes, I'm aware that as the system is currently set up, they cannot be drafted if they are sitting and learning.  The whole point of the argument is that that should NOT be the system. It should change as circumstances have changed.  When the system was set up, the haredim were a tiny minority and it was done largely to appease them.   Their numbers got too big.  And no, most of those guys sitting there are not being productive.   And almost none of them share their Torah with society at large.  Yet they sit and take money for it.  It's a disgrace.

Quote
Enabling Left Wing parties for the sake of attacking Haredim also enables people who want to hand over The Land of Israel to the Muslim Nazis.

And how many times have the haredi parties joined coalition govt's led by the leftists?  Many.  Shas even hoe'd out for Oslo with Rabin.

Quote
Yeshiva is supposed to be instead of the army.

Oh it is?  I didn't see that in the Torah, can you show me where it is?

Please.  Your arms must be getting so tired carrying all this water. 

Offline ChabadKahanist

  • Ultimate JTFer
  • *******
  • Posts: 4987
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #17 on: September 26, 2019, 03:07:33 AM »
I see that you continue to drink the kool aid and be the loyal servant for the haredi establishment.  You push all their same talking points.  It's too bad how disingenuous they are. 

Why would learning in a yeshiva exempt someone from being drafted? 
In general, they mostly all stay in yeshiva indefinitely and into ADULTHOOD where it's simply name changed to Kollel rather than yeshiva. 
Yes, I'm aware that as the system is currently set up, they cannot be drafted if they are sitting and learning.  The whole point of the argument is that that should NOT be the system. It should change as circumstances have changed.  When the system was set up, the haredim were a tiny minority and it was done largely to appease them.   Their numbers got too big.  And no, most of those guys sitting there are not being productive.   And almost none of them share their Torah with society at large.  Yet they sit and take money for it.  It's a disgrace.

And how many times have the haredi parties joined coalition govt's led by the leftists?  Many.  Shas even hoe'd out for Oslo with Rabin.

Oh it is?  I didn't see that in the Torah, can you show me where it is?

Please.  Your arms must be getting so tired carrying all this water.
See what Rabbi Kahane,ZT"L,HY"D said on exemptions for yeshiva students https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQwwtpzn7mU

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #18 on: September 26, 2019, 08:24:08 AM »
http://www.rationalistjudaism.com/2019/09/now-you-tell-me.html

Rafi Goldmeier, of Life in Israel, translated the following Facebook status that was posted by an Israeli charedi man undergoing a divorce:

This is what I said this morning to the Dayanim in Beis Din at the end of the proceedings regarding how much child support I need to pay:
"You explained very well how much I need to pay as a father responsible for his daughters, and that as of now I do not have a profession but I need to take care to get myself one. You are 100% right. It is my responsibility and I will do everything to fulfill it.
"I only have one question.
"Now you come and tell me this???
"Our entire lives you have educated us that we do not need professions, that we can sit and learn in kollel, we can bring home 1500 NIS per month with ten children and it will be enough and all will be fine. And now suddenly you remember to tell me that a father needs to bring home 1400 NIS per child??
"You, as dayanim who deal with this issue regularly and understand and recognize the problem, have a responsibility to take care that this should change, that children and bochurim should be prepared in advance for the situation in which they will need to support their future children, and not just to wait until the last moment in a crisis to remember suddenly to tell them!"
And they had no answer.
(One of the dayanim joked that the education we give is only valid as long as nobody gets divorced, but he too realized it is not a joke.)
Of course, even without getting divorced, there are many charedim men who get harshly woken up to being woefully unprepared to support their families. And Chazal, forseeing this obvious problem, required parents to ensure that their children can earn a living. Alas, the Gedolim and the MKs don't seem to care.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2019, 08:25:15 AM »
See what Rabbi Kahane,ZT"L,HY"D said on exemptions for yeshiva students https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQwwtpzn7mU

He is alluding to the "shtick" that they do, and he was going to end it. 

But times have also changed a lot since the 1980's.  There are so many Torah scholars compared to then.  It's not the same situation.

Offline ChabadKahanist

  • Ultimate JTFer
  • *******
  • Posts: 4987
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #20 on: September 26, 2019, 10:01:19 AM »
He is alluding to the "shtick" that they do, and he was going to end it. 

But times have also changed a lot since the 1980's.  There are so many Torah scholars compared to then.  It's not the same situation.
You have no idea how many young men that are supposed to be learning in yeshiva are roaming the streets & or sitting in cafes drinking lattes or sitting at head shops smoking nargilas rather than sitting in yeshiva IMHO these fakes should be rounded up & drafted & or forced to  work for a living & pay taxes!!!!! All yeshivos should have time clocks & the bochurim should punch in & out & if they don't keep all the hours of the seder of the yeshiva they get booted out & drafted & or forced to work & contribute to society!!!!

Offline Binyamin Yisrael

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5390
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #21 on: September 26, 2019, 06:29:07 PM »
I know Haredim sat in Left Wing governments. But that was when the Left was larger in numbers. It's not artificially larger because Lieberman all the sudden made his party not in the Right Wing bloc. Lieberman and Yisrael Beitenu even used to be in the National Union with religious MKs at one time.

I said yeshiva is supposed to be instead of the army under Israeli law. Active soldiers are full time soldiers and yeshiva students are full time students. They should allow them to work part time. Currently, they can only work if they go to the army first. If they got permanent exemptions, then they wouldn't have to be full time students. They could tell them they will give them all permanent exemptions but no free money. Then they would all work or get their money from private donors.


Offline Israel Chai

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 9732
  • 112
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #22 on: September 26, 2019, 10:29:22 PM »
Did any of you even read The Jewish Idea. Rav Kahane's position on it is straightforward, the top learners whose Torah study we need, like calculating the calender and such, can not be drafted. Ordinary students are obligated in wars to reclaim the land or defend it. The issue currently is the army is waging a war on the religious soldiers, and religious people don't want to walk into the line of fire. It was worse when Rav Kahane was there, and he did fine and was a commander. People outside the army need to pressure the army to be better for religious Jews, and religious Jews need to change things from the inside like Rav Kahane did.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #23 on: September 26, 2019, 10:58:38 PM »
Did any of you even read The Jewish Idea. Rav Kahane's position on it is straightforward, the top learners whose Torah study we need, like calculating the calender and such, can not be drafted. Ordinary students are obligated in wars to reclaim the land or defend it. The issue currently is the army is waging a war on the religious soldiers, and religious people don't want to walk into the line of fire. It was worse when Rav Kahane was there, and he did fine and was a commander. People outside the army need to pressure the army to be better for religious Jews, and religious Jews need to change things from the inside like Rav Kahane did.

There are thousands of ordinary students today in haredi society sitting in kollel because their entire society forces all men, every man they possibly can, into that system, and they believe and teach that living any other way is subpar religiously.  A modern ascetic-society invention.  But one that drains public resources and demands servitude from the public at the same time.
Very few of the kollel learners are the truly talented and exceptional Torah learners - And even fewer of them even bother to share their Torah insights with the Jewish community (which really is there obligation, to teach).

Offline Israel Chai

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 9732
  • 112
Re: Lapid and Lieberman Are Amalekites
« Reply #24 on: September 27, 2019, 07:35:59 AM »
There are thousands of ordinary students today in haredi society sitting in kollel because their entire society forces all men, every man they possibly can, into that system, and they believe and teach that living any other way is subpar religiously.  A modern ascetic-society invention.  But one that drains public resources and demands servitude from the public at the same time.
Very few of the kollel learners are the truly talented and exceptional Torah learners - And even fewer of them even bother to share their Torah insights with the Jewish community (which really is there obligation, to teach).

You usually do a year of kollel and that's it with Chabad. It's wonderful that people sit and study most of the day, but obviously they must work like the Rabbis they read of from Gemarra.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge