Author Topic: Rabbi Yoel Schwartz ZT"L Regarding Gentiles Observing Hanukah  (Read 511 times)

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Rabbi Yoel Schwartz ZT"L Regarding Gentiles Observing Hanukah
« on: October 20, 2022, 02:32:33 AM »
http://www.thesanhedrin.org/en/index.php/Questions_and_Answers_on_Bnei_Noah_by_Rav_Yoel_Shwartz
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Judaism forbids establishing a new religion, as explained by the Rambam (Kings 10, 5:6-9): “The principle of the matter: You cannot allow them to establish a new religion or to carry out commandments from this knowledge...” Anyway, what we are doing here in connection with the Children of Noah is not the establishment of a new religion. Since a foreigner (Gentile) is not ordered in writing to fulfill them, but only, if by his own free will, he wishes to carry out such commandments as the Rambam wrote: “We are not allowed to stop a child of Noah that seeks to be compensated by fulfilling the (some of those) laws of the Torah (that were only commanded to the Jews).” So it seems that the establishment of a new religion occurs only when a person comes and says that he has been ordered by G-d to fulfill such and such a law and not when he is trying to reach a degree of spiritual perfection by fulfilling the commandments that the children of Israel have been ordered to carry out.

On The Importance Of Doing (Fulfilling and Carrying Out)
Foreword

“We will fulfill and we will hear” (Shabbat 88a).

Here we will try to explain the importance of spiritual fulfillment and its effect on the personality of the person. We will also see why it is not enough to feel this spiritual fulfillment in the heart, but that it must be accompanied by concrete actions. All this has been explained in the Torah and was understood as something quite simple by many intellectuals of the world like Soren Kirkgegard (In “A Jew, Who Is He, What Is He?” page 22) who said, “A belief that does not bring in its wake a fulfillment and a change, is a false one. The greatest believer, who carries out his belief with great enthusiasm, but shows no sign of a complete change in his life, proves, that his belief is simply part of his own imagination only. The influence and recognition of a belief in a human being depends on the way he carries out his day-to-day life and manages to control and suppress his desires, stops doing evil and the actions he takes to carry this out.”
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Hanukah
Noahides are called to celebrate the victory of Judaism over Hellenism since this victory showed the world the strength of the Israelite’s belief in the one true G-d, their true devotion and dedication in keeping the Torah and its commandments. It is also a time of special prayer for the restoration of the Tabernacle, the Temple and divine worship.
I don't believe, Rabbi Schwartz ZT"L meant Noahides are obligated to celebrate Hanukah, just that it is a good thing to do so, if done for the right ideological reasons.

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Re: Rabbi Yoel Schwartz ZT"L Regarding Gentiles Observing Hanukah
« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2022, 05:05:57 AM »
The fact that Kirkgegard is being cited proves this is philosophizing, not halaha.

As verified by Rabbi Moshe Weiner (author of The Divine Code), Noahides may light Hanukkah candles, but without reciting any of the associated Jewish blessings. For Gentiles, those would be false statements said in God’s Name because they testify that the person lighting the candles is commanded to kindle the lights of Hanukkah, and that God did those miracles for “our fathers”, both of which apply only to Jews.

Rambam's ruling in Laws of Kings 10:10 has nothing to do with spiritual perfection. It talks about a practical benefit. For example, to marry a woman only to refine himself, to return some lost objects and so on.
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Re: Rabbi Yoel Schwartz ZT"L Regarding Gentiles Observing Hanukah
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2022, 12:57:14 PM »
I think Rabbi Schwartz just mentioned Kirkgegard to make the point more understandable.
In any case from Rambam Hilchot Rotzeach 12:15 it is implied that it is usually not good to give advice to the average Gentile to do an extra credit commandment.
Daniel (of the book of Daniel) made this mistake and according to the Talmud was punished for it.
It must be that Rabbi Schwartz found some exception to Rambam's rule to justify what he wrote, but I am not familiar with his answer if he did indeed had one.
My main motivation in quoting Rabbi Schwartz was to remove the insults made against Rabbi Cherki which a member of this forum made in another post, because on some Noahide issues they share a common line of reasoning. We have a principle that we should come to the defense of the honor of a Talmudic scholar (when it has not been proven that he has done something wrong).
In this post I am not out to prove or disprove Rabbi Moshe Weiner's viewpoint brought up by Hrvatski Noahid. I just wish to keep the debate polite.

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Re: Rabbi Yoel Schwartz ZT"L Regarding Gentiles Observing Hanukah
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2022, 01:11:10 PM »
I think Rabbi Schwartz just mentioned Kirkgegard to make the point more understandable.
In any case from Rambam Hilchot Rotzeach 12:15 it is implied that it is usually not good to give advice to the average Gentile to do an extra credit commandment.
Daniel (of the book of Daniel) made this mistake and according to the Talmud was punished for it.
It must be that Rabbi Schwartz found some exception to Rambam's rule to justify what he wrote, but I am not familiar with his answer if he did indeed had one.
My main motivation in quoting Rabbi Schwartz was to remove the insults made against Rabbi Cherki which a member of this forum made in another post, because on some Noahide issues they share a common line of reasoning. We have a principle that we should come to the defense of the honor of a Talmudic scholar (when it has not been proven that he has done something wrong).
In this post I am not out to prove or disprove Rabbi Moshe Weiner's viewpoint brought up by Hrvatski Noahid. I just wish to keep the debate polite.

Cherki teaches that Gentiles may keep Jewish commandments as a religious obligation. If you think that isn't wrong, you are simply ignorant of the Noahide Code.
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