JTF.ORG Forum

Kahanist Singles => Righteous Gentile Singles => Topic started by: dibblah on January 24, 2008, 11:10:28 PM

Title: I'm a young guy, I have a girlfriend and we want to marry!
Post by: dibblah on January 24, 2008, 11:10:28 PM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: newman on January 24, 2008, 11:12:43 PM
A Jew cannot marry a non-Jew. Sorry I know it's tough but there you have it.

If you do anyway, what religion will you raise the children as?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: KansasJew on January 24, 2008, 11:39:16 PM
I would have to ask the following question.
Is She Orthodox, Conservative, or Reformed from that point. More questions can follow.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on January 24, 2008, 11:49:01 PM
As Newman said, a Jew cannot marry a non-Jew.  You can talk to a local Rabbi who can explain it to you in depth.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: KansasJew on January 24, 2008, 11:53:38 PM
This is true Jews are forbidden to marry outside of their religion. However in the Reformed Movement and I am not sure of the Conversative. They have no issue of Non Jews and Reformed Marrying.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on January 25, 2008, 12:49:08 AM
Thank you all for your comments and suggestions. They are much appreciated.

-*Mills* Thanks for your insights, I appreciate what you're saying, but yes she is definately from a full Jewish family although they are not the most conservative as they would have never allowed her to date a gentile in the first place!

Please bear in mind though that when we met we had no idea of each others religion/faiths until at least the 3rd date!

I would have no problem at all in bringing my children up as Jewish if it meant we could be married. This does not come lightly to me as I am from an Irish Catholic family, going back for many Centauries.

However, my mother brought me up from an early age (along with a few licks of the spatula) to respect and understand Judaism as the bedrock of our faith (and in our view it is also ours in the form of the Tanach.) Moreover, the strength of Jewish family bonds, unity and support, throughout the Jewish community has always been an inspiration to her in the pulling together of her own family.

My girlfriend does not know I am a JTF member...she is fairly liberal but knows the strength of my beliefs..she does not know I am posting here, but it seems appropriate that I should ask advice from fellow members of a cause I deeply believe in.

I think its best that we see how it goes as neither of us would ever give up our religion (and I would never want it so). Are there any alternatives?- we would not have a civil marriage. I would dearly welcome your advice.

-Thank you.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: KansasJew on January 25, 2008, 01:10:48 AM
I will tell you something my Orthodox friends and Rabbi would tell you. If you convert to Judaism for the sake of Marriage. This is not allowed. You have to want to convert because YOU have a desire to convert for yourself not for your future spouse.

It may sound harsh but centuries of Traditions and experiences have taught us well to abstain for intermarriages.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on January 25, 2008, 01:11:45 AM
Thank you Mills...I know you're speaking sense and the truth of it. It is a hard one though, we are very much in love...

I think I'll show her these posts now to try and bring this to a head.

Thank you so much for taking the time I've been at a bit of a loss so far.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on January 27, 2008, 02:30:37 AM
This issue is very difficult. I know what you are saying in my heart, in rational thought and in religous ethics is the truth; however it is difficult to accept outright.

Sometimes there is such a thing as doing what you feel is right. I suppose that I am trying to build up an argument to defy what you have said but at every turn, in truth, I cannot do it.

I showed her these posts from yesterday and she cried, but she did not say that anything that was stated was wrong or lies. Although from a very liberal Jewish family she (when push comes to shove) would not forego her faith, as I would never convert to Jadaism, not because I have any great objections, but when you believe, you believe....The fact remains though that I dont think her family would object to the union. We are well suited and we want the same things... a big family, house in the country ect...

The strange thing here is that although my mother thinks she is a great girl, my mother also says that ultimately I should marry a good catholic girl from an Irish family. I think she thinks this year-long relationship will somehow just fizzle away. This is despite the fact that she brought me up all my life to view the Jewish people as brothers and sisters (we have many Jewish family friends) and she has always lauded their sense of family and unity as one to be aspiring to- by everyone!.

I'm starting to think that the elders of both religions are striving to protect the integrity of their people. This may not be such a bad thing, but it does cause a degree of dis-unity when we should be joining to fight the common enemy- Islam.

It may well be that the romantic element in all this will not stack up against what is clearly a huge mountain. It is very sad. The thing is (as far as I know)Catholics are not forbidden to marry Jews, so why the other way around?

Whatever comes of this relationship, it will not matter to me in the bigger scheme of things...my absolute devotion to the cause of trying to protect and defend the holy land of Israel for the Jews (because it is our spiritual holy land too) will never diminish. Moreover we have a huge battle on our hands in which all us must play a part. We must stand united for as long as it takes until there is never again any Muslim threat to our peoples.

I do not think that in the end we will now marry. The seed of doubt has been planted and this is usually enough. You know how it is though, two people meet and fall in love but family, religion and beliefs are 3 very hard things to fly in the face of with little or no regard to the consequences.

I want to thank you guys very much for your candid, honest and wise counsel on this matter. After all, history has already proven you right.

God bless.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Merkava on January 27, 2008, 08:37:27 AM
"And loving them should be active, not passive.



hehehehehe .....Iakov you naughty boy.  ^-^
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Vito on January 31, 2008, 11:56:39 AM
Western "falling in love" is false. If you can "fall in love", then you can "fall out of love". The real way to find love is pick a person and decide you want to get to know them. And loving them should be active, not passive.



"Fall in love" is a term, of course it's not passive, I don't think anyone thinks of it as passive except for Hollywood scum.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tina Greco - Melbourne on January 31, 2008, 07:39:56 PM
Western "falling in love" is false. If you can "fall in love", then you can "fall out of love". The real way to find love is pick a person and decide you want to get to know them. And loving them should be active, not passive.



Western ideas are false  :::D :::D

Some of this I love you business every 5 seconds yes I agree, but others no.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: KansasJew on January 31, 2008, 07:55:03 PM
Falling in love....Sounds like someone fell into a hole while walking and not paying attention.....
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tina Greco - Melbourne on January 31, 2008, 07:57:19 PM
Falling in love....Sounds like someone fell into a hole while walking and not paying attention.....

Well its pretty much it  ;)
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 04, 2008, 10:00:06 PM
Hey *Mills*,

-Thank you very much, and for sharing your own experiences on this issue and for your very objective views. I realise as a Jewish lady this cannot be an easy thing in this context. Also, I appreciate your support for a Catholic family that has been brought up to love the Jewish people as brothers and sisters. I think you will find that this is a fairly common theme in many Catholic families, particularly in Ireland and Italy. O0 O0- God bless.


-Also to: "There are no Israeli Arabs"- (Aint that the truth!)  ;)

Thank you for the historical/biological perspective!- -Much appreciated...

- If its any consolation to the conservatives... we have not gone to a Rabbi for counsel, she did not want to. She said that what would be said would be the same as posted here. The only way would be for me to convert to Judaism and that would take up to 2 years and circumcision...I told her I wasn't in the market for that and I would never deny Christ..on pain of death.

I think we both realise that what we wanted was not possible in this day and age. I'm an idealist though..one day I hope that the union in marriage of a Catholic and a Jew would not be so bad...(It certainly does not seem that way to me). -Mixed emotions in truth, but thank you for your advice.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 05:09:13 PM
Dear Sir,

She is certainly not an orthodox Jew but I will ask her to talk to her Rabbi on this subject next time she goes to Temple. I will show her your post.

If at the end of all this what you are saying can and may happen, then this is truly a good thing; no matter what religion. -I think that we will miss each other but ultimately we may both benefit in the long run. I can't help thinking though: What a strange place the Jews and Catholics are in......?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 06, 2008, 07:25:15 PM
Dear Sir,

She is certainly not an orthodox Jew but I will ask her to talk to her Rabbi on this subject next time she goes to Temple. I will show her your post.
Have her talk to an Orthodox Rabbi.  He is the only reliable source of information on this subject.  Where do you live?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 07:52:40 PM
London.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 06, 2008, 08:08:18 PM
London.
Which part of London?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: MarZutra on February 06, 2008, 08:20:52 PM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
It would appear that you understand and practice your faith while it is obvious that your girlfriend does not.  I would suggest that either she learn her faith and you as well, or the other way round.  In future, where children are concerned there may be a major conflict and/or friction as they decide to either pick a faith or abandon it entirely for "progressive" socialistic "humanist" ideal...
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 08:27:45 PM
Dear "There are no Israeli Arabs"

I have had my own reasons for joining this website, mainly because I saw and watched the links of David and Chaim on LiveLeak and Utube which were provided to me as links from the BNP website.- The only UK party that stands by Israel, has a remit to protect the Judaic/Chritsian tradition of the UK and evict the Muslim fachsits from our shores. I am a party member, a Catholic and pro Israeli; no more or less than how I have been brought up by my parents- having had the benefit of a good education, travel and life experience, I can now choose my own qualified path that I firmly believe in.

I believe that I would be failing in my duty to my ancestors, God and the desire for a peaceful world if I did not stand up and be counted.- That is why I am here on this JTF forum. It is purely incidental that my girlfriend happens to be Jewish.

TBH the fact of who my girlfriend was (her religion et. al.) 3 months ago, had no bearing on anything, it just simply did not matter to us. Other than cautionary words from both our sets of parents, we were simply just late 20-30's people on the dating game. We are both fairly succesful, have good jobs and have dreams to match. It was a subject that we knew existed and probably had to be confronted at some point as the relationship grew more serious, but one that we sidelined as much as we could. I am sure we are not alone in this.

In truth I have been quite taken aback by the level of belief, Tannach and feeling on this subject against our union. However I do understand that you wouldn't want your daughter to be bringing a Catholic boy back to the family to be betrothed any more than probabaly my elders would. -(Although I know in fairness that my mother is a hopeless romantic and would welcome her if I told her I loved her.)

Allright, so now we have a date for this Friday.. a drink, but not a meal-which is unusual. I think either she or I will end it at this stage, it will not be a pleasant event.  I will reccomend that she speak to an Orthodox Rabbi.- This I promise. I know in her heart that she is very fundamentaly Jewish. She may or may not take my advice, but I think at that point I will have done my duty.

I have done my best to preserve the respect between both religions. I can do no more.. and at what cost???- I only hope that it is worth it in the final analysis.- Shalom.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 08:33:53 PM
North London,-Southgate.- Why do you ask?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: MarZutra on February 06, 2008, 08:36:15 PM
Hello Dibblah, You are in a rock and a hard place as I had been a few years ago and my Aunt (67) and uncle (80) are in today.  She's Jewish (Deformed) and he's (Catholic).  She's an ignoramus on Judaism but loves to preach the "line" while he knows his faith and much of the time it ends in an arguement.  

I think, nothing against her or you, it makes things a hell of a lot easier if both parties were of the same basic beliefs.  Perhaps is why one doesn't see "right wingers" marrying, or even talking to, "left wingers"...unless it is in a debate, arguement or brawl...lol

You are doing the right thing brother, Jews can support Catholics and Catholics can support Jews.  When it comes down to it in the end, I think you'll wish to be with one that is akin to you both ideologically and spiritually.  

No need to start off behind the 8 ball brother... :)
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 08:47:50 PM
Thanks MarZutra,

-For putting a human face on it and a sense of humour.

I have to say though, I realy, realy hate these divivions, but I cannot deny them. But for the acknowledgement of Christ as the son of God (or otherwise) we would be the same people... Imagine that...how one thing can change everything, for so many people. - What a great shame, to all of us.

However we can both, in true faith, look to Moses to lead us to where we all need to be.

What a wonderful life!
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: MarZutra on February 06, 2008, 08:55:21 PM
Thanks MarZutra,

-For putting a human face on it and a sense of humour.

I have to say though, I realy, realy hate these divivions, but I cannot deny them. But for the acknowledgement of Christ as the son of G-d (or otherwise) we would be the same people... Imagine that...how one thing can change everything, for so many people. - What a great shame, to all of us.

However we can both, in true faith, look to Moses to lead us to where we all need to be.

What a wonderful life!
Similar to that of Bavel (The Tower of Babble), if G-d wanted everyone to be the same, would you not consider that he'd have made us all the same?  Perhaps, this egalitarian thought, that is so propagated today via every progressive avenue, was invented by man while G-d has a very different agenda? 
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 09:48:52 PM
MarZutra

Thank you for your kind words on the last and un-related post to this (The great Revd. et al).

To address your last point on this subject:

If my Sunday school education of the Tennach and the Tower of Babel scripture will assist me and my limited biblical knowledge correct, then what we faced was a punishment from God. He broke the tower in an almighty thunderclap and all the men from different nations could no longer communicate with each other. Mistrust and division quickly spread and the word of God was disputed by all. From that point forward Man as from the seed of Adam and Eve and as the decendants of Issac and Abraham could no longer be as one in their thoughts words and deeds.

I believe, in my very humble opinion that this is the challenge that God has given us on Earth: Transcend the language and intricacies of your religion and learn to join wholeheartedly with your fellow man. Join with them on the righteous laws that were given to us in the 10 commandments and evolve your union from here. Accept no less and demand no more. Never concede to a subversion of the truth, or an evil and aggressive faith; for this is not who God is or wants us to be.

If we ever manage to achieve this then I truly believe that we would have fulfilled God's will for us on Earth.

If others of our fellow men are slow to see this then we must have patience and faith and draw them to us by reason and love rather than the sword.

The Jews were given this Holy responsibility, they alone were tasked with leading man towards heaven. Then came the Christians and thereafter the Muslims. -The job for the Jews suddenly became that much harder.

Fundamentally, if you were a hermit, or exile and you never had teaching from a mosque, church or synagogue, but yet you were a "GOOD" person who helped everyone when you could, protected your own and sacrificed unreservedly, without promise of a reward in hevean, then you would be welcomed into the arms of God.

I believe that this is the story that all men who were exiled from the Tower of Babel knew before they left but could not effectively communicate to others once the tower had been destroyed.

Peace on Earth will happen when all religions and peoples and agnostics and Humanists acknowledge this as God's Law. We are a spiritual being on a physical trip, that is short.. Let us not forget.

Dibbs Nutz.

Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 06, 2008, 10:13:22 PM
Dibblah,
Have her talk to Rabbi Kesselman:
44-20-8361-3044
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 10:30:27 PM
Thank you- "There are no Israeli Arabs"

I appreciate you're advice throughout- are you an Orthodox Jew? and can I ask what is the difference from an Orthodox Jew to a non-Orthodox Jew?

-The short answer will suffice...-Thanks :)

PS.- OdKahaneChai- I will pass on the number; it is a Rabbi from Golders Green Yes?- But first you must promise me not to make this a family issue they are a very respected family in the community.. It would do more harm than good.- Pls give me your word, I have done all I can so far in good faith.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 06, 2008, 10:39:11 PM
Thank you- "There are no Israeli Arabs"

I appreciate you're advice throughout- are you an Orthodox Jew? and can I ask what is the difference from an Orthodox Jew to a non-Orthodox Jew?

-The short answer will suffice...-Thanks :)

PS.- OdKahaneChai- I will pass on the number; it is a Rabbi from Golders Green Yes?- But first you must promise me not to make this a family issue they are a very respected family in the community.. It would do more harm than good.- Pls give me your word, I have done all I can so far in good faith.
Dibblah,
I am not familiar with the London area, but that is the Chabad Rabbi in Southgate (I don't know him personally).  And I'm not sure exactly what you meant by "not to make this a family issue."  If she is having trouble understanding the issue with a Jew marrying a non-Jew, he is a great person to talk to. 

And the difference between an "Orthodox" Jew and a "non-Orthodox" Jew is that the former fulfills (or does as much as he can to fulfill) the obligations given to him by G-d, in the Torah, and the latter does not.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 06, 2008, 11:09:24 PM
Dear OdKahaneChai,

I am making the assumption that you are a Rabbi yourself?- Thank you for your counsel and the Rabbi contact in Southgate.-I am assuming he is like a Priest and cannot breach the sacricanty of the confessional?

I will pass this number to my girlfriend tommorow. Doubtless she will be reading these posts.
It is not inconcievable to me that she will not be clear with this; obviously this has happened to you before,... so what should I say to her then? Is it best that I break contact, and never communicate again? Should I visist the Rabbi myself in this case? Will he see me?

- I need to know what will happen... This has become very involved....

I had it planned that following tommorrow, we could both either end this now or some time in the future and be done with it in the best way. It seems that now there's a mountain left to climb.

Ultimately I just want to do the right thing by both of us and I will be strong.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: MarZutra on February 06, 2008, 11:13:58 PM
MarZutra

Thank you for your kind words on the last and un-related post to this (The great Revd. et al).

To address your last point on this subject:

If my Sunday school education of the Tennach and the Tower of Babel scripture will assist me and my limited biblical knowledge correct, then what we faced was a punishment from G-d. He broke the tower in an almighty thunderclap and all the men from different nations could no longer communicate with each other. Mistrust and division quickly spread and the word of G-d was disputed by all. From that point forward Man as from the seed of Adam and Eve and as the decendants of Issac and Abraham could no longer be as one in their thoughts words and deeds.

I believe, in my very humble opinion that this is the challenge that G-d has given us on Earth: Transcend the language and intricacies of your religion and learn to join wholeheartedly with your fellow man. Join with them on the righteous laws that were given to us in the 10 commandments and evolve your union from here. Accept no less and demand no more. Never concede to a subversion of the truth, or an evil and aggressive faith; for this is not who G-d is or wants us to be.

If we ever manage to achieve this then I truly believe that we would have fulfilled G-d's will for us on Earth.

If others of our fellow men are slow to see this then we must have patience and faith and draw them to us by reason and love rather than the sword.

The Jews were given this Holy responsibility, they alone were tasked with leading man towards heaven. Then came the Christians and thereafter the Muslims. -The job for the Jews suddenly became that much harder.

Fundamentally, if you were a hermit, or exile and you never had teaching from a mosque, church or synagogue, but yet you were a "GOOD" person who helped everyone when you could, protected your own and sacrificed unreservedly, without promise of a reward in hevean, then you would be welcomed into the arms of G-d.

I believe that this is the story that all men who were exiled from the Tower of Babel knew before they left but could not effectively communicate to others once the tower had been destroyed.

Peace on Earth will happen when all religions and peoples and agnostics and Humanists acknowledge this as G-d's Law. We are a spiritual being on a physical trip, that is short.. Let us not forget.

Dibbs Nutz.
In a way I agree with you but one must always remember that G-d created all different not the same and not "equal".  G-d created different races for a reason as he did different plants, species etc.  G-d lays it out pretty accurate as to how all humanity can live in peace via the 7 laws of Noah and the Principles handed down at Sinai for Israel. 

This, I think is the crux of the problem as all the other major ideologies contort or contradict these basic Laws of G-d.  Most certainly Mohammad and Islam, Marx/Engles and Communism, Socrates/Plato and his Humanism etc.  imo...

Good luck and be well...
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 06, 2008, 11:31:46 PM
Dear OdKahaneChai,

I am making the assumption that you are a Rabbi yourself?- Thank you for your counsel and the Rabbi contact in Southgate.-I am assuming he is like a Priest and cannot breach the sacricanty of the confessional?

I will pass this number to my girlfriend tommorow. Doubtless she will be reading these posts.
It is not inconcievable to me that she will not be clear with this; obviously this has happened to you before,... so what should I say to her then? Is it best that I break contact, and never communicate again? Should I visist the Rabbi myself in this case? Will he see me?

- I need to know what will happen... This has become very involved....

I had it planned that following tommorrow, we could both either end this now or some time in the future and be done with it in the best way. It seems that now there's a mountain left to climb.

Ultimately I just want to do the right thing by both of us and I will be strong.
Dibblah,

First of all, I am not a Rabbi (although I hope to become one eventually), so I can't tell you exactly what to do.  Perhaps it it best if you speak to Rabbi Kesselman, and explain the situation, before you have her talk to him.  If she refuses to talk to him (is this what you're asking?  I don't see why she would), the I suppose you would have to explain to her yourself that it is not appropriate under any circumstances for a non-Jew to marry a Jew, and that the relationship has to end.

You're a good man, dibblah.  Take care...
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 07, 2008, 12:00:03 AM
OdKahaneChai,

Thanks for that.- Much appreciated my friend. I sincerley hope you are made a Rabbi, if this is your wish.

I have passed on the feedback and contacts you have given and engaged in a respectful way, at this stage I can do no more. I have asked her repeatedly to speak with her rabbi but it seems there is a lack of willingness to do so. This relationship was not public knowledge to the other families and I think she is afraid that it may be so if she discusses this issue with other people.

To DW-I feel bad darling, I feel I have "mugged" you somewhat with this official line.- What started out as a genuine enquiry has developed into something much more involved. -  I'm sorry sweetheart- Please forgive me...I just want whats right for everyone...

How can I put this to you without sounding trite?- When she told me she was Jewish I felt good because I knew the union was not blessed by both our religions but I knew it felt "right" none-the-less. -That's it. ENDEX.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Salty German on February 10, 2008, 04:16:46 PM
By getting married you will lose the love of the Blessed Virgin.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tina Greco - Melbourne on February 10, 2008, 06:05:02 PM
By getting married you will lose the love of the Blessed Virgin.

BY getting married you gain the love of a woman, and love of your family to be.

Where does it state this blessed virgin I assume you mean Mary, loses favour with you.

After all she was married.  ::)
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tina Greco - Melbourne on February 11, 2008, 09:46:28 PM
By getting married you will lose the love of the Blessed Virgin.

Is this supposed to be a joke?

Well... Catholics who are respectful of Judaism would feel this way. The "Blessed Virgin" is revered by Catholics and give her a respected place as the mother of jesus. Some would believe that she would approve of two catholics getting married but not get her approval if they marry someone not of their religion who's not a Christian.
I don't know about loosing her "love" I would just say that Catholics would believe that she would not approve, is all.

Well thats correct it not acceptable in the church to marry a non Catholic. But now a days with the modernization of the Church it is becoming more acceptable.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Nic Brookes on February 12, 2008, 05:55:27 AM
By getting married you will lose the love of the Blessed Virgin.

Is this supposed to be a joke?

Check his other posts.... it's Fruit.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tina Greco - Melbourne on February 12, 2008, 07:07:40 AM
He hasn't talked about Black men and White women yet  :::D
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Salty German on February 12, 2008, 07:47:22 AM
What does 'Fruit' mean?

Who is Nic Brookes?  I have no idea who he is.  I think he is more than a little misguided.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: mord on February 12, 2008, 07:59:17 AM
Mary was Jewish why would she care
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: MarZutra on February 12, 2008, 10:42:50 AM
Mary was Jewish why would she care
Are you sure Mord?  I thought Mary was a "Pal-stinian".  According to PLO/A Emperor Arafat Jesus too was a "Pal-stinian"......  I think for the past 2000 years Christians have been totally wrong and their Bible, along with the Jewish Bible are nothing but anti-Pal-stinian-Arab-Muslim propaganda because not once does either of the two mention the land of the Palest-ian People....  Propaganda...  You bunch of racists.... ???
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: mord on February 12, 2008, 12:25:50 PM
Mary was Jewish why would she care
Are you sure Mord?  I thought Mary was a "Pal-stinian".  According to PLO/A Emperor Arafat Jesus too was a "Pal-stinian"......  I think for the past 2000 years Christians have been totally wrong and their Bible, along with the Jewish Bible are nothing but anti-Pal-stinian-Arab-Muslim propaganda because not once does either of the two mention the land of the Palest-ian People....  Propaganda...  You bunch of racists.... ???
THATS TRUE ;)
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Nic Brookes on February 12, 2008, 01:13:25 PM
What does 'Fruit' mean?

Who is Nic Brookes?  I have no idea who he is.  I think he is more than a little misguided.

sorry, it must be said

LOL
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Salty German on February 12, 2008, 03:38:27 PM
What does 'Fruit' mean?

Who is Nic Brookes?  I have no idea who he is.  I think he is more than a little misguided.

sorry, it must be said

LOL


You sound like a masterfully eloquent person.

Do you have a comprehensive school education?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Raulmarrio2000 on February 12, 2008, 04:12:32 PM
Nearly all religions forbids intermarriage. But in case of Jews and Gentiles, the problem is not only the different beliefs, but also the different souls. A Noahide is not of different beliefs from a Jew. They keep the same Torah, though Torah itself orders different mitzvot for them. However a Noahide is also forbidden to marry a Jew. If a Gentile marries a Jew, it's not only the Jew who is harmed, the Gentile also. A Gentile needs a Gentile mate.
You can get a civil "marriage" certificate but you are not married. That certificate would be nothing more than a piece of paper with a lie written on it, so you and your "wife" will be still single and just have sex outside marriage.
And if you have children with a Jewess, they will be 100% Jewish and I suppose they will be only her children, not yours.
Now, regarding beliefs, why are you Catholic and why wouldn't abandon your faith? I suppose that's because you truly believe that you need Jesus and the Church to save your soul. Then why would you allow your children to be brought up as Jews? According to YOUR beliefs, your children would not have eternal life. And if you think a person can have eternal life without Jesus, just believing in Hashem, the Holy One, as the Torah commands, why don't you accept Torah now, and do what Torah tells to Gentiles? (Torah has a way for Gentiles, that is The Seven Noahide Laws). Why dont you become a Noahide? However, as I have written above, even being a Noahide, you can't marry a Jew. That's not a prohibition, it's a natural law. Marriage doesn't exist unless both are Jews, or both are Gentiles.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Nic Brookes on February 12, 2008, 05:42:27 PM
What does 'Fruit' mean?

Who is Nic Brookes?  I have no idea who he is.  I think he is more than a little misguided.

sorry, it must be said

LOL


You sound like a masterfully eloquent person.

Do you have a comprehensive school education?

No. I attended a single gender school. What is your opinion on these establishments?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tina Greco - Melbourne on February 12, 2008, 06:17:48 PM
Mary was Jewish why would she care

LOL.
But ever since her son's followers spread Christianity, she's sided with them.


But as a mother would you not love your own child regardless what they have done?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on February 12, 2008, 07:20:56 PM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
Not allowed no matter what. Show your Jewish girldfriend this video

http://kolyakov.org/rav_mizrachi.html
"01/08/08 Intermarriage"
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 12, 2008, 07:25:18 PM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
Not allowed no matter what. Show your Jewish girldfriend this video

http://kolyakov.org/rav_mizrachi.html
"01/08/08 Intermarriage"
Let her watch something a bit shorter first...
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on February 12, 2008, 07:33:17 PM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
Not allowed no matter what. Show your Jewish girldfriend this video

http://kolyakov.org/rav_mizrachi.html
"01/08/08 Intermarriage"
Let her watch something a bit shorter first...

What do you mean? What else is their to watch? Anyway the link I posted is very good and allways gives good facts. Most others many times talk nicer and use politically correct things and may not allways show the "frightining" aspects of the consequences. Learning from Rabbi Mizrahi you get the facts even if they seem scary, but the truth is the truth, he brings down the sources and after one sees he and she can still decide, BUT they will be aware about the deep consequences about their evil actions.  And because of that thousands have been influenced in heading and doing positive things with their life, and changing their life completly, keeping the Mitzvot and following G-d, BUT if only love, love love is shown. Or someone preches lets follow G-d when it is convenient for us, etc. + keeping away and not revealing many of the consequences and the sources that speak about it (for all the subjects including intermarriage, breaking Shabb-t, etc.), then it is a very terrible sin, and it could be that those speakers will also share in the punishment for not teaching people the proper path to change.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Salty German on February 12, 2008, 07:34:22 PM
No. I attended a single gender school. What is your opinion on these establishments?


I believe that there is some merit in single-gender schooling, e.g. less sexual interest and more time for bonding with one's own gender (vital for being able to succeed in life), studying, doing sports etc.  Uniforms can also help prevent colour-coding and inequalities which can result in bullying.

No single type of school system is perfect but single-gender schools have a lot going for them.  (There is plenty of time to explore the other gender at college or university, or even just after school hours ...)

Did you enjoy your time at an all-boys school?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 12, 2008, 07:46:04 PM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
Not allowed no matter what. Show your Jewish girldfriend this video

http://kolyakov.org/rav_mizrachi.html
"01/08/08 Intermarriage"
Let her watch something a bit shorter first...
What do you mean? What else is their to watch? Anyway the link I posted is very good and allways gives good facts. Most others many times talk nicer and use politically correct things and may not allways show the "frightining" aspects of the consequences. Learning from Rabbi Mizrahi you get the facts even if they seem scary, but the truth is the truth, he brings down the sources and after one sees he and she can still decide, BUT they will be aware about the deep consequences about their evil actions. 
I just don't think Rav Mizrachi's videos are very good for outreach because they're very interesting - but they're very, very long.  A person who doesn't want to listen to a long Shiur isn't going to watch the whole thing.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on February 12, 2008, 08:12:30 PM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?
Not allowed no matter what. Show your Jewish girldfriend this video

http://kolyakov.org/rav_mizrachi.html
"01/08/08 Intermarriage"
Let her watch something a bit shorter first...
What do you mean? What else is their to watch? Anyway the link I posted is very good and allways gives good facts. Most others many times talk nicer and use politically correct things and may not allways show the "frightining" aspects of the consequences. Learning from Rabbi Mizrahi you get the facts even if they seem scary, but the truth is the truth, he brings down the sources and after one sees he and she can still decide, BUT they will be aware about the deep consequences about their evil actions. 
I just don't think Rav Mizrachi's videos are very good for outreach because they're very interesting - but they're very, very long.  A person who doesn't want to listen to a long Shiur isn't going to watch the whole thing.

Maybe, but listining to a 2 hour Shiur by the Hacham, for something that that influence one for the rest of their life is well worth it, and in reality is not a lot of time to spend. Its just 2 hours, and very interesting, insightful, and extremly necessary. Giving a quick short answer doesn't allways do it for some people, but listining in (even if no tthe whole thing) brings down many of the sources and the vital information.  + people spend most of their time in non-sense and no-one can say that they dont have 2 hours to spend, instead of watching a movie one can watch the video instead (its just the Yetzer Hara which tries to convince one that they dont have time, expecially when it comes to Spirituality, but when its other things like eating and movies or sports, etc. people make all the time they want).
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 12, 2008, 08:17:18 PM
Hi Salty,

I agree with you on many of your points... and yes I think most people who have a single-sex education have benefited from it and had a great education- I had some of my best times in a Catholic boys school and laterly in an all-boys grammar school in the UK. However I did also spend time in other schools -(British Embassy School et. al.) as we moved around different countries ect..

OdKahaneChai - Thank you for your concern, and it is much appreciated- The video was quite long and involved. However, I think we both got the message...this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do. Interestingly, after she has talked with her parents they have now agreed that what has been said here is the truth and what they did not say earlier has been laid out here. -Funny old world...why didn't they say something before then?

-I'm now out on this subject guys, it has taught me a thing or two, but thank you anyway, all of you, for your advice. It has been much appreciated.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: OdKahaneChai on February 12, 2008, 08:19:14 PM
Hi Salty,

I agree with you on many of your points... and yes I think most people who have a single-sex education have benefited from it and had a great education- I had some of my best times in a Catholic boys school and laterly in an all-boys grammar school in the UK. However I did also spend time in other schools -(British Embassy School et. al.) as we moved around different countries ect..

OdKahaneChai - Thank you for your concern, and it is much appreciated- The video was quite long and involved. However, I think we both got the message...this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do. Interestingly, after she has talked with her parents they have now agreed that what has been said here is the truth and what they did not say earlier has been laid out here. -Funny old world...why didn't they say something before then?

-I'm now out on this subject guys, it has taught me a thing or two, but thank you anyway, all of you, for your advice. It has been much appreciated.
Your very welcome, and may Hashem bless you.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on February 12, 2008, 08:24:54 PM
Hi Salty,

I agree with you on many of your points... and yes I think most people who have a single-sex education have benefited from it and had a great education- I had some of my best times in a Catholic boys school and laterly in an all-boys grammar school in the UK. However I did also spend time in other schools -(British Embassy School et. al.) as we moved around different countries ect..

OdKahaneChai - Thank you for your concern, and it is much appreciated- The video was quite long and involved. However, I think we both got the message...this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do. Interestingly, after she has talked with her parents they have now agreed that what has been said here is the truth and what they did not say earlier has been laid out here. -Funny old world...why didn't they say something before then?

-I'm now out on this subject guys, it has taught me a thing or two, but thank you anyway, all of you, for your advice. It has been much appreciated.

 I dont understand, so you are breaking up then? When you said "this thing we have will not be viewed as Kosher no matter what we do" - did that imply that you wanted to get a conscience approval, of what you want to do, or that you learned the answers and now are changing your plans?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 12, 2008, 08:34:30 PM
As a final note we have been close for over a year now and both get on well with both sets of parents...There did not seem to be any objections, though I did feel a bit of an "outsider" at times..but not in an unfriendly way...

We got to talking (have discussed many times) about moving things forward in our relationship and naturally marriage, children were discussed. At first flush, it seemed that we were both keen on doing this. We then started to look at the nitty-gritty and it started to look like a move we would have to look more deeply into. As a JTF member already, and as a bit of a long shot, I threw the question out there for a response from respected members of the Jewish community; perhaps hoping to circumvent the need to talk/see a Rabbi or Priest.- I hope this clarifies.

Dibblah.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on February 12, 2008, 08:38:20 PM
As a final note we have been close for over a year now and both get on well with both sets of parents...There did not seem to be any objections, though I did feel a bit of an "outsider" at times..but not in an unfriendly way...

We got to talking (have discussed many times) about moving things forward in our relationship and naturally marriage, children were discussed. At first flush, it seemed that we were both keen on doing this. We then started to look at the nitty-gritty and it started to look like a move we would have to look more deeply into. As a JTF member already, and as a bit of a long shot, I threw the question out there for a response from respected members of the Jewish community; perhaps hoping to circumvent the need to talk/see a Rabbi or Priest.- I hope this clarifies.

Dibblah.

Not completly, are you still together, its a simple yes or no? Also did the lady watch the video I posted about assimilation?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: MarZutra on February 12, 2008, 08:41:12 PM
I think she will enjoy Rabbi Kahane's video: "Why Be Jewish?" http://www.kahane.org/video.htm  O0
Within he speaks about intermarriage and assimilation... :'(
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 12, 2008, 09:06:04 PM
Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: MarZutra on February 12, 2008, 09:26:12 PM
All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.
Actually brother, most were Hellenists before, and even for a fair time after Constentine made Catholocism/Christianity the Empire's Official Religion.  Have you ever read about the early "Christians" that followed John the Baptist?  Early Christianity was far different after the Council of Nicea in 325 or even the Council of Trent 1545...then the Reformation and counter Reformation...  Whoa, what a interesting history...
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on February 12, 2008, 09:47:59 PM
Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...


 ??? , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabb-t and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: DownwithIslam on February 12, 2008, 11:50:22 PM
Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...


 ??? , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabbat and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).


I agree. Jews need to marry jews. Intermarriage is severely hurting world jewry and I believe the marriage will be doomed if it is allowed to progress. All the cases of intermarriage that I have seen were not successful.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 14, 2008, 08:43:10 PM
Thank you, thats about it.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on February 14, 2008, 11:45:38 PM
Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...


 ??? , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabbat and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).

I think he realizes that, but I don't think bombarding the girl with soooo much rhetoric against intermarraige will work in our favor. Like he said, if you push her too hard, she will reject Judaism and be against it for all the suffering it caused her. Dibblah needs to break up with her carefully and still leave her with a Jewish yearning. The point against intermarraige should be made, but stuffing it down her throat seems to much for her now. I think she gets it, but both he and she need some time to sort themselves out.

Yea, but I assume that if "they are together" they are at least touching eachother, at the veryyy least (G-d forbid they should do more). From his standpoint, it is wronge and he isn't allowed to be with her or give her the false impression. He doesn't need to bombard her, just simply break up. What she does next isn't his problem but completly hers, just as long as their not together. If he wants he can direct her to that important video, so she can correct her foolish ways and have a change for true repentence.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Dr. Dan on February 20, 2008, 09:05:04 AM
Hi,

Re: The above:

I am a confirmed and practising Catholic but I meet and join with a Jewish girl; religion never having come between us in our courtship. We want to marry and are both understanding and respecting each others' faith...What do we do? and how do we in the eyes of our G-d make things right?

Would appreciate your thoughts/suggestions?

IF you two truely love each other, then let her marry a Jew and you marry a Catholic. Love between two people doesn't just mean getting married to them.

If you want to do the right thing, marry someone who sees Gd the same way as you, as a Catholic..and she should do the same with a Jew.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Dr. Dan on February 20, 2008, 09:10:11 AM
Falling in love....Sounds like someone fell into a hole while walking and not paying attention.....

Oh i like that one!
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Dr. Dan on February 20, 2008, 09:22:10 AM
Easy does it and one step at a time my friend... we still love each other although marriage is now looking unlikely... to quote the US saying it has become: "the elephant in the room?"

That is all I can tell you of the status quo right now. She did not watch all of the video..I will ask her to have patience with it when she is not so upset and view it from an unemotionally-charged perspective. I do not want her to rebel against this but if I, (of all people) push this, she will reject it!...

All I can do in clear concience is as I have done and in respect to my Judaic brothers. I have probably and conciously scuppered our chances of marriage. Niether of us would marry outside of a religous marriage and probably never outside of our faith. The one message you can probabaly thank yourselves for helping us with, was to get accross that message that the Jewish mother passes on the Jewish inheritance. This gave us both significant pause for thought.

Let us hope (and pray) that by not inter-marrying we are not giving the Muslims another rod to divide us with; Lord knows we have managed to do that amongst each other for a long time now without their help!

All Christians were Jews before we recognized Christ. Let us not forget the fundamentals of our religion.- The Torah. I'm a bit done with this now, but have tried to maintain dialogue despite my (our) personal grief on the subject.

Dibblah -out...


 ??? , one step at a time? What does that mean? You are breaking up, one step at a time? If you recognize that it is wrong then you have to end it right away, if not then you can state it and you will be shown why. If you love that girl the best thing you can do is show here that video (and also the one on Shabbat and the Divineinformation video), and not have contact with her any longer. These are rules, not made by me, but by the Creator of the World, (The Holy One Blessed Be He), and she has to follow them and not make a terrible huge mistake (not only her, but you also cant make that sin, and you would also be held responsible).

I think he realizes that, but I don't think bombarding the girl with soooo much rhetoric against intermarraige will work in our favor. Like he said, if you push her too hard, she will reject Judaism and be against it for all the suffering it caused her. Dibblah needs to break up with her carefully and still leave her with a Jewish yearning. The point against intermarraige should be made, but stuffing it down her throat seems to much for her now. I think she gets it, but both he and she need some time to sort themselves out.

Yea, but I assume that if "they are together" they are at least touching eachother, at the veryyy least (G-d forbid they should do more). From his standpoint, it is wronge and he isn't allowed to be with her or give her the false impression. He doesn't need to bombard her, just simply break up. What she does next isn't his problem but completly hers, just as long as their not together. If he wants he can direct her to that important video, so she can correct her foolish ways and have a change for true repentence.

Tzvi, stay out of it, you're not helping.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Raulmarrio2000 on February 20, 2008, 06:27:48 PM
The problem with keeping in touch with her, is that the longer you are together, the more difficult it'll be to break up. And even if you don't care of the religious ban on intermarriage, that relation will mostly likely bring suffering, not happiness. However you must not bash her with Hallachic reasons, since you don't keep Torah Hallacha, and you'll sound just as an hypocrite. She may think, he cares about Judiasm for me, but he, himself is not a Noahide. Since Catholic reasons against intermarriage are different. You'd better use rational arguments about the problems it'll bring for children education, home life and so on. And even better just break up, or avoid meeting often, and when you do see each other, just talk like friends. You can also say that you are simply not sure if you really were in love with her.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on February 20, 2008, 10:50:39 PM
Thank you all for the advice. I know what to do.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on March 21, 2008, 01:31:38 AM
That was a very inspirational and meaningful vid.

-Thank you for the link.

-BTW, he had bags of character and came across as a genuine, reasonable man.

-God bless him he is making me think in a fundamental way about how I should conduct my life.

This is one of the main reasons why I joined the JTF forum....to be inspired.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on March 30, 2008, 02:52:30 AM
It is time for me to come clean and explain everything...

The situation I have portrayed to date does not descibe me or any situation I'm involved in. I have been posting questions on other peoples behalf.

-This enquiry was done on behalf of a friend of mine that is in exactly this position and has asked me for insights from the Jewish community as to what his prospects were with his girlfriend as regards marriage. At all times I have been an honest reflection of his (and hers) position on this issue and have communicated the response from fellow JTF'ers in the same way.

I care deeply that this couple find happiness as it is all too rare in this day and age.

The truly useful thing from this is that she has now gone and spoken with her Rabi in North London and decided that she should only marry a Jewish man.

He, who is my cousin and a Catholic, is very upset but is reasonable enough to understand her position on this. BTW some, (if not all) of the responses I posted were directly from him and her so this in effect is me acting by proxy for them.

They both asked me to do this for them as they knew I was a JTF'er. BTW they found some of the responses very extreme, but some very honest and which struck a chord with them both in a deep way.

-Thank you all for your advice..... It has been life changing in this instance for these two people. I happen to agree that as a rule of thumb Jews should marry Jews and Catholics the same. As for Muzzies, well they shouldn't even be here!

-Thank you guys for making a real difference in this instance.

VBR,

Dibbz
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on March 30, 2008, 06:31:14 AM
Mills- you again ;)

I was cutting and pasting their e-mails most of the time.

The others were phone conversations.

What amazed me was the reluctance of my cousin's girlfriend to come on line and make her case. Obviously she knew in advance that as a Jew she would have an unsympathetic audience here. I tried to tell her that this was not the case but she (quite reasonably) said that her Rabi would find out and tell her parents.

-Live and learn et al. didn't mean to be disingenuous, but this was my cousin so I had to help.

Thanks again for all the advice.

VBR,

Dibbz.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: newman on March 30, 2008, 06:45:46 AM
The problem with a half-Jew, half-catholic is they have to burn their own houses down on good friday. :D
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: dibblah on March 30, 2008, 06:50:00 AM
This is true, but only when they have Romans leaning over them  8;)
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: IslamIsCancer on April 06, 2008, 04:39:40 PM
I wish you good luck, religion doesn't matter to me either except for one religion and you know what that is.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Wayne Jude on April 06, 2008, 05:14:23 PM
I like ask moses!Ask them
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Wayne Jude on April 08, 2008, 01:45:22 PM
great website and honest.I have used it :)
wayne jude
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: ~Hanna~ on June 11, 2008, 11:23:44 PM
I just have a question though..... ::)

What about Moses, what about Esther????

Didn't they marry non Jews????

Wasn't it for God's higher purpose????

And before I get any rocks thrown at me..... :'(

I've had several gentile friends over the years who have married Jews......

They seem to get along just fine.

I don't want to get into all of their theological thinking here, but also, I know two Jews, one is Messianic, one is not...they get along just fine also.....

*goes back into the cave....

 :laugh:

I know that we all have our traditions, opinions, thoughts, rules, regulations and laws...

But doesn't anyone wonder about Esther and Moses?????

Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: ~Hanna~ on June 12, 2008, 12:02:15 AM
oh ok, kewl........

 :D

That makes sense.....

 :)

I just have a question though..... ::)

What about Moses, what about Esther????

Didn't they marry non Jews????

Wasn't it for G-d's higher purpose????

And before I get any rocks thrown at me..... :'(

I've had several gentile friends over the years who have married Jews......

They seem to get along just fine.

I don't want to get into all of their theological thinking here, but also, I know two Jews, one is Messianic, one is not...they get along just fine also.....

*goes back into the cave....

 :laugh:

I know that we all have our traditions, opinions, thoughts, rules, regulations and laws...

But doesn't anyone wonder about Esther and Moses?????




Moses's wife converted.


Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: KAHANIST on June 23, 2008, 10:41:44 AM
Tell your jewish girlfriend shell better marry a donkey then "marry" a goy.
Arent you ashamed to think of "marrying" a woman that was on mount sinai
and said " NAASE VENISHMA" ???

KAHANIST
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Raulmarrio2000 on July 10, 2008, 07:31:19 AM
I just have a question though..... ::)

What about Moses, what about Esther????

Didn't they marry non Jews????

Wasn't it for G-d's higher purpose????

And before I get any rocks thrown at me..... :'(

I've had several gentile friends over the years who have married Jews......

They seem to get along just fine.

I don't want to get into all of their theological thinking here, but also, I know two Jews, one is Messianic, one is not...they get along just fine also.....

*goes back into the cave....

 :laugh:

I know that we all have our traditions, opinions, thoughts, rules, regulations and laws...

But doesn't anyone wonder about Esther and Moses?????



Mose's wife converted to Judaism. A Gentile can never marry a Jew. If a Gentile really wishes to be an Israelite, then he must first convert, and then if he meets a Jewess after conversion, he is allowed to marry her, or he may marry a convert. But a Gentile is not allowed to "convert" just to marry. Does this sound hard? Then what if you fall in love with your sister? Would you marry her? If you really believe in the truth you'd avoid intermarriage in the same way you avoid incest!!!
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Zelhar on July 10, 2008, 02:59:25 PM
A convert must be honest about his wish to convert. It doesn't matter what reason got him to start the process, as long as he is honest about his wish for becoming a Jew.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Tzvi Ben Roshel1 on July 11, 2008, 04:39:10 PM
I just have a question though..... ::)

What about Moses, what about Esther????

Didn't they marry non Jews????

Wasn't it for G-d's higher purpose????

And before I get any rocks thrown at me..... :'(

I've had several gentile friends over the years who have married Jews......

They seem to get along just fine.

I don't want to get into all of their theological thinking here, but also, I know two Jews, one is Messianic, one is not...they get along just fine also.....

*goes back into the cave....

 :laugh:

I know that we all have our traditions, opinions, thoughts, rules, regulations and laws...

But doesn't anyone wonder about Esther and Moses?????



If you really believe in the truth you'd avoid intermarriage in the same way you avoid incest!!!

 I dont think that it is that good to say that to people in todays society. You never know how low someone reading or hearing someting could be. Maybe they dont avoid incest, you never know.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: muslimslayer0075995 on July 18, 2008, 04:10:28 PM
This is true Jews are forbidden to marry outside of their religion. However in the Reformed Movement and I am not sure of the Conversative. They have no issue of Non Jews and Reformed Marrying.
hey wait my dad married a gentile, wait am i a mischling ?
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: Raulmarrio2000 on July 18, 2008, 07:06:27 PM
This is true Jews are forbidden to marry outside of their religion. However in the Reformed Movement and I am not sure of the Conversative. They have no issue of Non Jews and Reformed Marrying.
hey wait my dad married a gentile, wait am i a mischling ?

If that Gentile your father married is your biological mother, then you are a Gentile. But there is no problem, as a Gentile you can keep Torah by fullfilling the Noahide Laws. And if you truly want to be Jewish , then you must convert by an Orthodox Court.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: AsheDina on August 08, 2008, 08:01:57 AM
I dont know. What if 2 people just connect, and fall  in love at first site? People CAN CONVERT entirely, if there is NO loving compromise btwn. the 2, then heartbreak is on its way. SAD to say. I am WAY more Torah oriented than David, he is very spiritual and centered. We would NOT even be together, if he had ZERO Judaism, or (only one of us). We would NOT 'get' each-other. That would be a TRAGEDY for both of us.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: ~Hanna~ on August 10, 2008, 08:53:53 PM
The way I look at it, if both people believe in the G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, that is good enough, but of course they should love each other....of course, I am a die hard romantic......*sigh

 ::)

I dont know. What if 2 people just connect, and fall  in love at first site? People CAN CONVERT entirely, if there is NO loving compromise btwn. the 2, then heartbreak is on its way. SAD to say. I am WAY more Torah oriented than David, he is very spiritual and centered. We would NOT even be together, if he had ZERO Judaism, or (only one of us). We would NOT 'get' each-other. That would be a TRAGEDY for both of us.
Title: Re: I'm a Catholic but I have a Jewish girlfriend and we want to marry
Post by: P J C on August 19, 2008, 07:07:08 AM
I do beleive it is condemned.