JTF.ORG Forum
Torah and Jewish Idea => Torah and Jewish Idea => Topic started by: ramen on January 02, 2008, 11:01:42 AM
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Examples of intolerance towards Jews in Christian world:
1. In Spain, every child born of marriage between Christian and Jew was to be baptised. Later at the height of inquisition all Jews were given the option to convert or leave Spain. Thousands were burnt alive and many lived as crypto-Jews.
2. When epidemics like plague spread, the Jews were always blamed and charged with the spread of diseases. Like in 14 th century when thousands of Jews were held responsible for Black Death and killed.
3. In 1215 Jews were ordered to wear distinct dress from Christians so that they could be identified. At many places they were made to wear yellow badges or specified dress.
4. Almost 13,000 Jews were burnt in Spain alone during inquisition for not converting to Christianity in 15th-16th centuries.
5. Popes through out history condemned Jews. Pope Julius III publicly condemned their holy book Talmud.
6. For two millennium (2,000 years) Jews were persecuted in one form or the other in Europe. Always harassed and thrown into ghettoes.
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Here some timelines for Jewish Persecutions
http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/HistoryJewishPersecution.htm (http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/HistoryJewishPersecution.htm)
http://www.nmhschool.org/tthornton/mehistorydatabase/christian_persecution_of_the_jew.php (http://www.nmhschool.org/tthornton/mehistorydatabase/christian_persecution_of_the_jew.php)
Here is a link on the History of the Holocaust
http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/holocaust/timeline.html (http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/holocaust/timeline.html)
I think that is enough reading for now. If you want more I can get it.
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The worst massacres and extermination attempts throughout history have always been in Germany/Poland/Austria. In the middle ages in Germany there were literally multiple holocausts. It's also sad but true that the two other massive holocausts both which according to one of those sites killed 1/3 of Jews there, were in Germany and Poland. The anti-semitic attacks in Germany and Poland were always so vicious and widespread, one can almost look back at history and say that a holocaust was foreseeable and inevitable.
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I would like to add something to , about the fact you mention Jabotinsky; the inevitability of the Holocaust.
It i a fact that "modern anti-semitism" began in France, with the case Dreifuss.
The 19th century in Austria/Poland/Germany was totally anti-semitic.
Therefore, after the disastrous outcome in Germany of the 1929 crash , and the Versaille-treaty,
the foundations of the Holocaust were laid.
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The worst massacres and extermination attempts throughout history have always been in Germany/Poland/Austria. In the middle ages in Germany there were literally multiple holocausts. It's also sad but true that the two other massive holocausts both which according to one of those sites killed 1/3 of Jews there, were in Germany and Poland. The anti-semitic attacks in Germany and Poland were always so vicious and widespread, one can almost look back at history and say that a holocaust was foreseeable and inevitable.
Do you know that in XVI century the 80% of European Jews lived in Polish-Lituenian comonwealth? that in XIX century Poland not existed? and that pogroms were organised by ocuping Russian tsarist goverment? or that before WWI the France, Russia and Britain were more antisemitic than German and Autro Hungarian Empires? that during this war Russian Jews were welcoming the German and Austrian soldiers as liberators from pogroms made by Kozaks? From which country mosy of US jews escaped?
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The worst massacres and extermination attempts throughout history have always been in Germany/Poland/Austria. In the middle ages in Germany there were literally multiple holocausts. It's also sad but true that the two other massive holocausts both which according to one of those sites killed 1/3 of Jews there, were in Germany and Poland. The anti-semitic attacks in Germany and Poland were always so vicious and widespread, one can almost look back at history and say that a holocaust was foreseeable and inevitable.
Do you know that in XVI century the 80% of European Jews lived in Polish-Lituenian comonwealth? that in XIX century Poland not existed? and that pogroms were organised by ocuping Russian tsarist goverment? or that before WWI the France, Russia and Britain were more antisemitic than German and Autro Hungarian Empires? that during this war Russian Jews were welcoming the German and Austrian soldiers as liberators from pogroms made by Kozaks? From which country mosy of US jews escaped?
No . totally unaware of that.
Can you give some more facts?
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about the History of Polish Jews check the superb Skippy thread:
http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php?topic=13403.0
Thursday, August 03, 2006
German Jews in WWI
The other day I posted information about the military draft in the U.S. for World War I. Our grandfather Walter Ruby registered in the draft, was called up, and fought and was seriously injured in the war. Our German grandfather, Hermann Ringel, also fought in the war on the other side.
I was curious about German Jewry and its response to the war, so I dipped into Amos Elon's "The Pity of It All--A Portrait of the German-Jewish Epoch, 1743-1933" for these excerpts:
"When war actually broke out, five weeks after the assassination, middle- and upper-middle-class urban Jews did not 'go home.' They joined up. By volunteering for war sevice long before being called up they hoped they would finally overcome the remaining informal impediments to full integration in German society....
The common experience of war was generally expected to cement firm new bonds among Germans of all faiths. The term used for that experience was Erlebnis. A young Jewish volunteer, Julius Holz, invoked his Erlebnis on December 7, 1914, his twentieth birthday, in a letter to his father from the front. He vowed to 'fight like a man, as a good German of true Jewish faith and for the greater honor of my family.' ...
In the main urban centers, liberal, leftist, and perhaps even some pacifist Jews were swayed by the prevailing emphasis on Russia. It was easier to endorse a war directed against the last despoitic and openly anti-Semitic regime in Europe....
In a speech he gave on August 4 affirming his government's decisio to go to war, the kaiser solemny assured his audience by proclaiming that differences of religion, political affiliation, class, and ethnic origin no longer counted. He said: 'I no long know any aprties, I know only Germans,' at which point the Reichstag broke into a 'storm of bravos.' ....
Jewish volunteers and conscripts felt very little hostility in the ranks. In the name of the kaiser's 'civic truce,' the military authorities ordered the more radical anti-Semitic periodicals to refrain from anti-Jewish agitation.
The Zionists were still a negligible minority among German Jews. At a conference just sight weeks before the war, they had reaffirmed their conviction that they were aliens in Germany. Once war was declared, though, they joined in with as much--and often more--enthusiasm than others, ready if necessary to shoot at French or Russian Zionists.
The Zionist Judische Rundschau, in its first issue after the outbrak of war, exhorted reader to volunteer unhesitatingly and en mass....
German Zionists already settled in Palestine hurried back to volunteer....
Large parts of the Pale of Settlement in Russia soon came under German military rule. Nearly everywhere, Russian Jews welcomed the German troops as liberators....
[Lots of great detail about Jewish pro-war sentiment, including from Freud and other intellectuals, followed by rising disillusionment as the war dragged on.]
Far from unitying Germans and Jews, the ware seemed only to deepen the gulf between them. As soon as the war turned sour, chauvinism turned inward....
Such feelings were exacerbated by the sudden influx of impoverished Jews from occupied Poland and Russia. Living in abject conditions on the edges of the larger cities, they elicited revulsion....
In October 1916, when almost three thousand Jews had already died on the battlefield and more than seven thousand had been decorated, War Minister Wild von Hohenborn saw fit to sanction the growing prejudices. He ordered a 'Jew census' in the army to determine the actual number of Jews on the front lines as opposed to those serving in the rear....
The Jew census had a devastating effect on German Jews, generating an unprecedented moral crisis among those on the front line....
In 1914, Eranst Simon had fully shared the 'intoxicating joy' of going to war. The Jew census was a 'betrayal:' the dream of community was gone. In one horrendous blow, the census reoped the deep chasm that 'could not be bridged by common language, work, civilizaton, and custom.' ....
Only two years earlier, Nahum Godmann had hailed the gloried of Prussian milarists and their wonder war. Now he wrote that Jews had nothing to do with this war: its origins, its aims, its content were totally alien to them. It was taking place outside their sphere.....
(http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/7248/1780/320/hermannringelinuniform.jpg)
[I'll stop there. This book has lots of great content about Jewish life in Germany until it was obliterated by the Nazis. I'll return later with excerpts about the Zionist movement and also the Jewish reaction to the rise of Hitler. For now here is a photo of Hermann Ringel in uniform as a German soldier during WWI.]
http://rubyfamily.blogspot.com/2006/08/german-jews-in-wwi.html