JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: mord on January 23, 2008, 06:01:18 PM
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Beatings and Burkas in Beit Shemesh
Posted by Daniel Treiman, January 22, 2008, 8:27 pm
Something has gone horribly wrong in Ramat Beit Shemesh.
Zealots within the haredi community in that Israeli city near Jerusalem have engaged in sometimes violent confrontations with their secular and Modern Orthodox neighbors, as well as other ultra-Orthodox Jews.
Even The New York Times has taken notice. Back in September, the paper of record reported that a Ramat Beit Shemesh kosher pizzeria was apparently pelted with tomatoes, hot oil and gasoline — all for daring to seat both men and women.
The latest incident was an attack on an ultra-Orthodox American immigrant by a gang of crazies. “A bunch of goons, maybe 20 or 30 guys, attacked me — it was like a pogrom,” the victim told Ha’aretz. “They kicked me, beat me, and then just left me there. Luckily, I am a strong guy and was able to get up and go to the hospital.”
The victim, Ha’aretz reports, had previously been involved in efforts to stop the violence that has plagued Ramat Beit Shemesh’s Haredi neighborhoods. In response to the latest attacks, ultra-Orthodox residents finally came out and protested the violence of their more fanatical brethren.
The strangest story to have come out of Ramat Beit Shemesh, however, seems to have largely escaped attention here in the United States. A small group of ultra-Orthodox women, apparently influenced by a Ramat Beit Shemesh rebbetzin, have — to the dismay of rabbinic authorities and even their husbands —in an over-the-top display of modesty, taken to wearing burkas. Ha’aretz ran an article (unfortunately available only in Hebrew) on this phenomenon a few months back. The story has, however, in recently received a little bit of attention in the American blogosphere, thanks to earlier posts from the Muqata blog and Israeli blogger Tali Shapiro. :o :o
Reportedly, only a handful of Jewish women are donning the burkas. But the Muqata blog says the trend has already spread to other Israeli cities.
Any trend, no matter how small, deserves a name. And so I hereby dub this item of apparel “the Jurka” — the Jewish burka!
Read the Muqata’s take here, and Shapiro’s here.
http://www.forward.com/blogs/bintel-blog/
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That's crazy they're some borders you shud not cross, jews shud not emulate musslimes. Even if some Rabbis acept this. :o
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That's crazy they're some borders you shud not cross, jews shud not emulate musslimes. Even if some Rabbis acept this. :o
Agrred maybe they are neturei karta
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That's crazy they're some borders you shud not cross, jews shud not emulate musslimes. Even if some Rabbis acept this. :o
Agrred maybe they are neturei karta
I highly doubt it.
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This is yet another BS garbage from the israeli media, what else do you expect? Beit Shemesh is known to be a town that many American Olim come to. This is probably propaganda for them to stop coming. Either way, I dont believe ANY Rabbi would approve of a burka, expecially if it covers the face. In Jewish law the face has to be shown, Muslims took modesty to an extreme so they can say see we are better in that issue.
- Guys do you allways believe what the media tells you?
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Tzvi Ben Roshel, you are 1000000% wrong. I actually witnessed these crazy Chareidim in Bet Shemesh calling Israeli soldiers who were walking in the town names simply because they were with a girl. These religious zealots need to be put on a leash before they destroy the country. It's bad enough that they don't serve in the army and collect welfare while they roam the streets and create chaos. It is actually well known that these religious guys in Bet shemesh are bored as they don't work or do anything productive with their lives so they go around and are violent. These beasts give religious jews a bad name and turn people off.
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Tzvi Ben Roshel, you are 1000000% wrong. I actually witnessed these crazy Chareidim in Bet Shemesh calling Israeli soldiers who were walking in the town names simply because they were with a girl. These religious zealots need to be put on a leash before they destroy the country. It's bad enough that they don't serve in the army and collect welfare while they roam the streets and create chaos. It is actually well known that these religious guys in Bet shemesh are bored as they don't work or do anything productive with their lives so they go around and are violent. These beasts give religious jews a bad name and turn people off.
Learning Torah isn't productive?
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In Jewish law the face has to be shown, Muslims took modesty to an extreme so they can say see we are better in that issue.
Does this mean that Jews can't wear masks either? I'm just curious. Like say, if you had a dress up party with masks, like a masked ball, could a Jew attend?
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Tzvi Ben Roshel, you are 1000000% wrong. I actually witnessed these crazy Chareidim in Bet Shemesh calling Israeli soldiers who were walking in the town names simply because they were with a girl. These religious zealots need to be put on a leash before they destroy the country. It's bad enough that they don't serve in the army and collect welfare while they roam the streets and create chaos. It is actually well known that these religious guys in Bet shemesh are bored as they don't work or do anything productive with their lives so they go around and are violent. These beasts give religious jews a bad name and turn people off.
Learning Torah isn't productive?
This was discussed by a Rabbi on Arutz Sheva.
He said that refusing to earn a living in order to study Torah at the expense of others is a sin. He did point out that if a man received voluntary sponsorship by another person to study Torah full-time it was OK. But to refuse to work and draw social security in order to study Torah full-time was wrong.
What's wrong with working and studying Torah part-time like 99.9% of religious Jews throughout history?
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Tzvi Ben Roshel, you are 1000000% wrong. I actually witnessed these crazy Chareidim in Bet Shemesh calling Israeli soldiers who were walking in the town names simply because they were with a girl. These religious zealots need to be put on a leash before they destroy the country. It's bad enough that they don't serve in the army and collect welfare while they roam the streets and create chaos. It is actually well known that these religious guys in Bet shemesh are bored as they don't work or do anything productive with their lives so they go around and are violent. These beasts give religious jews a bad name and turn people off.
Learning Torah isn't productive?
This was discussed by a Rabbi on Arutz Sheva.
He said that refusing to earn a living in order to study Torah at the expense of others is a sin. He did point out that if a man received voluntary sponsorship by another person to study Torah full-time it was OK. But to refuse to work and draw social security in order to study Torah full-time was wrong.
What's wrong with working and studying Torah part-time like 99.9% of religious Jews throughout history?
I do not support taking welfare from the state, and I would certainly encourage serving in the army - but if someone has the financial means to be able to learn Torah all day, more power to him...
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Tzvi Ben Roshel, you are 1000000% wrong. I actually witnessed these crazy Chareidim in Bet Shemesh calling Israeli soldiers who were walking in the town names simply because they were with a girl. These religious zealots need to be put on a leash before they destroy the country. It's bad enough that they don't serve in the army and collect welfare while they roam the streets and create chaos. It is actually well known that these religious guys in Bet shemesh are bored as they don't work or do anything productive with their lives so they go around and are violent. These beasts give religious jews a bad name and turn people off.
Learning Torah isn't productive?
This was discussed by a Rabbi on Arutz Sheva.
He said that refusing to earn a living in order to study Torah at the expense of others is a sin. He did point out that if a man received voluntary sponsorship by another person to study Torah full-time it was OK. But to refuse to work and draw social security in order to study Torah full-time was wrong.
What's wrong with working and studying Torah part-time like 99.9% of religious Jews throughout history?
I do not support taking welfare from the state, and I would certainly encourage serving in the army - but if someone has the financial means to be able to learn Torah all day, more power to him...
I agree. I support funding Jews to be able to only study Torah. It will bring Moshiach Faster.
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In Jewish law the face has to be shown, Muslims took modesty to an extreme so they can say see we are better in that issue.
Does this mean that Jews can't wear masks either? I'm just curious. Like say, if you had a dress up party with masks, like a masked ball, could a Jew attend?
Actually, probably the party itself would be worse then the fact of wearing a mask. But I know that on purim it is done (actually it also has deeper meanings behind it), but I dont know if its not allowed allway (except Purim), or just as a general rule.
- The face is the identity of the person (also those who have the knowledge are able to see a lot about the soul of the person which is shown specifically by the face). Covering it up completly is like taking away the identity, also many other things are involved.
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According ot the Mishna, Jewish women living in Arabia wore Burqa-style veils.
Never Jewish women living in
Israel.
But to each his own. I don't think it is a very positive development but we'll see where this leads.
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This is yet another BS garbage from the israeli media, what else do you expect? Beit Shemesh is known to be a town that many American Olim come to. This is probably propaganda for them to stop coming. Either way, I dont believe ANY Rabbi would approve of a burka, expecially if it covers the face. In Jewish law the face has to be shown, Muslims took modesty to an extreme so they can say see we are better in that issue.
- Guys do you allways believe what the media tells you?
AMEN! I agree with yhou!
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- Guys do you allways believe what the media tells you?
Only when then news are crazy enough: who woud belive twenty years ago aside from Kahane fallowers that Arabs will get all lands liberated in 1967 almost without single shot... german owned Haretz of course has it's own anti zionist and anti Jewish agenda agree but it coud happened.