JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: DownwithIslam on December 10, 2008, 11:21:13 AM
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Feiglin just gave an interview to ynet in which he has reversed all the positions he previously held. he now says the arabs should not be thrown out of israel. he also says gush katif should not be rebuilt and so much more. this is in addition to him removing all controversial opionions like that water should be cut off from the arabs from his website upon him winning the likud spot. he just gave an interview to ynet. this beast feiglin has quickly sgown what a sick fraud he is. chaim ben pesach is the only answer. let the kikes at the splinter continue to support feiglin.
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I haven't read this interview but I seriously doubt that he conveys such a definite message. Feiglin is now facing a Bolshevik attempt to move him down the candidates ranks to a nonreal postion. Some verbal overtures which he is forced to make doesn't constitute a forfeit of his ideology.
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http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3636401,00.html
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I've always suspected Feiglin's actions. For years people begged him to leave the Likud party and start his own party, since there was no way he'd make it to the top of the party list and have any political success.
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Feiglin just gave an interview to ynet in which he has reversed all the positions he previously held. he now says the arabs should not be thrown out of israel. he also says gush katif should not be rebuilt and so much more. this is in addition to him removing all controversial opionions like that water should be cut off from the arabs from his website upon him winning the likud spot. he just gave an interview to ynet. this beast feiglin has quickly sgown what a sick fraud he is. chaim ben pesach is the only answer. let the kikes at the splinter continue to support feiglin.
DWI,
Did you read the interview?
He did not say he thinks we should not rebuilt Gush Katif. What he said is:
Should Gush Katif be rebuilt?
"I think so, but I know there is no use in returning to Gaza if the public does not believe this region belongs to us. Entering Gaza today means killing our soldiers senselessly… As long as we don't see this place as our own and want to return in order to build it and to stay there, there is no use going back.
"This is also true for the issue of the Qassams. As long as we don't have faith that this country is ours there can be no military solution, not for the Qassams or anything else."
He said we should rebuild Gush Katif, but not so with Gaza.
It sounds like Feiglin is the best hope for Israel at this time. I don't know if it is productive to speak so harshly against him. It seems like he wants to do his best to bring Israel back into the Torah lifestyle. He says he doesnt want a Torah state, but if you read between the lines I think he is saying that is what he ultimately wants. He wants to return Jewish education into the school systems. This is an excellent first step toward moving toward the Torah state we wish for.
What should the education system look like?
"We must stress the issue of Jewish heritage. We need to make sure every child here can recite the prayer 'Shema Israel', get to know the basic texts in the Torah, and as Hanukkah is approaching, know who the Maccabees were – and not just the basketball team."
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I have read the interview in Hebrew (I believe it had been conducted in Hebrew). DWI I think you misunderstood Feiglin's statements and you are certainly wrong about his intentions. He may be a pragmatist, but he is not a political whore.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
Even in the same interview Feiglin says that Arabs who want to live in Israel must be loyal, otherwise they should leave. The interviewer tried to trap him, because if Feiglin said that Arabs should be thrown out it wuoud be illegal in Israel and most likely would result in immediate disqualification and a legal charge. "Hayami Haamiti" avoids the same trap as well and if Chaim was interviewed in Israel he too would no express support of forced transfer.
While Feiglin's strategy might not be successful, as indeed it hasn't been so far, He represent a righteous ideology. He is not a foe of Hayamin and shouldn't be treated as such.
Last note, regarding his role in rise of Smolmet- Feiglin may have reached a voting deal with Smolmert back in the 2003 Likud primaries. So what ? I mean suppose Smolmert wasn't elected to the Knesset, what difference would it make ? Still Sharon would win the election, and then when Sharon had fallen ill, he would have been replaced by Tzipi Livni or some other evil figure.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
The honest to goodness reality of the situation is Feiglin is on the ballot and Chaim is not... That's the fact. You can only vote for someone who is running, and as far as I know Chaim is not running. We all know we would support Chaim, but that is not possible because he is not on the ticket.
That being said, all politicians in a democratic system must play this game. It is not productive to be so outraged by it. Unless you want to overthrow the government through non-democratic means you will never find a politician who doesnt have to shift his position to get into office.
All in all I think Feiglin is one of the best of the bunch that I know.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
The honest to goodness reality of the situation is Feiglin is on the ballot and Chaim is not... That's the fact. You can only vote for someone who is running, and as far as I know Chaim is not running. We all know we would support Chaim, but that is not possible because he is not on the ticket.
That being said, all politicians in a democratic system must play this game. It is not productive to be so outraged by it. Unless you want to overthrow the government through non-democratic means you will never find a politician who doesnt have to shift his position to get into office.
All in all I think Feiglin is one of the best of the bunch that I know.
Just because Feiglin is on the list doesn't mean one should vote Likud. Voting Likud means 39/40th of your vote is wasted on to treasonous or immoral politicians and only 1/40th goes to Feiglin.
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Feiglin just gave an interview to ynet in which he has reversed all the positions he previously held. he now says the arabs should not be thrown out of israel. he also says gush katif should not be rebuilt and so much more. this is in addition to him removing all controversial opionions like that water should be cut off from the arabs from his website upon him winning the likud spot. he just gave an interview to ynet. this beast feiglin has quickly sgown what a sick fraud he is. chaim ben pesach is the only answer. let the kikes at the splinter continue to support feiglin.
Provide a source or you've got nothing. I also read the phony article about him taking his platform down, but I was able to see his site without any problems and it still said what I can remember it said many months ago.
http://www.jewishisrael.org/hundred/hundred_03.htm
For years he has called for rebuilding Gush Katif and in fact, 100 Gush Katifs. And in many articles. I want proof that he said any such things like you are claiming. I personally do support Feiglin.
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KWR, there is no reason to be so confrontational. But DownwithIslam, it would be helpful for you to provide a link.
We all know that Chaim is ultimately the only answer and that other Israeli rightists vary from being downright frauds to good, but not good enough. Let's see what Chaim has to say about this latest development. I don't know much about Feiglin, but Chaim has always had a decent opinion of him.
And as for the freaks on the splinter forums (Guzofsky's, Haivri's, and Yacov's), well, we all know they'd support Adolf Hitler himself (yimach schmo vezichro) just to get back at JTF.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
You couldn't be more wrong. Chaim never "exposed" Feiglin unless by "expose" you mean calling him a good Jew, which Chaim has done countless times on his program. You have been proven wrong by those who quoted the interview, and/or heard it in Hebrew (Zelhar), and now your baseless hatred is showing itself.
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Mishmaat posted the link a few posts up. That is the article I was referring to.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
You couldn't be more wrong. Chaim never "exposed" Feiglin unless by "expose" you mean calling him a good Jew, which Chaim has done countless times on his program. You have been proven wrong by those who quoted the interview, and/or heard it in Hebrew (Zelhar), and now your baseless hatred is showing itself.
Your heinous, please read the article Mishmaat posted before you accuse people of hate mongering.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
You couldn't be more wrong. Chaim never "exposed" Feiglin unless by "expose" you mean calling him a good Jew, which Chaim has done countless times on his program. You have been proven wrong by those who quoted the interview, and/or heard it in Hebrew (Zelhar), and now your baseless hatred is showing itself.
Your heinous, please read the article Mishmaat posted before you accuse people of hate mongering.
He states in the article the JTF position on expulsions, and he also wisely states that an "operation" in gaza is pointless if it is only to hand over the place from one band of terrorists to another band of terrorists (which IS, believe it or not, on the Israeli establishment's agenda - eventually, when they feel the time is right). Feiglin has been speaking out against this for many months. I see no difference here from his previously stated stances. In fact, the haaretz article ( a different evil article that was out to slander Feiglin) lied and said that he took back his stance of leaving the UN. Here he clearly suggests Israel reconsiders that. Just as he has all along.
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I disagree with the Feiglin supporters here. Chaim Ben Pesach has again been far ahead of the game as he exposed Feiglin as one of the people who enabled Ehud "Prostate" Olmert to rise to power. Feiglin clearly said "The arabs should not be thrown out." It doesn't get much clearer than that. This individual is such a waste of time. At least Netanyahu is being honest and telling us that he will continue the "peace process." Avigdor Lieberman the beast is honest as well and doesn't flip flop, he openly admits to his disastrous ideas. Feiglin on the other hand posed as a kahanist for years and when he smells some power is near, he succumbs to the prostitution that is so popular amongst Israeli politicians.
You couldn't be more wrong. Chaim never "exposed" Feiglin unless by "expose" you mean calling him a good Jew, which Chaim has done countless times on his program. You have been proven wrong by those who quoted the interview, and/or heard it in Hebrew (Zelhar), and now your baseless hatred is showing itself.
Your heinous, please read the article Mishmaat posted before you accuse people of hate mongering.
He states in the article the JTF position on expulsions, and he also wisely states that an "operation" in gaza is pointless if it is only to hand over the place from one band of terrorists to another band of terrorists (which IS, believe it or not, on the Israeli establishment's agenda - eventually, when they feel the time is right). Feiglin has been speaking out against this for many months. I see no difference here from his previously stated stances. In fact, the haaretz article ( a different evil article that was out to slander Feiglin) lied and said that he took back his stance of leaving the UN. Here he clearly suggests Israel reconsiders that. Just as he has all along.
Address the fact that the article quoted him as saying "of course not," when asked if the arabs should be thrown out of Israel.
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He states in the article the JTF position on expulsions, and he also wisely states that an "operation" in gaza is pointless if it is only to hand over the place from one band of terrorists to another band of terrorists (which IS, believe it or not, on the Israeli establishment's agenda - eventually, when they feel the time is right). Feiglin has been speaking out against this for many months. I see no difference here from his previously stated stances. In fact, the haaretz article ( a different evil article that was out to slander Feiglin) lied and said that he took back his stance of leaving the UN. Here he clearly suggests Israel reconsiders that. Just as he has all along.
Address the fact that the article quoted him as saying "of course not," when asked if the arabs should be thrown out of Israel.
Address the fact that the article quoted him as saying " We need to create a situation in which those who are loyal to us can find their place here, and those who are not are encouraged to find another place." and "The State should demand that its Arab citizens be loyal to the State of Israel as a Jewish State. "
If you can't do the simple "math" to understand what he means here, you either haven't been following Feiglin or his policies (in which case you should can your lid), you don't understand the JTF's policies, or you simply don't understand Rabbi Kahane's ideology, which is exactly where both of the aforementioned stem from. In fact, in either of those three cases, you would be wise to shut your trap and learn, rather than spout ignorance.
Now who is "heinous," you child?
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Peace folks...
I believe we are on the same side here. It just seems that some are not quite willing to be 'political' about things. I am with KWRBT on this one. It seems to me that Feiglin is still supportive of Kahanist ideas including moving the non-loyal arabs out of Israel. From what I understand this was what Rabbi Kahane suggested.
Please let us just not resort to name calling. I do find it offensive that the thread calls Feiglin supporters Schmucks. I am a supporter and I take offense at being called this name.
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including moving the non-loyal arabs out of Israel.
Are there loyal arabs?
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He states in the article the JTF position on expulsions, and he also wisely states that an "operation" in gaza is pointless if it is only to hand over the place from one band of terrorists to another band of terrorists (which IS, believe it or not, on the Israeli establishment's agenda - eventually, when they feel the time is right). Feiglin has been speaking out against this for many months. I see no difference here from his previously stated stances. In fact, the haaretz article ( a different evil article that was out to slander Feiglin) lied and said that he took back his stance of leaving the UN. Here he clearly suggests Israel reconsiders that. Just as he has all along.
Address the fact that the article quoted him as saying "of course not," when asked if the arabs should be thrown out of Israel.
Address the fact that the article quoted him as saying " We need to create a situation in which those who are loyal to us can find their place here, and those who are not are encouraged to find another place." and "The State should demand that its Arab citizens be loyal to the State of Israel as a Jewish State. "
If you can't do the simple "math" to understand what he means here, you either haven't been following Feiglin or his policies (in which case you should can your lid), you don't understand the JTF's policies, or you simply don't understand Rabbi Kahane's ideology, which is exactly where both of the aforementioned stem from. In fact, in either of those three cases, you would be wise to shut your trap and learn, rather than spout ignorance.
Now who is "heinous," you child?
Should the Israeli Arabs be transferred out of Israel?
"Of course not, nor the Arabs of Judea and Samaria. We need to create a situation in which those who are loyal to us can find their place here, and those who are not are encouraged to find another place."
That is straight out of Feiglins mouth. KahanewrBT, You have proven that you have the literary skills of a shvartza. Get your mommy to help you read that article before you open that anti semitic, lubavitch hating mouth of yours.
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He states in the article the JTF position on expulsions, and he also wisely states that an "operation" in gaza is pointless if it is only to hand over the place from one band of terrorists to another band of terrorists (which IS, believe it or not, on the Israeli establishment's agenda - eventually, when they feel the time is right). Feiglin has been speaking out against this for many months. I see no difference here from his previously stated stances. In fact, the haaretz article ( a different evil article that was out to slander Feiglin) lied and said that he took back his stance of leaving the UN. Here he clearly suggests Israel reconsiders that. Just as he has all along.
Address the fact that the article quoted him as saying "of course not," when asked if the arabs should be thrown out of Israel.
Address the fact that the article quoted him as saying " We need to create a situation in which those who are loyal to us can find their place here, and those who are not are encouraged to find another place." and "The State should demand that its Arab citizens be loyal to the State of Israel as a Jewish State. "
If you can't do the simple "math" to understand what he means here, you either haven't been following Feiglin or his policies (in which case you should can your lid), you don't understand the JTF's policies, or you simply don't understand Rabbi Kahane's ideology, which is exactly where both of the aforementioned stem from. In fact, in either of those three cases, you would be wise to shut your trap and learn, rather than spout ignorance.
Now who is "heinous," you child?
Should the Israeli Arabs be transferred out of Israel?
"Of course not, nor the Arabs of Judea and Samaria.
That is straight out of Feiglins mouth. KahanewrBT, You have proven that you have the literary skills of a shvartza. Get your mommy to help you read that article before you open that anti semitic, lubavitch hating mouth of yours.
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KahanewrBT, You have proven that you have the literary skills of a shvartza. Get your mommy to help you read that article before you open that anti semitic, lubavitch hating mouth of yours.
DWI, your insults against KahaneBTs are complete lies, and for you to insult his literary skills is ridiculous.
I can demonstrate your own poor literary skills very easily.. I think they are below any black person I have ever met in my life.
You accuse KahaneBT of being lubavitch hating.
**Quote him**
You won't be able to. You probably won't even try to quote him.
You really are -worse- than a child.
I've seen more intelligence in blacks and children than i've ever seen from you. And I really am serious. You are very dishonest, that's the worst thing.
Now Quote him. You would if you were truthful.
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First let him understand a quote from an article he supposedly read before he tried to understand something I have written.
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He couldn't understand a feiglin quote so I doubt he can understand a Kahanewasrightbt quote.
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For the sake of the movt, I wont continue debating you two. Anyone who reads the ynet article will clearly see the quote that you two can't comprehend. End your love affair with the fraud Feiglin. We are screwed if he is the one the right wing looks to.
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For the sake of the movt, I wont continue debating you two. Anyone who reads the ynet article will clearly see the quote that you two can't comprehend. End your love affair with the fraud Feiglin. We are screwed if he is the one the right wing looks to.
DWI,
You are not reading the article correctly. Although it says that he said that he doesnt think that Arabs should be forcibly removed he does support only allowing loyal arabs to remain. This is in line with Kahanist ideas, as far as I understand. Rabbi Kahane was for relocating the non-loyal arabs only. He allowed for arabs to live in Israel as long as they swore aliegence to the state of Israel. If they violated this they would be evicted from the state.
I think you also are not giving credit to the fact that this is a democratic election. In a democracy a politician must shift positions in order to get elected. I am not surprised by this... But my reading of the article is completely opposite of yours. I see a man who wants to create a strong Jewish identity in Israel, which is a goal we all share.
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For the sake of the movt, I wont continue debating you two. Anyone who reads the ynet article will clearly see the quote that you two can't comprehend. End your love affair with the fraud Feiglin. We are screwed if he is the one the right wing looks to.
DWI,
You are not reading the article correctly. Although it says that he said that he doesnt think that Arabs should be forcibly removed he does support only allowing loyal arabs to remain. This is in line with Kahanist ideas, as far as I understand. Rabbi Kahane was for relocating the non-loyal arabs only. He allowed for arabs to live in Israel as long as they swore aliegence to the state of Israel. If they violated this they would be evicted from the state.
I think you also are not giving credit to the fact that this is a democratic election. In a democracy a politician must shift positions in order to get elected. I am not surprised by this... But my reading of the article is completely opposite of yours. I see a man who wants to create a strong Jewish identity in Israel, which is a goal we all share.
you keep repeating this, I must correct you.
you are right in a sense, but rabbi kahane would have never used the terminology you are using, about loyal and non-loyal arabs.
Infact he himself said that every arab is loyal (meaning, TO HIS OWN)
Rabbi Kahane was willing to offer them the chance to stay and accept the state, but he knows they won't. He expects them to leave. So often he just said he wants them out.
Rabbi Kahane would never have responded as Feiglin would, starting a paragraph with "Of course not" when asked if he wants them out. Regardless of the fact that the plain logic of Feiglin is in line with kahanism(based on torah), and has been correctly read by KahaneBT and yourself, and ignored by DWI .
It's just the way Feiglin said it.. It's likely he was just being smart.
Rabbi Kahane was always blunt and wanted the tough image, that was his image, and a great one. He maintained his credibility that way too. Nobody was more effective at warning people of te dangers than he was so it was smart. I have no doubt that rabbi kahane inspired Feiglin. Feiglin's methods are a bit different. People know already, he doesn't need to tell people what the problem is.
Those words of Feiglin's are fine. The reason why he might have answered it like that is obvious. And the fact that he still talked about encouraging arabs that are not loyal to israel, to leave, that is very good. Much better than those that don't speak of it.
The one place where Feiglin's end result would differ from Rabbi Kahane, is nobody would have been able to run a jewish govt like Kahane.
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Of course their is no such thing as a muslim(or arab) being loyal to Israel, so obviously that statement is wrong. QQ, I have read that article and it is obvious that Feiglin is willing to compromise. Are you aware that he just removed certain "controversial" viewpoints from his website because the leftist media was hitting him on it. For instance, he removed a section where he spoke of cutting off basic needs like water to the muzzies. That was the old Feiglin but the new one has arrived.
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You couldn't be more wrong. Chaim never "exposed" Feiglin unless by "expose" you mean calling him a good Jew, which Chaim has done countless times on his program. You have been proven wrong by those who quoted the interview, and/or heard it in Hebrew (Zelhar), and now your baseless hatred is showing itself.
Kahane Was Right, there is no need to attack DownwithIslam like this.
DownwithIslam, he is at least partly right though. Chaim has not attacked Feiglin. He has called him a good Jew who has unfortunately helped the Likud establishment.
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You couldn't be more wrong. Chaim never "exposed" Feiglin unless by "expose" you mean calling him a good Jew, which Chaim has done countless times on his program. You have been proven wrong by those who quoted the interview, and/or heard it in Hebrew (Zelhar), and now your baseless hatred is showing itself.
Kahane Was Right, there is no need to attack DownwithIslam like this.
DownwithIslam, he is at least partly right though. Chaim has not attacked Feiglin. He has called him a good Jew who has unfortunately helped the Likud establishment.
He said that on this past weeks ask jtf so you are right about that. But I remember shows he did in the past in which he said that Feiglin has caused terrible things to happen and is not the answer. Besides, Chaim is strongly against him running in the likud so Chaim would never support what Feiglin is doing which is strengthening the likud.
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You have proven that you have the literary skills of a shvartza. Get your mommy to help you read that article before you open that anti semitic, lubavitch hating mouth of yours.
This was completely uncalled for.
Chaim said just last week that he thinks he may well work with Feiglin when he gets to Israel. I don't understand the context of what Feiglin said, but let's give him the benefit of the doubt for now.
There are plenty of certain frauds out there that are a threat to us, like Mike Huckster and Mike Faggot. Let's give Feiglin a break for now.
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You have proven that you have the literary skills of a shvartza. Get your mommy to help you read that article before you open that anti semitic, lubavitch hating mouth of yours.
This was completely uncalled for.
Chaim said just last week that he thinks he may well work with Feiglin when he gets to Israel. I don't understand the context of what Feiglin said, but let's give him the benefit of the doubt for now.
There are plenty of certain frauds out there that are a threat to us, like Mike Huckster and Mike Faggot. Let's give Feiglin a break for now.
Chaim said that before Feiglin started acting like a fraud after winning the 20th spot on the Likud list. I wonder what Chaim would say about Feiglin now. If Chaim comes in here and explains that I am wrong about Feiglin, then I will admit defeat.
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Q_q and Muman have a very good point. For him to say all Arabs should be expelled would not only be political suicide (you know how insane Israel's secular majority is when it comes to Arab "civil rights"), but would likely subject him to arrest, conviction, and a couple of years in a Shabak gulag for "incitement". We all know that Bolshevik Israel has powerful laws against "incitement against Arabs".
This was like when Sarah Palin said "Yes, I support two states" but then every single thing she said after that was clearly and exclusively in support of Israel. She had no choice but to pay lipservice to the establishment there. But we know where she stands, and (I think) we know where Feiglin stands. He is by far the best of the mainstream politicians in Israel, and even if he is not a perfect Kahanist (and Chaim has never said that he is), he is light-years better than Weewee Netanloser or Gayhud Holemert.
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If Chaim comes in here and explains that I am wrong about Feiglin, then I will admit defeat.
Just give this topic a rest for now--it's not cool to attack everyone you disagree with, especially before a statement from Chaim. Trust me here.
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Q_q and Muman have a very good point. For him to say all Arabs should be expelled would not only be political suicide (you know how insane Israel's secular majority is when it comes to Arab "civil rights"), but would likely subject him to arrest, conviction, and a couple of years in a Shabak gulag for "incitement". We all know that Bolshevik Israel has powerful laws against "incitement against Arabs".
This was like when Sarah Palin said "Yes, I support two states" but then every single thing she said after that was clearly and exclusively in support of Israel. She had no choice but to pay lipservice to the establishment there. But we know where she stands, and (I think) we know where Feiglin stands. He is by far the best of the mainstream politicians in Israel, and even if he is not a perfect Kahanist (and Chaim has never said that he is), he is light-years better than Weewee Netanloser or Gayhud Holemert.
No, I disagree with that. He has to state his true positions. Rabbi Kahane did that and was en-route to getiing 10-12 knesset seats right before he was killed. Can you imagine the damage Feiglin can do to the right wing kahanist camp in Israel if he sells out and compromises. The right wing will be demoralized and they will feel that everyone ultimately sells out. We cannot allow Feiglin in now that he has shown sign of compromise. And I think he has the potential to cause more harm than anything else.
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If Chaim comes in here and explains that I am wrong about Feiglin, then I will admit defeat.
Just give this topic a rest for now--it's not cool to attack everyone you disagree with, especially before a statement from Chaim. Trust me here.
Kahnaewasrightbt unleashed the first personal attack in this thread. You can check the posts.
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In the words on a 'Great' Man: Why can't we all just get along?!
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Of course their is no such thing as a muslim(or arab) being loyal to Israel, so obviously that statement is wrong. QQ, I have read that article and it is obvious that Feiglin is willing to compromise. Are you aware that he just removed certain "controversial" viewpoints from his website because the leftist media was hitting him on it. For instance, he removed a section where he spoke of cutting off basic needs like water to the muzzies. That was the old Feiglin but the new one has arrived.
You are right to be suspicious of him when he said what he said that way he did. And that he removed those things from his website.
We know not to just give israeli politicians the benefit of the doubt..
But what you did was you took what he said , and concluded that
"he has reversed all the positions he previously held. he now says the arabs should not be thrown out of israel. "
Now, it may well be that Feiglin if he got power would indeed not throw the arabs out. Infact, it's very likely that he wouldn't throw them out!! (and we know the arabs won't be loyal to israel, that's for sure)
But to conclude as you did, as if it was a logical conclusion, was wrong.
It is logical to be suspicious of him and concerned.. (though there are also innocent reasons for what he said).. And his stated position there is no different -logically- from rabbi kahane, it's just said in a different way, a strange way that may well be cause for concern.
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I believe I am right about Feiglin. Any individual who is dumb enought to work with the Likud is not what we are looking for anyways. We need someone like Rabbi Kahane who started his own party and never compromised once. The closest person to that is Chaim Ben Pesach. Their is no need for us to have any hope in Feiglin only to be screwed by him. He hasn't even been elected yet and already he is playing games. Can you imagine what he will do once he gets in power to maintain his position at the country club?
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I believe I am right about Feiglin. Any individual who is dumb enought to work with the Likud is not what we are looking for anyways. We need someone like Rabbi Kahane who started his own party and never compromised once. The closest person to that is Chaim Ben Pesach. Their is no need for us to have any hope in Feiglin only to be screwed by him. He hasn't even been elected yet and already he is playing games. Can you imagine what he will do once he gets in power to maintain his position at the country club?
You see the way you operate it's as if you have 2 modes,
support
and reject/hate..
When you choose reject/hate, you jump to any irrational reasons against them. When you choose support, you jump to any irrational reasons for them.
In this case, you choose hate/reject.
I agree that him joining the Likud probably won't help. Rabbi Kahane himself preferred the idea of -referendum-. Much better. And at one point (some point around 2002-2007) the majourity of israelis were polled and wanted transfer, shame it wasn't an actual referendum!
But all this doesn't make your first post(which you've been defending) any less wrong.
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Lets keep the conversation simple and leave out these button analogies.
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Kahnaewasrightbt unleashed the first personal attack in this thread. You can check the posts.
Yeah, and I told him off too.
Feiglin is not perfect, but he is better than any current Israeli politician. He has never said he is a Kahanist, and Chaim has always said that he disagrees with him on many things.
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Kahnaewasrightbt unleashed the first personal attack in this thread. You can check the posts.
Yeah, and I told him off too.
Feiglin is not perfect, but he is better than any current Israeli politician. He has never said he is a Kahanist, and Chaim has always said that he disagrees with him on many things.
Chaimfan, I would support Avigdor Liberman over Feiglin simply because he can't demoralize the right wing as much if something should go wrong.
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And finally, the jerks over at the splinter forum are so excited about Feiglin so that tells us that real kahanists shouldn't support him. The shelly rubin supporters never have taken a real kahanist position.
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בס''ד
First, there is no way we can become a meaningful movement if every disagreement descends into name calling and personal insults.
Some of our members had a difference of opinion here. So what? We have to learn to respect each other even when there are differences of opinion.
Moshe Feiglin is not a Kahanist and never claimed to be. Is that a problem? In my opinion, yes. Because I view Kahanism as the only real solution.
I like Feiglin personally, and I certainly do not consider him to be like the other politicians in Israel. I think he sincerely wants to save Israel.
But it is precisely because I like him that I am disappointed by many of his actions. For example:
*Feiglin vigorously condemned Dr. Baruch Goldstein, Hashem yikom damo (may G-d avenge his blood). Dr. Goldstein was a captain in the Israeli army who was informed by his superiors that there would be a huge massacre of the Jews in Kiryat Arba and Chevron by the Arab Nazis. To prevent the massacre, Dr. Goldstein went to Mearat Hamachpelah (the Cave of the Patriachs) and shot to death 29 Muslim terrorists who were praying on the second most sacred Jewish spot in the world. Dr. Goldstein himself was then brutally murdered by the Arab Nazi mob. So he gave his life to prevent a massacre of Jews. As a result of what Dr. Goldstein did, the entire area was curfewed and the planned Arab massacre of Jews never took place. Feiglin strongly condemned Dr. Goldstein. I think that at the least Feiglin should have refused to say anything. He would not have been banned politically for refusing to discuss the issue. But to condemn a Jew who gave his life to save his fellow Jews is something I would never have done. Even if it meant paying a political price.
*Feiglin strongly condemned Yigal Amir, who killed Yitzchak Rabin. My position is that Amir was entrapped by the Shabak (the Israeli KGB) who incited him to kill Rabin, and therefore it is the Shabak which is responsible for the assassination. Because he was entrapped, Amir should be released from prison immediately. This position that I take is not illegal in Israel, and it does not betray a Jew who wanted to save his people (Amir).
*Feiglin has supported and helped numerous Likud politicians who are evil people. He supported Ehud Smolmert, Limor Livnat and other disgusting crooks who eventually worked to surrender Jewish land and expel thousands of Jews from Gush Katif. Call me naive or inflexible or unrealistic, but I will not support corrupt Likud criminals who are destroying the Jewish homeland. Feiglin has made many deals that I believe are morally and ethically wrong just to advance himself in the Likud. I'm sure that he convinced himself that he was doing it for the good of Israel, but I don't trust a leader who makes unsavory deals just to get ahead.
*In the most recent Likud primary, Feiglin strongly supported Benny Begin, the son of Menachem Begin. In fact, Begin was the number two candidate on Feiglin's recommended list of candidates. Benny Begin supported the Sinai retreat that his father carried out; Begin said that he is embarrassed when people say that we must have a Jewish majority in Israel, because such talk is not democratic and it's insulting to the growing Arab Muslim Nazi minority; Begin called Rechavam Zeevi (Gandhi) "moral pollution" for advocating a voluntary transfer of the Arabs out of Israel; but Begin would never refer to the Arab Nazis as "moral pollution"; Begin insisted that Bibi Netanyahu bring Dan Meridor, an extreme leftist traitor, into the LIkud Knesset list - Meridor is a slavish defender of the self-hating "Supreme Court" and Meridor favors suicidal Israeli surrender of the entire Biblical heartland.
*Feiglin is now encouraging all rightwing Jews to vote Likud. The Likud is a disaster that has retreated from more Jewish land than the openly leftist parties. For Feiglin to urge all Jews to vote Likud just so that he could get elected is very bad, in my view. Feiglin will be all by himself out of 30 or 40 Likud Knesset members. For people to vote Likud just because Feiglin is one of the candidates is a big mistake. The rest of the Likud Knesset members are the same old politicians who have failed the Jewish people repeatedly. Having Feiglin there as just one out of 30 or 40 of these Likud Knesset members will not protect Israel.
Well, that's my opinion.
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Had I known that Feiglin condemned Dr. Goldstein, I would of used vulgar language towards him. Of course Feiglin is not the answer. In fact, I hope Netanyahu throws Feiglin out of the likud now that I know What Feiglin thinks of Boroch kappel Goldstein and Yigal Amir.
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Of course I agree with you Chaim that the things Feiglin di in regard to the Dr Goldstein and Yigal Amir situation is problematic. I think I take a much stronger stance against Feiglin than you do Chaim. I personally prefer a few other politicians in Israel over Feiglin right now. Are these politicians scum, absolutely. They are better only because they can't cause the damage Feiglin can when he compromises.
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I had higher hopes for him. But a real religous canidate needs to get into power and not by way of the Likud.
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Had I known that Feiglin condemned Dr. Goldstein, I would of used vulgar language towards him. Of course Feiglin is not the answer. In fact, I hope Netanyahu throws Feiglin out of the likud now that I know What Feiglin thinks of Boroch kappel Goldstein and Yigal Amir.
I don't think Bibi thinks of Dr. Golstein any higher. He is going to be Prime Minister he wouldn't support someone like him no matter how right he was. May G-d Avenge is Blood.
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I don't know what exactly Mr Feiglin said about Dr. Goldstein but if he doesn't accept the unproven explanation of Goldstein receiving warning from the IDF about an imminent massacre, I think he is right to condemn Goldstein's action. The same goes to condemning Yigal Amir. Of course Goldstein and Amir killed evil people which wouldn't be missed, but their actions may have caused severe negative repercussions, for example, The expulsion of the Jews from the ancient city of Hebron was very nearly carried out due to the Goldstein's killings.
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I don't know what exactly Mr Feiglin said about Dr. Goldstein but if he doesn't accept the unproven explanation of Goldstein receiving warning from the IDF about an imminent massacre, I think he is right to condemn Goldstein's action. The same goes to condemning Yigal Amir. Of course Goldstein and Amir killed evil people which wouldn't be missed, but their actions may have caused severe negative repercussions, for example, The expulsion of the Jews from the ancient city of Hebron was very nearly carried out due to the Goldstein's killings.
Zelhar, both Dr. Goldstein and Yigal Amir are heroes. Their is nothing worth condemning about them.
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The Likud just knocked Feiglin down to the 36th spot on the list. This means he will almost certainly not be a minister in the next knesset. This is what the shmuck Feiglin deserves for trying to help the Likud. That shmuck should of listened to Chaim ben pesach who predicted that they would get rid of him somehow.
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בס''ד
First, there is no way we can become a meaningful movement if every disagreement descends into name calling and personal insults.
Some of our members had a difference of opinion here. So what? We have to learn to respect each other even when there are differences of opinion.
Moshe Feiglin is not a Kahanist and never claimed to be. Is that a problem? In my opinion, yes. Because I view Kahanism as the only real solution.
I like Feiglin personally, and I certainly do not consider him to be like the other politicians in Israel. I think he sincerely wants to save Israel.
But it is precisely because I like him that I am disappointed by many of his actions. For example:
*Feiglin vigorously condemned Dr. Baruch Goldstein, Hashem yikom damo (may G-d avenge his blood). Dr. Goldstein was a captain in the Israeli army who was informed by his superiors that there would be a huge massacre of the Jews in Kiryat Arba and Chevron by the Arab Nazis. To prevent the massacre, Dr. Goldstein went to Mearat Hamachpelah (the Cave of the Patriachs) and shot to death 29 Muslim terrorists who were praying on the second most sacred Jewish spot in the world. Dr. Goldstein himself was then brutally murdered by the Arab Nazi mob. So he gave his life to prevent a massacre of Jews. As a result of what Dr. Goldstein did, the entire area was curfewed and the planned Arab massacre of Jews never took place. Feiglin strongly condemned Dr. Goldstein. I think that at the least Feiglin should have refused to say anything. He would not have been banned politically for refusing to discuss the issue. But to condemn a Jew who gave his life to save his fellow Jews is something I would never have done. Even if it meant paying a political price.
*Feiglin strongly condemned Yigal Amir, who killed Yitzchak Rabin. My position is that Amir was entrapped by the Shabak (the Israeli KGB) who incited him to kill Rabin, and therefore it is the Shabak which is responsible for the assassination. Because he was entrapped, Amir should be released from prison immediately. This position that I take is not illegal in Israel, and it does not betray a Jew who wanted to save his people (Amir).
*Feiglin has supported and helped numerous Likud politicians who are evil people. He supported Ehud Smolmert, Limor Livnat and other disgusting crooks who eventually worked to surrender Jewish land and expel thousands of Jews from Gush Katif. Call me naive or inflexible or unrealistic, but I will not support corrupt Likud criminals who are destroying the Jewish homeland. Feiglin has made many deals that I believe are morally and ethically wrong just to advance himself in the Likud. I'm sure that he convinced himself that he was doing it for the good of Israel, but I don't trust a leader who makes unsavory deals just to get ahead.
*In the most recent Likud primary, Feiglin strongly supported Benny Begin, the son of Menachem Begin. In fact, Begin was the number two candidate on Feiglin's recommended list of candidates. Benny Begin supported the Sinai retreat that his father carried out; Begin said that he is embarrassed when people say that we must have a Jewish majority in Israel, because such talk is not democratic and it's insulting to the growing Arab Muslim Nazi minority; Begin called Rechavam Zeevi (Gandhi) "moral pollution" for advocating a voluntary transfer of the Arabs out of Israel; but Begin would never refer to the Arab Nazis as "moral pollution"; Begin insisted that Bibi Netanyahu bring Dan Meridor, an extreme leftist traitor, into the LIkud Knesset list - Meridor is a slavish defender of the self-hating "Supreme Court" and Meridor favors suicidal Israeli surrender of the entire Biblical heartland.
*Feiglin is now encouraging all rightwing Jews to vote Likud. The Likud is a disaster that has retreated from more Jewish land than the openly leftist parties. For Feiglin to urge all Jews to vote Likud just so that he could get elected is very bad, in my view. Feiglin will be all by himself out of 30 or 40 Likud Knesset members. For people to vote Likud just because Feiglin is one of the candidates is a big mistake. The rest of the Likud Knesset members are the same old politicians who have failed the Jewish people repeatedly. Having Feiglin there as just one out of 30 or 40 of these Likud Knesset members will not protect Israel.
Well, that's my opinion.
Fabulous post, Chaim. Extremely well written (I don't know why you think you're not an excellent writer), full of pertinent information and politically savvy observations.
What I'd like to know (and perhaps this deserves a separate thread), is WHY HAS JTF BEEN SO STRANGELY SILENT ABOUT THE UPCOMING ISRAELI ELECTION ?
We are now less than two months away from the Feb 10, 2009 election day. JTF has had polls debating whether we should support Sarah Palin in an election she might not even run in, 4 years from now. Yet JTF has barely discussed the Israeli election or endorsed any candidate. This is odd.
On last week's ASK JTF, you were asked if Baruch Marzel was running and you replied that he was. Personally, I think Marzel is the candidate JTF should be endorsing. He's probably the most Kahanist candidate, and his party has some good ideas about revamping the Israeli election process to a more directly representational system.
I do understand there are reasons for you not to endorse Marzel. I remember the dispute you had when he denied receiving funds from JTF.
I understand why Feiglin's running within Likud makes it almost impossible to support him.
Perhaps Noam Federman is correct that it is useless to try to change the Israeli government from within the existing system.
Perhaps JTF doesn't want to get involved because of the legal ramifications of non-Israelis being prohibited from providing financial support to any candidate or party.
In any event, JTF's position on which candidates or parties are worthy of our support should be clarified. If we're not not mobilizing to support anyone, that's fine too. But we should have a clear position.
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Feiglin has been wrong on many things, but I don't think he is pure evil--he just thinks he needs to kiss up to the establishment.
In any case, Chaim has never said he is the answer, and certainly is not now. Let's just drop this.
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I don't know what exactly Mr Feiglin said about Dr. Goldstein but if he doesn't accept the unproven explanation of Goldstein receiving warning from the IDF about an imminent massacre, I think he is right to condemn Goldstein's action. The same goes to condemning Yigal Amir. Of course Goldstein and Amir killed evil people which wouldn't be missed, but their actions may have caused severe negative repercussions, for example, The expulsion of the Jews from the ancient city of Hebron was very nearly carried out due to the Goldstein's killings.
1. You mean the withdrawal from 97% of Chevron. The Jews were not expelled from the tiny section of Chevron where they live.
2. The withdrawal from 97% of Chevron by Pipi Netanyoyo was not because of what Dr. Goldstein did to the Arab Nazi terrorists. On the contrary, Dr. Goldstein's action prevented even more retreats from Judea and Samaria. In response to Dr. Goldstein, the Arab Nazis suspended the negotiations and there was a wave of Arab riots and Arab violence that made implementation of the Oslo surrender agreement much more difficult. The Israeli retreats that had already been agreed upon were delayed for long periods of time because of the Arab violence that followed Dr. Goldstein's action. Dr. Goldstein prevented major portions of Judea and Samaria from being handed over to the Arab Nazis.
3. You say that the IDF warnings about an imminent massacre are unproven. If you research it, you will find that there are witnesses who were friends and relatives of Dr. Goldstein, who attest to the fact that there was an imminent IDF warning of a massacre of Jews. So it is not unproven. Witnesses are proof, unless you believe that the friends and relatives of Dr. Goldstein are lying. If you knew these people, you would know that they are not liars.
4. Yitzchak Rabin and Syrian Nazi dictator Hafez al Assad were very close to an agreement on the Israeli surrender of the entire Golan Heights. If such an agreement would have been signed by Rabin and Assad, it would have been implemented even if Netanyahu had won the election in 1996. Because Netanyoyo said that he would carry out all signed agreements such as Oslo. So Israel would have surrendered the Golan Heights to Nazi Syria - an act of suicidal insanity. Yigal Amir stopped Rabin just before a final agreement was concluded.
I am not advocating that Jews go out and kill Arabs or that they assassinate self-hating Jewish leaders. I am a law-abiding, moderate, enlightened civil rights leader. And I do not want to be banned from running for the Knesset.
But I will never condemn Jews who give their lives to save the Jewish people. And if I ever become Prime Minister, I will honor all Jewish heroes, including the "politically incorrect" ones.
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You couldn't be more wrong. Chaim never "exposed" Feiglin unless by "expose" you mean calling him a good Jew, which Chaim has done countless times on his program. You have been proven wrong by those who quoted the interview, and/or heard it in Hebrew (Zelhar), and now your baseless hatred is showing itself.
Kahane Was Right, there is no need to attack DownwithIslam like this.
DownwithIslam, he is at least partly right though. Chaim has not attacked Feiglin. He has called him a good Jew who has unfortunately helped the Likud establishment.
Actually CF, there was plenty of reason for it. Because I was attacked by him to begin with. It is only fitting and proper that I respond in kind. I'm not going to lie down and take his inane attempts at abuse and insults without a retaliation, which he most certainly deserves (far worse than I gave him).
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If Chaim comes in here and explains that I am wrong about Feiglin, then I will admit defeat.
Just give this topic a rest for now--it's not cool to attack everyone you disagree with, especially before a statement from Chaim. Trust me here.
Kahnaewasrightbt unleashed the first personal attack in this thread. You can check the posts.
False.
You are quoted as having said "Your heinous"
First of all, it's you're, not "your," and secondly, that was what prompted me to ask, "who is heinous now...?" Oh the irony that you insult my reading skills.
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Kahnaewasrightbt unleashed the first personal attack in this thread. You can check the posts.
Yeah, and I told him off too.
Feiglin is not perfect, but he is better than any current Israeli politician. He has never said he is a Kahanist, and Chaim has always said that he disagrees with him on many things.
Chaimfan, I would support Avigdor Liberman over Feiglin simply because he can't demoralize the right wing as much if something should go wrong.
Avigdor Lieberman has already betrayed his promises to the public ie when he campaigned on the fact that he would never support any 2 state solution, but then once elected, actually came out and said he would support a two state solution with some settlements remaining Israeli...
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I don't know what exactly Mr Feiglin said about Dr. Goldstein but if he doesn't accept the unproven explanation of Goldstein receiving warning from the IDF about an imminent massacre, I think he is right to condemn Goldstein's action. The same goes to condemning Yigal Amir. Of course Goldstein and Amir killed evil people which wouldn't be missed, but their actions may have caused severe negative repercussions, for example, The expulsion of the Jews from the ancient city of Hebron was very nearly carried out due to the Goldstein's killings.
1. You mean the withdrawal from 97% of Chevron. The Jews were not expelled from the tiny section of Chevron where they live.
2. The withdrawal from 97% of Chevron by Pipi Netanyoyo was not because of what Dr. Goldstein did to the Arab Nazi terrorists. On the contrary, Dr. Goldstein's action prevented even more retreats from Judea and Samaria. In response to Dr. Goldstein, the Arab Nazis suspended the negotiations and there was a wave of Arab riots and Arab violence that made implementation of the Oslo surrender agreement much more difficult. The Israeli retreats that had already been agreed upon were delayed for long periods of time because of the Arab violence that followed Dr. Goldstein's action. Dr. Goldstein prevented major portions of Judea and Samaria from being handed over to the Arab Nazis.
3. You say that the IDF warnings about an imminent massacre are unproven. If you research it, you will find that there are witnesses who were friends and relatives of Dr. Goldstein, who attest to the fact that there was an imminent IDF warning of a massacre of Jews. So it is not unproven. Witnesses are proof, unless you believe that the friends and relatives of Dr. Goldstein are lying. If you knew these people, you would know that they are not liars.
4. Yitzchak Rabin and Syrian Nazi dictator Hafez al Assad were very close to an agreement on the Israeli surrender of the entire Golan Heights. If such an agreement would have been signed by Rabin and Assad, it would have been implemented even if Netanyahu had won the election in 1996. Because Netanyoyo said that he would carry out all signed agreements such as Oslo. So Israel would have surrendered the Golan Heights to Nazi Syria - an act of suicidal insanity. Yigal Amir stopped Rabin just before a final agreement was concluded.
I am not advocating that Jews go out and kill Arabs or that they assassinate self-hating Jewish leaders. I am a law-abiding, moderate, enlightened civil rights leader. And I do not want to be banned from running for the Knesset.
But I will never condemn Jews who give their lives to save the Jewish people. And if I ever become Prime Minister, I will honor all Jewish heroes, including the "politically incorrect" ones.
Chaim, I agree with you totally. Nothing about the actions of Yigal Amir and Dr. Baruch Goldstein are questionable at all. Both actions saved lives and certainly gave monsters, fitting endings. Yitzchak Rabin and the muzzies certainly deserved death. We don't need leaders such as Feiglin who condemn these noble acts. Now its debatable if Feiglin is even a lesser of the evils. Even if he claims to have policies more in line with kahanism, a sellout on his part would be devastating. Him selling out is a real possiblilty and he has shown a strong tendency to do so during his retarded Likud campaign.
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I don't know what exactly Mr Feiglin said about Dr. Goldstein but if he doesn't accept the unproven explanation of Goldstein receiving warning from the IDF about an imminent massacre, I think he is right to condemn Goldstein's action. The same goes to condemning Yigal Amir. Of course Goldstein and Amir killed evil people which wouldn't be missed, but their actions may have caused severe negative repercussions, for example, The expulsion of the Jews from the ancient city of Hebron was very nearly carried out due to the Goldstein's killings.
1. You mean the withdrawal from 97% of Chevron. The Jews were not expelled from the tiny section of Chevron where they live.
2. The withdrawal from 97% of Chevron by Pipi Netanyoyo was not because of what Dr. Goldstein did to the Arab Nazi terrorists. On the contrary, Dr. Goldstein's action prevented even more retreats from Judea and Samaria. In response to Dr. Goldstein, the Arab Nazis suspended the negotiations and there was a wave of Arab riots and Arab violence that made implementation of the Oslo surrender agreement much more difficult. The Israeli retreats that had already been agreed upon were delayed for long periods of time because of the Arab violence that followed Dr. Goldstein's action. Dr. Goldstein prevented major portions of Judea and Samaria from being handed over to the Arab Nazis.
Immediately After Goldstein's killings, The Israeli Government seriously considered to deport all Jews from Hebron. This is what I was referring to. Of course I know that it was Netanyahu who withrew from 97% of Hebron.
3. You say that the IDF warnings about an imminent massacre are unproven. If you research it, you will find that there are witnesses who were friends and relatives of Dr. Goldstein, who attest to the fact that there was an imminent IDF warning of a massacre of Jews. So it is not unproven. Witnesses are proof, unless you believe that the friends and relatives of Dr. Goldstein are lying. If you knew these people, you would know that they are not liars.
I think the whole area would be under curfew had the IDF been a aware of an imminent terrorist attack. I am sure that the friends of Dr. Goldteins are good people but I don't think they are incapable of lying or modifying the truth to defend their friend's heritage and reputation.
4. Yitzchak Rabin and Syrian Nazi dictator Hafez al Assad were very close to an agreement on the Israeli surrender of the entire Golan Heights. If such an agreement would have been signed by Rabin and Assad, it would have been implemented even if Netanyahu had won the election in 1996. Because Netanyoyo said that he would carry out all signed agreements such as Oslo. So Israel would have surrendered the Golan Heights to Nazi Syria - an act of suicidal insanity. Yigal Amir stopped Rabin just before a final agreement was concluded.
That is a valid reason I agree. I recall that the negotiations with Syria had been halted and were supposed to resume after the elections. I also think that because the assassination severely crippled the ability of the Israeli right to fight suicidal agreements. Basically any form of effective protest was made illegal in Israel due to this incident.
I am not advocating that Jews go out and kill Arabs or that they assassinate self-hating Jewish leaders. I am a law-abiding, moderate, enlightened civil rights leader. And I do not want to be banned from running for the Knesset.
But I will never condemn Jews who give their lives to save the Jewish people. And if I ever become Prime Minister, I will honor all Jewish heroes, including the "politically incorrect" ones.
Fair enough.