JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Dan Ben Noah on May 25, 2010, 06:21:26 AM
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Shalom
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:laugh: great.
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That made me laugh. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
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Man is she (Kagan) is ugly.
Added to Facebook.
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בס''ד
Thank you so much Dan! G-d bless you!
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She isn't very popular, and I've heard that she is Gay.
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Considering the following:
ot Lashon Hara Review: Part 3
I. Circumstances Under Which Speaking Lashon Hara is Permitted
In "Chafetz Chaim: A Lesson a Day" p. 132, Rabbi Yitzchak Berkowitz lists the major categories of constructive purposes for which Lashon Hara may be spoken:
1. To influence the subject to improve by discussing his faults with someone who can help him.
2. To prevent someone from being harmed by the subject, or help someone who was already harmed by the subject.
3. To help end a dispute between individuals which could escalate to the community level.
4. To help others learn from the subject's mistakes.
II. The Seven Conditions
Before speaking Lashon Hara for a constructive purpose, the following seven conditions must be met:
1. The information spoken must be completely true and witnessed or verified by the speaker. If it is impossible to verify the information yet necessary that it be passed on, the speaker must preface his remarks with a warning that the information is only hearsay and not definitely true.
2. The issue must be a problem (e.g. transgression, relevant character flaw or bad behavior) from an objective viewpoint, not merely a preference or sensitivity. (For example, if a store openly encourages shoppers to sample the new grape shipment, and someone takes a few grapes rather than exactly one, it would be incorrect to consider him "greedy" or "a thief.")
3. The speaker must first rebuke the subject directly, in a kind and gentle way which is likely to have an influence. (If the subject will not listen to any rebuke, or if trying to rebuke him can make the Lashon Hara ineffective, refer to ch. 10 in Hilchot Lashon Hara and ch. 9 in Hilchot Rechilut for the Chafetz Chaim's treatment of the subject.)
4. The information cannot be exaggerated or embellished, even if it's the only way to get the listener to heed the information.
5. The intention of the speaker must be purely to help in the situation, not to degrade the subject or cause him shame.
6. If the constructive purpose intended by the speaker can be achieved in a way other than speaking Lashon Hara, the speaker should resort to that other method.
7. Any damage that is caused to the subject as a result of the Lashon Hara should not exceed that which would be decreed by a Beit Din (Jewish court) if the case were reviewed there. This is difficult to evaluate, so that situations that impact the livelihood or other areas of the subject should be referred to a Beit Din.
When someone either speaks or requests Lashon Hara for constructive purposes, they should state the constructive purpose. Otherwise, the other party in the conversation will think they are speaking Lashon Hara without any halachic justification.
Also, it would be foolish to include the subject's enemies in a constructive discussion. Not only would they be unlikely to have truly constructive intentions in handling the information, but hey might also add false or exaggerated information to the con versation due to their strong feelings against the subject.
Finally, it is important to think about the listener of the Lashon Hara. It is forbidden for the listener to believe or accept the information as true; they can only suspect the information in order to take proper precautions or to bring the issue to a Beit Din for resolution. Also, it would be forbidden for the listener to carelessly circulate the Lashon Hara out of anger or disgust, since that would violate condition (5) above. When possible, the speaker should preface his remarks with instructions reflecting these concerns; if the listener would not heed such instructions, the speaker should consult his Rabbinic authority before relating the Lashon Hara.
III. Additional Guidelines for Speaking Lashon Hara
When someone either speaks or requests Lashon Hara for constructive purposes, they should state the constructive purpose. Otherwise, the other party in the conversation will think they are speaking Lashon Hara without any halachic justification.
Also, it would be foolish to include the subject's enemies in a constructive discussion. Not only would they be unlikely to have truly constructive intentions in handling the information, but hey might also add false or exaggerated information to the con versation due to their strong feelings against the subject.
Finally, it is important to think about the listener of the Lashon Hara. It is forbidden for the listener to believe or accept the information as true; they can only suspect the information in order to take proper precautions or to bring the issue to a Beit Din for resolution. Also, it would be forbidden for the listener to carelessly circulate the Lashon Hara out of anger or disgust, since that would violate condition 5, to have purely constructive intent. When possible, the speaker should preface his remarks with instructions reflecting these concerns; if the listener would not heed such instructions, the speaker should consult a Rabbi.
How do you justify discussing Elana Kagan's sexuality?????
What happened to your TOS????
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Frum Yid,
I think the forum in general is using less virulent words for people who are gay than in the past, EXCEPT in the case of people who are seen to be enemies of America and the Jewish people. I think people on the forum are concerned that Kagan will be one of these enemies. I havent read enough about her to know myself, but from what I have seen she seems like a very far out Leftist.
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Frum Yid,
I think the forum in general is using less virulent words for people who are gay than in the past, EXCEPT in the case of people who are seen to be enemies of America and the Jewish people. I think people on the forum are concerned that Kagan will be one of these enemies. I havent read enough about her to know myself, but from what I have seen she seems like a very far out Leftist.
I can't argue that point, because I look at her from a jurisprudential rather than political pov. However, I'm not even discussing the question of how this forum responds to gays. I am responding to the fact that NO ONE KNOWS IF SHE IS GAY. the people who are attacking her are simply using rumor as a subterfuge. That, as far as I understand, is Lashon Hara.
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frumyid: "the people who are attacking her are simply using rumor as a subterfuge. That, as far as I understand, is Lashon Hara."
What, to your understanding, is just plain being butt ugly and looking like a carpet munching hippopotamus?
Will that do?
They're gonna' have to take out extra insurance on the "bench" she sits on because of the weight damage! :::D
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frumyid: "the people who are attacking her are simply using rumor as a subterfuge. That, as far as I understand, is Lashon Hara."
What, to your understanding, is just plain being butt ugly and looking like a carpet munching hippopotamus?
Will that do?
They're gonna' have to take out extra insurance on the "bench" she sits on because of the weight damage! :::D
If you keep this up, they're going to make you repeat kindergarten again. go take your ritalin like a good boy, and while you're at it, convert to christianity so we won't have to be embarrassed by you any more. Sick puck.
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frumyid: "while you're at it, convert to christianity so we won't have to be embarrassed by you any more. Sick puck."
You won't have to be embarrassed by me anymore.
But you won't have to be embarrassed by me any less !
;D :::D
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Dan, thanks for uploading the video and to Chaim for his excellent commentary. I gladly saved this video to my ZooTube Favorites.
It's imperative that ALL 41 Republican Senators oppose Elena Kagan in the process to attempt to confirm her to the U.S. Supreme Court. Already, the hideous beast Barack Hussein Obama was able to get Sonia Sotomayor on to the U.S. Supreme Court, in large part because of political correctness. In reality, Sonia Sotomayor is a non-Muslim version of BHO.
Thankfully, Arlen Specter was defeated in the Pennsylvania " Democrat " Party Primary. G-d Willing, Pat Toomey will be elected to the U.S. Senate in November. How great would it be if it turns out Joe Sestak, Toomey's opponent in the PA. U.S. Senate Race, was the individual who brought down the reign of terror--- also known as Barack Hussein Obama's occupation of the oval office!
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In this audio, Jewish Task Force chairman Chaim Ben Pesach discusses what a disaster it is for self-hating Jews like the lesbian Elena Kagan to hold positions of power in non-Jewish nations. They always sell out their own people and bend over backwards for the enemies of the Jewish people just to show how impartial they are. Elena Kagan, who is about as kosher as a McDonald's menu, has spent her whole life trying to spit in the eye of her own Creator by supporting leftist causes. And now as Barack Hussein Osama's tool, she will be screwing her own people as much as she screws other women. Join JTF to help wake people up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYQiJA7L9-I
:::D :::D
Excellent & funny commentary