JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: TheCoon on March 28, 2011, 08:46:29 AM
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I was amazed to find out that Libya is hardly a third-world country. In fact, it is in better shape economically than most countries in the muslim world. Although unemployment is high, they have low poverty by comparison. They have 82% literacy and a life expectancy of 74.2 years. They have a GDP per capita of 14000 dollars. In comparison, the average Libyan has a higher GDP per capita than the average Mexican, Turk, Brazilian(Obama's new economic power partner), Venezuelan, Serb, Chinese, Egyptian, among many others. The average Libyan is richer than any other arab in North Africa and nearly every other muslim on the planet per capita, with the exception of tiny oil-rich states like Qatar or Kuwait with many ultra-rich individuals.
Why bring this up? If you listen to the US media like CNN, ABC, NBC, etc, you wouldn't hear any of these facts. You would think Libya is a nightmarish hellhole where everyone is dirt poor and kept under Gaddafi's boot. This simply is not the case. As you can see, the average Libyan is hardly a dirt-poor uneducated savage living in squalor. So what is it that is driving this "rebellion" against Gaddafi, who as you can see has not been the vicious tyrant many make him out to be? I was stunned to find out many things Louis Farrakhan said about Gaddafi are true! He has put a lot of his country's money into building it up and making it one of the better countries Africa and the muslim world. Gaddafi has been a model leader for the muslim world in terms of enriching his people.
Now back to what is driving the rebellion. Why are his people so angry if they have it so well comparatively to their muslim brethren in Egypt, Tunisia and everywhere else. Well it is quite clear why. Gaddafi has been a bad muslim. He gave up Libya's weapons of mass destruction in return for economic growth that helped the people. He is not openly calling to destroy America and the Jews. He is simply not muslim enough for his population. CNN recently did a report on a man in Libya who sparked the fall of Gaddafi's forces in Benghazi which is now the capital of the "rebels". How did this muslim man do this? He packed his car with explosives and rammed Gaddafi's main barracks, blowing a hole in the gate killing himself and many soldiers with him. He was a suicide bomber. The heroes of the "rebellion" are muslim nazi terrorists. The same ones who blew up Jews on buses and Americans on 9/11. Muslims. The Libyan people are telling the world they want to go back to the dark ages of islam.
The sad truth is that while America and its allies are devastating one of the only muslim countries that isn't a hellish nightmare, they're also proving again that islam won't allow for any progress or enriching of its people. It only allows for darkness. We can only hope that when "democracy" comes to Libya that whichever muslim nazi tyrant the Libyans chose doesn't immediately lead to Jews or Americans being killed.
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If you didn't see the video, take a look:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuCC2GA9RHc&feature=player_embedded
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Some foreign oil concessions in Libya to UK,USA,FRA,ITA,SPA are going to be over in one or two years. Contracts of usage will terminate and there won't be another contracts. And that's a reason too for starting the aggression.
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how many people live in libya compared to those other countries listed?
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Like any other Arab Muslim country........
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Like any other Arab Muslim country........
Problem is, Gaddafi has been outright benevolent compared to other muslim leaders around the world.
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Problem is, Gaddafi has been outright benevolent compared to other muslim leaders around the world.
yeah, I'm afraid you're right...
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There are also riots in Bahrain which is one of the wealthiest countries in the world. Libya is immensely rich in oild and gas and quite possibly in many other natural resource while its population is under 7 million (citizens only, excluding foreign workers).
And BTW, Libya should have been much wealthier and it would have been had Qaddafi not put it under isolation in for 20 years because of his terror attacks.
http://www.indexmundi.com/libya/gdp_per_capita_%28ppp%29.html
As this chart shows, Libya had a GDP per capita edging 14,000$ back in 1980 !
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Some foreign oil concessions in Libya to UK,USA,FRA,ITA,SPA are going to be over in one or two years. Contracts of usage will terminate and there won't be another contracts. And that's a reason too for starting the aggression.
Great video...facts are facts....
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Interesting info.
nazis killing nazis and US sending in help to fight the libyan street's war. Stupid.
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"Unarmed civilians" on the run:
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/03/30/article-1371595-0B6884FB00000578-565_964x468.jpg
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/03/30/article-1371595-0B68843F00000578-957_964x537.jpg
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/03/30/article-1371595-0B67A0E400000578-345_964x656.jpg
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We should hope Gaddafi wins and takes bloody revenge on Benghazi.
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Some foreign oil concessions in Libya to UK,USA,FRA,ITA,SPA are going to be over in one or two years. Contracts of usage will terminate and there won't be another contracts. And that's a reason too for starting the aggression.
I think it was Trump who stated that China gets oil from Libya, not the US.
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"Collateral damage"(children) caused by the US-NATO bombing. This is the same as it was in Serbia.
NATO is the biggest terrorist organization in the world.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mriZODpY2Gw&feature=player_embedded#at=780
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Nato is unreliable, but no sides can be taken in war between Gaddafi Vs Libyan muslamic peoples democrats of AQ - Hamas and Hizbulla.
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It looks as if NATO is not as eager to aid the rebels and bombings have been lessened. This is good news. Maybe they aren't so keen to advance the Obama pro-muslim al Qaeda position. We can only hope Gaddafi takes this advantage and stamps them out.
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EU announced starting the EUFOR Libya. It means EU is going to bring Al Qaeda on power with their own armies.
Once more, modern Babylonian Empire(EU) shows its face.
http://www.consilium.europa.eu/uedocs/cms_data/docs/pressdata/EN/foraff/121237.pdf
Just to remind... In Bosnia there is also EUFOR army.
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America's true reason for attacking Libya becomes clear with new central bank
http://www.examiner.com/finance-examiner-in-national/america-s-true-reason-for-attacking-libya-becomes-clear-with-new-central-bank
America's true reason for intervention, and missile attacks against Libya has become very clear today with a sudden creation by the rebels of a new central bank on March 29th.
The rebels in Libya are in the middle of a life or death civil war and Moammar Gadhafi is still in power and yet somehow the Libyan rebels have had enough time to establish a new Central Bank of Libya and form a new national oil company. Perhaps when this conflict is over those rebels can become time management consultants. They sure do get a lot done. What a skilled bunch of rebels - they can fight a war during the day and draw up a new central bank and a new national oil company at night without any outside help whatsoever. If only the rest of us were so versatile! But isn't forming a central bank something that could be done after the civil war is over? According to Bloomberg, the Transitional National Council has "designated the Central Bank of Benghazi as a monetary authority competent in monetary policies in Libya and the appointment of a governor to the Central Bank of Libya, with a temporary headquarters in Benghazi." – The Economic Collapse via Uruknet
Libya has been one of the last nations in the world that had its own state run banking system, and control over its own money supply. By having this system in place, they could demand oil purchases from their oil fields to be made in Lybyan Dinar, and not the US Dollar. It also means that Libya has ensured themselves a stable economy, with little inflation and currency devaluing as most of the industrialized world has under private central banks.
The parallels for both European and US intervention now in Libya is very reminiscent to why the United States attacked Iraq in 2003. Six months before the US moved into Iraq to take down Saddam Hussein, the oil nation had made the move to accept Euro's instead of dollars for oil, and this became a threat to the global dominance of the dollar as the reserve currency, and its dominion as the petrodollar.
The American people were given the lie that there were weapons of mass destruction (WMD), and that there were Al Quida training bases in the Arab state, both of which were proven to be false. No, these were false flags given by the government to try to justify a punishment on Iraq for moving away from dollars as payment for oil.
To be able to create a new central bank under the blueprint that is used by Western powers in less than two weeks by the rebels gives vast credence that the rebellion itself in Libya was initiated by outside forces, and not over demands by the citizens of Libya for social reform. This plan was put in place by the world's game changers who want complete global control over oil and economic systems.
It did not take long before we discovered the real reason why America chose to intervene and attack Libya, and not any of the other nations in the Middle East that are going through internal rebellion. The rebels creation of a central bank, coupled with the United Nations report two days ago that there would be no sanctions on the selling of oil by the rebels who control certain fields and refineries, proves that this war is not about human rights, but about punishment for a nation that refused to give up its sovereignty to the global banking and oil cabals.
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http://www.alternet.org/story/150470/us-saudi_deal_on_libya_exposed:_obama_ok%27ed_bahrain_invasion_in_exchange_for_%27yes%27_vote_on_%22no-fly_zone%22?akid=6779.234851.GW6SVV&rd=1&t=21
US-Saudi Deal on Libya Exposed: Obama OK'ed Bahrain Invasion in Exchange for 'Yes' Vote on "No-Fly Zone"
First there was the great 2011 Arab revolt. Then, inexorably, came the US-Saudi counter-revolution.
April 1, 2011
You invade Bahrain. We take out Muammar Gaddafi in Libya. This, in short, is the essence of a deal struck between the Barack Obama administration and the House of Saud. Two diplomatic sources at the United Nations independently confirmed that Washington, via Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, gave the go-ahead for Saudi Arabia to invade Bahrain and crush the pro-democracy movement in their neighbor in exchange for a "yes" vote by the Arab League for a no-fly zone over Libya - the main rationale that led to United Nations Security Council resolution 1973.
The revelation came from two different diplomats, a European and a member of the BRIC group, and was made separately to a US scholar and Asia Times Online. According to diplomatic protocol, their names cannot be disclosed. One of the diplomats said, "This is the reason why we could not support resolution 1973. We were arguing that Libya, Bahrain and Yemen were similar cases, and calling for a fact-finding mission. We maintain our official position that the resolution is not clear, and may be interpreted in a belligerent manner."
As Asia Times Online has reported, a full Arab League endorsement of a no-fly zone is a myth. Of the 22 full members, only 11 were present at the voting. Six of them were Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) members, the US-supported club of Gulf kingdoms/sheikhdoms, of which Saudi Arabia is the top dog. Syria and Algeria were against it. Saudi Arabia only had to "seduce" three other members to get the vote.
Translation: only nine out of 22 members of the Arab League voted for the no-fly zone. The vote was essentially a House of Saud-led operation, with Arab League secretary general Amr Moussa keen to polish his CV with Washington with an eye to become the next Egyptian President.
Thus, in the beginning, there was the great 2011 Arab revolt. Then, inexorably, came the US-Saudi counter-revolution.
Profiteers rejoice
Humanitarian imperialists will spin en masse this is a "conspiracy", as they have been spinning the bombing of Libya prevented a hypothetical massacre in Benghazi. They will be defending the House of Saud - saying it acted to squash Iranian subversion in the Gulf; obviously R2P - "responsibility to protect" does not apply to people in Bahrain. They will be heavily promoting post-Gaddafi Libya as a new - oily - human rights Mecca, complete with US intelligence assets, black ops, special forces and dodgy contractors.
Whatever they say won't alter the facts on the ground - the graphic results of the US-Saudi dirty dancing. Asia Times Online has already reported on who profits from the foreign intervention in Libya (see There's no business like war business, March 30). Players include the Pentagon (via Africom), the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), Saudi Arabia, the Arab League's Moussa, and Qatar. Add to the list the al-Khalifa dynasty in Bahrain, assorted weapons contractors, and the usual neo-liberal suspects eager to privatize everything in sight in the new Libya - even the water. And we're not even talking about the Western vultures hovering over the Libyan oil and gas industry.
Exposed, above all, is the astonishing hypocrisy of the Obama administration, selling a crass geopolitical coup involving northern Africa and the Persian Gulf as a humanitarian operation. As for the fact of another US war on a Muslim nation, that's just a "kinetic military action".
There's been wide speculation in both the US and across the Middle East that considering the military stalemate - and short of the "coalition of the willing" bombing the Gaddafi family to oblivion - Washington, London and Paris might settle for the control of eastern Libya; a northern African version of an oil-rich Gulf Emirate. Gaddafi would be left with a starving North Korea-style Tripolitania.
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Sometimes facts are stranger than the fictions.
;D
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Gaddafi how so much considered to be a brainless, somehow understood in advance that the entrapment of Nato within Libya may be applauded by the whole world on one pretext or the other.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fUxVgxj0vc&feature=player_embedded
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Libyan army entering Benghazi. The rebels are loosing:
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1953106788415&oid=187117224643451&comments
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Libyan army entering Benghazi. The rebels are loosing:
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1953106788415&oid=187117224643451&comments
NOOOOO!! let it go on until no Arab is in less than million pieces!
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NOOOOO!! let it go on until no Arab is in less than million pieces!
But Ron don't you see that if the rebals start to lose, Obongo will launch more missiles in their favour to continue the bloodshed.
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Kerber - who is the wench in the video? She's a pro-Libya and pro-Gaddafi apologist. She claims in the video that Libya had nothing to do with Lockerbie bombing! For crying out loud
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Kerber - who is the wench in the video? She's a pro-Libya and pro-Gaddafi apologist. She claims in the video that Libya had nothing to do with Lockerbie bombing! For crying out loud
I don't know who she is. I saw the woman for the first time. It says she is a journalist.
But, I didn't pay attention who she is, only to hear a little bit of different opinion and a certain facts about oil companies.
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The ideal situation shall be that intensive infighting to be continued till none of them is left. To make this possible, all others shall be free to support or not to support any or both of the sides on any grounds they feel justified.
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Hi Kahane-Was-Right BT
she might be right on this subject that libya had nothing to do with the bombing,here are a few interesting facts:
1.the finding of the intelligence community has been pointing a strong connection of a terror oraganization called Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine-General Command headed by Ahmed Jibril,and guess who hired him? Iran.
2.the only "real" supposedly investigation link to libyia was a delay clock mechanism ,swiss made,that could have been bought by any terror organization in the world.very fragile proof about libyan connection.
3.although libya paid to the families of the victims there was never took responsibility officially.
4.from 2 supposedly suspects ,one was quickly released and was not found connected to the scene,the second one was found guilty ,but....app a year ago he was released from prison because of health problems and went back to libyia . trust me,no european country would have released a mass murder of this caliber completely free because of supposedly "health problems" ,they are quietly but clearly admit they got the wrong man here.
what was the interest of libya to bomb the plain anyway?libya is more of a secular state rather a fundamentalist leadership if you oppose it against other muslim countries. maybe again ,its the oil that driving everyone nuts here.
something is absolutely fishy about all of this and also smells like a political plot against libya.
although i am not a supporter of gaddafi ,i know his "style" and this bombing is certainly not his style .he is an extravagant man that is proud of all his deeds and when he is doing something he wants the hole world to know that and not to hide that and deny he had done it.on the other hand ,it is exactly the style of all so called "free palesitne" fundamentalist movements that kills with no mercy .
think about it and check the new revealed facts.
Regards
relentless partisan
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T32Z5mBPCpo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T32Z5mBPCpo)
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Please 'Relentless Partisan'
Do not attempt to revise history. Libya accepted responsibility for the attack. And Libya was also responsible for several other Terrorist attacks against America and its interests. I hate Gaddafi and want to see him dead.
More information is coming out concerning Gadaffis own orders to down the Pan Am plane.
I don't believe your conspiracy white-wash...
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/politics/gaddafi-henchman-ready-to-tell-all-about-lockerbie-1.1094217?localLinksEnabled=false
http://english.ruvr.ru/2011/04/06/48550980.html
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-04-01/ex-qaddafi-spy-chief-koussa-may-share-many-valuable-secrets.html
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My brother had a class-mate who died in the Lockerbie bombing... I went to Highschool with two of the victims {although I did not know them}.... I want to see justice...
http://www.stamfordadvocate.com/news/article/Parents-of-Stamford-students-killed-in-Lockerbie-6571.php
And several years later my brother was a victim of Al Queda when he died in the WTC on 9/11...
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Hi Kahane-Was-Right BT
she might be right on this subject that libya had nothing to do with the bombing,here are a few interesting facts:
1.the finding of the intelligence community has been pointing a strong connection of a terror oraganization called Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine-General Command headed by Ahmed Jibril,and guess who hired him? Iran.
you can read a few facts about it here: http://www.serendipity.li/more/lockerb.htm (http://www.serendipity.li/more/lockerb.htm) very interesting
2.the only "real" supposedly investigation link to libyia was a delay clock mechanism ,swiss made,that could have been bought by any terror organization in the world.very fragile proof about libyan connection.
3.although libya paid to the families of the victims there was never took responsibility officially.
4.from 2 supposedly suspects ,one was quickly released and was not found connected to the scene,the second one was found guilty ,but....app a year ago he was released from prison because of health problems and went back to libyia . trust me,no european country would have released a mass murder of this caliber completely free because of supposedly "health problems" ,they are quietly but clearly admit they got the wrong man here.
what was the interest of libya to bomb the plain anyway?libya is more of a secular state rather a fundamentalist leadership if you oppose it against other muslim countries. maybe again ,its the oil that driving everyone nuts here.
something is absolutely fishy about all of this and also smells like a political plot against libya.
although i am not a supporter of gaddafi ,i know his "style" and this bombing is certainly not his style .he is an extravagant man that is proud of all his deeds and when he is doing something he wants the hole world to know that and not to hide that and deny he had done it.on the other hand ,it is exactly the style of all so called "free palesitne" fundamentalist movements that kills with no mercy .
think about it and check the new revealed facts.
Regards
relentless partisan
Are you aware that you are quoting from and promoting a site ("serendipity") that prides itself in being anti-zionist and anti-capitalist ?
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Ok .
i have the feeling you think I'm not against terror and people who commit this crimes and that is simply not true.
don't forget that everyday now we see seniors from Libya that are corrupted and whiling to do anything for the buck,and tell reporters everything they want to hear.
i also didn't release Abdelbaset al-Megrahi from prison in 2009 and send him back to Libya ,it was the Cabinet Secretary for Justice in Scotland.
all i am saying is: think twice before you buy all the media is feeding us.
i would be glad to see justice being done ,but not self-justification that covers self interest behind it of either a western or an eastern country.
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Are you aware that you are quoting from and promoting a site ("serendipity") that prides itself in being anti-zionist and anti-capitalist ?
I think this user is the troll Ben M.
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Thank you Yaakov Mendel ,i've seen these in different sites not only this one.
anyway,i deleted the link just exterminating the existence of a site like this ,you can do the same in your reply to me.
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i know I'm a newbie and might do some mistakes with you guys ,and if i post my thoughts i might be your punch-bag.
if you have a logic FACTS to convince me i am wrong i would be happy to here them ,I'm not(G_d forbid) a supporter of any Arab organization.
answer with patient ,i am willing and waiting to listen to the truth,only the truth.
anyways,I'm glad this site is alive and kicking.
Relentless Partisan
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Please 'Relentless Partisan'
Do not attempt to revise history. Libya accepted responsibility for the attack. And Libya was also responsible for several other Terrorist attacks against America and its interests. I hate Gaddafi and want to see him dead.
More information is coming out concerning Gadaffis own orders to down the Pan Am plane.
I don't believe your conspiracy white-wash...
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/politics/gaddafi-henchman-ready-to-tell-all-about-lockerbie-1.1094217?localLinksEnabled=false
http://english.ruvr.ru/2011/04/06/48550980.html
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-04-01/ex-qaddafi-spy-chief-koussa-may-share-many-valuable-secrets.html
When the justice is going to come to USA and its fascist regimes?
We want to see the justice, too.
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think about it this way:if all of this is true(the Jibril and Iran connection to Lockerbie) it will be a very good jumping start for justifiably attacking Iran for its nuclear weapons together along with its bad public opinion that will rise from this issue.
especially instead of the waist of time of the western forces intervention in the Libyan strugle.
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4.from 2 supposedly suspects ,one was quickly released and was not found connected to the scene,the second one was found guilty ,but....app a year ago he was released from prison because of health problems and went back to libyia . trust me,no european country would have released a mass murder of this caliber completely free because of supposedly "health problems" ,they are quietly but clearly admit they got the wrong man here.
LOL !
LOL LOL LOL!
This looks like "circular illogic."
No european country would ever release the lockerbie bomber early if he was really guilty, therefore when they did release him, you should conclude that he wasn't guilty!? Wow, is this the twilight zone?
BTW, he is no longer called "suspect" after he has been CONVICTED of the crime.
what was the interest of libya to bomb the plain anyway?libya is more of a secular state rather a fundamentalist leadership if you oppose it against other muslim countries.
Come on, you can't be this stupid. Are you trying to poke fun at me?
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The pro-government forces have won most major batles and are pushing the rebels back. That being said the rebellion is far from over maybe the rebels will reestablish themselves and halt the advance.