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Israel => Save Israel => Topic started by: mord on June 18, 2007, 11:02:20 AM
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Jun. 18, 2007 13:18 | Updated Jun. 18, 2007 13:24
Gaza's Christians fear for their lives
By KHALED ABU TOAMEH
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Christians living in Gaza City on Monday appealed to the international community to protect them against increased attacks by Muslim extremists. Many Christians said they were prepared to leave the Gaza Strip as soon as the border crossings are reopened.
The appeal came following a series of attacks on a Christian school and church in Gaza City over the past few days.
Father Manuel Musalam, leader of the small Latin community in the Gaza Strip, said masked gunmen torched and looted the Rosary Sisters School and the Latin Church.
"The masked gunmen used rocket-propelled grenades to storm the main entrances of the school and church," he said. "Then they destroyed almost everything inside, including the Cross, the Holy Book, computers and other equipment."
Musalam expressed outrage over the burning of copies of the Bible, noting that the gunmen destroyed all the Crosses inside the church and school. "Those who did these awful things have no respect for Christian-Muslim relations," he said.
He estimated damages at more than $500,000. "Those who see the destruction will realize how bad this attack was," he said. "Christians have been living in peace and security with Muslims for many years, but those who attacked us are trying to sabotage this relationship."
He said Palestinian Authority Chairman Mahmoud Abbas phoned him on Sunday night to express his strong condemnation for the attack. "President Abbas promised that he would do his utmost to prevent such attacks on Christians here," he said.
Fatah officials blamed Hamas militiamen for the attack on the church and school. However, Islam Shahwan, spokesman for Hamas's Executive Force in the Gaza Strip, denied responsibility.
He nevertheless admitted that a large group of Hamas militiamen had been near the area during the attack. "We have instructed all our men to withdraw from the area," he said. "We will punish anyone who targets churches and public institutions."Print Subscribe
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Sand ape christians are NOT real christians. They don't read or acknowledge the Hebrew bible (1st testament) so as not to offend moslem sand apes and they preach that jesus was a pallestinian arab!
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I feel sorry for the Christians. One solution would be to send them to Egypt. Another - to exchange them for muslims. That is to say, for every Christian Arab refugee who is granted a political asylum in Israel, a muslim arab should be expelled.
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Sounds good to me
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Sand ape christians are NOT real christians. They don't read or acknowledge the Hebrew bible (1st testament) so as not to offend moslem sand apes and they preach that jesus was a pallestinian arab!
They could be re-educated in special re-education camps. Differentiating between muslims and Christians could be a good PR for Israel. It will show that Israelis are not racists, they are against islam.
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Yes
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Yes
If christian arabs havn't worked out that they'd be 400 times better off living under jewish rule than moslem sand ape rule they must all have a screw loose!
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These same Christian Arabs have been supporting Arab terrorism for atleast 80 years.
I do feel bad for them but hey, YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW.
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Those types of Christians don't seem legit to me. Besides the pastor said that "These people have no regard for Muslim-Christian relation." He was inferring that the Muslim religion is peaceful and these are just a few extremists. I am sure they could of left long ago.
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These same Christian Arabs have been supporting Arab terrorism for atleast 80 years.
I do feel bad for them but hey, YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW.
Or to put it another way.....they've [censored] in their bed, let 'em lie in it!
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These same Christian Arabs have been supporting Arab terrorism for atleast 80 years.
I do feel bad for them but hey, YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW.
I do see what you and others say. However, here is my concern. If these Christian Arabs are not helped, they will be forcibly converted to islam (those of them who are not killed). I really don't like this prospect. In fact, it really scares me that on the big scale of things, islam speards and grown while Christianity retreats. I think that this trend should be checked, and the disappearance of Christians living among muslims should be stopped.
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These same Christian Arabs have been supporting Arab terrorism for atleast 80 years.
I do feel bad for them but hey, YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW.
I do see what you and others say. However, here is my concern. If these Christian Arabs are not helped, they will be forcibly converted to islam (those of them who are not killed). I really don't like this prospect. In fact, it really scares me that on the big scale of things, islam speards and grown while Christianity retreats. I think that this trend should be checked, and the disappearance of Christians living among muslims should be stopped.
Good point
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Sand ape christians are NOT real christians. They don't read or acknowledge the Hebrew bible (1st testament) so as not to offend moslem sand apes and they preach that jesus was a pallestinian arab!
Who the [deleted] are to say who's a Christian and who's not? When Christians are a tiny minority amongst savage muslims they either have to toe the line or be slaughtered. I'd love to see you be part of a tiny Jewish minority living with muslims and call all the muslims animals and savages. They'd kill you in a second. Chaim has made this point. A lot of Christian Arabs are anti-Israel B.C.E. the muslims will slaughter them if they aren't. In Lebanon we see the Christian Arabs are a large minority and their support for Israel is comparable to any white European nation.
The arab Christians you see who are anti-Israel are generally socialists like the whites in Europe who hate Israel. I know from viewing Lebanese websites, the Christians there who hated Israel literally were pro-communist or far-left socialist and didn't have any faith.
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Many Christian arabs are pro-Israel when they leave Beth lechem many speak up against the moslems
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Sand ape christians are NOT real christians. They don't read or acknowledge the Hebrew bible (1st testament) so as not to offend moslem sand apes and they preach that jesus was a pallestinian arab!
Who the [deleted] are to say who's a Christian and who's not? When Christians are a tiny minority amongst savage muslims they either have to toe the line or be slaughtered. I'd love to see you be part of a tiny Jewish minority living with muslims and call all the muslims animals and savages. They'd kill you in a second. Chaim has made this point. A lot of Christian Arabs are anti-Israel B.C.E. the muslims will slaughter them if they aren't. In Lebanon we see the Christian Arabs are a large minority and their support for Israel is comparable to any white European nation.
The arab Christians you see who are anti-Israel are generally socialists like the whites in Europe who hate Israel. I know from viewing Lebanese websites, the Christians there who hated Israel literally were pro-communist or far-left socialist and didn't have any faith.
Now the Lebanes Christians want to be our friend, but for many years you wouldnt find more hardcore Jew haters then the Lebanese Christians. I say we shouldnt let in a single Arab Muslim or Christian, those who arent Muslims are still mostly Jew haters, and we bear them no obligation.
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Sand ape christians are NOT real christians. They don't read or acknowledge the Hebrew bible (1st testament) so as not to offend moslem sand apes and they preach that jesus was a pallestinian arab!
Who the [deleted] are to say who's a Christian and who's not? When Christians are a tiny minority amongst savage muslims they either have to toe the line or be slaughtered. I'd love to see you be part of a tiny Jewish minority living with muslims and call all the muslims animals and savages. They'd kill you in a second. Chaim has made this point. A lot of Christian Arabs are anti-Israel B.C.E. the muslims will slaughter them if they aren't. In Lebanon we see the Christian Arabs are a large minority and their support for Israel is comparable to any white European nation.
The arab Christians you see who are anti-Israel are generally socialists like the whites in Europe who hate Israel. I know from viewing Lebanese websites, the Christians there who hated Israel literally were pro-communist or far-left socialist and didn't have any faith.
Now the Lebanes Christians want to be our friend, but for many years you wouldnt find more hardcore Jew haters then the Lebanese Christians. I say we shouldnt let in a single Arab Muslim or Christian, those who arent Muslims are still mostly Jew haters, and we bear them no obligation.
good point too
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Gee, I'm shocked kahaneloyalist wants to exclude Christians. ::)
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Why should we halp to christian thet want us dead?
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How many of these are real Christians? ::) Twenty bucks says 80% or more of them are Muslims in everything but name.
Are they being persecuted by Muslim Nazis? Absolutely. But most of these so-called believers were in the streets with yellow and green hair last summer just the same as they were, and (at least outwardly) call for the extermination of Jews just as loudly as they do.
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Who the [deleted] are to say who's a Christian and who's not?
That is manifestly true. I always cringe when Chaim says “ these people aren’t real Christians, those people aren’t real Christians.”
It is not the place of a Jew to determine who is and who is not a christian.
I would be pissed as hell if Christians walked around declaring who was and who was not a Jew. So I think Jews should just consider anyone who declares himself to be a Christian to be one.
When Christians are a tiny minority amongst savage muslims they either have to toe the line or be slaughtered. I'd love to see you be part of a tiny Jewish minority living with muslims and call all the muslims animals and savages. They'd kill you in a second. Chaim has made this point.
True, but they don’t have to be actively involved in terrorist attacks on Jews in order to save their own lives as PFLP and DFLP did. These two terrorist groups were majority Christian and run by only Christians.
A lot of Christian Arabs are anti-Israel B.C.E. the muslims will slaughter them if they aren't. In Lebanon we see the Christian Arabs are a large minority and their support for Israel is comparable to any white European nation.
Bullcrap. Have you even met a Christian Lebanese? Most of them are anti-Israel and consider pro-Israel Arab Christians as traitors and rightfully so.
The arab Christians you see who are anti-Israel are generally socialists like the whites in Europe who hate Israel. I know from viewing Lebanese websites, the Christians there who hated Israel literally were pro-communist or far-left socialist and didn't have any faith.
I don’t know what correlation you see between Christian faith and supporting Israel.
Pat Buchanan is a very faithful believing Christian and he hates Israel with a passion.
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an arab is an arab irregarlus of religion.
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Pat Buchanan is a very faithful believing Christian and he hates Israel with a passion.
Bull-crud. He is a Catholic Nazi whose heart actually lies with Odinism. He admires Hitler and German Nazis and is about as Christian as Sheik Nasrallah.
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I would be pissed as hell if Christians walked around declaring who was and who was not a Jew. So I think Jews should just consider anyone who declares himself to be a Christian to be one.
Judea, I know where you come from, but do you consider Neturei Karta members to be Jews? They certainly call themselves such. Do you consider Spielberg a Jew? Tzipi Livni? Tali Fahima?
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Bullcrap. Have you even met a Christian Lebanese? Most of them are anti-Israel and consider pro-Israel Arab Christians as traitors and rightfully so.
I acknowledged such in my original post in this thread, but what do Lebanese Muslims-in-all-but-name have to do with American or other Christians?
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I would be pissed as hell if Christians walked around declaring who was and who was not a Jew. So I think Jews should just consider anyone who declares himself to be a Christian to be one.
Judea, I know where you come from, but do you consider Neturei Karta members to be Jews? They certainly call themselves such. Do you consider Spielberg a Jew? Tzipi Livni? Tali Fahima?
Of course they are Jews. My Rabbi said that he believes that their ancestors were raped by evil men, and that they arent Jewish. but of course Spielberg, Livni, Etc. are Jews, but they are wayward.
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How can you say that those creatures are Jews? They act just like Muslim Nazis.
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Most of the Christians like the Coptics and the Lebonese Christians hate the Muzzies for years of torture, rape and murder. I think mostly there is a strong fear among Middle Easteners that are Christians. I mean look at a great woman like Bridgette Gabriel. If there is a way we can show these people the light maybe it can be helpful cause I agree last thing we need out of their fear that they convert to Islam.
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Some of them do hate Islam, but I guarantee you, most also hate Israel. If push came to shove in a clash of West vs. Islam, who do you really think they would join?
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Who the [deleted] are to say who's a Christian and who's not?
That is manifestly true. I always cringe when Chaim says “ these people aren’t real Christians, those people aren’t real Christians.”
It is not the place of a Jew to determine who is and who is not a christian.
I would be pissed as hell if Christians walked around declaring who was and who was not a Jew. So I think Jews should just consider anyone who declares himself to be a Christian to be one.
When Christians are a tiny minority amongst savage muslims they either have to toe the line or be slaughtered. I'd love to see you be part of a tiny Jewish minority living with muslims and call all the muslims animals and savages. They'd kill you in a second. Chaim has made this point.
True, but they don’t have to be actively involved in terrorist attacks on Jews in order to save their own lives as PFLP and DFLP did. These two terrorist groups were majority Christian and run by only Christians.
A lot of Christian Arabs are anti-Israel B.C.E. the muslims will slaughter them if they aren't. In Lebanon we see the Christian Arabs are a large minority and their support for Israel is comparable to any white European nation.
Bullcrap. Have you even met a Christian Lebanese? Most of them are anti-Israel and consider pro-Israel Arab Christians as traitors and rightfully so.
The arab Christians you see who are anti-Israel are generally socialists like the whites in Europe who hate Israel. I know from viewing Lebanese websites, the Christians there who hated Israel literally were pro-communist or far-left socialist and didn't have any faith.
I don’t know what correlation you see between Christian faith and supporting Israel.
Pat Buchanan is a very faithful believing Christian and he hates Israel with a passion.
Anybody who claims jesus was a p@ll*stinian arab as the p@ll*stinian sand apes preach) is NOT a real christian.
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Judeanoncapta is right.
With all due respect for Thunderbolt, some of the most vicious Arab terror groups have been run by Christian Arabs (or at least that's what they called themselves). The Popular Front For the Liberation of Palestine, which was run by George Habash is one of them, as is/was the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine. Also, PFLP was responsible for many airline hijackings. Then there's the late Yasser Arafat's former mouthpiece Hanan Ashwari who is also a Christian (again, just going by what these people call themselves). And she was always bad news. Yet another example is White House Press Corps reporter Helen Thomas who is Lebanese born. She is VERY pro fakestinian. There are accounts of her badgering the White House press secretaries of the plight of these fakestinians, and asking about the years of "occupation" by the Israelis. In fact, during last year's Israel/Hezbo/Lebanon war, the hag started arguing with Tony Snow, who retorted that she was parotting the Hezbollah view of the situation.
Chaim has also said on past "Ask JTF" shows that many of these Christian Arabs identify racially, socially and politically as Muslims. For example, I once read an article about a Syrian priest who would light candles in his church for hezbo leader Hassan Nasrallah. Another time, I read an article on Frontpage Magazine (http://www.frontpagemag.com) about some priest in Israel who had pictures of Yasser Arafat all over his church.
On another note, do you all remember that troll Christian Pal that came here?
Now please don't get me wrong here. I think the conservative Christians, and the ones who post on this forum are all wonderful. But I will hate and fight against anyone who condones or participates in terrorism, and who wants Israel destroyed. Whatever such people call themselves is irrelevant.
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Lisa,
Your post is certainly factually correct, and yes, we must fight against these creatures just as strongly as we fight the professing Muslims. I still don't see any of these human roaches as Christians though--they practice a hybrid of it and Islam (in fact, they are basically Muzzies in all but name).
I disagree with Judeanoncapta about them being real Christians though, for sure, much less Fag Buchanus. I don't want this human dreck counted among my faith any more than I want the Episcopalian/Presbyterian faggot and abortionist "Christians" included as such.
Now, I have been told on occasions that most "Christian Arabs" really support Israel and are afraid to admit it for fear of their lives. This I do not buy. If this were the case, we would see large numbers of them in America (where they are free to do so) coming out in defense of Jewry. In fact, we see the exact opposite.
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I'm sure that at least some p-lestinian's are true christians, they just want to life where they have lived for years.
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Israeli Arabs, you meant to say.
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I said p-lestinians to imply those who are living in the occupied (by the PA) territories, not those that are living in the state if Israel.
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It's still the territory of Biblical Israel and they are still Israeli Arabs. Who is occupying that part of the Jewish land at this moment is irrelevant.
But to address your point, Israel has never had any problem with Israeli Christian ("")Arabs living where they do, unless, of course, they are actively taking up arms against her, which some have.
Chaim has said that sincere Arabs who are not Muslim and are allies of Israel and willing to live under Jewish sovereignty must not be expelled.
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I was referring specifically to those who are living under palestinian rule, such as those in Gaza.
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I was referring specifically to those who are living under PLO/Hamas Arab Muslim Nazi rule, such as those in Gaza.
Oh now I get ya, you mean those ISRAELI-ARABS who are Delusional and Hallucinate off Arab Hashish that there is a Palestinian State. Gotcha ;)
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No I mean the christians who live under palestinian rule because they just want to stay where they've always been lived, or because they can't leave for some reason, those who support a palestinian state are seriously misguided.
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I would be pissed as hell if Christians walked around declaring who was and who was not a Jew. So I think Jews should just consider anyone who declares himself to be a Christian to be one.
Judea, I know where you come from, but do you consider Neturei Karta members to be Jews? They certainly call themselves such. Do you consider Spielberg a Jew? Tzipi Livni? Tali Fahima?
Look at the Bible.
The story of Isaiah and Ahaz.
The story of Elijah and Ahab.
These were both wicked evil Kings.
But neither of these prophets told these evil kings, they weren't Israelite or Jewish.
Never.
Despite all of their condemnations of these evil kings.
They never said they're no longer Jewish.
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Judeanoncapta is right.
With all due respect for Thunderbolt, some of the most vicious Arab terror groups have been run by Christian Arabs (or at least that's what they called themselves). The Popular Front For the Liberation of Eretz Yisrael, which was run by George Habash is one of them, as is/was the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Eretz Yisrael. Also, PFLP was responsible for many airline hijackings. Then there's the late Yasser Arafat's former mouthpiece Hanan Ashwari who is also a Christian (again, just going by what these people call themselves). And she was always bad news. Yet another example is White House Press Corps reporter Helen Thomas who is Lebanese born. She is VERY pro fakestinian. There are accounts of her badgering the White House press secretaries of the plight of these fakestinians, and asking about the years of "occupation" by the Israelis. In fact, during last year's Israel/Hezbo/Lebanon war, the hag started arguing with Tony Snow, who retorted that she was parotting the Hezbollah view of the situation.
Chaim has also said on past "Ask JTF" shows that many of these Christian Arabs identify racially, socially and politically as Muslims. For example, I once read an article about a Syrian priest who would light candles in his church for hezbo leader Hassan Nasrallah. Another time, I read an article on Frontpage Magazine (http://www.frontpagemag.com) about some priest in Israel who had pictures of Yasser Arafat all over his church.
On another note, do you all remember that troll Christian Pal that came here?
Now please don't get me wrong here. I think the conservative Christians, and the ones who post on this forum are all wonderful. But I will hate and fight against anyone who condones or participates in terrorism, and who wants Israel destroyed. Whatever such people call themselves is irrelevant.
The arab terrorist who call themselves Christians leader socialist racial-identity parties that are akin to the nazis. They call themselves Christian but they're really secular socialist. They're no more examples of Christian Arab hatred of Israel than the nazis, communists, etc are of white Christian hatred of Israel. As for Chaim, he's right and wrong. Many Christian Arabs who don't live under the yolk of Islamic dictatorship aren't anti-Israel. As for that Syrian priest, imagine if he spoke out against hizbullah in Syria. He'd be killed.
I'd like to make another comment. It takes a lot of chutzpah for a Jew to say who is and who isn't a Christian. Just don't do that. I detest when Chaim says certain people aren't Christians. We don't say who is a Jew and who isn't. It works both ways.
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Look at the Bible.
The story of Isaiah and Ahaz.
The story of Elijah and Ahab.
These were both wicked evil Kings.
But neither of these prophets told these evil kings, they weren't Israelite or Jewish.
Never.
Despite all of their condemnations of these evil kings.
They never said they're no longer Jewish.
Did they need to? Wasn't it obvious?
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I'd like to make another comment. It takes a lot of chutzpah for a Jew to say who is and who isn't a Christian. Just don't do that. I detest when Chaim says certain people aren't Christians. We don't say who is a Jew and who isn't. It works both ways.
I see what you are saying. You are saying if someone doesn't understand what Christianity is, then they should be careful to judge if someone is doing it right - which, in turn, qualifies them as a true follower or not. I *think* that is what you are saying.
But sometimes it's pretty obvious who is and who isn't a Christian by the fruit they bear. I'm a Jew and I know that. I think anyone (not just Christians or even Jews) can tell who isn't a Christian sometimes. Sometimes it's just REALLY obvious.
Lastly, I would like to say that Chaim has known a lot of real Christians for many years (obviously) and would probably have the experience to see this. Wouldn't you think? Chaim is a man of wisdom.
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Look at the Bible.
The story of Isaiah and Ahaz.
The story of Elijah and Ahab.
These were both wicked evil Kings.
But neither of these prophets told these evil kings, they weren't Israelite or Jewish.
Never.
Despite all of their condemnations of these evil kings.
They never said they're no longer Jewish.
Did they need to? Wasn't it obvious?
A Jew is a Jew, he can never lose this status, that is Halacha Ahaz, Akhav and all other rotten kings were still Jews. No one, ever, can declare a Jew to have lost his Jewish status.
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A Jew is a Jew, he can never lose this status, that is Halacha Ahaz, Akhav and all other rotten kings were still Jews. No one, ever, can declare a Jew to have lost his Jewish status.
But can't Jews be excommunicated? Isn't is called "cherem?" Also weren't Baruch Spinoza and Henry Kissinger excommunicated?
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A Jew is a Jew, he can never lose this status, that is Halacha Ahaz, Akhav and all other rotten kings were still Jews. No one, ever, can declare a Jew to have lost his Jewish status.
But can't Jews be excommunicated? Isn't is called "cherem?" Also weren't Baruch Spinoza and Henry Kissinger excommunicated?
And yet they are still Jews, Cherem means we dont associate with them or count them in a Minyan, if a woman is in Cherem her children are still Jews. If someone in Cherem does teshuva they are immediatly reaccepted into the Jewish community.
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What if someone is karet?
Why would that matter?
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yes
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I agree you guys have a point: Judaism is more often than not a religion that is passed via birth, whereas people choose to be Christians. But I don't want to take the Judaism-as-an-ethnicity idea too far here or make this needlessly complex. After all, aren't most of the people who insist first and foremost that Judaism is an ethnic or racial quality anti-Semites?
Still, even looking at the matter in a very simple, sloppy way, I think it is safe to say that there are some Jews-by-birth who either are not considered Jews by outsiders because of their behavior or who have disowned Judaism. The term Erev Rav refers to people who, although apparently part of the nation of Israel, were never really with Hashem to begin with.
Are Spielberg and Tali Fahima technically Jews? I guess so. Should we do them the humor of pretending that they are on a practical basis? I think we all know the answer to that.
I know that if I were Jewish I wouldn't want to be associated with those turds even in name, any more than now I want to be associated with Jimmy-hat Farter or Suha Arafat.
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Look at the Bible.
The story of Isaiah and Ahaz.
The story of Elijah and Ahab.
These were both wicked evil Kings.
But neither of these prophets told these evil kings, they weren't Israelite or Jewish.
Never.
Despite all of their condemnations of these evil kings.
They never said they're no longer Jewish.
Did they need to? Wasn't it obvious?
No, they didn't say it because it's not true.
It says in Jeremiah that despite our sins, the covenant with Israel will never be broken.