Author Topic: Kosher Cooking Question  (Read 3299 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Lisa

  • Forum Administrator
  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9373
    • The Urban Grind
Kosher Cooking Question
« on: July 11, 2010, 03:45:16 PM »
Hi guys,

Not to sound totally ignorant, but is it, by any chance possible to make kosher a used slow cooker.  For example, is removing the inside dish, and sticking it in a regular oven on high heat an option? 

The reason I ask is because I understand you can get slow cookers for dirt cheap at thrift stores.

Thanks.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Kosher Cooking Question
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2010, 05:08:27 PM »
Hi guys,

Not to sound totally ignorant, but is it, by any chance possible to make kosher a used slow cooker.  For example, is removing the inside dish, and sticking it in a regular oven on high heat an option? 

The reason I ask is because I understand you can get slow cookers for dirt cheap at thrift stores.

Thanks.

Hmm good question I'll try to ask around bli neder.  By slow cooker you mean like a crock pot?

Offline Lisa

  • Forum Administrator
  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9373
    • The Urban Grind
Re: Kosher Cooking Question
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2010, 06:09:11 PM »
Yes.  It's exactly the same as a crock pot (which I believe is a brand name). 

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Kosher Cooking Question
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2010, 06:49:22 PM »
Wasn't the law of Kashering cooking utensils in this weeks Parasha?

Yes, In Parasha Matot we read:

http://www.chabad.org/parshah/torahreading.asp?AID=52598&p=complete&showrashi=true

Quote
21. Eleazar the kohen said to the soldiers returning from battle, "This is the statute that the Lord commanded Moses.
22. Only the gold, the silver, the copper, the iron, the tin, and the lead
23. whatever is used in fire you shall pass through fire and then it will be clean; it must, however, [also] be cleansed with sprinkling water, and whatever is not used in fire you shall pass through water.

Rashis comments on these verses:

Quote
whatever is used in fire: It is purged in the manner it is used. If it is used in hot water, it must be purged in hot water, and if it is used for roasting, such as a spit or grill, it must be made to glow in fire. — [A.Z. 75b]

it must, however, [also] be cleansed with sprinkling water: According to its simple meaning, this sprinkling was to cleanse it from contamination by a corpse. He said to them,“The vessels require purging to cleanse them from the [absorption of] forbidden [food], and sprinkling to cleanse them of [spiritual] uncleanness [caused by a corpse].” Our Rabbis expounded from here that even to make them fit for use [after contamination] from forbidden food, ritual immersion was required for metal utensils. They expound מֵי נִדָּה written here to mean water fit for a menstruant [Heb. נִדָּה] to immerse herself in. How much is that? Forty 'seah.’- [A.Z. 75b]

and whatever is not used in fire: Anything which is not used in fire such as ewers, cups, and jugs, all of which are used for cold [food] and did not absorb forbidden food. — [A.Z. 75b]

shall be passed through water: He immerses them and that is sufficient. This refers only to metal utensils. — [A.Z. 75b, Sifrei Mattoth 50]


These form the basis of the Halachas concerning Kashering utensils...

I will look for more specific Halachot concerning crock-pots, or slow cookers...

BTW: We just bought a new one last month..

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Kosher Cooking Question
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2010, 06:52:46 PM »
Here is information from Star-K conerning Kashering utensils:



http://www.star-k.org/kashrus/kk-containers-tevilas.htm

The Mitzvah of Tevilas Keilim
Rabbi Moshe Heinemann, Star-K Rabbinic Administrator


Introduction:
In His infinite wisdom Hashem Yisborach has spiritually elevated the mundane activity of eating and has vested it with special sanctity, special kedusha. The food we eat must be kosher; the table upon which we eat our meals represents the holy altar, the mizbeach. Similarly, the vessels and utensils used for preparing food and for dining must be given special holiness. When these dishes and/or utensils have been previously owned by a non-Jew we have to immerse these utensils, these keilim, in a mikvah, a ritualarium, before their first use.

Keilim (vessels/utensils) can be categorized into three halachic groupings. Utensils requiring tevila (immersion) with a brocha, utensils requiring tevila without a brocha, and utensils not requiring tevila at all. Utensils require tevila with a brocha when they have direct contact with food during preparation or meal time and are made from metal such as aluminum, brass, copper, gold, iron, lead, silver, steel, tin, or glass such as pyrex, duralex, and corelle. (Corelle, a form of glass, should not be confused with corning ware, a form of earthenware, which will be discussed later in this article.)

Utensils do not require tevila, even if they have direct contact with food during preparation or meal time, if they are made from bone, non-glazed earthenware (flower pot dull finish), paper, plastic, stone, styrofoam, or wood. Other instances not requiring tevila include:

   1. Utensils made from metal or glass whose intended purpose is not for food usage, e.g. an arts and crafts knife. Even if the knife was to be used occasionally for food preparation, tevila would not be required.
   2. Metal or glass utensils that do not come into direct contact with the food, e.g the metal shell of a removable crock pot or can-opener.
   3. Utensils which are made by a Jewish craftsman (observant or non-observant) who owns his company or business and are sold directly to a Jewish customer.
   4. Empty metal cans that previously held food, e.g canned vegetables, can be used to cook food therein without tevila. One does not have to immerse the can because the Jew who opened the can to remove the original contents has now created a "new" utensil.
   5. Storage utensils that are not brought to the table, e.g. glass spaghetti/pasta containers or ceramic cookie jars.
   6. Food sold in glass jars (mayonnaise jars or juice bottles): When it is emptied, the glass jar does not require tevila due to the fact that it is secondary to its contents. If a deposit is required on the bottle, the glass has individuality in its own right and would require tevila before reuse. In the event that the jar or the bottle is fancy and important in its own right, tevila would be required. A competent halachic authority should determine whether a brocha is required when making the tevila. One should not assume that Jewish merchants immerse the jars of bottles used to package loose or bulk food items.
   7. Utensils used exclusively with raw, non-edible food, for instance cookie cutters or a metal tenderizer hammer do not need tevila.

Utensils require tevila without a brocha when the dishes or vessels are made from glazed china, bone china, stoneware, corning ware, or porcelain enamel. Other vessels requiring tevila without a brocha include:

   1. Utensils made from a combination of materials, e.g. metal pots coated with teflon or enamel.
   2. Utensils used for raw ingredients, but could also be used for edible food, such as mixer beaters, should be toveled without a brocha.
   3. Metal utensils used for food storage that remain in the kitchen or pantry and are not brought to the table, e.g. metal flour or sugar canisters.
   4. Disposable aluminum pans and containers used for cooking and baking require tevila with a brocha if they are to be used more than once. If they are to be discarded after one use, a competent Rabbinic authority should be consulted.


Instructions for Tevilas Keilim:
The vessel/utensil to be immersed must be completely clean - free of dirt, dust, rust, stickers, or glue. If the utensil was immersed with a label, a Rabbinic authority should be consulted.

The immersion must be done in a mikvah, a ritualarium, which is kosher for tevilas noshim (a mikvah that is kosher for men only does not qualify). One may also use the ocean and rivers that flow the entire year. If there is no alternative, rivers that flow due to rain or snow can be used for tevila only after settling. In all cases, the water of the mikvah, ocean and/or river must touch the entire utensil inside and out.

In case of great need, it is permitted to tovel glass and china in snow if there is at least 240 cubic feet of snow joined together in any area. For example, four inches of snow in a field which has an area of 27' X 27' would be large enough to tovel vesels. The snow must fill the inside and cover the outside of the vessel, and the vessel must be connected to the required amount of snow.

Anyone may tovel keilim, including a small child or a non-Jew. The tevila must be done in the presence of a Jewish adult to verify that it took place. The recitation of a brocha can only be said if an adult Jew does the immersion. Therefore, if many utensils are to be immersed with the help of a child or a non-Jew, the owner should first immerse a few vessels with a brocha and the child or non-Jew can take over.

Prior to the immersion of metal or glass utensils, one wets his or her hand in the mikvah water, holds the vessel in the wet hand says Baruch....al tivilas keilim and immerses the vessel. The water of the mikvah must touch the entire vessel inside and out. The entire vessel must be under the water at one time. The cover can be toveled separately if it is removable.  If only one vessel is immersed, the above procedure is followed and the brocha al tivilas keili is recited.

Under no circumstances can a utensil be toveled in parts, nor can two keilim touch each other during immersion. Utensils comprised of separate pieces that are used together as a single unit, e.g. a meat grinder or thermos bottle, may be toveled in the manner used and not piece by piece. When toveling an assembled appliance, it is imperative that the water touch all areas that the food will touch during use, both inside and out.

If it is impossible to tovel a utensil because the utensil is too large to immerse in a mikvah, if there is no available mikvah, if the vessel will be ruined when placed in a mikvah, or if immersion may present a hazard, a Rabbinic authority should be consulted. A possible suggestion would be to disassemble the vessel and have a Jew reassemble the vessel. Reassembly would not apply to the parts of a meat grinder that are regularly assembled and disassembled during ordinary use. Reassembly would apply to utensils that don't ordinarily get dismantled. Another suggestion would be to give the utensil in question to a non-Jew as an outright gift and borrow it back from the non-Jew. However, this procedure only helps for one day, such as Shabbos.

Essentially, each specific question should be evaluated by a Rav so that an appropriate halachic ruling can be made.

A pocket knife used for food should be toveled in its open position so that the water will touch all areas of the blade. A narrow necked bottle should be toveled neck up so that the inner surface of the bottle will fill completely with mikvah water. It is important to emphasize that if a utensil requires tevila, it may not be used even once before the tevila is done. If a utensil was used numerous times without tevila, one is still required to immerse it before its next use.

Even if all the workers that manufactured the utensils are Jewish, the utensil requires tevila if the company is owned by a non-Jew. This halacha applies to companies whose whole ownership is completely held by non-Jews, or if non-Jewish owners hold partial ownership. Similarly, a company that has non-Jewish voting stockholders would also qualify for non-Jewish ownership. Unless one has information to the contrary, one should assume that all companies outside Eretz Yisroel have some public non-Jewish ownership.

If a utensil which was owned by a Jew and was toveled fell into disrepair and the utensil was no longer functional, e.g. a hole or crack on the bottom of a pot, and a non-Jewish repairman welded a new patch on the broken area the newly repaired vessel would require tevila again. This is due to the fact that the newly functional vessel is considered to be brand new. A Rav should be consulted to determine whether a brocha should be said on a repaired vessel.

If one bought a used vessel which needs to be kashered, e.g. from a non-Jewish owner, the keili must be kashered before it is toveled. If the order was switched, a Rav should be consulted.

Utensils require tevila if they were given to a Jew as a gift from a non-Jew or bought from a non-Jew. This requirement would apply even if the Jew owned the utensil originally, sold it to the non-Jew and subsequently bought it back. It is for this reason that one does not sell chometz keilim to a non-Jew. If someone converts, their utensils require tevila, even if they were only used for kosher food, since the utensils went from the possession of a non-Jew to the possession of a Jew.

If one borrows or rents utensils from a non-Jew or from a Jewish/non-Jewish partnership, tevila would not be required. If utensils are purchased from the partnership or if the Jew buys out the non-Jewish partner and now has total ownership of the utensils, tevila with a brocha is required.

Tevilas keilim may be done by day or night, except Shabbos or Yom Tov. In case of great necessity, where one needs to use an untoveled keili on Shabbos or Yom Tov, the utensil should be given to a non-Jew as a present and the Yehudi should borrow it back. After Shabbos, if the Yehudi re-purchased the utensil from the non-Jew, it must be toveled with a brocha. If the Yehudi continues to use the keili without paying for it, the keili will require tevila without a brocha. If one is in doubt whether a keili needs tevila, a Rav must be consulted. If one is in doubt if a vessel that requires tevila was toveled, it should now be immersed without a brocha.

If a keili that requires tevila was mixed together with utensils that have already been immersed and the untoveled one is unidentifiable, all of the vessels should be retoveled. If this poses a difficulty or expense, a Rav should be consulted.

If one is invited to eat at a friend's house and it is known to you that his/her utensils have not been toveled, since the guest is aware that a problem exists, a Rav should be consulted. However, it is not proper or necessary to investigate if the host complies with the laws of tevilas keilim since we assume G-d fearing Jews comply with the halacha. If by mistake a non-toveled utensil was used to prepare food, the food is still kosher and must be eaten on properly toveled dishes.

In conclusion: It is obviously difficult to address all of the issues and questions one may have regarding tevilas keilim in this brief article. Of course, when in doubt about a particular facet of this mitzvah, always consult with a competent Rabbinic authority. Let us hope that fulfillment of this mitzvah will add an enhanced kosher flavor to the sanctity of our home.
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Kosher Cooking Question
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2010, 06:56:11 PM »
Also this discussion might be relevant to your question:

http://www.torah.org/advanced/weekly-halacha/5762/bamidbar.html

CROCK-POTS ON SHABBOS

QUESTION: Is it permitted to place food in a crock-pot on Friday afternoon in order for it to be cooked and warm for Shabbos?

DISCUSSION: There are basically two kinds of crock-pots on the market. One(1) is designed as a free-standing pot which is filled with food and then placed on top of the heating element. The heating element does not encircle the pot at all. This type of crock-pot may be used on Shabbos as long as the food in the pot is half-cooked(2) by the time Shabbos arrives(3).

The other type of crock-pot(4) consists of a pot holding food which is inserted into another, bigger pot. The outer pot completely surrounds the inner pot (insert) on three sides. The heating element is built into the walls and base of the outer pot. The halachic concern pertaining to this type of crock-pot is the rabbinic prohibition of hatmanah, insulation. The Rabbis forbade the insulation of all foods, even prior to Shabbos, if the insulation will add heat to the food(5). Contemporary poskim debate whether inserting the inner pot into the outer pot is considered "insulating" it, which is forbidden by the Rabbis, or not. There are three areas of dispute which we will attempt to describe briefly:

1. There are Rishonim who hold that it is forbidden to place a pot - even on Friday - in burning coals. It is considered as if the coals are insulating the pot. In their view, the only permissible way for a pot to be left on a fire is to place the pot on a grate, over the fire, not "in it"(6). Other Rishonim argue and hold that as long as the top of the pot is uncovered "and air can get to it," the pot is not considered to be insulated. Although the Rama(7) rules according to this view, it is not clear if he considers it sufficient that the top is uncovered so that "air can get to the pot," or if he would require that the sides be exposed as well. Thus, some poskim(8) understand the Rama to hold that when a pot is surrounded on three sides [as is a crock-pot], even if the top is not covered, it is still considered insulated, since no air can reach the sides of the pot.

2. The second issue to consider concerns the proximity between the outer and the inner pots. There is usually a small air pocket which separates the two pots. It is questionable whether this small space is sufficient to consider the insert as being physically separate from the outer pot and thus not being insulated by it, or if the outer pot is so close to the insert that it is insulating it(9).

3. The third issue to consider is whether the Rabbis prohibited insulation when its purpose is not to warm the food but to cook it. Since a crock-pot is used for cooking, not for warming, it has been suggested that the rabbinic decree would not apply.

What do contemporary poskim rule? Harav S.Z. Auerbach and Harav Y.S. Elyashiv rule stringently on all of the points listed above and do not allow the use of this type of crock-pot on Shabbos. Harav S. Wosner and Harav C.P. Scheinberg rule leniently and permit this type of crock-pot to be used(10). There are reliable sources who report that Harav M. Feinstein had also ruled leniently concerning this type of crock-pot.

Harav Elyashiv, though, suggests a simple solution for those who want to use this type of crock-pot. He suggests placing several stones(11) between the insert and the outer pot. This way, the insert will rest on the stones and not on the floor of the outer pot. Since the stones will raise the insert above the rim of the outer pot, the sides of the insert will be exposed to the air. In this fashion, no violation of hatmanah will occur.

Simply putting aluminum foil between the insert and the outer pot does not resolve the problem of hatmanah.

FOOTNOTES:

1 Produced by Westbend, Inc. and others.

2 In time of urgent need, if it is cooked a third of the way through it is also permissible.

3 Note that we are not discussing removing and then returning the pot on Shabbos, nor are we discussing stirring or removing food from this pot on Shabbos.

4 Produced by Hamilton Beach, Rival and others.

5 For the reasons behind this rabbinic decree, see Shabbos 34a and Mishnah Berurah 257:1.

6 Shulchan Aruch 253:1 rules like this opinion. According to the Chazon Ish 37:19, the halachah is like this view.

7 O.C. 253:1.

8 This is clearly the understanding of the Pri Megadim 259:3 in explanation of the view of the Rashba and the Taz. There is some uncertainty as to the view of the Chayei Adam and the Mishnah Berurah on this issue. See Otzros ha-Shabbos, pg. 256 for a lengthy analysis.

9 See Sha'ar ha-Tziyon 257:43.

10 Responsa from all of the quoted contemporary poskim are published in Otzros ha-Shabbos, pg. 514-522. See also Ohr ha-Shabbos, vol. 9, pg. 10, responsum from Harav Y. Roth, who rules leniently.

11 A more practical choice - in lieu of stones - would be to crumple large piece of aluminum foil into balls.
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Kosher Cooking Question
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2010, 06:59:32 PM »
See the following articles also:

http://www.halachayomit.com/hagala.html
http://www.revach.net/yourrevach/parshashashavua/Kashering-Your-Heart-and-Kashering-Your-Utensils-Submitted-By-an-Anonymous-Reader/2290
http://www.vbm-torah.org/pesach/kasher.htm

Quote
1. BASIC INFORMATION ABOUT KASHERING

"Kashering," a process that renders a utensil fit for use ("kosher") by removing material that has been absorbed in it, has its roots in Bemidbar 31:21-24. Elazar, the Kohen Gadol, instructs the people how to treat the utensils that they acquired as booty in the war against Midian. "Anything that was used with fire should be passed through fire to be purified, but [then] needs to be immersed in a mikveh [lit., the waters of the nidda], and anything not used with fire should be passed through water." (Trans. According to the Sifre and the Ramban.)

[Kashering should not be confused with immersion. Food vessels bought from a non-Jew that were used for non-kosher food must be both "kashered" to remove the non-kosher food absorbed in them, and immersed in a mikveh. Non-kosher food that got absorbed in a vessel owned by a Jew necessitates kashering but not immersion; a new unused vessel bought from a non-Jew requires immersion but not kashering.]

Kashering applies both to utensils used with non-kosher food (as in the biblical passage) and to those used with kosher food which can later pose a halakhic problem (as in chametz, or meat and milk). See below for any differences.

The basic rule of thumb in kashering is: "Things can be removed in the same way they got absorbed (ke-vol'o kakh polto)" (Pesachim 30a). If, for example, non-kosher soup was boiled in a pot, kashering it would involve boiling. Likewise, if non-kosher meat was roasted on a spit in fire, removal of the non-kosher meat absorbed by the spit requires fire.

Three factors must be taken into account in order to determine how to kasher something: 1. What the utensil is made of; 2. What has been absorbed; and 3. How it has been absorbed.

1. Metals can always be kashered; pottery and materials like it (many plastics) never can. Glass is like pottery according to the Rama, but does not absorb at all according to the Shulchan Arukh OC 451:26. 2. Removing prohibited non-kosher foods requires a more intense type of kashering than permitted foods (e.g., removing milk from a utensil that one wants to use with meat). In other words, "heteira bala" is easier to rectify than "issura bala." Rishonim differ about whether chametz that was absorbed into a utensil before Pesach is considered a permitted material or a prohibited one. Most adopt the stricter opinion, but sometimes, when there are other reasons to be lenient, chametz can be considered "heteira bala" (Mishna Berura OC 451:28). 3. The most crucial determinant of what method to use for kashering is how the food got absorbed. This issue is dealt with extensively in Shulchan Arukh OC 451. The general rule is as stated above, that removing material requires the same process as that which caused it to get absorbed. Things absorbed through fire can only be removed through fire; things boiled, through boiling; pouring hot water over something can remove food absorbed through pouring. Sometimes we veer from this principle because of practical difficulties in applying it. It is the main use of the utensil which determines the method of its kashering.

There are three main methods of kashering: Heating a utensil until sparks fly ("libbun chamur"), which destroys any chametz that might have once been there; heating it until straw burns on the outside of the utensil ("libbun kal"); and using boiling water ("hag'ala") to cause the material absorbed inside a utensil to leave it ("pleita"). Utensils used directly in fire require "libbun chamur" for kashering; those used in boiling liquids or with hot foods require "hag'ala." "Libbun kal" is used for hard-to-reach places on things which normally need "hag'ala," and is sometimes required instead of "hag'ala" as a stringency. "Hag'ala" is sufficient for removing permissible food, even if it has been absorbed through fire.

Of course I recommend you contact a Rabbi for the actual Halacha, but from these articles you should be able to figure out what is involved...

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Lisa

  • Forum Administrator
  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9373
    • The Urban Grind
Re: Kosher Cooking Question
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2010, 07:11:06 PM »
Thanks Muman.  I'll check out the links.