Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
Intermarriage Banning Poll + Lecture
Dr. Dan:
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on January 20, 2008, 05:22:03 PM ---
--- Quote from: Dr. Dan on January 20, 2008, 05:18:10 PM ---
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on January 20, 2008, 04:40:38 PM ---
--- Quote from: MackaB on January 20, 2008, 04:16:17 PM ---I think this was sort of a unique situation. I could be wrong and may not have the story correct...
But didn't an enemy (was it Baalam?) send a gaggle of Midianite hookers to get dolled up and tempt the men of Israel?
I think maybe this case would be different from one where a Jew and non-Jew met regularly.
The specific set up of the Midianite women in the Pinchas story was from the beginning a plot to kill Jews.
--- End quote ---
Yes you are right, but still its something that is allways Disgusting in G-d's eyes, even one encounter. And the Halacha Technically is that if someone is having sex with a non-Jewish women, at the exact time (not before or later), one can barge in and kill both of them, BUT the person who can do this is only someone who is like Pinhas who is Zealous for G-d, someone who is completly connected to G-d and is Zealous for G-d, and just like G-d is disgusted by this so is he (no one here is on that level, BUT we can see what G-d thinks about this act).
--- End quote ---
yah..that's not going to happen anytime soon in our lifetime....thank goodness...
--- End quote ---
Why thank goodness? Either way, the person who does this will have his soul cut off forever (unless he does REAL tishuva (with all the proper steps and never does it again + he will still experience some amount of suffering (just as a Shabbat desecrator) even in this world. Even for one act - not only "marriage".
--- End quote ---
Ok good..as long as one gets to live...
Gd is merciful...so should people, especially Jews.
Tzvi Ben Roshel1:
--- Quote from: Dr. Dan on January 20, 2008, 07:21:19 PM ---
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on January 20, 2008, 05:22:03 PM ---
--- Quote from: Dr. Dan on January 20, 2008, 05:18:10 PM ---
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on January 20, 2008, 04:40:38 PM ---
--- Quote from: MackaB on January 20, 2008, 04:16:17 PM ---I think this was sort of a unique situation. I could be wrong and may not have the story correct...
But didn't an enemy (was it Baalam?) send a gaggle of Midianite hookers to get dolled up and tempt the men of Israel?
I think maybe this case would be different from one where a Jew and non-Jew met regularly.
The specific set up of the Midianite women in the Pinchas story was from the beginning a plot to kill Jews.
--- End quote ---
Yes you are right, but still its something that is allways Disgusting in G-d's eyes, even one encounter. And the Halacha Technically is that if someone is having sex with a non-Jewish women, at the exact time (not before or later), one can barge in and kill both of them, BUT the person who can do this is only someone who is like Pinhas who is Zealous for G-d, someone who is completly connected to G-d and is Zealous for G-d, and just like G-d is disgusted by this so is he (no one here is on that level, BUT we can see what G-d thinks about this act).
--- End quote ---
yah..that's not going to happen anytime soon in our lifetime....thank goodness...
--- End quote ---
Why thank goodness? Either way, the person who does this will have his soul cut off forever (unless he does REAL tishuva (with all the proper steps and never does it again + he will still experience some amount of suffering (just as a Shabbat desecrator) even in this world. Even for one act - not only "marriage".
--- End quote ---
Ok good..as long as one gets to live...
Gd is merciful...so should people, especially Jews.
--- End quote ---
(I dont want to sound annoying) but, is that all that matters? That person will be cut off, FOREVER, and all that matters is if he will get to live life here? (allthought who says that he wont also get punished in this world, either way eternity is much more important then this world which isn't the blink of an eye compared to ETERNITY.
And in this case Pinhas was given the noble Peace prize (what would have been for his time- but literally the "covenent of Peace") for his great act, and that was concidered true mercy.
Dr. Dan:
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on January 20, 2008, 07:40:52 PM ---
--- Quote from: Dr. Dan on January 20, 2008, 07:21:19 PM ---
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on January 20, 2008, 05:22:03 PM ---
--- Quote from: Dr. Dan on January 20, 2008, 05:18:10 PM ---
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on January 20, 2008, 04:40:38 PM ---
--- Quote from: MackaB on January 20, 2008, 04:16:17 PM ---I think this was sort of a unique situation. I could be wrong and may not have the story correct...
But didn't an enemy (was it Baalam?) send a gaggle of Midianite hookers to get dolled up and tempt the men of Israel?
I think maybe this case would be different from one where a Jew and non-Jew met regularly.
The specific set up of the Midianite women in the Pinchas story was from the beginning a plot to kill Jews.
--- End quote ---
Yes you are right, but still its something that is allways Disgusting in G-d's eyes, even one encounter. And the Halacha Technically is that if someone is having sex with a non-Jewish women, at the exact time (not before or later), one can barge in and kill both of them, BUT the person who can do this is only someone who is like Pinhas who is Zealous for G-d, someone who is completly connected to G-d and is Zealous for G-d, and just like G-d is disgusted by this so is he (no one here is on that level, BUT we can see what G-d thinks about this act).
--- End quote ---
yah..that's not going to happen anytime soon in our lifetime....thank goodness...
--- End quote ---
Why thank goodness? Either way, the person who does this will have his soul cut off forever (unless he does REAL tishuva (with all the proper steps and never does it again + he will still experience some amount of suffering (just as a Shabbat desecrator) even in this world. Even for one act - not only "marriage".
--- End quote ---
Ok good..as long as one gets to live...
Gd is merciful...so should people, especially Jews.
--- End quote ---
(I dont want to sound annoying) but, is that all that matters? That person will be cut off, FOREVER, and all that matters is if he will get to live life here? (allthought who says that he wont also get punished in this world, either way eternity is much more important then this world which isn't the blink of an eye compared to ETERNITY.
And in this case Pinhas was given the noble Peace prize (what would have been for his time- but literally the "covenent of Peace") for his great act, and that was concidered true mercy.
--- End quote ---
Yes all that matters is this life...not eternity..
I'm not into any religion that emphasizes on after lives...so if you want to practice your religion that way, be my guest...
Maccabi:
well, I watched the video.
I'm not going to delete my other post, but I have taken the rabbi's words it into consideration and I take it somewhat seriously. A lot of what Rabbi Mizrachi said was pretty powerful.
I don't want to mislead any Jews to think it's ok. If I am mistaken in my beliefs than I hope that it is I and I alone who suffer and I don't want to mislead anyone.
Honestly, this stuff just messes with my mind way too much. It seems sadistic to be tempted day in, day out by beautiful goyas and then be told that being with just 1 for 1 second is cut off for eternity. This is not my favorite aspect of Judaism ;)
Maybe it will be easier if I move to Israel.
Also, in regards to my last post - I know all or most of the Jews that died during this exile died to sanctify G-d. Just want to clarify that, but I think if you look at some of the sexual deviance among Jews today, it can be attributed to a horrible exile that was too much mentally...Like it has warped things so extremely that I find it hard to be too judgmental towards fellow Jews who couldn't take it anymore and wanted to assimilate.
I mean, the biggest reason for massive intermarriage is probably the holocaust. Let's not say that intermarriage is the 'silent holocaust' - what a bunch of bologna - the two things aren't even comparable in my opinion. One probably led to another. I wonder what the statistics are? How many Jews intermarried and at what rate before the Holocaust, and how many intermarried and at what rate afterwards?
Also, are there any other stories in the Bible of Jews being punished for relations with Goyas? I mean it must have happened thousands of times...If it were such a huge sin, why would there only be the one mention of it, and under the circumstances where the goyas were sent as an act of war?
Also, why did the Rabbi immigrate from Israel to the USA? I am suspicious of Rabbis teaching the most hardcore aspects of Judaism who don't live in Israel (except for Chaim who literally can't go). Don't get me wrong, he is a great speaker, and I enjoy his method of teaching (maybe he is in USA to help diaspora Jews), but if you are going to preach that touching a women means you're cut off, you should probably at least be living in Israel.
Any thoughts?
Tzvi Ben Roshel1:
--- Quote from: MackaB on January 20, 2008, 09:35:44 PM ---well, I watched the video.
I'm not going to delete my other post, but I have taken the rabbi's words it into consideration and I take it somewhat seriously. A lot of what Rabbi Mizrachi said was pretty powerful.
I don't want to mislead any Jews to think it's ok. If I am mistaken in my beliefs than I hope that it is I and I alone who suffer and I don't want to mislead anyone.
Honestly, this stuff just messes with my mind way too much. It seems sadistic to be tempted day in, day out by beautiful goyas and then be told that being with just 1 for 1 second is cut off for eternity. This is not my favorite aspect of Judaism ;)
Maybe it will be easier if I move to Israel.
Also, in regards to my last post - I know all or most of the Jews that died during this exile died to sanctify G-d. Just want to clarify that, but I think if you look at some of the sexual deviance among Jews today, it can be attributed to a horrible exile that was too much mentally...Like it has warped things so extremely that I find it hard to be too judgmental towards fellow Jews who couldn't take it anymore and wanted to assimilate.
I mean, the biggest reason for massive intermarriage is probably the holocaust. Let's not say that intermarriage is the 'silent holocaust' - what a bunch of bologna - the two things aren't even comparable in my opinion. One probably led to another. I wonder what the statistics are? How many Jews intermarried and at what rate before the Holocaust, and how many intermarried and at what rate afterwards?
Also, are there any other stories in the Bible of Jews being punished for relations with Goyas? I mean it must have happened thousands of times...If it were such a huge sin, why would there only be the one mention of it, and under the circumstances where the goyas were sent as an act of war?
Also, why did the Rabbi immigrate from Israel to the USA? I am suspicious of Rabbis teaching the most hardcore aspects of Judaism who don't live in Israel (except for Chaim who literally can't go). Don't get me wrong, he is a great speaker, and I enjoy his method of teaching (maybe he is in USA to help diaspora Jews), but if you are going to preach that touching a women means you're cut off, you should probably at least be living in Israel.
Any thoughts?
--- End quote ---
Yea, dont worry about the Rabbi (their are reasons also, if you really want to know personally about him, then contact him either in person in Queens, or by phone (PM me if you really care),
All what should matter for you, and also for anyone here who has sined in this aspect is to right away make a complete turn. The fact that it got to you is good, but as you know from the video which brought the sources, etc. that this is a VERY serious thing. What needs to be done right afterwards is for one (whoever that is) is to do serious Tishuva, and with Tishiva hope and pray that the sins are forgiven. And anyway, moving to Israel has nothing to do with this particular Tishuva process. If one conducts these acts with non-jewish girls here what would make them stop and not pollute the Jewish girls in Israel also?
The first step is to stop immediatly and completly since one now knows the seriousness of the sin.(and also learn right away the right steps to do Tishuva, if at least one cares about themselves.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version