Iranians rediscovering their giant faith, zoroastrianism

[ape]

[George]

I visited Iran recently and can tell you there is definitely an anti-Islamic movement going on. The US is in fact funding these movements and these groups have anti-Islamic programs and discussions which air in Iran via satellite. I really believe these people are waking up just by talking to them.

[SavetheWest]

I visited Iran recently and can tell you there is definitely an anti-Islamic movement going on. The US is in fact funding these movements and these groups have anti-Islamic programs and discussions which air in Iran via satellite. I really believe these people are waking up just by talking to them.

Why were you in Iran?

[Lisa]

The Iranian Aryan National Front is a pro Nazi, anti-Semitic, anti-Christian, Holocaust denying organization. 

No decent organization or group of people would display those disgusting swaztikas.  So what if it was an ancient Indian symbol?  After how the Nazis used it, I would be suspect of anyone who would ever display that hated symbol again. 

Before he was banned, Babylonian Jew posted about that site, and I went there for a visit.  That's how I know about them. 

[TruthSpreader]

I visited Iran recently and can tell you there is definitely an anti-Islamic movement going on. The US is in fact funding these movements and these groups have anti-Islamic programs and discussions which air in Iran via satellite. I really believe these people are waking up just by talking to them.

Why were you in Iran?

Yes, Ralph why?

I wanna know too.

[George]

I had to sell my grandparents property. In fact I'll likely be going back many more times in the future. The Iranian Aryan National Front are a pan-aryan group who believe they are related to Germans. They suffer from intense inferiority complex and hate Jews as much as they hate Arabs.

[Ulli]

The Iranian Aryan National Front is a pro Nazi, anti-Semitic, anti-Christian, Holocaust denying organization. 

No decent organization or group of people would display those disgusting swaztikas.  So what if it was an ancient Indian symbol?  After how the Nazis used it, I would be suspect of anyone who would ever display that hated symbol again. 

Before he was banned, Babylonian Jew posted about that site, and I went there for a visit.  That's how I know about them. 

Hobson's choice Lisa 

[Rubystars]

I thought Zoroastrianism was an ancient form of monotheism, and they had some kind of significance related to fire being a holy symbol. I don't know much about them other than that the Magi of the NT were supposed to be Zoroastrians.

[muman613]

I thought Zoroastrianism was an ancient form of monotheism, and they had some kind of significance related to fire being a holy symbol. I don't know much about them other than that the Magi of the NT were supposed to be Zoroastrians.

Nooooo!

Zoroastarianism is DUALISTIC. They believe in a good diety and a bad diety who are fighting each other!

It is NOT monotheistic!

muman613

http://www.sullivan-county.com/z/dualism.htm

If there is anything known about the Zoroastrian faith in the West, it is that it is a dualistic religion. "Zoroastrian dualism" has become a cliche often used in the field of religious scholarship as well as in popular accounts of religion. Is Zoroastrianism really dualistic? In a word, yes. But are the cliches true? What really is the nature of this dualistic doctrine? In this article I will attempt to describe this important aspect of Zoroastrian teaching.

Dualism, as the dictionary defines it, is a "theory that in any domain of reality there are two independent underlying principles, e.g. mind and matter, form and content." Another definition follows: "the theory that the forces of good and evil are equally balanced in the universe." (Oxford Encyclopedic English Dictionary) Neither of these definitions quite fits Zoroastrian dualism, though they have some relationship to it.

PS: This is diametrically opposed to the Jewish understanding of Hashem being the ONLY force in the universe who is master and creator of all forces {melachim}. That site trys to say that Judaism incorporated ideas from zoroastrianism but I find this very hard to believe. Maybe early chrstians believed this kind of stuff... But never was this the belief of Judaism. Hashem is the ONE AND ONLY!

muman613

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Zoroastrianism is almost as bad as Islam. In classical Persia, the Zoroastrian majority committed pogroms as savage as any in Russia or the Ukraine. Right now they act like nice people because they are a persecuted minority, but just watch--if they ever gain power in Iran again somehow, you wouldn't be able to tell that the regime changed at all. 

I can also assure you that they support the ayatollahist regime's nuclear program--out of national pride and the desire to wipe the Jews off the face of the earth.

[Masha]

Even if Iranians convert to Zoroastrianism (which would break the ranks of world islam and is, therefore, a good thing), we should never forget that Persians have always been the historical enemies of the Western Civilization. Even before they became Muslim, they were Asiatic - barbarous, treacherous, crude. Although their civilization had some great achievements, and they are a lot smarter and more sophisticated than Arabs, they are not compatible with the West. They have historically disliked Western people, and we should keep them at arm's length, even though we should welcome their conversion away from islam.

[SavetheWest]

Freddy Mercury of the band Queen was Zoroastrian.   

[SavetheWest]

Zoroastrianism is almost as bad as Islam. In classical Persia, the Zoroastrian majority committed pogroms as savage as any in Russia or the Ukraine. Right now they act like nice people because they are a persecuted minority, but just watch--if they ever gain power in Iran again somehow, you wouldn't be able to tell that the regime changed at all. 

I can also assure you that they support the ayatollahist regime's nuclear program--out of national pride and the desire to wipe the Jews off the face of the earth.

Do you think it was because of the religion or the evil leadership?  I seriously don't know much about the history but you can't blame Christianity for Russia and the Ukraine's pogroms.

I thought Zoroastrianism was an ancient form of monotheism, and they had some kind of significance related to fire being a holy symbol. I don't know much about them other than that the Magi of the NT were supposed to be Zoroastrians.

Nooooo!

Zoroastarianism is DUALISTIC. They believe in a good diety and a bad diety who are fighting each other!

It is NOT monotheistic!

muman613

http://www.sullivan-county.com/z/dualism.htm

If there is anything known about the Zoroastrian faith in the West, it is that it is a dualistic religion. "Zoroastrian dualism" has become a cliche often used in the field of religious scholarship as well as in popular accounts of religion. Is Zoroastrianism really dualistic? In a word, yes. But are the cliches true? What really is the nature of this dualistic doctrine? In this article I will attempt to describe this important aspect of Zoroastrian teaching.

Dualism, as the dictionary defines it, is a "theory that in any domain of reality there are two independent underlying principles, e.g. mind and matter, form and content." Another definition follows: "the theory that the forces of good and evil are equally balanced in the universe." (Oxford Encyclopedic English Dictionary) Neither of these definitions quite fits Zoroastrian dualism, though they have some relationship to it.

PS: This is diametrically opposed to the Jewish understanding of Hashem being the ONLY force in the universe who is master and creator of all forces {melachim}. That site trys to say that Judaism incorporated ideas from zoroastrianism but I find this very hard to believe. Maybe early chrstians believed this kind of stuff... But never was this the belief of Judaism. Hashem is the ONE AND ONLY!

muman613

So they believe that G-D is fighting with an equally powerful Satan?  I've always heard Zoroastrianism as the first monotheist religion throughout the history books.

[muman613]

Zoroastrianism is almost as bad as Islam. In classical Persia, the Zoroastrian majority committed pogroms as savage as any in Russia or the Ukraine. Right now they act like nice people because they are a persecuted minority, but just watch--if they ever gain power in Iran again somehow, you wouldn't be able to tell that the regime changed at all. 

I can also assure you that they support the ayatollahist regime's nuclear program--out of national pride and the desire to wipe the Jews off the face of the earth.

Do you think it was because of the religion or the evil leadership?  I seriously don't know much about the history but you can't blame Christianity for Russia and the Ukraine's pogroms.

I thought Zoroastrianism was an ancient form of monotheism, and they had some kind of significance related to fire being a holy symbol. I don't know much about them other than that the Magi of the NT were supposed to be Zoroastrians.

Nooooo!

Zoroastarianism is DUALISTIC. They believe in a good diety and a bad diety who are fighting each other!

It is NOT monotheistic!

muman613

http://www.sullivan-county.com/z/dualism.htm

If there is anything known about the Zoroastrian faith in the West, it is that it is a dualistic religion. "Zoroastrian dualism" has become a cliche often used in the field of religious scholarship as well as in popular accounts of religion. Is Zoroastrianism really dualistic? In a word, yes. But are the cliches true? What really is the nature of this dualistic doctrine? In this article I will attempt to describe this important aspect of Zoroastrian teaching.

Dualism, as the dictionary defines it, is a "theory that in any domain of reality there are two independent underlying principles, e.g. mind and matter, form and content." Another definition follows: "the theory that the forces of good and evil are equally balanced in the universe." (Oxford Encyclopedic English Dictionary) Neither of these definitions quite fits Zoroastrian dualism, though they have some relationship to it.

PS: This is diametrically opposed to the Jewish understanding of Hashem being the ONLY force in the universe who is master and creator of all forces {melachim}. That site trys to say that Judaism incorporated ideas from zoroastrianism but I find this very hard to believe. Maybe early chrstians believed this kind of stuff... But never was this the belief of Judaism. Hashem is the ONE AND ONLY!

muman613

So they believe that G-D is fighting with an equally powerful Satan?  I've always heard Zoroastrianism as the first monotheist religion throughout the history books.

Yes, and that is not compatible with Jewish understanding. In a way this is equal to idol worship. Judaism doesnt believe that there is any other power. Both the good and the bad are from him alone.

It is not monotheism like Judaism is.

See this thread : http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php?topic=24976.msg267713#msg267713

muman613

[muman613]

Freddy Mercury of the band Queen was Zoroastrian.   

Yes, and this song represents the zoroastarian idea of evil and good:

Bohemian Rapsody
Is this the real life-
Is this just fantasy-
Caught in a landslide-
No escape from reality-
Open your eyes
Look up to the skies and see-
Im just a poor boy,i need no sympathy-
Because Im easy come,easy go,
A little high,little low,
Anyway the wind blows,doesnt really matter to me,
To me

Mama,just killed a man,
Put a gun against his head,
Pulled my trigger,now hes dead,
Mama,life had just begun,
But now Ive gone and thrown it all away-
Mama ooo,
Didnt mean to make you cry-
If Im not back again this time tomorrow-
Carry on,carry on,as if nothing really matters-

Too late,my time has come,
Sends shivers down my spine-
Bodys aching all the time,
Goodbye everybody-Ive got to go-
Gotta leave you all behind and face the truth-
Mama ooo- (any way the wind blows)
I dont want to die,
I sometimes wish Id never been born at all-

I see a little silhouetto of a man,
Scaramouche,scaramouche will you do the fandango-
Thunderbolt and lightning-very very frightening me-
Galileo,galileo,
Galileo galileo
Galileo figaro-magnifico-
But Im just a poor boy and nobody loves me-
Hes just a poor boy from a poor family-
Spare him his life from this monstrosity-
Easy come easy go-,will you let me go-
Bismillah! no-,we will not let you go-let him go-
Bismillah! we will not let you go-let him go
Bismillah! we will not let you go-let me go
Will not let you go-let me go
Will not let you go let me go
No,no,no,no,no,no,no-
Mama mia,mama mia,mama mia let me go-
Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me,for me,for me-

So you think you can stone me and spit in my eye-
So you think you can love me and leave me to die-
Oh baby-cant do this to me baby-
Just gotta get out-just gotta get right outta here-

Nothing really matters,
Anyone can see,
Nothing really matters-,nothing really matters to me,

Any way the wind blows....

In no way to I agree with the world view of this song.

muman613

[SavetheWest]

So it's not true monotheism in the sense that it thinks that evil came as a seperate creation.  Does Judaism believe in free will and that G-D gave man free will to choose between good and evil or is it just predetermined?

Sorry for all these questions but I really like learning about these things.   

[Lisa]

So it's not true monotheism in the sense that it thinks that evil came as a seperate creation.  Does Judaism believe in free will and that G-D gave man free will to choose between good and evil or is it just predetermined?

Sorry for all these questions but I really like learning about these things.   

Judaism does believe in free will and that G-d gave man free will to choose between good and evil. 

[Rubystars]

Just to clarify the Christian viewpoint doesn't see satan as equal to G-d. It's generally believed at least among protestants that satan is a rebellious creation of G-d who is nowhere near as powerful. Sort of like evil people who rebel against G-d just more evil because he knew exactly what he was doing with full spiritual knowledge. God is said to have allowed this but will one day put everything right and punish satan and all who followed him and rebelled against God.

[Zelhar]

The pox on these Nazi beasts...

Regarding Zoroastrians from Jewish perspective- They were far better than any other Empire in the ME, including the Babylonians, the Assyrians, the Greeks, the Romans, the Byzantines, and the Muslims.   

The Achmaenid Persians and then the Parthians had traditionally been tolerant to other religions. The Sassanids were much more fanatical with their religion but still relatively tolerated other religions except for eastern Orthodox Christianity whose followers they suspected of siding with their Byzantine enemy.

The fact is that the Jews welcomed and supported the brief conquest of Eretz Israel by the Persians of 614-628 CE. BTW the continous wars between Persia and Byzantine is exactly what enabled Islam to take over the middle east and establish itself as the heir to both empires.

[syyuge]

Looking from their origin, Zoroastrianism theologically believes and supports the AntiG_d struggling against the G_d. Their understanding of the AntiG_d is as the wisest being in the universe rather a kind of omniwisdom. Such a concept can be a basic anathema to all other religions.

In spite of this and other severe shortcomings, I think that they are and were and will be much better than muslamics in all aspects and matters. They simply can not be compared to the muslamics.

They do not convert, they almost never marry outside, so now their population is dwindling and their genetic pool is getting distorted in a mercurial manner. Their present population is nearing 100000 only. Alas! 99% of them are exemplary gentlemen and are extremely successful everywhere. 

The only solution from their oncoming Shushrayantra may be that they all should be made the ruling junta of a free and empty Iran. The fate of OIL wells is to be decided and settled well in advance. 

[GoIsraelGo!]

The Iranian Aryan National Front is a pro Nazi, anti-Semitic, anti-Christian, Holocaust denying organization. 

No decent organization or group of people would display those disgusting swaztikas.  So what if it was an ancient Indian symbol?  After how the Nazis used it, I would be suspect of anyone who would ever display that hated symbol again. 

Before he was banned, Babylonian Jew posted about that site, and I went there for a visit.  That's how I know about them. 

Hi Lisa ...the Nazi's took that symbol and tilted it ...by tilting the symbol it is supposed to bring chaos, death and destruction. The Nazi's ruin anything they touch.

                                                                              Shalom from Dox   

[Rubystars]

Every culture just about had a version of it if they did any kind of weaving at all. However that doesn't change the fact that any use of it on a Jewish forum like this would be completely inappropriate.

[Ulli]

Ruby is right.

High Christianity has no dualist worldview. Perhaps in popular belief is this dualist worldview but nothing of this has a fundament in the Gospels.

The difference between Judaism and Christianity is only, that Satan is in the Christian view self-employed and in the Jewish view employed by god.

But in both views has God, like always, the last word.

I have read in the book of Hiob, that Satan goes everytime before he does something evil to god and asks him for permission. But imo the initiative comes from Satan. 

In a nutshell: Nothing in this world is happening without God's approval. After I have finished the book Hesekiel in depth I know for shure that God is able to approve and to do by himself terrible things. We must do everything in order not to incur the wrath of Him. 

[syyuge]

The Iranian Aryan National Front is a pro Nazi, anti-Semitic, anti-Christian, Holocaust denying organization. 

No decent organization or group of people would display those disgusting swaztikas.  So what if it was an ancient Indian symbol?  After how the Nazis used it, I would be suspect of anyone who would ever display that hated symbol again. 

Before he was banned, Babylonian Jew posted about that site, and I went there for a visit.  That's how I know about them. 

Hi Lisa ...the Nazi's took that symbol and tilted it ...by tilting the symbol it is supposed to bring chaos, death and destruction. The Nazi's ruin anything they touch.
                                                                              Shalom from Dox   

Yes, Reverse swaxtika of the Reverse Aryans can not be good to anyone and such discussions are useless.

[2honest]

That's an interesting issue. I stumbled upon it I when found the letter Umar ibn al Khattab wrote to Yazdgird III when muslim armies conquered Persia. In his reply Yazdgird states that they (Persians/Zoroastrians) consider themselves as Aryans. That happened in the 7th century, so possibly Adolf Hitler took this term and twisted it. I don't know enough about Zoroastrianism to judge if the ancient term Aryan was applied in order to express some kind of supremacy. According to the clip one major zoroastrian slogan was "Good Thoughts, good words, good deeds" which sounds quite reasonable, especially since Yazdgird opposes muslim savagery.
If anyone got reliable sources about Zoroastrian teachings or their history go ahead.     

My sources:

http://www.bozorgbazgasht.com/yazdgird.html