General Category > General Discussion
Large Hadron Collider to recreate big bang, is this dangerous?
Nic Brookes:
--- Quote from: muman613 on September 10, 2008, 04:52:06 PM ---Nic,
So you believe that everything can be known and we have the ability to do what Hashem himself does. I think this is rather vain myself. There is a reason that we dont know everything. I dont have a problem admitting that I will never know everything. As I said earlier, I believe that the more we think we know the less we actually know. But Hashem has HIDDEN HIMSELF on purpose. By smashing atoms or sending probes into space we do not get closer to him, we actually distance ourselves from him.
muman613
--- End quote ---
Nonsense. No, we can't know what God does. However we can see the day to day workings of His creation and become more certain of it's infinite beauty and power by the day. It does not take us closer to God, every discovery made begs another question, which all trace to God. However, looking at least at the parts we as humans can understand is seriously interesting and makes many many many people (even high profile scientists though they do not speak out about it much) very sure of God's existance. Surely this is a good thing. Observing Gods creation as carefully as possibly is exciting, interesting and above all useful in scientific progress. Science deals in fact. The Big Bang is only a theory, therefore it is not scientific. Mass and gravity definitely exist (however they are unexplained) so they are scientific. Surely human nature and the thirst for being as knowledgable about God's creation as possible are excellent justifications for all of this.
Besides, you tell me one place where it says in the Bible that science experiments such as these are not to be carried out.
Raulmarrio2000:
--- Quote ---Is this not because everything has a reason? (That reason can be traced, eventually, back to G-d) How, please do explain, is the quest for knowledge of our existance "vanity"? Surely your argument can be extended that there is no point in learning anything for knowledge to pass down the generations as we'll just die. For example, why bother learning about how to make good music and passing this down the generations when you're just going to die eventually. This is an argument that logically contradicts the notion of the afterlife and I therefore respectfully suggest that it is wrong.
--- End quote ---
If they care about the next generations they would work for a better world, not for curiosity. There are many good things to do for future generations and for the present also. The world establishment is preparing a horrible future.....full of hate and wars. How can they claim that they do this experiments out of love for next generations?
And I don't deny afterlife, but I suppose that, in the Olam Habaa, all neccessary knowledge will be spiritual and provided by Hashem
--- Quote ---And how is this denying G-d's control of the universe AT ALL?! Surely it's confirming that G-d built a universe that is so perfectly governed by hard and fast rules that has been created to an exact specification to allow us to thrive. That's not denying G-d, quite the reverse.
--- End quote ---
We don't know if the world is governed perfectly by rules. We only assume it. What if there is no rule at all, and Hashem not only created the world but is also guiding it at every moment? They assume atoms collisions are safe becasuse it occurs naturally everyday. But is it safe? What if, according to physics, the world should explode every second, but Hashem is doing millions of miracles per second to save us?
The idea that the world was created once and now it is governed by natural rules is contrary to the Torah.
And the Bible has no prohibition against these experiments in written, but Torah is much more than a written text. The Sages forbade to investigate the beggining of the world.
Nic Brookes:
--- Quote from: Raulmarrio2000 on September 10, 2008, 09:01:53 PM ---If they care about the next generations they would work for a better world, not for curiosity. There are many good things to do for future generations and for the present also. The world establishment is preparing a horrible future.....full of hate and wars. How can they claim that they do this experiments out of love for next generations?
And I don't deny afterlife, but I suppose that, in the Olam Habaa, all neccessary knowledge will be spiritual and provided by Hashem
We don't know if the world is governed perfectly by rules. We only assume it. What if there is no rule at all, and Hashem not only created the world but is also guiding it at every moment? They assume atoms collisions are safe becasuse it occurs naturally everyday. But is it safe? What if, according to physics, the world should explode every second, but Hashem is doing millions of miracles per second to save us?
The idea that the world was created once and now it is governed by natural rules is contrary to the Torah.
And the Bible has no prohibition against these experiments in written, but Torah is much more than a written text. The Sages forbade to investigate the beggining of the world.
--- End quote ---
OK let me start by saying I'm not Jewish so I didn't know about what the sages say. My apologies. In any case, they are not investigating the beginning of the world, they are creating conditions they believe to have been present in the beginning to investigate the world as it is at the moment.
While we can't ever know if the world is goverened by laws, we only assume it, this is true of all knowledge we claim to have. How is it anti Torah to say that God created a world which is perfect and has flawless rules governng it? Surely the whole idea of free will revolves round God just "letting us get on with it" which, logically extended would mean that the world would have to be predictable otherwise we wouldn;t know if we are coming or going.
Shlomo:
I do not believe this will cause the world to be destroyed. I've heard the arguments and I think it is silly to think a black hole could be so small. A black hole is a black hole because of the gravity due to mass.
:nuke:
Hashem is completely in full control because G-d has no boundaries or limitations and every day we exist is a miracle. History is not over yet. We have promises from the Torah.
spiritus_persona:
--- Quote from: White Israelite on September 09, 2008, 02:49:41 PM ---I laughed when someone said it could open a portal to an alien world, that reminds me of the video game halflife. Guess i'll be killing headcrabs with a crowbar.
--- End quote ---
That game is FUN! ;D
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