Can we disagree without getting personal, please?

[zachor_ve_kavod]

I'm noticing an awful lot of personal attacks on this forum.  Please keep in mind that we are all committed to the same cause.  We can disagree of course on certain issues, but we should jump all over people because we don't like what they have to say.  While I'm on the subject, I'm willing to bet that we have driven away new members because some senior members accused them of being trolls.  We do get trolls, to be sure, but we must also keep in mind that it is very unlikely that new members will see things our way 100% of the time.  They have to be educated first.  If we want to grow, we need to hang on to our senior members, while attracting new ones.  Posters need to feel that they can post freely.

I was quite impressed a week ago, how Chaim handled one particular situation.  A member told Chaim on Ask JTF that he had voted for Obama and would understand if he would be banned for this.  Chaim read him the riot act for this but said that of course he would not be banned.  I think this was the right thing to do.  We are not a fascist organization.  We can tolerate differences of opinion.  We don't have to be shy about telling a member when we think he is out of line, but we don't have to attack him personally.

There are rivalries on this forum.  This is nothing new.  Let them work their problems out on their own.  Don't jump in with your own personal attack on a member.  We have business to attend to.  Let's attend to it.

[Vito]

You're absolutely right. Attacking each other gets us further from our main goals, that's exactly what the enemy wants.

[Xoce]

 

[Lisa]

I agree with Zachor.  Let's keep it all civil. 

[q_q_]

regarding new members being accused of being trolls.

I have mentioned this before. Even if you think they are trolls, it doesn't help to say so on the forum, because it disrupts things(which is what trolls want). And if they are not then we could lose a new member.  If they are trolls, the only people that can do anything useful about it are the moderators, banning them, all done behind the scenes. It's not like an unmoderated forum where nothing can be done and all that can be done is warn people that the person is a troll and should be ignored. That is not the way to do things on a moderated forum, we have a better system.

[Americanhero1]

I agree with you  q_q_ .

[Daleksfearme]

Great Points....I agree completely.

[Shamgar]

I agree with you  q_q_ .

Hey AH. Shut the heck up.

[Americanhero1]

I agree with you  q_q_ .

Hey AH. Shut the heck up.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

regarding new members being accused of being trolls.

I have mentioned this before. Even if you think they are trolls, it doesn't help to say so on the forum, because it disrupts things(which is what trolls want). And if they are not then we could lose a new member.  If they are trolls, the only people that can do anything useful about it are the moderators, banning them, all done behind the scenes. It's not like an unmoderated forum where nothing can be done and all that can be done is warn people that the person is a troll and should be ignored. That is not the way to do things on a moderated forum, we have a better system.

So are you saying it is not legitimate to question members who are not new that defend Neturei Karta in every post?

[Americanhero1]

regarding new members being accused of being trolls.

I have mentioned this before. Even if you think they are trolls, it doesn't help to say so on the forum, because it disrupts things(which is what trolls want). And if they are not then we could lose a new member.  If they are trolls, the only people that can do anything useful about it are the moderators, banning them, all done behind the scenes. It's not like an unmoderated forum where nothing can be done and all that can be done is warn people that the person is a troll and should be ignored. That is not the way to do things on a moderated forum, we have a better system.

So are you saying it is not legitimate to question members who are not new that defend Neturei Karta in every post?

Hey I was called a Troll when I first joined by certain members but look what happened

[q_q_]

regarding new members being accused of being trolls.

I have mentioned this before. Even if you think they are trolls, it doesn't help to say so on the forum, because it disrupts things(which is what trolls want). And if they are not then we could lose a new member.  If they are trolls, the only people that can do anything useful about it are the moderators, banning them, all done behind the scenes. It's not like an unmoderated forum where nothing can be done and all that can be done is warn people that the person is a troll and should be ignored. That is not the way to do things on a moderated forum, we have a better system.

So are you saying it is not legitimate to question members who are not new that defend Neturei Karta in every post?

C.F. is this post a defence of neturei karta? (yes or no)

That's a simple question with 2 possible answers.

[q_q_]

C.F.   it's really not a difficult question. It's a Yes or No question.

[George]

Controversy makes things interesting. There are many off limit topics on this forum and I think this is a mistake. For example, if someone thinks 9/11 is a government conspiracy then they should be welcome to express themselves and if the forum members want to debate that then they will. If they don't then the topic will die so let the members decide. When admins rule with an iron fist forums decline and people lose interest. I've seen this happen before.

[cjd]

911 was a muzzy conspiracy plain and simple. No debate needed. To open that avenue only clouds the waters and take peoples minds off the real culprits. Debate is fine however this forum has an agenda an debates that undermine it should not be entertained. The forum is open to most reasonable issues so I don't see where your being restricted in your posts. If you were it was most likely for a good reason.

[Abben]

fighting will get us no where. I have seen a few trolls on this board and I am pretty sure they are banned here.

[Daleksfearme]

I think a great deal depends on how a question is posed. For example if a young person joins the forum and has honest questions about a topic like 9/11, then I think its fine for them to have a safe place to ask so that they can Be exposed to the truth. Or for those people who may be struggling with their faith and / or other issues I also think that the forum should be a safe place to help them in re connecting.

However if someone on the forum is presenting an opinion that is directly at odds with the beliefs of JTF, it should be made clear to them that after a certain point a topic may be locked or removed as to preserve the integrity of the forum as a whole. Or in the worse case situation they could be banned if they were to be actively attempting to disrupt the forum or entering into personal attacks threats etc.

[muman613]

Honest questions are one thing but some people have an agenda to make people beleive in conspiracies about 9/11. This topic is very distressing to me for reasons most here are aware {Personal loss in the event}. It is clear who the enemy is and to spend time debating someone who has such a distorted view of events is simply foolish.

What I think the original posting was referring to is that there is often a lot of evil speech and slander amongst members who are not trolls. I would love to see that there is less name calling and derrogatory speech going on amongst the JTF members whos opinions all contribute to the same goal of spreading JTFs ideals.

I hope that everyone has had a wonderful holiday week.

[George]

911 was a muzzy conspiracy plain and simple. No debate needed. To open that avenue only clouds the waters and take peoples minds off the real culprits. Debate is fine however this forum has an agenda an debates that undermine it should not be entertained. The forum is open to most reasonable issues so I don't see where your being restricted in your posts. If you were it was most likely for a good reason.

Not true. The Muslims said the Jews did it but there are non-Muslims who say the government knew about it and did nothing to try to stop it. Even Rice admitted that they knew something big was coming but didn't publicize this information so that there wouldn't be panic in America. The majority of the non-Muslim conspiracy theorists are Leftist/Communist scum who claim they used 9/11 as an excuse to invade Afghanistan and Iraq.

[muman613]

911 was a muzzy conspiracy plain and simple. No debate needed. To open that avenue only clouds the waters and take peoples minds off the real culprits. Debate is fine however this forum has an agenda an debates that undermine it should not be entertained. The forum is open to most reasonable issues so I don't see where your being restricted in your posts. If you were it was most likely for a good reason.

Not true. The Muslims said the Jews did it but there are non-Muslims who say the government knew about it and did nothing to try to stop it. Even Rice admitted that they knew something big was coming but didn't publicize this information so that there wouldn't be panic in America. The majority of the non-Muslim conspiracy theorists are Leftist/Communist scum who claim they used 9/11 as an excuse to invade Afghanistan and Iraq.

Nobody ever denied that they knew 'something' was going to happen. This goes all the way back to Clinton when OBL first appears on our intelligence horizon. But this doesn't make a conspiracy where they claim that explosives were placed in the building {which is so hysterical in a sick way}.

I think the conspiracy issues have been addressed in previous threads... Let us not reignite that discussion.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Not true. The Muslims said the Jews did it but there are non-Muslims who say the government knew about it and did nothing to try to stop it. Even Rice admitted that they knew something big was coming but didn't publicize this information so that there wouldn't be panic in America. The majority of the non-Muslim conspiracy theorists are Leftist/Communist scum who claim they used 9/11 as an excuse to invade Afghanistan and Iraq.

Ralph, don't you have some threads about black jawlines to make?

[George]

Ralph, don't you have some threads about black jawlines to make?

No I don't because anyone who knows anything about boxing understands that they dominate this sport because of their stronger jaws. But I think you may want to discuss your fetish for Condaleeza and Arab women: http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php/topic,5812.msg46938.html#msg46938

[Mishmaat]

Philip, why are you agitating C.F.?

I mean c'mon already. Let's just drop this!

[q_q_]

C.F.   it's really not a difficult question. It's a Yes or No question.

C.F.   If you really cannot even answer whether that post defends neturei karta, then you have no business judging whether any post defends neturei karta.

[Lisa]

Can we all stop this bickering, please?