Author Topic: A Word About Racism  (Read 3128 times)

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Offline JewishAmericanPatriot

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #25 on: February 09, 2009, 03:11:53 PM »
wait a second a roma is a romanian...

There are some nice ones and some terrible ones out there...

I don't think a Roma is the same thing as a Romanian. Roma are originally from India. Romanians are white Europeans.

The Roma and Sinti people are both families of Gypsies, who were persecuted by Hitler (ym"sh).  This article explains:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinti

I have known Jews who have been against the Gypsy people.  My father's lady friend is a Hungarian Jew who considers the Gypsies to be a bunch of thieves.  She never claimed that they are this way because they are racially inferior though.  So you can say that she has a bias against this group of people, and it might be an unfair bias, a bigotry even, but it's not based on race.

Do Jews in general have a particular bias against the Roma?  I don't know, I doubt it.  But I would bet that any existing biases of this kind would not be based on assumptions about racial inferiority.  Therefore it is not racism.  Let's call bigoty bigotry and racism racism.

I had an experience last year that distressed me.

My youngest daughter attends a Chabad Hebrew school, and she came home one day and asked me "why do gypsies steal babies?" And I said, "Where in the world did you get such a crazy idea?" She said, "Morah (teacher) told me it."

I went to the school and it turned out to be a teacher from Eastern Europe...I had a LONG talk with her, and gave her some printed info about the history of the Romani people, showing how THEIR children were often kidnapped (esp. in Bohemia) by non-Roma!

I told her that we of all people should not spread false stories like that, because that kind of stuff has often been done to US.

It would be one thing if what she said was based on a TRUE story, but the idea of Roma stealing babies is so old and so untrue...its like the one about all Jews being commuunists or moneylenders!

I understand your point, but you should know that there are in fact a large number of Jews who were and who are communists.  Also, Jews were money lenders.  In this they had no choice--it was often the only profession that they were allowed to engage in.  So to condemn Jews for being money lenders is absurd, as they were forced into it.  Also, to condemn Jews for being communists in the early part of the 20th century is absurd.  Nobody could have known what kind of disasters communism would lead to.  But Jews who are communists today should know better.

Oh don't worry, I'm WELL aware of that! I was just trying to say that there are stereotypes that may have once been true, but generally are not anymore. And there are also stereotypes that were never true.

In the Middle Ages, Jews were falsely accused of using Christian blood for Pesach rituals. Interestingly, the ancient Christians were falsely accused by the pagan Romans of killing Roman children to use THEIR blood for Communion!

The Roma often had their children kidnapped from them to be raised as non-Roma, and to accuse them of doing the same, in my mind is just reprehensible.
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Offline Ulli

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #26 on: February 09, 2009, 03:43:07 PM »
The baby issue I read very often, but only in very old books.

I think Roma families have a lot of work with maintaining their own children, so this accusation is bogus.
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Offline White Israelite

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #27 on: February 09, 2009, 03:45:23 PM »
wait a second a roma is a romanian...

There are some nice ones and some terrible ones out there...

I don't think a Roma is the same thing as a Romanian. Roma are originally from India. Romanians are white Europeans.

The Roma and Sinti people are both families of Gypsies, who were persecuted by Hitler (ym"sh).  This article explains:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinti

I have known Jews who have been against the Gypsy people.  My father's lady friend is a Hungarian Jew who considers the Gypsies to be a bunch of thieves.  She never claimed that they are this way because they are racially inferior though.  So you can say that she has a bias against this group of people, and it might be an unfair bias, a bigotry even, but it's not based on race.

Do Jews in general have a particular bias against the Roma?  I don't know, I doubt it.  But I would bet that any existing biases of this kind would not be based on assumptions about racial inferiority.  Therefore it is not racism.  Let's call bigoty bigotry and racism racism.

I had an experience last year that distressed me.

My youngest daughter attends a Chabad Hebrew school, and she came home one day and asked me "why do gypsies steal babies?" And I said, "Where in the world did you get such a crazy idea?" She said, "Morah (teacher) told me it."

I went to the school and it turned out to be a teacher from Eastern Europe...I had a LONG talk with her, and gave her some printed info about the history of the Romani people, showing how THEIR children were often kidnapped (esp. in Bohemia) by non-Roma!

I told her that we of all people should not spread false stories like that, because that kind of stuff has often been done to US.

It would be one thing if what she said was based on a TRUE story, but the idea of Roma stealing babies is so old and so untrue...its like the one about all Jews being commuunists or moneylenders!

I understand your point, but you should know that there are in fact a large number of Jews who were and who are communists.  Also, Jews were money lenders.  In this they had no choice--it was often the only profession that they were allowed to engage in.  So to condemn Jews for being money lenders is absurd, as they were forced into it.  Also, to condemn Jews for being communists in the early part of the 20th century is absurd.  Nobody could have known what kind of disasters communism would lead to.  But Jews who are communists today should know better.

I think a large reason many Jews became communist after World War II is that they associated the right wing with Nazism/Fascism/Nationalism so they felt that communism was the direct opposite of Nazism to equality/peace/freedom. If you watch left wing Jewish documentaries, many of the left wingers try to tie things to Nazis.

Take an example

Many of the Leftist Jews that are for illegal immigration justify it because of the fact that many countries would not allow Jews into their countries during World War II.

Leftists justify this from the following verse

"You shall not aggrieve a stranger or oppress him, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt" (Exodus 22:20)

Gun Control which is a typical leftist notion comes from the following.

Rav Nosson says that a person is not allowed to raise a dangerous dog, or to place a weak ladder in his home, because the Torah says (Devarim 22:8) "V'Lo Sosim Domim B'Vaysechah" (And You Should Not Place Blood [Danger] In Your House). The Maharsha explains that the Torah is teaching us that even though what you are doing may be no threat to your own family since they are known to the dog or aware that the ladder is weak, and even though you are raising this dog only for protection from burglars, it is still forbidden to keep this danger in your home. The Sefer HaChinuch (Mitzvah 547) writes that this prohibition even applies if the danger could only cause harm and not death. (See the Teshuvos Dvar Avraham Vol. 1 Ch. 37:25, and the Chazon Ish in Likutim Ch 18 & 19).

They claim because it's a tool that creates danger in the home that a Jew should not have a gun and therefore feel gentiles should not have them in their home either.

Nationalism, of course this is related to Nazi Germany, the notion that Jewish communists and leftists claim that race does not exist and blaming the white man for racism is done out of fear due to history of pogroms in Europe and being removed or expelled from countries.

I truly think the majority of Jewish communists after World War II became communists because they felt it was as far away from Nazism and nationalism possible when in reality, the two are really quite similar.

Nazism and Communism really aren't very different at all, to believe that the Soviet Union wasn't a racist country is putting it mildly, the Soviet Union expelled Jews to the east and many of the races were kept separate from each other although there was no official government policy, but it was still put in place. Both were socialist which government had authority and control.

Todays communists, you have leaders and followers. The leaders are well aware of what they are doing, the followers are not. Just like Nazi Germany, today's youth are brainwashed to believe that the United States is the new Nazi Germany and that capitalism is evil or that we are imperialist, therefore as a means of rebel, many youth believe communism is far to the left of what the US is (although technically we have become socialist).

One thing for sure, communists, nazis, blacks, socialists, liberals, muslims seem to all agree that we the Jews are their greatest enemy and will work together to destroy us, what does that tell ya?

Offline ag337

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #28 on: February 09, 2009, 04:09:10 PM »
It has been my experience more than often, that those who accuse others of racism are the most bigoted and racists of all.

Offline Rubystars

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #29 on: February 09, 2009, 04:28:49 PM »
wait a second a roma is a romanian...

There are some nice ones and some terrible ones out there...

I don't think a Roma is the same thing as a Romanian. Roma are originally from India. Romanians are white Europeans.

As someone with Romanian blood, i'd feel pretty insulted if someone called me a Roma, that'd be like calling a British person Irish or something.

I knew that Romanians I'd seen on tv looked absolutely nothing like Roma.

My dad said one of his friends used to tell their kids that when the ice cream truck was coming it was the gypsies and they had to hide or they'd be stolen away. That was to avoid having to pay for ice cream. I think it's mean but the story still makes me laugh.

Offline White Israelite

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #30 on: February 09, 2009, 04:30:55 PM »
wait a second a roma is a romanian...

There are some nice ones and some terrible ones out there...

I don't think a Roma is the same thing as a Romanian. Roma are originally from India. Romanians are white Europeans.

As someone with Romanian blood, i'd feel pretty insulted if someone called me a Roma, that'd be like calling a British person Irish or something.

I knew that Romanians I'd seen on tv looked absolutely nothing like Roma.

I was about to say, does my dad look like a Roma to you?



I'd donkey slap someone if they said he does minus the Jew fro.

Offline GoIsraelGo!

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #31 on: February 09, 2009, 05:32:48 PM »
wait a second a roma is a romanian...

There are some nice ones and some terrible ones out there...

I don't think a Roma is the same thing as a Romanian. Roma are originally from India. Romanians are white Europeans.

As someone with Romanian blood, i'd feel pretty insulted if someone called me a Roma, that'd be like calling a British person Irish or something.

I knew that Romanians I'd seen on tv looked absolutely nothing like Roma.

I was about to say, does my dad look like a Roma to you?



I'd donkey slap someone if they said he does minus the Jew fro.

Hi WhiteIsraelite, your dad is handsome and his hair style was popular in the seventies. I am assuming the picture was taken in the seventies or early eighties. Thank you for sharing his picture with the forum.

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« Last Edit: February 09, 2009, 06:09:59 PM by republicandox »

Offline ProudAndZionist

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #32 on: February 09, 2009, 06:03:10 PM »
The biggest difference between Romas(Gypsies) and Romanians, that Romanians have country, Gypsies have not homeland, they came somewhere from Pakistan or North-India 500 years ago.
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Offline muman613

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #33 on: February 09, 2009, 06:19:54 PM »
My boss is Romanian and he sounds like Dracula too... Actually there are about four Romanians who I work with at my company... I have not heard anything derogatory from these co-workers.
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Offline Inquiring Mind

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #34 on: February 11, 2009, 01:19:56 AM »


I would like to see no racism anywhere.  It certainly is not on this forum.  A good start in eliminating racism is to first only label as racist that which is racist.  And start using language properly. 

Some members here stereotype all romas as criminals and some even call them animals. Thats clearly racist, i didnt expectet that from jews since we have a similar history of suffering and persecution i thought we are friends.


What are Romas and why do you claim that (all) "jews" are racist? I'm a Jew...I"m not racist against romas in that I particularly don't know what one is...So quit stereoptyping that all jews are racists against romas...

Romas are also called gypsies.

And a good chunk of those "Romas" are muslims.

The Muslim Gypsies in Romania are Sunnites of the Hanafitic rite

Majority of european romas are christians, catholic, protestant or orthodox only a small minority are muslims.
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Offline ProudAndZionist

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #35 on: February 11, 2009, 08:07:15 AM »


I would like to see no racism anywhere.  It certainly is not on this forum.  A good start in eliminating racism is to first only label as racist that which is racist.  And start using language properly. 

Some members here stereotype all romas as criminals and some even call them animals. Thats clearly racist, i didnt expectet that from jews since we have a similar history of suffering and persecution i thought we are friends.


What are Romas and why do you claim that (all) "jews" are racist? I'm a Jew...I"m not racist against romas in that I particularly don't know what one is...So quit stereoptyping that all jews are racists against romas...

Romas are also called gypsies.

And a good chunk of those "Romas" are muslims.

The Muslim Gypsies in Romania are Sunnites of the Hanafitic rite

Majority of european romas are christians, catholic, protestant or orthodox only a small minority are muslims.

Most of the members know them as "Gypsy". Well that's why they robbed a synagogue in Veszprém county, where few days ago they killed a famous Romanian handball player by knife, and attacked a Serb and Croat guys too?
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Offline ChaimBenMordechai

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Re: A Word About Racism
« Reply #36 on: February 11, 2009, 10:33:22 AM »
It has been my experience more than often, that those who accuse others of racism are the most bigoted and racists of all.

You got that right!