Author Topic: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?  (Read 8597 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #25 on: November 16, 2010, 11:17:44 AM »
Rabin's newly rediscovered last speech to The Knesset, on October 5, 1995, in which he defies the Peres/Oslo "peace" process with the declaration that,
"We will not return to the 4 June 1967 lines ...First and foremost, united Jerusalem ...as the capital of Israel, under Israeli sovereignty."
"The security border of the State of Israel will be located in the Jordan Valley... The establishment of blocs of settlements in Judea and Samaria, like the one in Gush Katif."[/color]       


This is coming from the same criminal who once said that they will never talk to the PLO terrorists because he doesn't negotiate with terrorists.   Come on, do you really expect us to belief this nonsense?

Perhaps this was only his initial bargaining stance and would negotiate from there.   You are acting like a few things  he referred to in a  speech was a religious dogma he followed.

How many Israeli prime ministers have told us that Jerusalem will not be divided, including Bibi (And now they are dividing it), and how many told us that we would not retreat to the Auschwitz borders (And yet they want to do this)?     Your position makes no logical sense, and it requires a great deal of leap in faith to believe in it.   A leap of faith fitting only for a very naive and gullible person.

You want to believe Rabin backed out, and therefore you believe.

You want to believe Peres "took him out" because of misgivings, and therefore you believe.

Offline Secularbeliever

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1957
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #26 on: November 16, 2010, 11:37:57 AM »
Rabin's newly rediscovered last speech to The Knesset, on October 5, 1995, in which he defies the Peres/Oslo "peace" process with the declaration that,
"We will not return to the 4 June 1967 lines ...First and foremost, united Jerusalem ...as the capital of Israel, under Israeli sovereignty."
"The security border of the State of Israel will be located in the Jordan Valley... The establishment of blocs of settlements in Judea and Samaria, like the one in Gush Katif."[/color]       


This is coming from the same criminal who once said that they will never talk to the PLO terrorists because he doesn't negotiate with terrorists.   Come on, do you really expect us to belief this nonsense?

Perhaps this was only his initial bargaining stance and would negotiate from there.   You are acting like a few things  he referred to in a  speech was a religious dogma he followed.

How many Israeli prime ministers have told us that Jerusalem will not be divided, including Bibi (And now they are dividing it), and how many told us that we would not retreat to the Auschwitz borders (And yet they want to do this)?     Your position makes no logical sense, and it requires a great deal of leap in faith to believe in it.   A leap of faith fitting only for a very naive and gullible person.

You want to believe Rabin backed out, and therefore you believe.

You want to believe Peres "took him out" because of misgivings, and therefore you believe.

Nethanyahu and Sharon said similar things.
We all need to pray for Barack Obama, may the Lord provide him a safe move back to Chicago in January 2,013.

Offline Secularbeliever

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1957
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #27 on: November 16, 2010, 11:39:30 AM »
The conspiracists will tell you that Rabin was actually on the verge of pulling out of Oslo,


The only problem is, there is no evidence to support this.

To the contrary he was at a celebration of Oslo when he was killed.
We all need to pray for Barack Obama, may the Lord provide him a safe move back to Chicago in January 2,013.

Offline mord

  • Global Moderator
  • Platinum JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 25853
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2010, 11:56:00 AM »
So Feiglin is only slightly above the Rubins who condemned Pollard 
Thy destroyers and they that make thee waste shall go forth of thee.  Isaiah 49:17

 
Shot at 2010-01-03

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #29 on: November 16, 2010, 12:43:17 PM »
So Feiglin is only slightly above the Rubins who condemned Pollard 

No, not really.

Do you know how many times Moshe Feiglin has visited Pollard in jail and openly called upon the Israeli govt to bring about his release?

Do you know how often Feiglin has said the disengagement must be resisted?   

Do not compare Feiglin with the animals who said Sharon is king and Jews must go.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 23384
  • Real Kahanist
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #30 on: November 16, 2010, 05:14:11 PM »
Feiglin is the best of the establishment, or the worst of the reformist right, depending on whether you are a glass half-full/glass half-empty guy.

I said he would be an improvement over the Israeli regime, but he's not the real answer. Hayamin is.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #31 on: November 16, 2010, 05:22:16 PM »
He's really not part of the establishment.   The establishment calls him a fascist and has tried to compare him to Hitler y's.

Offline wonga66

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1039
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #32 on: November 17, 2010, 03:04:24 AM »


http://israelinsider.net/profiles/blogs/dalia-rabin-my-father

Dalia Rabin: My father considered stopping the Oslo process due to terrorism.

The daughter of Yitzhak Rabin confirmed what until now only "conspiracy theorists" have dared to claim: that on the eve of his mysterious assassination he was seriously considering declaring an end to the "Oslo" process because of the terrorist attacks. Dalia Rabin-Philosoph, interviewed in the Seven Days magazine supplement of Yediot Ahronot, published Friday, 8 October, said: "Many people who were close to father told me that on the eve of the murder he considered stopping the Oslo process because of the terror that was running rampant in the streets and that Arafat wasn't delivering the goods."

"Father, after all, wasn't a blind man running forward without thought. I don't rule out the possibility that he considered also doing a reverse on
our side. After all, he was someone for whom the security of the state was sacrosanct.

"So they say that Oslo brought Arafat and gave them rifles and caused the intifada. But historical processes develop, change and flow. It is
impossible to take a person murdered in '95 and judge him according to what happened in 2000," she said.

Those who have claimed that Rabin's second thoughts about concessions to the Palestinians may have cost him his life have long been marginalized for believing that left-leaning, foreign-funded forces used a faction inside Israel's Shin Bet domestic security to eliminate Rabin and replace him with the unreservedly dovish Shimon Peres, who became PM after the assassination and now serves as Israel's President.

Those who believe that there was a conspiracy say that convicted assassin Yigal Amir was a patsy. Dalia Rabin's statement that her father was considering "reversing" the bloody "peace process" provides a motive for why the left, not the right, may have wanted Rabin replaced.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2010, 03:27:58 AM by wonga66 »

Offline mord

  • Global Moderator
  • Platinum JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 25853
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #33 on: November 17, 2010, 05:56:04 AM »
Clinton must have killed Rabin the Clintons have a long history of killing business rivals
Thy destroyers and they that make thee waste shall go forth of thee.  Isaiah 49:17

 
Shot at 2010-01-03

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 23384
  • Real Kahanist
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #34 on: November 17, 2010, 05:59:58 AM »
KWRBT: At one time Avigwhore Lieberman, Israel's Pruneface, was also called a "racist" and anti-establishment and that was obviously a shell game that the regime was playing in order to fool gullible Russian Jewish voters. I'm not saying Feiglin is in his category by any stretch, or that he will ever be treated well by the establishment, but the fact of the matter is that he wants to be part of the establishment. He is a Likud member and urges Israelis to vote Likud. He makes politically-correct statements to make himself more acceptable to the establishment. If that isn't establishment, what is?

Wonga: Are you really telling us that we should take the word of the daughter of a Nazi-collaborating slimeball?

Offline wonga66

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1039
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #35 on: November 17, 2010, 06:55:21 AM »
Kahane was called "a Nazi". Chaim has been called "a Nazi". Chamish has been called a "Nazi-toady". Feiglin has been called a "Nazi-racist". Ben Gvir, Marzel, Federman etc have been called "Nazi-lackeys". And now Rabin's daughter a "Nazi-collaborator"!

Is there anyone who isn't "a Nazi"?! There people who'd call you a "Nazi-shill" for frequenting this forum!

Together with Rabin's October 1995 Knesset speech, I believe her.

And that would give "TPTB-NWO" more than enough motive to take Rabin out, install Peres and take the Right down all at the same time, thanks to the "Nazi-murderer" Amir!
« Last Edit: November 17, 2010, 07:01:15 AM by wonga66 »

Offline Secularbeliever

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1957
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #36 on: November 17, 2010, 11:43:56 AM »
Kahane was called "a Nazi". Chaim has been called "a Nazi". Chamish has been called a "Nazi-toady". Feiglin has been called a "Nazi-racist". Ben Gvir, Marzel, Federman etc have been called "Nazi-lackeys". And now Rabin's daughter a "Nazi-collaborator"!

Is there anyone who isn't "a Nazi"?! There people who'd call you a "Nazi-shill" for frequenting this forum!

Together with Rabin's October 1995 Knesset speech, I believe her.

And that would give "TPTB-NWO" more than enough motive to take Rabin out, install Peres and take the Right down all at the same time, thanks to the "Nazi-murderer" Amir!
When assessing who to believe you should go by the facts that you know instead of what you hope for.  The undisputable fact is that Rabin was attending a rally celebrating Oslo when he was killed.  That outweighs any loose talk about how Oslo wasn't working out like he hoped.  Do you think Sharon and Nethanyahu have not at times told people that Arafat, Abbas, Bush, Obama are liars, not lived up to promises, announced a red line that cannot be crossed yet is, etc.  Yet they keep going back for more.  Everyone at this point knows that Oslo has been a fiasco but nobody knows how to walk away from it.  It is one of the great ironies of life.
We all need to pray for Barack Obama, may the Lord provide him a safe move back to Chicago in January 2,013.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #37 on: November 17, 2010, 12:31:18 PM »


Dalia Rabin: My father considered stopping the Oslo process due to terrorism.


What does it mean "consider?"   He had a thought.   

So who read his mind and decided to kill him?   


This is ridiculous.     Maybe once or twice he thought to himself, "maybe I'm actually an idiot."  But that didn't stop him from shaking arafats hand inviting his thugs and promoting his peace charade in the "rabin square"

His daughter is trying to save face for her father's "glorious legacy" because she knows THE PUBLIC IS AGAINST OSLO.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2010, 12:38:01 PM by Kahane-Was-Right BT »

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #38 on: November 17, 2010, 12:36:19 PM »
KWRBT: At one time Avigwhore Lieberman, Israel's Pruneface, was also called a "racist" and anti-establishment
  But he's clearly not.

DBF, you don't know who Feiglin is or what he's about.   Give this a rest.   He cannot be called part of the establishment by any stretch of imagination.   By the phonies in his party, including Bibi, he is considered a "usurper" who is trying to take over the party and turn it into religious zionism (or fascism, or whatever their stupid accusations are).  He has said from the beginning he's trying to take over the likud from within, and that is his strategy to achieve the goal of a JEWISH Israel.    A Jewish Israel is anti the establishment by definition because they do not want a Jewish state. 

JTF disagrees with Moshe on his tactics, on his strategy that he is using to achieve his goal.   Chaim has said it hurts the national camp and diverts resources.   But you are extending that argument to say that his goals are wrong and he's a phony rightwinger like bibi.   No one can possibly claim that !

Do you know that he led the only meaningful protest movement against the Oslo accords when they first came about?   Do you know that he and a small group of activists called Zo Artzeinu got many thousands of people to flood the streets and bring traffic to a stop in protest of oslo?      He began his political career after seeing that the protests by themselves aren't enough, especially when they succeeded in a "rightwing revolution" in the aftermath when bibi got elected to replace peres, but then he turned around and continued the disastrous policy of the left rather than uprooting it.

Quote
he wants to be part of the establishment.
Not really.  He wants to take it over (and change it) from within.   He thinks it can only be achieved by fighting from within the system in order to then break the system and change it.  What you are saying is incorrect.

Offline Yaakov Mendel

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Master JTFer
  • *
  • Posts: 1766
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #39 on: November 17, 2010, 02:49:56 PM »
KWRBT: At one time Avigwhore Lieberman, Israel's Pruneface, was also called a "racist" and anti-establishment
  But he's clearly not.

DBF, you don't know who Feiglin is or what he's about.   Give this a rest.   He cannot be called part of the establishment by any stretch of imagination.   By the phonies in his party, including Bibi, he is considered a "usurper" who is trying to take over the party and turn it into religious zionism (or fascism, or whatever their stupid accusations are).  He has said from the beginning he's trying to take over the likud from within, and that is his strategy to achieve the goal of a JEWISH Israel.    A Jewish Israel is anti the establishment by definition because they do not want a Jewish state. 

JTF disagrees with Moshe on his tactics, on his strategy that he is using to achieve his goal.   Chaim has said it hurts the national camp and diverts resources.   But you are extending that argument to say that his goals are wrong and he's a phony rightwinger like bibi.   No one can possibly claim that !

Do you know that he led the only meaningful protest movement against the Oslo accords when they first came about?   Do you know that he and a small group of activists called Zo Artzeinu got many thousands of people to flood the streets and bring traffic to a stop in protest of oslo?      He began his political career after seeing that the protests by themselves aren't enough, especially when they succeeded in a "rightwing revolution" in the aftermath when bibi got elected to replace peres, but then he turned around and continued the disastrous policy of the left rather than uprooting it.

Quote
he wants to be part of the establishment.
Not really.  He wants to take it over (and change it) from within.   He thinks it can only be achieved by fighting from within the system in order to then break the system and change it.  What you are saying is incorrect.


Here is an interview of Feiglin that, I think, pretty much substantiates what you say :

http://www.jewishmag.com/107mag/feiglin/feiglin.htm

I must say I do have sympathy for Feiglin. He is a good Jew and a good person in general. But his political tactics are very questionable. Maybe he is too naive.

« Last Edit: November 17, 2010, 03:08:20 PM by yaakov mendel »

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 23384
  • Real Kahanist
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #40 on: November 17, 2010, 06:48:52 PM »
I didn't say he was scum of the earth, or useless, or as bad as Lewinsky--nothing of the sort. However, the fact that he is a Likud member, believes in empowering the Likud (even if his motives are better than Lewinsky's), believes that "reforming" the Likud is the answer, and especially the fact that he treacherously denounced two Jews much more righteous than he is, one of whom died saving Jewish lives, are all ample proof that he is establishment or at least wants to be establishment. Would I vote for him if the choice were him vs. Lewinsky, Hitler, or Holemert? Obviously, but it doesn't mean that he would have been my first choice.

Getting criticized by the establishment doesn't mean you are anti-establishment. I'm sure you remember when the clowns Newt Gingrich, Bob Barr, etc. were called militants, extremists, right-wing radicals, etc. by the Democratic Party and the media. Did that make them so? Were they real revolutionaries of any sort?

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #41 on: November 17, 2010, 08:00:02 PM »
are all ample proof that he is establishment or at least wants to be establishment.

I don't find the things you listed as proof of anything like that.

Quote
Getting criticized by the establishment doesn't mean you are anti-establishment. 

I didn't say that that in itself makes him anti-establishment.  You are ignoring the bigger picture.  It's simple: at this point in time, Jewish state = anti-establishment.

Quote
I'm sure you remember when the clowns Newt Gingrich, Bob Barr, etc. were called militants, extremists, right-wing radicals, etc. by the Democratic Party and the media. Did that make them so? Were they real revolutionaries of any sort?

No comparison.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 23384
  • Real Kahanist
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #42 on: November 17, 2010, 08:40:27 PM »
I don't find the things you listed as proof of anything like that.
How are they not?

I'd probably call Feiglin the Mike Huckabee of Israel--the best candidate that's out there right now, quite a bit superior to anybody in power, sincerely caring for Israel, but still a member of the establishment, with plenty of flaws.

Quote
I didn't say that that in itself makes him anti-establishment.  You are ignoring the bigger picture.  It's simple: at this point in time, Jewish state = anti-establishment.
I don't think it's quite that cut and dry. Yes he supports the survival of the Jewish people but his tactics for doing so--working within and becoming a part of the establishment, and reassuring the Bolshevik regime that he hates the "extremists" Amir and Goldstein (may the L-rd avenge his blood)--are solidly and firmly establishment tactics.

Quote
No comparison.
It was meant to be an exaggerated example to prove a point, not a 1:1 analogy. I already compared him to Huckabee, which I think Chaim and most Jews would call perfectly fair.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #43 on: November 17, 2010, 09:03:22 PM »
I don't find the things you listed as proof of anything like that.
How are they not?

I'd probably call Feiglin the Mike Huckabee of Israel--the best candidate that's out there right now, quite a bit superior to anybody in power, sincerely caring for Israel, but still a member of the establishment, with plenty of flaws.   

There is no human being who does not have flaws.

That doesn't make him an "establishment politician."  Sorry.

As to 'how are they not' - because there's no connection.
Quote
Quote
I didn't say that that in itself makes him anti-establishment.  You are ignoring the bigger picture.  It's simple: at this point in time, Jewish state = anti-establishment.
I don't think it's quite that cut and dry. Yes he supports the survival of the Jewish people but his tactics for doing so--working within and becoming a part of the establishment, and reassuring the Bolshevik regime that he hates the "extremists" Amir and Goldstein (may the L-rd avenge his blood)--are solidly and firmly establishment tactics. 

It's funny to me that you phrase it like this, so self-assured about what you think you know of Moshe.   Did you ever stop to think that maybe it's simply his opinion, and he is not saying anything for anyone else's benefit but because he actually believes it?     What is so impossible that he actually believes that it's wrong to kill vigilante style?   I don't see an indication that says to me he's saying that to make the establishment like him.   He says enough things that make them hate him.   To me it may just be that's how he feels about it, right or wrong.

"He supports the survival of the Jewish people" - well, yes, he does, but I said something far more significant than that-   He promotes the notion of a Jewish state and his policies aim at this goal.   At this point in time, this notion is anti-establishment.   Very cut and dry.

Offline wonga66

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1039
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #44 on: November 17, 2010, 09:28:22 PM »
Feiglin has said that if he was Israeli PM, he would answer Obama and the World about Israel's right to exist and the Jewish claim to the Land of Israel solely with English & Hebrew verses slowly quoted on a podium from a giant Gold-Leafed Tanach, with audio-visual display.

That would be something new, something even R.Kahane didn't do, and would win many goyim over, including the Arabs, and even placate, defang and reconcile them.

Of course the unbelievably evil Erev Rav in Israel would ensure that Feiglin would be dead within the hour of his first "Biblical" News Conference, such is their hatred of true Torah!

The conspiracists will tell you that those like Feglin and Nadia Matar, have been silent since their sons' car 'accidents' in the West Bank, like so many other rabbis and leaders in Yesha, and their families, who have had scores of crashes with Arabs vehicles, under Shabak and PLO joint command.



And that even Benny Begin's son's jet was "crashed" to take him totally out of the political loop for 8 years.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2010, 09:38:51 PM by wonga66 »

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #45 on: November 17, 2010, 09:53:43 PM »
Feiglin has said that if he was Israeli PM, he would answer Obama and the World about Israel's right to exist and the Jewish claim to the Land of Israel solely with English & Hebrew verses slowly quoted on a podium from a giant Gold-Leafed Tanach, with audio-visual display. 

 ;D ;D ;D


Quote
That would be something new, something even R.Kahane didn't do, and would win many goyim over, including the Arabs, and even placate, defang and reconcile them.
Perhaps.
Quote
Of course the unbelievably evil Erev Rav in Israel would ensure that Feiglin would be dead within the hour of his first "Biblical" News Conference, such is their hatred of true Torah! 

G-d forbid, but I don't doubt they would try something like that.

Quote
The conspiracists will tell you that those like Feglin and Nadia Matar, have been silent since their sons' car 'accidents' in the West Bank, like so many other rabbis and leaders in Yesha, and their families, who have had scores of crashes with Arabs vehicles, under Shabak and PLO joint command.

And that even Benny Begin's son's jet was "crashed" to take him totally out of the political loop for 8 years.

I'm not really a "conspiracist type" but honestly this does worry me.   It would be incredibly sick and evil if they did that on purpose to Moshe's son or to these other people.   I guess that is how mafia's work, though, so it is worrisome.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #46 on: November 17, 2010, 09:59:34 PM »
Btw, speaking of Feiglin, his son miraculously awoke from his coma a few months ago!   I had no idea that this happened since I have been in the US.  This is great news!

http://www.worldofjudaica.com/jewish-news/israel/moshe-feiglin-son-wakes-from-coma-i/657/19/

Moshe Feiglin’s Miracle: His son David Wakes up from Coma (Part I)

15 minutes before the beginning of the Yom Kippur fast, David, son of Moshe Feiglin, woke up from a 3-month coma after a car accident. “When something like this happens to a man, he examines his deeds,” says the Likud’s bad boy to Yediot Acharonot.

(Translated from Ynet)

By Moshe Ronen

It happened on the 28th of June, towards evening. 16 year old volunteer David Feiglin and two older firefighters had just finished their shift at the fire station in Alfe Menashe and were on their way home in one of the other firefighter’s cars. Another car made a sudden U-turn on the entrance road to the town without giving the right of way and hit them, throwing them into a street light. The two firefighters were lightly wounded. David was critically wounded and was transported to the hospital unconscious with his life in real danger.

In the three months that passed since then, his parents set up a makeshift bed next to his hospital bed and have stayed with him 24 hours a day. His father, Moshe Feiglin, chairman of the Manhigut Yehudit (Jewish Leadership) faction of the Likud, spent the three day Rosh Hashanah holiday at his bedside. The center of the Feiglins’ lives has moved to their son’s room, the fourth of five children. First it was Schneider Hospital in Petach Tikva, and afterwards the rehabilitation wing of Safra Children’s Hospital in Tel HaShomer.

“Leading up to Yom Kippur we decided that my wife would stay with David,” Feiglin retells, “and I would go back home to Ginot Shomron to be with our youngest son Avraham.”

Feiglin arrived at his home in the afternoon and went to have his pre Yom Kippur meal by neighbors. Shortly before the beginning of the fast he went out to the empty street and called his wife at the hospital. “I asked her to put me on speaker so I could speak to David,” he says, and explains that as the months passed since the accident, the family has been vigilant about speaking to the wounded boy despite the lack of response.

Just like every other time, Feiglin held the phone and said “Shalom David,” insistent on talking to the unconscious youngster, not really expecting any response. But David, in a frail voice, answered one word. “Shalom.”

“I’m alone in the street, 15 minutes before the beginning of the holy day, and my wife screams: ‘Did you hear? Did you hear? He said Shalom!’ Chills swept through my body. I heard her say to him: ‘Say it again’ and he said, again, ‘Shalom’ in a weak but clear voice. I could hear it well on the telephone,” says Feiglin with excitement that was almost tangible. Immediately, at that moment, in the middle of the empty street, he says the shehchayanu blessing. “This Yom Kippur was full of excitement. I got my son back. That night I thought about [the Biblical character] Chana, who when she was given a son she sang, ‘my heart rejoices in God.’ I felt like her. My heart rejoiced.”


A New Ideological Playing Field

Moshe Feiglin’s exactness is well known by anyone who has been reading newspapers these past 16 years. Face to face he is even more impressive: Very tall, thin, nearly an asceticist.

He is described in the newspapers as a dangerous and extreme right winger. They typecast him as the Bad Boy, the cunning and unwanted one who forced himself on the Likud. They’ve called him a provocateur, a black sheep that infuriates Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

This is the man that in 2005 resigned from the Likud Knesset list claiming that he “fears entering a bottle that’s in [Israeli Supreme Court Chief Justice] Aharon Barak’s pocket,” the man that in 2007 received close to a quarter of the votes in the primaries for the party’s leadership, who was elected to the 20th slot on the Likud list, but was moved to an unrealistic slot after an appeal was filed to the party’s internal court. This is also the man who caused Netanyahu to threaten his colleagues on the Likud Knesset list that anyone who makes a deal with Feiglin will not be appointed a cabinet minister.

He is described as a cold, dangerous man, a megalomaniac that does not make friends with anyone and does not reveal any emotion. But in the children’s rehabilitation wing that has transformed into his second home, I met a warm, heartfelt man, who talks a lot but is also willing to listen, who well understands that his opinions are far from the consensus.

Moshe Feiglin was born in Haifa 48 years ago to a family that has in its ranks, according to him, Haredim and leftists, Meretz voters, supporters of right wing parties and dedicated followers of United Torah Judaism. His mother is religious and his father secular, and one of his sisters works in the State prosecutor’s office. He has, he says, a good and close relationship with all of them. “Despite the differences of opinion, we are a warm family.”

He grew up in Rehovot, where he also met his wife Tzipi, then a new immigrant from the United States. He studied in the Or Etzion Yeshiva High School, served in the Israel Defense Forces as a combat engineer, and was discharged with the rank of Captain. After his release, he founded the first rappelling window washing company in Israel, and as he cleaned the windows of the diamond exchange building in Ramat Gan hanging from a rope, he became familiar with the security procedures at the building and decided to found a start-up high tech company that would “streamline and optimize security.”

But his business ventures were nipped in the bud. When Feiglin was 30, the Oslo Accords were signed and he stood at the head of their detractors. Together with Shmuel Sackett and Rabbi Benny Elon, he founded and led the Zo Artzeinu movement, and in August 1995 he brought out 100,000 demonstrators that blocked traffic at 80 intersections throughout the country. “A Stopped-Up State” read the next day’s front headline in Yediot Acharonot. (Translator’s note: The original word used for “Stopped-Up” has a double meaning along the lines of “stupid bimbo” in Hebrew.)

The movement, he says, was a safe springboard into politics. But the offers that came, according to him, from every right wing party did not interest him. “I didn’t want to get involved in politics. I fought against the accords and I wanted to get back to my business.”

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #47 on: November 17, 2010, 10:04:37 PM »
Here is part 2 of that article:

Later, in 1997, he was found guilty of sedition against the sate and publishing seditious material and was sentenced to 18 months in prison and served six in community service.

The sedition trial drew him into the public eye where he has remained ever since. Today he is the head of Manhigut Yehudit which is funded—entirely he emphasizes—by donations. But Feiglin admits that he has changed. “I am no longer in a constant battle. I am not contending against any one person, not demonstrating. But I have not broken. I am now involved in education. I am building a new ideological playing field.”

What does that mean?

“Without God, the Zionist enterprise cannot successfully justify its very existence. With our own two hands we have stripped away the legitimacy of our existence as an independent state, and that is more threatening than a nuclear bomb. Before the kill comes the stripping of legitimacy.”

You are very pessimistic. Are you predicting the end of the State?

“I’m not pessimistic. I see the deep processes of the search for Jewish meaning and am trying to give them political expression. To create a Jewish State.”

In a state like that, does a secular person have to keep Mitzvot? Will courts adjudicate according to Halacha?

“No. Judaism is first and foremost freedom. The meaning of a Jewish state is that every Jew in the world will be able to vote. Not the state of Israelis, but the state of Jews. When a flotilla comes from Turkey and Obama throws our Prime Minister down the stairs, the nation feels like the plank it is standing on just got a little thinner under our feet. I want the Israeli citizen to feel like he has the option of moving to a different playing field.”

Personal Introspection

For the Shabbat of Succot, David was released to his house for 24 hours with his family. The next day he went back to the hospital. In the days that passed since Yom Kippur eve, he has begun to whisper other words, and he is capable of saying “Abba,” “yes,” and “no”. His motor skills are also showing signs of improvement and he can move his left hand. “The movement on his left side is coming back first,” his father quotes the doctors and says that this is only the beginning. “The path is very long until he comes back to himself. He has started talking. It reminds me very much of a baby beginning to speak. Speech is the level in which we become human beings, the level that separates us from the animal kingdom.”

The trauma, he says, has not changed his life principles, “but certain things took on a much stronger emphasis. Today I am less critical of people. My principles have not changed, but how I relate to people is much more delicate,” he explains.

“When something like this happens to a man, he examines his deeds. I feel like the many battles I’ve waged these past 15 years have begun to spill into the personal arena, and that isn’t good. In Psalms it’s written that “sins will vanish from the earth’ – sins and not sinners. When I did my own personal introspection on Yom Kippur, I decided to focus on the errors in this war, not on those who commit them. To put the emphasis on the matter at hand, not on people.”

Do you believe in remuneration?

“You mean reward and punishment? I believe that everything happens for a reason and a purpose. But most of the reasons are beyond us. We can’t understand them. When a little child suffers—it’s certainly not because of his sins. I believe that we need to learn and improve ourselves from within the situation we find ourselves in.”

A minute before we part he asks to add one more sentence. “I know that an article in a newspaper is not a greeting card with a poem,” he apologizes, “but the main reason I agreed to be interviewed was so I could have an opportunity to say thank you from the depths of my heart to the medical staff at Schneider Hospital and Tel HaShomer, and another huge thank you to the Creator of the World, and the tens of thousands of Jews who are praying all the time for David’s recovery.”

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #48 on: November 17, 2010, 10:11:18 PM »
His comments are quite interesting.  He is committing himself to be less critical of people, a very courageous step toward teshuvah as he has defined for himself.   This should be a lesson for all of us.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 23384
  • Real Kahanist
Re: Why not a whisper from Feiglin?
« Reply #49 on: November 17, 2010, 10:18:22 PM »
His comments are quite interesting.  He is committing himself to be less critical of people, a very courageous step toward teshuvah as he has defined for himself.   This should be a lesson for all of us.
Does this mean an apology for his comments on Amir and Dr. Goldstein are forthcoming?