He calls me again.

[BritishSword]

I really thought I'd seen the last of this guy. I mean our last convo, I put down some pretty stringent conditions on him staying with me which i honestly don't think hes fulfilled.
  But he appears out of the blue, wants to clear the air.
  This time I'm just going to quote his whole message so you can see what I'm dealing with. I might try talking sense to him, probably worthless but in the interests of science I'm interested in just how far gone people have to be before they are totally unreachable.
  Also I don't know anything about the abortion clinic bombings. I need information on those, their context what you think of them etc.
  So tell me about those, tell me what you think of his message.
Anyone who is not ron ben michael is welcome to comment.

-----------------------
From Joshua Zachariah
Yo bro....lt's been more than 6 months, time to chat so we can clear
any misconceptions you have about me. You know, I understand you are
autistic but you need to calm down, take a deep breath, and hear me
out instead of taking a bunch of random typed text out of context.

Oh and btw, LOOK what happened in Norway. When I read about them
identifying the terrorist who carried out those attacks I was
surprised, because the mainstream news media automatically assumed it
was islamic extremists at first. It turned out that he's a far right
wing fundamentalist xenophobic christian nationalist extremist. When I
heard the true identity, it kinda reminded me of the abortion clinic
bombings here in America by christian fundamntalists. He is considered
anti-islamic, anti-marxist, and anti-multiculturalist to the extreme
core. He's also a die hard christian.

I hope you don't defend scum like him. Fundies like him give a bad
name to christianity much in the same wahabi terrorists give a bad
name to muslims.
---------------------------------------------------------

[muman613]

Maybe this information can help you understand:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-abortion_violence

Anti-abortion violence is violence committed against individuals and organizations that provide abortion.[1] Incidents of violence have included destruction of property, in the form of vandalism; crimes against people, including kidnapping, stalking, assault, attempted murder, and murder; and crimes affecting both people and property, including arson and bombings.

Anti-abortion violence is most frequently committed in the United States, though it has also occurred in Australia, Canada, and New Zealand.[citation needed] G. Davidson Smith of Canadian Security Intelligence Service defined anti-abortion violence as "single issue terrorism".[2] A study of 1982–87 violence considered the incidents "limited political" or "subrevolutionary" terrorism.[3]
.
.
.
Violence by Army of God

The Army of God, an underground terrorist organization active in the United States, has been responsible for a substantial amount of anti-abortion violence. In addition to numerous property crimes, the group has committed acts of kidnapping, attempted murder, and murder. In August 1982, three men identifying as the Army of God kidnapped Hector Zevallos (a doctor and clinic owner) and his wife, Rosalee Jean, holding them for eight days.[37] In 1993, Shelly Shannon, a very active member of the Army of God, was found guilty for the attempted murder of Dr. George Tiller.[38] That same year, law enforcement officials found the Army of God Manual, a tactical guide to arson, chemical attacks, invasions, and bombings buried in Shelly Shannon's backyard.[37] Paul Jennings Hill was found guilty of the murder of both Dr. John Britton and clinic escort James Barrett. The Army of God justified his actions on the grounds that "whatever force is legitimate to defend the life of a born child is legitimate to defend the life of an unborn child... if in fact Paul Hill did kill or wound abortionist John Britton, and accomplices James Barrett and Mrs. Barrett, his actions are morally justified if they were necessary for the purpose of defending innocent human life".[10] The AOG claimed responsibility for Eric Robert Rudolph's 1997 shrapnel bombing of abortion clinics in Atlanta and Birmingham.[39]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Robert_Rudolph

Eric Robert Rudolph (born September 19, 1966), also known as the Olympic Park Bomber, is a terrorist responsible for a series of bombings across the southern United States between 1996 and 1998, which killed two people and injured at least 150 others. The Federal Bureau of Investigation considers him a terrorist.[2]

As a teenager Rudolph was taken by his mother to a Church of Israel compound in 1984; it is connected to the Christian Identity movement.[3] Rudolph has denied that his crimes were religiously or racially motivated,[4] Rudolph has also called himself a Roman Catholic in "the war to end this holocaust" (in reference to abortion).[5]

He spent years on the FBI Ten Most Wanted Fugitives until he was caught in 2003. In 2005, as part of a plea bargain, Rudolph pled guilty to numerous federal and state homicide charges and accepted four consecutive life sentences in exchange for avoiding a trial and a potential death sentence.
.
.
.
Rudolph has also confessed to the bombings of an abortion clinic in the Atlanta suburb of Sandy Springs on January 16, 1997; the Otherside Lounge of Atlanta lesbian bar in Atlanta on February 21, 1997, injuring five; and an abortion clinic in Birmingham, Alabama on January 29, 1998, killing Birmingham Police Officer and part-time clinic security guard Robert Sanderson, and critically injuring nurse Emily Lyons. Rudolph's bombs were made of dynamite surrounded by nails which acted as shrapnel.

[Zelhar]

The killer is not a Christian fundamentalist, he is not a right wing activist, basically he is a deranged loner. He copied much of his manifesto from  Ted Kaczynski (aka Unabomber), another loner who is a deranged environmentalist anarchist.

[mord]

 Who is Joshua Zachariah?

[angryChineseKahanist]

Are you Jewish?

[Rubystars]

I don't condone violence as a means to protect unborn babies because it damages the pro life movement as a whole. I don't have any sympathy for monsters like Tiller though, and yes he was a monster.

[JTFenthusiast2]

I don't condone violence as a means to protect unborn babies because it damages the pro life movement as a whole. I don't have any sympathy for monsters like Tiller though, and yes he was a monster.

I'm glad you don't have sympathies for people who target physicians with deadly force while they are performing a medical procedure that is currently protected under the law.  I think abortion is a terrible thing AND I stand by my first sentence.

[mord]

 I DO NOT condone the killing of Tiller the Baby killer but just looking at his face shows a very mean face   

[Rubystars]

I'm glad you don't have sympathies for people who target physicians with deadly force while they are performing a medical procedure that is currently protected under the law.  I think abortion is a terrible thing AND I stand by my first sentence.

I don't think the doctors should be murdered because it harms the pro life movement and because it will get the shooters into legal trouble.

[Rubystars]

I DO NOT condone the killing of Tiller the Baby killer but just looking at his face shows a very mean face   

I'm glad he's gone but I don't think it was right to shoot him.

[mord]

I'm glad he's gone but I don't think it was right to shoot him.

Yes of course i agree with you

[Zelhar]

I'm glad you don't have sympathies for people who target physicians with deadly force while they are performing a medical procedure that is currently protected under the law.  I think abortion is a terrible thing AND I stand by my first sentence.

I don't agree with the reasoning which I bold faced. Laws and rules procedures etc. are man made and sometimes can be flawed to the point that simply following them because "they are law" is a moral crime. I am not nearly as anti aboriton as many JTFers are but I am trying to make a principle point that no matter what the law says, people must always use their own moral compass.

[JTFenthusiast2]

Zelhar,

I definitely understand your point.  I have seen the flip end of it.  People outside of clinics--no hospitals where ONLY medical abortion done to save the mother's life is performed, and some of these protesters, not an insignificant number, carry on in a way that does ZERO to help the woman and plenty to traumatize her.  I wish abortion didn't exist.  My own life was affected by a woman's choice, but shooting doctors who do this procedure, is not a moral equivalent of some nazi piece of garbage following orders to kill living breathing, totally viable human beings.  As awful as abortion is and it's horrible, especially if you've seen one, it is not the latter, although it is horrible, absolutely

[Rubystars]

Zelhar,

I definitely understand your point.  I have seen the flip end of it.  People outside of clinics--no hospitals where ONLY medical abortion done to save the mother's life is performed, and some of these protesters, not an insignificant number, carry on in a way that does ZERO to help the woman and plenty to traumatize her.  I wish abortion didn't exist.  My own life was affected by a woman's choice, but shooting doctors who do this procedure, is not a moral equivalent of some nazi piece of garbage following orders to kill living breathing, totally viable human beings.  As awful as abortion is and it's horrible, especially if you've seen one, it is not the latter, although it is horrible, absolutely

What Tiller did was kill babies that were in the last trimester and I don't think it can be argued in any valid way that these weren't full human beings. He was a mass murderer and I think he doesn't deserve any sympathy whatsoever, legally protected procedures or not. He was a monster. If this were a decent society he would have been put to death by order of a court for jabbing kicking babies in the back of the head with scissors. However that doesn't give an assassin the right to go outside the law and take matters into their own hands, that was wrong and only got himself and the pro-life movement into trouble.

[JTFenthusiast2]

What Tiller did was kill babies that were in the last trimester and I don't think it can be argued in any valid way that these weren't full human beings. He was a mass murderer and I think he doesn't deserve any sympathy whatsoever, legally protected procedures or not. He was a monster. If this were a decent society he would have been put to death by order of a court for jabbing kicking babies in the back of the head with scissors. However that doesn't give an assassin the right to go outside the law and take matters into their own hands, that was wrong and only got himself and the pro-life movement into trouble.

I agree third trimester abortions, I dont know how a person could perform one unless the mother was going to right die if she didn't terminate the pregnancy.  I knew a doctor that gave a 24 y/o an abortion in the 2nd trimester.  I couldn't believe the lack of conscience in the girl.  She was totally showing an everything  The doctor did it on the condition that she allow him to place norplant in her arm after the procedure.  This was her xth number of abortions.  Even then, I couldn't sleep with myself at night. I'm not sure what most gynecologists, who do perform abortions, say to themselves to keep them going.  I dont believe all of them are evil, but they must think or feel something very strongly to keep at it

[Rubystars]

I agree third trimester abortions, I dont know how a person could perform one unless the mother was going to right die if she didn't terminate the pregnancy.  I knew a doctor that gave a 24 y/o an abortion in the 2nd trimester.  I couldn't believe the lack of conscience in the girl.  She was totally showing an everything  The doctor did it on the condition that she allow him to place norplant in her arm after the procedure.  This was her xth number of abortions.  Even then, I couldn't sleep with myself at night. I'm not sure what most gynecologists, who do perform abortions, say to themselves to keep them going.  I dont believe all of them are evil, but they must think or feel something very strongly to keep at it

They may not be so corrupt that they can't change, but what they are doing is evil and I think they should stop doing abortions. I think the late term abortions are the most evil because at that point the baby can feel everything that's going on and is kicking around, etc. but I think at any stage it's a bad thing. I'm glad that the doctor put the Norplant in her though at least he probably prevented her from having more abortions. I personally think that woman is the most evil one in that particular situation as she was apparently using it as a form of birth control. Maybe she was too selfish to go to the trouble of remembering to take pills or insist her male sex partners used condoms.

I personally think that abortion should only be an option if the mother is going to die otherwise. I don't really see a situation where that would be the case in the 3rd trimester because it seems like at that point the doctors could just do a C-section and take the baby out if ending the pregnancy was necessary.

When Michelle Duggar was going to die if her pregnancy wasn't ended that's what they did for her and her baby was very premature and yet they didn't say just to cut her to pieces. They did everything they could to save Josie and she's alive now.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

1: Who the heck is Joshua Zechariah?

2: I agree that the only time abortion might be acceptable is if they will both die without it. Rubystars is 100% right.

[England4Ever]

Your friend British Sword is a lost cause! Tell him that you don't want to be friends with him anymore. If he can not accept who you are, than why be friends with somone who won't accept you?

[angryChineseKahanist]

Because of a strange metamorphosis due to an over dose of Gamma radiation
British Sword morphs into .... England4Ever.

[muman613]

Because of a strange metamorphosis due to an over dose of Gamma radiation
British Sword morphs into .... England4Ever.

The Incredible Bulk

[BritishSword]

1: Who the heck is Joshua Zechariah?

2: I agree that the only time abortion might be acceptable is if they will both die without it. Rubystars is 100% right.

I didn't realise I started such a massive discussion LOL.
  Joshua Zachariah is the real name, not screen name of someone I met on zootube. I was friends with him for a long time because of his anti-government stance. The friendship faltered when I brought up the issue of muslims. As you can see from his post he seems more interested in defending a foreign religion than he does our freedoms. I told him to go away for 6 months and read tanach and koran side by side and see what he thought of them then. He did the 6 month part but  think its obvious he hasn't read the books.
  So I mentioned him on askJTF as the piece of dreck who called me up.
I think both of his names are actually very jewish names unless I'm mistaken.  Which is a real pity and a real irony because he believes and I quote.
  "Israel should have been set up as an atheistic state for all comers not just one particular nation or creed"

Israel the free for all. Kind of  defeats the point.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Because of a strange metamorphosis due to an over dose of Gamma radiation
British Sword morphs into .... England4Ever.

How do you know this?

[angryChineseKahanist]

How do you know this?

Just a guess.

[Rubystars]

No country should be a free for all for all people. Otherwise there's no point in borders. Nations are not just geographical regions. They're made up of a people. Multiculturalism = the destroyer of nations.