Author Topic: A poll cited by BBC claims that a majority of Germans back Circumcision Ban  (Read 3111 times)

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Offline edu

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excerpts from http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18793842
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The ruling by the district court of Cologne says circumcision "for the purpose of religious upbringing constitutes a violation of physical integrity".
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A poll for Focus magazine found that 56% of those polled thought the judgement was right, compared with 35% against and 10% undecided.
It is interesting to note that when the Nazis were still concerned about world opinion, one of their first attacks against the Jews, was in the name of compassion banning, Jewish ritual slaughter in order to make it uncomfortable to be Jewish. At least in Germany.
Now in the name of compassion and concern for children they are attacking one of the fundamental commandments of Judaism, the commandment to perform Brit Mila, which is stressed many times in the Bible.



Offline edu

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In an article at http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-schiffman/why-people-who-pray-are-heathier_b_1197313.html it is claimed that people who pray on the average, live longer or are healthier than those who don't. See the article for details.
My educated guess is those same compassionate Germans who are so quick to override the rights of Jewish parents to bring up their children according to their religious beliefs, would nevertheless not be in favor of having the government force secular parents to make their children pray, for the sake of health benefits!

Offline Meerkat

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why are there still jews in germany anyway?

Offline edu

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Another point, I'll raise.
I personally do not know of any family that had a child that died because of circumcision. I am not saying it never happens at all, but I know that it is extremely rare. However, I do know of a family, whose child died, because of a traffic accident, when he was riding a bicycle. It is many many more times likely that a child will die because someone gave him a bicycle than because he was given a circumcision.
Here's a quote from http://www.mcminnlaw.com/bicycle-accidents/austin-bicycle-accident-attorney/
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Bicycle accidents occur every day due to the increased popularity of bike riding and more importantly the negligence of automobile drivers. Although many cities across the U.S. have recently added bike lanes on busy city streets, cars still refuse to accept bikers as travelers on the road. Car collisions with bikes account for one-third of biking accidents, but most of those accidents are fatal because bikers are virtually unprotected. Other bike accident statistics include:

•A cyclist is fatally injured every 6 hours
•Roughly one million children are injured annually in bicycle related accidents
•Approximately half of biking accidents occur in children under age 16
•Head injuries make up 75 percent of serious injuries in accidents


Due to the negligence and inattentiveness of drivers new traffic laws dealing with cyclists have been enacted. Vehicles are required to share the road with cyclists, according to Texas law, and that means that bicycle riders must uphold their end of the bargain as well. Ignorance of these laws will not protect negligent persons on either end of the accident. Common collisions between cyclists and drivers are:

•A motorist turning directly in front of a biker
•A motorist entering traffic from a driveway/parking spot right in front of a cyclist
•A motorist failing to yield at an intersection/running a stop sign or traffic light
•Inattentiveness of an automobile driver
•Failure of a motorist to look both ways
•A motorist that is inhibited by drugs or alcohol
I would not be surprised if those hypocritical anti-semitic Germans who in the name of concern of the child, would ban circumcision, would nevertheless be against a ban of the use of bikes, for children under 18

Offline Meerkat

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.....
I would not be surprised if those hypocritical anti-semitic Germans who in the name of concern of the child, would ban circumcision, would nevertheless be against a ban of the use of bikes, for children under 18

typical euro

Offline Rubystars

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This might be off topic a little bit but the bike "lanes" that I've seen around here are accidents waiting to happen. There is absolutely no protection for the cyclist whatsoever, not even as much as a fence between the main road for cars and the bike lane (just some paint on the ground, like that's going to stop a car from swerving in there), and these are on very busy streets with fast moving traffic. The bike lanes are also so narrow that if you were to lose your balance and fall over, say your front wheel hit a rock, that you'd tip right over into traffic. There's no wonder that there are so many accidents on the bike lanes.

Offline USAReturn2GodNow1776

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I'm glad this is happening because it will send a message to Jews living in Germany that it is time for them to go to their real home, Israel!  With Jewish brains, Israel will be the envy of the world, and countries like Germany will be lifting their bans of circumcision and making every accommodation for Judaism in a desperate attempt to get Jewish geniuses to come back. But then it will be too late!  :P  :israel:

Offline edu

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Unfortunately, I know this attack against circumcision is not limited to Germany.
Some leftists tried to get it banned in California or parts of California not too long ago, although they were not successful.

Getting back to the main issue of what arguments can be made to secularists concerning circumcision, I will point out that any act of surgery has a risk to it.
Quote from http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2004-01-21-plastic-surgery-risks_x.htm
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Millions of Americans get poked, prodded — and cut open — all in the name of beauty. But last week's death of novelist Olivia Goldsmith from complications during plastic surgery provides a sharp reminder that surgery, any surgery, is inherently risky.
Goldsmith, 54, best known as the author of 1992's The First Wives Club, had a heart attack while she was under anesthesia for surgery in New York to remove loose skin under her chin, according to media reports. She fell into a coma and died a day later, according to reports, but the cause of death is under investigation, and "we're not confirming any details of her tragic death," says Ken Sunshine, spokesman for Goldsmith's estate.

Plastic surgery, like most surgeries, is relatively safe. Anesthesia-related deaths in the USA occur in 1 in 250,000 procedures, says the American Society of Anesthesiologists. But Goldsmith's death is a reminder that "plastic surgery isn't a pure benefit," says Nancy Etcoff, psychologist at Harvard Medical School and author of Survival of the Prettiest. "It isn't someone waving a magic wand and you look better. You're subjecting yourself to potential dangers."
No German court is preventing parents from giving their children plastic surgery, let alone regular surgery, if they conclude, that the benefits outweigh the risks. Here's one story that made the news of a child who had plastic surgery done on her to solve a social problem.
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/cosmetic-surgery-stop-school-bullying-plastic-surgery-children/story?id=13355871
Why are secular surgery procedures allowed in Germany, even for children, while for the religious it is not?
It comes down to the values of society, what they see as important and what is not.


Offline edu

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Quote from http://www.innernet.org.il/article.php?aid=109
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Ritual circumcision has been practiced on Jewish males for more than 3,700 years, ever since, as we read in the Torah, Abraham was commanded by G-d, "You shall cause every male among you to be circumcised." (Genesis 17:10)
As an operation, circumcision has an extremely small complication rate. A study in the New England Journal of Medicine (1990) reported a complication rate of 0.19% when circumcision is performed by a physician. When performed by a trained mohel, the rate falls to 0.13% or about 1 in 1000. When a complication occurs, it is usually excessive bleeding, which is easily correctable. No other surgical procedure can boast such figures for complication-free operations!

One reason why there are so few complications involving bleeding may be that, according to recent studies, the major clotting agents, prothrombin and vitamin K, do not reach peak levels in the blood until the eighth day of life. According to Dr. Armand J. Quick, author of several works on the control of bleeding, it was recognized as early as 1894 that the newborn infant tended to bleed easily in the first few days of life. This was later confirmed when researchers gained the ability to accurately measure prothrombin in the blood.

Prothrombin levels are normal at birth, drop to very low levels in the next few days, and return to normal at the end of the first week. Another study showed that by the eighth day prothrombin levels reach 110% of normal... In the words of Dr. Quick, "It hardly seems accidental that the rite of circumcision was postponed until the eighth day by the Mosaic law."

For years, circumcision has been known to offer virtually complete protection from penile cancer. According to a recent review article in the New England Journal of Medicine, none of the over 1600 persons studied with this cancer had been circumcised in infancy. In the words of Cochen and McCurdy, the incidence of penile cancer in the U.S. is "essentially zero" among circumcised men.

In addition, circumcision protects against bacterial, fungal, and parasitic infections and a variety of other conditions related to hygiene. The extremely low rate of cervical cancer in Jewish women (nine to 22 times less than among non-Jewish women) is thought to be related to the practice of circumcision.

Beginning in the early 1980s, several studies reported that circumcised boys were between 10 and 39 times less likely to develop urinary tract infections during infancy than uncircumcised boys.

As a result of studies like these, a number of prestigious medical organizations in the U.S. are beginning to recognize the benefits of circumcision on public health. The California Medical Association recently endorsed circumcision as an "effective public health measure." (Resolution March 1988)


 

Offline edu

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2 German Nazis "educate" two Jews on how to be more modern. Picture from Yad Vashem archives showing German policemen cutting off the beards and sidelocks of Jews.

Offline edu

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http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/158221
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Austrian Governor Bans Religious Circumcision
A ban on non-medical circumcision by a regional court in Germany, has prompted a governor in western Austria to follow suit.
AAFont SizeBy Gabe Kahn
First Publish: 7/24/2012, 10:30 PM
The governor of Voralberg province in Austria has instructed hospitals to halt non-medical circumcisions until the "legal situation is clarified" in his country.

The decision by Gov. Markus Wallner came after a German regional court ruled ritual circumcision amounted to criminal bodily harm.
Two hospitals in Switzerland last week also cited the German ruling when then announced that they would temporarily stop performing circumcisions.

Offline syyuge

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Circumcision ban on Jews is highly deplorable. However it should be clear, whether this ban is applicable to the muslamics or not.
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