Author Topic: Peace - Salaam - Shalom  (Read 25376 times)

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Offline Abdullah

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2007, 05:38:44 AM »
I don't think you understood what I said. If you have a proof against what I said other than your opinion then you should argue it. About that 'Hadith"- If it contradicts the Qur'an then it is Intstantly proven to be false and is to be ignored as a false hadith.
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newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2007, 05:47:13 AM »
I don't think you understood what I said. If you have a proof against what I said other than your opinion then you should argue it. About that 'Hadith"- If it contradicts the Qur'an then it is Intstantly proven to be false and is to be ignored as a false hadith.

hahaha...more taqiyya and circular logic. Nobody can PROOVE anything as far as religion is concerned. One must look at history and reallity and make a leap of faith. On that note:

If your vile religion is so 'perfect' as you lot claim, why are all islamic countries filfthy, third world dumps that everybody who can is leaving?

Why is all immigration from east to west and not west to east? Why do christian countries have a much higher standard of living than the muslim stink-hole countries if islam is so perfect? Should it not be the other way 'round?

Offline Abdullah

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #27 on: July 08, 2007, 05:56:31 AM »
Well its a common question and quite easy to explain. The "muslim" countries are not following Islam. Counties like Afganastan claim to impleament sharia but include very little actual sharia and a whole lot of afgani culture. There is no punishment in Sharia for a woman who doesn't cover up- it is between her and Allah.
Allahu Akbar!!!- God is the Greatest

newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #28 on: July 08, 2007, 06:02:30 AM »
Well its a common question and quite easy to explain. The "muslim" countries are not following Islam. Counties like Afganastan claim to impleament sharia but include very little actual sharia and a whole lot of afgani culture. There is no punishment in Sharia for a woman who doesn't cover up- it is between her and Allah.

What a joke !!

You're just like those stupid communists who claim that sorry ideology didn't really fail because Russia and it's allies didn't practice 'true' communism.

Bottom line: Islam=poor, dictatorial, cruel stink-holes.
Judaism/christianity=rich, democratic, humanitarian muslim immigrant/ refugee destinations......that's a fact.

Offline Abdullah

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #29 on: July 08, 2007, 06:12:43 AM »
What is funny is that you don't have a point. Do you have a question or do you want to insult me some more? It just shows your character. :)
Allahu Akbar!!!- God is the Greatest

newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #30 on: July 08, 2007, 06:16:42 AM »
What is funny is that you don't have a point. Do you have a question or do you want to insult me some more? It just shows your character. :)

That WAS the point. You are copping out, just like believers in other failed ideologies like communism.
" well they don't practice TRUE (insert failed ideology here)" . It's all a crock.

ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #31 on: July 08, 2007, 08:12:13 AM »
Firstly, guys, lets be civil, hurling insults that go beyond the truth belittles us, not the person we are trying to inuslt.

It doesn't seam that many points have really been made, other than mindless insults, however, there is one that Abdullah raised that I would specifically like to refute.

In response to the earlier question here is the definition of a "Innocent civilian"- any non-combatant.
Its is not true that Islam say All non-Muslims are not innocent, actually quite the oppisite. The Prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) once said " whoever harms a non-muslim citizen has harmed me" here is a verse from the Holy Qur'an that is of a similar theme- 5:32 " Because of that We ordained for the Children of Israel that if anyone killed a person not in retaliation of murder, or (and) to spread mischief in the land - it would be as if he killed all mankind, and if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of all mankind. And indeed, there came to them Our Messengers with clear proofs, evidences, and signs, even then after that many of them continued to exceed the limits (e.g. by doing oppression unjustly and exceeding beyond the limits set by Allah by committing the major sins) in the land"

If you give the refference for the quote "whoever harms a non-muslim citizen has harmed me" so i may look at the context I'll be able to comment about it, but for now I'll have to stick to the one that you have referenced.

Lets take this verse as it appears without added notes:

Quran Surah 5 Ayat 32:

"Because of that We ordained for the Children of Israel that if anyone killed a person not in retaliation of murder, or to spread mischief in the land - it would be as if he killed all mankind, and if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of all mankind. And indeed, there came to them Our Messengers with clear proofs, evidences, and signs, even then after that many of them continued to exceed the limits in the land."

Firstly, this verse has no instructions in it for muslims at all "We ordained for the Children of Israel", it is talking about an instruction for Jews, not muslims. Now the definition of "spreading mischeif in the land" is a matter of great dispute, some muslims who do accept this verse as being intended to instruct muslims as well as Jews will also say that speaking against Islam is spreading mischeif in the land, so then this verse becomes an encouragement to kill non-muslims. Now if we look at the end of the verse "even then after that many of them continued to exceed the limits" remembering that this verse was addressed at the beginning "We ordained for the Children of Israel" we see that the true intention of this verse is to call Jews evil. So far from being a message of peace, this verse is anti-semitic nazi style propoganda.

Do your research before making another point.

Offline Muck DeFuslims

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #32 on: July 08, 2007, 09:20:04 AM »
Be civil with a Mooslime ?

Why ?

Anyone that belongs to the vile cult of Islime, doesn't deserve civility or respect.

Islam calls for my forced conversion, dhimmitude or death !!

And I'm supposed to be CIVIL with these IslamoNazi bastards ?

Let's get something straight right here and right now.

Every Muslime is my enemy.

No exceptions.

Mohahmhead (excrement be upon the sewer rat) was a mass murderer, rapist, pedophile, liar, terrorist, scumbag thief.

ANYONE that proclaims this vile, psychotic piece of feces to be a prophet and desires to emulate him doesn't deserve to be treated civilly or with respect.

Let there be no confusion: Islam and Mohammedans are the enemies of all free thinking, righteous people everywhere.

They should be treated with the utmost contempt and as harshly and mercilessly as possible until Islam and Mohammedans are no more.

The best way to eradicate Islam is to treat all Muslimes exactly the way the assholey Queeran mandates they should treat non-Slimes.

It's time for Dar al Harb to go on a rampage and teach these Muslime beeyatches who the real dhimmis are.

DEATH TO ISLAM !
DEATH TO THE DISCIPLES OF MOHAM !

[censored] ALLAH THE PAGAN MOON GOD !

newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #33 on: July 08, 2007, 09:25:39 AM »
Be civil with a Mooslime ?

Why ?

Anyone that belongs to the vile cult of Islime, doesn't deserve civility or respect.

Islam calls for my forced conversion, dhimmitude or death !!

And I'm supposed to be CIVIL with these IslamoNazi bastards ?

Let's get something straight right here and right now.

Every Muslime is my enemy.

No exceptions.

Mohahmhead (excrement be upon the sewer rat) was a mass murderer, rapist, pedophile, liar, terrorist, scumbag thief.

ANYONE that proclaims this vile, psychotic piece of feces to be a prophet and desires to emulate him doesn't deserve to be treated civilly or with respect.

Let there be no confusion: Islam and Mohammedans are the enemies of all free thinking, righteous people everywhere.

They should be treated with the utmost contempt and as harshly and mercilessly as possible until Islam and Mohammedans are no more.

The best way to eradicate Islam is to treat all Muslimes exactly the way the assholey Queeran mandates they should treat non-Slimes.

It's time for Dar al Harb to go on a rampage and teach these Muslime beeyatches who the real dhimmis are.

DEATH TO ISLAM !
DEATH TO THE DISCIPLES OF MOHAM !

[censored] ALLAH THE PAGAN MOON G-d !

That's a big 10-4 and an AMEN, brother Muck. ;D ;D ;D

Offline cjd

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #34 on: July 08, 2007, 09:39:31 AM »
Be civil with a Mooslime ?

Why ?

Anyone that belongs to the vile cult of Islime, doesn't deserve civility or respect.

Islam calls for my forced conversion, dhimmitude or death !!

And I'm supposed to be CIVIL with these IslamoNazi bastards ?

Let's get something straight right here and right now.

Every Muslime is my enemy.

No exceptions.

Mohahmhead (excrement be upon the sewer rat) was a mass murderer, rapist, pedophile, liar, terrorist, scumbag thief.

ANYONE that proclaims this vile, psychotic piece of feces to be a prophet and desires to emulate him doesn't deserve to be treated civilly or with respect.

Let there be no confusion: Islam and Mohammedans are the enemies of all free thinking, righteous people everywhere.

They should be treated with the utmost contempt and as harshly and mercilessly as possible until Islam and Mohammedans are no more.

The best way to eradicate Islam is to treat all Muslimes exactly the way the assholey Queeran mandates they should treat non-Slimes.

It's time for Dar al Harb to go on a rampage and teach these Muslime beeyatches who the real dhimmis are.

DEATH TO ISLAM !
DEATH TO THE DISCIPLES OF MOHAM !

[censored] ALLAH THE PAGAN MOON G-d !
I agree!! In this guys case I agree with you even more because he is a recent convert to this garbage and not someone who was born into it. How can anyone convert to this garbage in light of all the problems and violence Islam is  fomenting in the world today.
He who overlooks one crime invites the commission of another.        Syrus.

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ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #35 on: July 08, 2007, 09:54:18 AM »
I know that Islam is evil, but if we do not treat muslims in a civil manner there is no chance of turning them from islam.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2007, 10:28:35 AM by ftf »

newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #36 on: July 08, 2007, 09:59:53 AM »
I knw that Islam is evil, but if we do not treat muslims in a civil manner there is no chance of turning them from islam.

"turning them from Islam".....you've got buckley's chance. For every odd one that a missionary might bag, those animals breed another ten thousand. Forget converting them. On a mathematical basis alone you'll never do it in 10,000 years. Their destruction is the only thing that will save us.

Offline Muck DeFuslims

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #37 on: July 08, 2007, 10:03:42 AM »
If you think being civil with Slimes is a way to get them to abandon Islam you need to get your head examined.

By the way ftf, is that why you're civil with Jews ?

ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #38 on: July 08, 2007, 10:30:26 AM »
If you think being civil with Slimes is a way to get them to abandon Islam you need to get your head examined.

By the way ftf, is that why you're civil with Jews ?
I am civil and friendly with everyone, because I believe it is right to be so, I gave the example of being able to turn muslims from islam as a practical reason for being civil to them, but that is far from the main reason for me.

I didn't say we'd succeed, but I still think we should try. Every person who abandons Islam is worth a party.

newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #39 on: July 08, 2007, 10:36:40 AM »
Quote:
I didn't say we'd succeed, but I still think we should try. Every person who abandons Islam is worth a party.




I'd rather have a bonfire for the ones who stay.

Offline Muck DeFuslims

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #40 on: July 08, 2007, 10:39:57 AM »
You go right ahead and be civil with Moozies.

Just don't ask me to follow your example.

I've never enjoyed being nice to my enemies.

I've got too much self-respect and too strong an instinct for self-preservation to be nice to people that are busy murdering Jews and 'infidels' all over the planet.

ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #41 on: July 08, 2007, 10:50:26 AM »
The first of the ten commandments instructs us not to give false witness about others, as Abdullah probably doesn't do things to cammels, and isn't a pig you are breaking said commandment by saying that he does. That's my understanding anyway.

I had a really fun debate with a muslim recently, in which we both stated that we believed that the other was unintentionally following satan, we were still very civil to each other though.

newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #42 on: July 08, 2007, 10:57:10 AM »
The first of the ten commandments instructs us not to give false witness about others, as Abdullah probably doesn't do things to cammels, and isn't a pig you are breaking said commandment by saying that he does. That's my understanding anyway.

I had a really fun debate with a muslim recently, in which we both stated that we believed that the other was unintentionally following satan, we were still very civil to each other though.

Well that's just peachy.

While your having a nice little tea party with one of those animals, ten of his mates will be trying to rape your mother and sister. Wake up.

ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #43 on: July 08, 2007, 11:49:28 AM »
The first of the ten commandments instructs us not to give false witness about others, as Abdullah probably doesn't do things to cammels, and isn't a pig you are breaking said commandment by saying that he does. That's my understanding anyway.

I had a really fun debate with a muslim recently, in which we both stated that we believed that the other was unintentionally following satan, we were still very civil to each other though.

Well that's just peachy.

While your having a nice little tea party with one of those animals, ten of his mates will be trying to rape your mother and sister. Wake up.
If they threaten me I will respond in like, but as long as they are just talking, I will keep to being civil.

newman

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #44 on: July 08, 2007, 11:52:53 AM »
The first of the ten commandments instructs us not to give false witness about others, as Abdullah probably doesn't do things to cammels, and isn't a pig you are breaking said commandment by saying that he does. That's my understanding anyway.

I had a really fun debate with a muslim recently, in which we both stated that we believed that the other was unintentionally following satan, we were still very civil to each other though.

Well that's just peachy.

While your having a nice little tea party with one of those animals, ten of his mates will be trying to rape your mother and sister. Wake up.
If they threaten me I will respond in like, but as long as they are just talking, I will keep to being civil.

You're missing the point. Somewhere in the koran there's something about talking peace out one side of your face whilst taking up the sword. Whilst thses people are being civil, they are plotting our deaths.

ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #45 on: July 08, 2007, 12:23:00 PM »
The first of the ten commandments instructs us not to give false witness about others, as Abdullah probably doesn't do things to cammels, and isn't a pig you are breaking said commandment by saying that he does. That's my understanding anyway.

I had a really fun debate with a muslim recently, in which we both stated that we believed that the other was unintentionally following satan, we were still very civil to each other though.

Well that's just peachy.

While your having a nice little tea party with one of those animals, ten of his mates will be trying to rape your mother and sister. Wake up.
If they threaten me I will respond in like, but as long as they are just talking, I will keep to being civil.

You're missing the point. Somewhere in the koran there's something about talking peace out one side of your face whilst taking up the sword. Whilst thses people are being civil, they are plotting our deaths.
How does being rude to them help the situation? I would be civil to someone even while driving a knife through them or firing a gun at them, there is need to be anything but civil.

Offline Muck DeFuslims

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #46 on: July 08, 2007, 01:55:53 PM »
"The first of the ten commandments instructs us not to give false witness about others, as Abdullah probably doesn't do things to cammels, and isn't a pig you are breaking said commandment by saying that he does. That's my understanding anyway."

I didn't say anything untrue about Abdul or Islam and I don't think Newman did either.

"I would be civil to someone even while driving a knife through them or firing a gun at them..."

How about when his friends are driving a knife through or firing a gun at you or your family ?

"I would be civil to someone even while driving a knife through them or firing a gun at them..."

Like when you try to convert Jews ?  Or have you given that up ?

ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #47 on: July 08, 2007, 02:00:34 PM »
"The first of the ten commandments instructs us not to give false witness about others, as Abdullah probably doesn't do things to cammels, and isn't a pig you are breaking said commandment by saying that he does. That's my understanding anyway."

I didn't say anything untrue about Abdul or Islam and I don't think Newman did either.

"I would be civil to someone even while driving a knife through them or firing a gun at them..."

How about when his friends are driving a knife through or firing a gun at you or your family ?

"I would be civil to someone even while driving a knife through them or firing a gun at them..."

Like when you try to convert Jews ?  Or have you given that up ?
I have never tried to convert a Jew, all I have said on that issue is that I would believe it right to do so, my religion clearly says that it should be preached to everyone.

I would do my best to be civil to someone even when he was trying to kill me, though I don't know if I'd be able to.

And newman accused Abdul of doing things to a cammel, I am pretty sure that he (Abdul) has never done things to a cammel, and therefore that is something untrue.

It is easy enough to insult Islam by quoting it's holy texts without making stuff up, so don't start making stuff up or all you do is lose your credibility.

Offline Muck DeFuslims

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #48 on: July 08, 2007, 02:27:19 PM »
OK, so here's what we've established about your beliefs:

You believe it is right to convert Jews.

You believe it is right to be civil with someone that is trying to kill you or your family.

I'm diametrically opposed to those beliefs.

And as far as I'm concerned, anyone holding that first belief, whether he practices it or not, doesn't belong here.

ftf

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Re: Peace - Salaam - Shalom
« Reply #49 on: July 08, 2007, 03:07:15 PM »
OK, so here's what we've established about your beliefs:

You believe it is right to convert Jews.

You believe it is right to be civil with someone that is trying to kill you or your family.

I'm diametrically opposed to those beliefs.

And as far as I'm concerned, anyone holding that first belief, whether he practices it or not, doesn't belong here.
Regarding the first of the two, I've asked Chaim to decide if he thinks I should leave because of it, and I will respect his decision, regarding the second, what does not being civil gain you?