Revava

[jsullivan]

Yekutiel, the State Department banned Kahane Chai along with Kach in 1994 because the Rabbi's son Binyamin was involved with Kahane Chai.  No one seriously considers the group you run now to be a real threat to the Israeli authorities.  YOU HAVE NO REAL PROGRAM AMONG HEBREW SPEAKING ISRAELI JEWS, WHO ARE 95% OF ISRAELI JEWRY.  The Hebrew page you have is only for show.  No one goes to it. 

You raise money for a referendum.  You are going to be able to place a referendum on the Israeli ballot in today's Israel?  This is just a gimmick that accomplishes nothing and you know it.

Noam has no program!?  He is currently on trial with an elaborate 25 count indictment because of the program that he does in JTF's Hebrew section.  You know very well that the authorities take Noam and Itamar Ben Gvir very seriously.  The indictment against Noam specifically states that his JTF program could potentially persuade Israeli Jews to physically resist future expulsions which would disrupt the government plan to create an independent PLO-Hamas state in Judea, Samaria and the Gaza District.

As far as Chaim's Hebrew-language programs, the indictment specifically says the same thing: that these programs if continued may persuade Israeli Jews to physically resist the planned expulsions.  The indictment makes clear that the programs of both Noam and Chaim are to be considered major threats to "public order" and "government policy", i.e. expelling Jews and surrendering more Jewish land to the Muslim terrorists.  They cannot indict Chaim because they do not allow him to become an Israeli citizen.  But about a third of Noam's very lengthy indictment deals with Chaim's program and the "major threat to government policy" that the program represents.

WE INVITE ALL OF OUR HEBREW-SPEAKING READERS TO GO TO JTF'S HEBREW FORUM - WHICH JUST STARTED LAST WEEK - TO SEE THE VERY HIGH QUALITY ISRAELI JEWISH YOUTH THAT JTF'S HEBREW PROGRAMS HAVE ATTRACTED TO THE KAHANIST MOVEMENT.  MOST OF THE POSTERS ARE NOT EVEN RELIGIOUS BUT ARE INTERESTED IN BECOMING PART OF OUR MOVEMENT TO SAVE THE LAND OF ISRAEL.

Yekutiel, I urge you to start doing what JTF is doing.  Stop the referendum nonsense.  Start a HEBREW forum for Israeli Jewish youth, and do five Hebrew programs every week that reach young Jews.

If you want to see why the Bolsheviks are so worried about Noam and Chaim, go to our Hebrew forum and see EDUCATED, INTELLIGENT, DEVOTED YOUNG JEWS WHO DAILY ARE SIGNING UP.  LOOK AT THEIR POSTS.  THIS IS THE BOLSHEVIKS' GREATEST NIGHTMARE.

Anway, the JTF forum is not like Revava.  We don't ban people simply because they disagree with us. To your credit, Yekutiel, on your forum you also do not ban people for merely disagreeing.  So you can continue posting here as you wish despite our differences of opinion.

[jsullivan]

Yacov, I don't know the answer to your latest question.  If you want, I'll ask Chaim. 

Or if you prefer, maybe you should place the question near the top of your questions for the upcoming Ask JTF program.  When it comes to what is happening on the ground in Israel, especially if it involves Hebrew, questions should be posed to Chaim rather than me because my Hebrew is very limited, although I am now taking Hebrew lessons.

I think you know that Chaim is always happy to answer your questions.

[jdl4ever]

Jsullivan, while Yukutiel goes on this site advocating unity (like the late R' Kahane hyd) you just resort to name calling and doing the "I better than thou" routine.  Both JTF and Kahane.org are Kahanist organizations and we should work together.  You have to realize that whether you agree with Yukutel or not, he was the right hand man of R' Kahane and his son for quite a while and I have no doubt he is continuing their campaign.  You also have to realize the chalanges that Kahane.org faces which JTF does not face instead of poking fun at their exposure.   Mainly, it is illegal to donate money to kahane.org since it was classified as a terrorist organization but JTF.org is not a terrorist organization so JTF gets more financial support (plus they have a cable show which means more exposure).  Also you have to understand that Chaim lives in the U.S. so he can say and get away with much more than Yukutiel can since he lives in Israel.  Also, since Chaim and yourself do not live in Israel like he does, he most probably has more Israeli support but this is mere speculation since I live in the US like you guys.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Yekutiel is a Tzaddik for sure, and soo is Marzel, but sometimes I just see that we might be waisting unneccesary resources ( allthought in Shamayim its never goes to waist and every little effort counts), but materially campaigning and doing this and that is a waist of money ( expecially to what marzel does), and besides that its feeding into the system and making it as if its legit, expecially to what the yesha council proposed of "lets have a referendum" and "ze lo ma ha am rotze" this isnt what the people want" , these slogans make democracy and the majority into G-d , and dont even mention the torah of Israel ( The Real Law Of AM YISRAEL).

[kahaneloyalist]

Tzvi, that is exactly why some people are working towards the restoration of Malchut Beis David. To replace this accursed Democracy

[Yekutiel]

Thanks for the kind words but I do not profess to be a tazdik. I am a simple Jew, who happens to believe with a passion that Rav Kahane was right and that we are heading for destruction, and rapidly running out of time. It is for this reason that I risk arrest and harrassment to speak out on behalf of Jews. I know that what I say and do is legal and I also know that I will be persecuted for it. I am a big boy and i understand the consequences of speaking part of the Torah truth in our generation.

I do not know why I have been singled out to absorb the brunt of the persecution to unprecedented extremes such as the kennel closure and the closure of a personal business. I accept my fate with truel love of the Almighty and am honored to be a target of the forces of darkness.

I see Chaim and Noam and Baruch and HaIvri as friends. At the same time i reserve the right to criticise them if I think they are doing something wrong. I have worked with all of the above on many different fronts, and will continue to work with anyone who shares various goals.

When I mentioned that I do not know the exact programs of Chaim or Noam I meant it in the sense that Merzel has apolitical program to realize parts of his ideology. I have some small programs like the canine unit or the referendum. Publishing and speaking out is wonderful and I applaud all of those who do it. Not everyone is launching specific programs on the ground. I will probabaly be forced to hault most of my programs as well due to lack of funds.I did not mean it as a minus. People do what they can and speaking out is hard enough. Both Noam and Chaim have done plenty of time for deeds and speaking out. I have no problem with that and respect both of them for their dedication and siffering on behalf of the Jewish people.

I mean it is fine to attack Merzel for running for Knesset if that is what some people believe, however, it is an another story entirely when people are given an alternative on theground.  I too will probabaly soon limit my activities to speaking out via internet, and through publications. That is risky enough and important enough. I meant no harm when I said that I do not know of any specific progams on the ground that they are leading to implement the ideas. I know that they say good things and support the Judean Initiative and other good programs, but support is not the same as launching programs on theground. There is a need for both and God bless those who have the wisdom and the ability to contribute in speech and in action within existing organizational infratsructures or from without to further common goals.

I sense people mocking Rabbi Kahane's referendum concept. And so let it be clear. The change that we all believe in will come one day. israel will become a Jewish state with pride and Judaism. How will this change come about? Will teh people force it through some sort of peaceful revolution surrounding the Knesset, demanding that change or will it be a bloody overthrow? I dont know. I do know that Rav Kahane wrote and said that he had preferred bringing about that change without a civil war and without bloodshed. I do hope that the warriors on this forum will not be too upset if that change happens to come first through the deligitimizing of the current regime through referendums that prove that the current corrupt regime do not enjoy the support of the majority of Jews in Israel. I do hope that if the referendum brings about that chnage or the beginning of the change that people the Kahanists will not ban the revolutionary changes that the referendum will bring!

It is wonderful to see people attack others, yet I dont see them leading the bloody revolution. It is wonderful to attack the referendom which is a utencil to bring about the proposed changes and to save Jewish lives. As if Rabbi Kahane said that  referendum results that vioilates halacha should be followed. As if we follow our parents or an evil king if they tell us to violate halacha. Obviously such a referendum is not followed if the results contradict God's law. That doe snot  mean that we dont use Knesset or referendum to try an dbring about the revolutionary changes we all believe in. It also does not mean that "majority rules" has no place in the halachic system. And even if there is no place in the halachic system as a system of government it does not mean the tool cant be used to overthrow the government. Federman, Rav Kahane Merzel Chaim and who not all supported Rav Kahane's runs for Knesset, back then. THUS DEMOCRACY CAN BE USED TO BRING ABOUT THE CHANGE!!

Also let us not confuse the immorality and anti Jewish ethics of democracy with other aspects of majority rule. Yes, Judaism opposes equality for all. Yes other pluralistic values are un and anti-Jewish. This does not mean that a majority of Jews who do or demand the right thing is a bad thing to strive for.

I want the majority of Jews to demand transfer, smashing hizbullah in Lebanon the way the Torah would obligate, not surrendering more land. Ironically, the majority of Israelis said exaclty that during and after the war in Lebanon. IT SEEMS ABSOLUTELY INSANE AND MIND BOGGLING THAT KAHANISTS WOULD SAY "LET US IGNORE THE INCREDIBLE NEW REALITY, AND LET US BABBLE ABOUT A CIVIL WAR THAT WE ARE NOT LEADING ANYHOW" it seems mind boggling and insane that we would not try and durect this new righteous massive protest movement to include real solutions based on faith in God and not in America! Instead we have the media and the leftist interest groups misdirecting the righteous protest into the direction of moronic National Commissions that will never address the real pain of the real pain of the nation an dthe real root of the problem.

And instead of Kahane people joining me to help direct this massive protest movemnt and to demand a referendum that will give a podium to the Jewish alternative and that will reach the correct conclusions, I have people teaching me that democracy is unJewish, as if I dont know that and as if Rav Kahane did not know that. What is the point? Protests that deligitimize the government or that broadcast our views is kosher, internet tirades that broadcast our position is kosher, but trying to mobilize the masses to topple the government peacefully is not?

I SAY WE SHOULD BE LEADING THIS PROTEST MOVEMENT AND SAYING:

YES TO A COMMISSION OF INQUIRY HEADED BY THE NATION AND NOT THE CORRUPT JUDGES!

Investigate the judges, the media together with the corrupt politicians!

For the nation has  the right to determine its own destiny- and the judges will not indict themselves!

Only the people will ask the relevant questions, that no state sponsored commission of inquiry will have the guts to ask.

Who gave the legal seal of approval to the corrupt politicians to surrender Lebanon and Gaza?

How much did these land surrenders contribute to the morale of the terrorists?

Did these land surrenders enable the terrorists to kidnap the IDF soldiers and to hit deeper into Israel with their rockets? Were the lands surrendered used as bases of operation enabling the Hizbullah to build bunkers and more effectively kill Jews in Israel?

Who established the code of ethics incorporated into the IDF that brought about the needless death of so many Jews as a result of not attacking terrorists in civilian population centers?

How did the massive resources used to expel Jews last year impact the level of readiness of the IDF to combat the real enemy?

demanding the implementation of the findings of such a referendum that will incorporate the issue of Arab expulsion and annexation of Yesha could be our last chance to bring about the necessary Torah changes, peacefully, before it is too late.
 

[jsullivan]

jdl4ever, don't give me this hypocritical "unity" talk.  Yekutiel is the one who split the movement to begin with.  We would have real unity today if not for what Yekutiel did.

I'm all for real unity.  Not talk, but action.

Also, within Yekutiel's sugarcoated remarks is the claim that he has an action program on the ground and we don't. 

It's the other way around.  His referendum plan is not serious.  THERE IS NO CHANCE THAT THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT IS GOING TO PUT YEKUTIEL'S REFERENDUM ON THE ISRAELI BALLOT.

JTF - through Noam - distributes many thousands of dollars to Jewish families who live in the Hilltop Youth communities.  I don't know if Yekutiel gives them any money - I hope he does.  But I do know that many of these Jewish families are greatly helped by our assistance.

THAT IS A PROGRAM ON THE GROUND.

Also, JTF sponsors kollel yeshiva learning at Mearat HaMachpelah in Chevron.  Rabbi Alba is giving daily shiurim in Talmud Yerushalmi at the Cave of the Patriachs.  Rabbi Alba is a great Jewish hero who served two years in prison for writing that the Torah commands Jews to avenge Arab terrorist attacks.  The Rabbi refused to cooperate with Shabak and was thrown in prison.  The Rabbi also is one of the great authorities today on Mearat HaMachpelah and has written a very scholarly book on the subject. 

JTF COVERS 100% OF THE COSTS OF THESE VITAL TORAH LESSONS THAT WILL, G-D WILLING, CREATE A NEW GENERATION OF HEROIC JEWISH SCHOLARS LIKE RABBI ALBA.

THAT IS A PROGRAM ON THE GROUND.

I could go on and on.

Yekutiel did start his canine program, which is an excellent idea.  He deserves credit for that.

Yekutiel is welcome to come here and post his messages.  As is Nahum.  But if he is going to make certain claims, he should expect that we will respond. 

[Scriabin]

Forgive my ignorance.  Who is Yekutiel? 

I'm assuming that we're not speaking of the Rabbi from the first half of the 20th century.

[TorahZionist]

Forgive my ignorance.  Who is Yekutiel? 

Mike Guzofsky/Yekutiel Ben Yaakov
He runs kahane.org, voiceofjudea.com and the Jewish Legion.

[Scriabin]

Is this the same Yekutiel that is posting here?

[TorahZionist]

Yes

[Yekutiel]

I strongly applaud the support of the "settlements" and Yeshivas and hilltops by JTF. Very nice. We are starting a new hill top near Tapuach and are in desperate need for funds for tents and to build a shul in memory of Rav Kahane there, if you know any people who would like to help. The programs you mentioned are all very nice as well. I was unaware that you had these programs in place to help implement the teachings and views expressed here. Now I know about the families on the hills an dthe Torah classes that you sponsor. These are al lvery nice programs and God should grant you much success teaching Torah and expanding those hilltops.

[jdl4ever]

jdl4ever, don't give me this hypocritical "unity" talk.  Yekutiel is the one who split the movement to begin with.  We would have real unity today if not for what Yekutiel did.

Actually, the split is very complicated and it started occuring during R' Kahane's life time.   For example, the JDL in America started swaying in one direction and the Rav disagreed with it on some issues.  R' Kahane's son's views were not liked by some Kahanists (like JTF I think) and that led to another split.  Then after his son died, more splits happened.  I respectfully think that the split you refer to happened during R' Kahane's life time when he decided to abolish the Kach party and move on to the revolution or referendum idea. 

Yukutiel was just a follower of the Rabbi and his son and stuck to their ideas.  It is splinter groups such as JTF that in fact split off.  But who the hell cares about the split, it is ancient history and just brings up animosity.  There are many paths that lead in the same direction .

[nikmatdam]

yekutiel suffice it to say i whole heartedly agree with you and your adoption of rav meir's endeavor to bring a bloodless revolution to am yisroel and eretz yisroel thru the referendum process... first of all it engenders love... ahavat yisroel not to right away go for the jugular... something shevet yehudah was punished for in their initial attacks upon shevet binyamin in sefer shoftim... (the whole vort not for now)... i concur... this IS the right approach... especially now after the failed war and the disasterous retreats from lebanon (twice now) and from gush katif and amona with dire threats of much, much more of the same to come... if we can do this without having to shed blood we should... especially since as you stated no one is stepping up to the plate thus far to launch either a coup d'etat from the army or an open revolt, rebellion and actual civil-war... so it is ludicrous to jump to this option alone and make it our primary focus and our l'chatchilla, preferred choice of action... this is absolutely absurd and makes us appear to be ridiculous and not to be taken serious... and we then just look like a bunch of raving lunatics and idiots... besides... rav meir's book and movement on this issue stipulates loud and clear... warns and threatens... that... EITHER AM YISROEL WILL BE ALLOWED TO VOTE UP OR DOWN ON ALL THIS MADNESS OR WE WILL RISE UP AND REBEL... AS THEN YOU (THE STATE) WILL HAVE GIVEN US (THE PEOPLE) NO OTHER VIABLE OPTIONS TO VOICE OUR OPINION AND MAKE OUR FEELINGS AND DESIRES FOR OUR LIVES AND THE SOUL OF OUR NATION AND LAND KNOWN, HEARD AND REGISTERED... PASHUT THIS IS THE PLAN AND THE WARNING TO THE POWERS-THAT-BE... besides rav meir wrote in that sefer that this is the natural outcome and course of history for all totalitarian and despotic regimes... EVENTUALLY THE PEOPLE ARE PUSHED TOO FAR... AND SICK AND DISGUSTED AND OUTRAGED THEY RISE UP TO FIGHT AND TAKE BACK WHAT IS RIGHTFULLY THEIRS... THEIR G-D GIVEN, INALIENABLE RIGHT TO BE FREE AND THE LIBERTY TO EXPRESS THEMSELVES AND MAKE THEIR WILL KNOWN AND AT LEAST TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION...   

i will answer the rest of your queries that you raise for the inquiry yet to come to handle in a separate thread... herein we are speaking about revava... and i wish to conform to this central theme... as anyone seeing my profile over there i have been posting and otherwise involved with revava for a while now... i was absolutely shocked but grateful to discover the truth and to have been shown this site and thread by a chaver of mine from both forums... you know who you are and thanks... and oh yeah send me again here info how to put rav bulman's picture up on my new deal here...

i have been upset at my treatment over there on revava for sometime now... since the regime change bringing lt~kn or yissacher or elisha or whomever to power there to be in charge of moderating the site... it has seemed right from the start that he had it in for me... and i did not understand until today why... as i thought we were mostly pro-kahane people... and after i had met and befriended yisroel, david and lenny... i thought we were all together on the same page... but strange thiongs started to occur...

the last time i showed up to pick david up to take him around l.a. he did not use me... true my car was not available then... but he rented and i just assumed that he would ask me to drive for him... he did not... i was lucky to bump into him right before he departed to find out what had happened... no call and no goodbyes would have been forthcoming otherwise but for this bit of hashgacha pratis occuring..

next i learned as reported on arutz sheva that shortly after david's community service sentence was complete that tours of jewish-american and probably non-jewish college students as well... were being brought by the ministry oif tourism to tapuach to be greeted by and spoken to by david... and i said to myself... "wait a minute... hold on here... he was just punished for 'racism' and now the state is bringing him kids to have an influence on...?" no way did and does this make any sense given what i thought was the struggle going on between david and our guys with the slime erev-rav unjewish jews unfortunately running the roost in our land... why would they do that... would they have let rav meir or rav binyamin do that...? no way... of course not... so why all of a sudden are they letting david do so when after all he's binyamin's brother-in-law for crying-out-loud...? mindblowing...

and if all of the above was not bad enough... recently... very recently we have carried on a bitter and a passionate debate on revava on their shifting of policy to not mention rav meir's torah or political views by name but supposedly just continue them without quoting the kahane shita by name... besides the 'b'shem omru' difficulty here i just did not understand why all of a sudden it was decided that they were now taboo for discussion in their outreach and other politicasl and spiritual endeavors to fight for the jewish state and a torah state with har habayit as our main focus as revava's mission statement and david's new book on the subject seemed to imply as to their movement's goals and objectives... again things just were not adding up anymore...

and to conclude the problem segment of this post... i began to be banned for expressing my displeasure at the moderators iron-hand at cutting off debate on certain threads prematurely... or deleting my offerings... etc. it felt like a concerted effort and campaign to derail me from my communicating with the tzibur over there and no appeal to david seemed to work...  especially puzzling since it wasdavid who asked me to begin writing for revava in the first place... besides today's banning... last time... david actually suggested that i start my own blog... which is strange 'cause no one really knows me or who i am since i write anonymously... so what good is my own spot if no one knows that i'm out there...? damn crazy stuff going on... no...?

i also hvae been a bit surprised up until now as to why revava had met with only minor resistance in their endeavors for har habayit... why for example are they not harassed like the kahanes were...? why do they get the kid-glove treatment of just the appearance of detaining and arresting without any of the harsh jail terms or riot-police beatings at their mass gatherings and thier attempts to go up en masse...? all of this bothered me... especially when yisroel told me he was called in to some police org. and told "you just have to stop this campaign and let this idea go..." that's it...? that's the extent of the interrogation...? almost begging him... and not ordering him...?

and so all taken together i think i now start to understand what's really going on here... they sold out... and their cover is the appearance of a movement for har habayit which is allowed to thrive in israel unmolested when the official policy of the gov't. is that all of this is off the table for official consideration as it along with the whole of yesha are and were on the chopping blocks of oslo... thus proving the existence of 2 secret clauses (unwritten) as barry chamish exposed for us... yerushalayim and har habayit to be given over to the vatican for control and for the erection of an eventual temple for a one-world religion domination (another time i will reveal here what i discovered to be the root meaning of this concept)... and of course the other hidden agenda, secret clause  for a palestinian state on 95+% of yesha as barak revealed to us in his failed initiative for
"peace"... and not just on the 65 or so% stipulated in the above-board written clauses of the original document of oslo...

and there you have it... when they say they are working for a beit hamikdash... it is the british/vatican model of one... a satanic, masonic idolatrous one... and this is what they really mean to refer to... as per ben gurion's original plan and mandate to bring to pass for the then british-controled world order back in the 40"s... see on-line the interview he gave to look magazine or life... wherein he "predicted" this structure... (really he knew all along about these plans of the nwo)... and so our two heroes david and yisroel have sold out or bought in for whatever they were ooffered to control the debate on this issue and steer it toward the nwo direction just as the yesha council has been doing all along legabi the west bank and gaza...

and this is why they are also striving so hard to distance themselves from the kahane legacy and to win over and to co-opt the strong protestant, evangelical american-chrisitian population who are pushing for and have been demonstrating their total and near-unanimous backing of the jews in this struggle and war over the position and side of the disgusting, filthy arabs as well as their on-going rallying to our settler cause over the slime erev rav gov't. policy to judenrein the country and these goyim have been doing so for quite a while now and in ever-increasing and greater numbers and in crescendoing and ever-higher pitched and shrill voices... scaring the pants off of the powers-that-be here in the u.s. and in israel as to who will prevail here... because with their throwing their support for our claim to eretz yisroel we just might have a chance... unless the wrong jewish "leadership" wins over their confidence and garners their power, support and clout... and so revava unsuspected by everyone... are actually working against us as they have been sent in to make it appear that they are the central address for this crucial movement in order to blunt its powerful effect and significant and sizeable political and economic clout which should be engendered and employed by us to enable us to finally realize our dreams... ansd with their christian numbers and with our jewish citizenry all over the world and in israel pulling together we should be empowered to carry the day... but instead revava is succeeding to deflect and to stimie this powerful union and jugernaut from even taking off and being launched... and instead of our dreams for the third and final beit hamikdash coming true... coming to pass... they will subvert everything and deny us victory and just make themselves and the other insiders of revava wealthy and powerrful instead and sell us all down the river... and in the end rationalizing all of this to be for the best... thus really.... actually... they are all fast becoming downright traitors!!!

unfortunately this is the conclusion i have been forced to draw from all that has been happening on the scene there and in light of my personal experiences on revava's site... it saddens me to no end to think the worst of these jews but i cannot and i will not shy away from whatever the truth exposes to the light of day nor flee from the ramifications and consequences which this truth brings forth naturally from the weight of its own evidence and from the depths of its own integrity and ability to put all of the pieces of the puzzle together and answer all the enigmas and finally start makeing some clear sense out of all of the pure insanity swirlling around us these past 13-16 years... and this latest breakthrough works for me to help sort out key problems which otherwise to date have remained fathomless events that i have been unable to perceive and to clearly penetrate their seemingly inscrutable vaneer which until now cast a totally different perspective on things which now appears to have been altered and to be forced finally to emerge from the shadows of obscurity where they formerly have been purposively laid and hidden... sometimes like today seemingly miraculous and out of nowhere comes new clarity in my pursuit of truth and my pursuit of our people's salvation... and each and every time these new perceptions yield fresh perot which always cast the same strong light on the hidden agenda(s) deceptivelly being kept from us little guys... the hamoan am... which we are continuely denied access to and which to our minds and hearts we are never consulted and to which when a lit bit more of the truth is finally discovered... grants us yet further breakthroughs to overcome many more of the obstacles put in our way by their purposeful acts of deceit against us... of attempting to leave us in the dark until it is too late for us to do anything to save our selves and our cause... and thus each new revelation of truth sheds stronger light and truth in its wake driving sheker back underground and righting our sense of control and perception so that we can continue to fight for our peoiple and our homeland... and our torah and our G-d... amen... boruch Hashem!!!

and in conclusion here... as one great author once penned... "let justice be done though the heavens fall..." and so let our erstwhile heroes lenny, yisroel and david fall if they have failed to live up to the kiddush Hashem and mesirat nefesh which our cause which is true demands and requires of us all... and if they have sinned against our cause... the cause of rav meir and rav binyamin... the cause for which they gave the full measure of their final devotion and which they both paid the penultimate self-sacrifice... and which above all is the cause of our G-d... if they have sinned... let them and a thousand like them all fall (myself included if i too dare sin against the cause, G-d forbid)... so let them all fall and let not a one of us shed a tear nor feel sorry for their betrayal and perfidy... for they will have brought their downfall upon themselves by their own volition even if only done under extreme duress from all of the various factions of the slime which sad to say rules this earth... so let all of their reputations be broken but let not perish one iota of the cause which is the essence of our Divine destiny as jews... nik. out...

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Yaakov to be fair, the people on the revava forum got fed up with you becuase every sentence you posted was from Jtf and you spammed alot which is annoying. ( not that im saying negative about jtf , but that some 1 spamming it again and again, made some ppl hate the spamming and bc of it jtf.

[nikmatdam]

sorry it took me so long to conclude my first piece... but tell me... why doesn't this rise to the top when a fresh reply is added...? especially if it is the hotest thread currently going here...? nik.

[kahaneloyalist]

other subjects have been made sticky so they stay at the top

[nikmatdam]

thanks... n.

[Nahum]

Jsullivan,

when you say you are not abou talk, just action, what exactly do you do.  with all due respect.  i am not tryin gto undermine you or anythin gof that sort i am just curious as to what you guys actually do. 

[nikmatdam]

i have some more to say on revava...

a few other things stick out in my mind from my dealings with david and yisroel...

a) yisroel lost a copy of my book... said he dropped it off at ohr somayach but they said they never received it... then i gave him another to hand deliver to the rav in quest. house and he sat on it for over a year... finally i asked him to return it to me which he did... turned out i had lost my one last copy... but anyhow... i had told him that my book an historical-novel on the life of avraham avinu... titled: "moriah revisited" was meaningful to adress all of today's problems between the world and israel... that all of history is nimrod vs. avraham over and over again in the guise of esav vs. yaakov... and so he promptly "lost" the first copy and forgot or had no time to deliver the second attempted one... my rav will read it and hopefully help me get it published...

b) david, yis. from revava and matt from bnai elim were going nuts last summer to get on the american zionist something or other and be given a voice in the world zio. org. and when i confronted them as to what a monumental waste of time and chillul hashem this effort was they said we want them to turn us away to make them appear biased against us....

first of all... after '88 and rav meir's banning we don't need anymore proof that secular zionism is afraid of us and banned us to keep us from power and that they will never let us back thru the door... not even this kind of back door...

second... they wanted so much of our time for this "crucial" name gathering campaign and petition drive. ... that it was taking away from efforts to stop the gush katif and amona debacles... which i never understood as to why they were doing it... now i know... to sabotage all of our efforts to get anything done about keeping our settlements...

third... their whole campaign to go up on har habayit... admittedly important and not a distraction from the yesha issue as yerush. is part of yesha... but everytime there is a major demonstration yis. and david never get thru to be there when things might turn ugly... they are both always conviently stopped and detained and they go so early to try and get into the kotel area that they are easy to spot and arrest... why not go up with the masses and try and sneak thru...?

and now for the clincher... in a moment of what i now know to be an unguarded moment where yis. let down his defenses and offered me his real truthful feelings... he said and if he denies this he is lying... he said: "they should all just give it up and the best thing for them would be if they were made to leave and come back into the real world and have to get real jobs..." etc. something along these lines... he said this about david and tapuach and all the settlements... and i was shocked... then why is he risking his life to raise money to save these frontier towns...? it made no sense and i dismissed the statement as his fatigue showing from the long haul of being on the road... but now we see perhaps the real agenda... the actual truth coming out...

because anyway... why does the shabak need a street-tough yeshivah boy from queens to watch the israeli-left for them...? this is what he says he was doing in the secret service... bull... he was recruited because for whatever sick reason his real sympathies lie with the satanic murderers of our people and the slime around the world who make the is. gov't erev rav filth do what they do... and yis. also told me he was guilty of many a thing or two growing up in ny he wasn't proud of... so his cred. as a member in good standing with the faithful trying to defend Hashem's holy land is now in question and both he and david have alot of explaining to do...

besides the abysmal way they run that forum of theirs... nik. out for now...

[jsullivan]

Nahum, if you want to know what JTF actually does, I suggest that you start by rereading my answer on this thread.  You ask a fair question, but I feel that I already answered it.  In my opinion, nothing could be more important for Israel than the things I describe in my original answer. 

[nikmatdam]

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Jonathan Shabbat
Hero Member

Posts: 4667


State of Judea Now!

 
      Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« on: October 21, 2006, 10:29:30 PM »   

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In light of some recent events I feel a need to clarify a few things about this forum and its purpose.

Revava operates this forum to serve the needs of like- and not-so-like-minded people who wish to discuss topics relating to Israel and the Jewish people. The forum exists to foster discussion and intellectual stimulation, not to 'rally the troops'. Revava is doing us a favor by providing us for a place to exchange ideas, presumably because it is in its best interest to foster such discussions. Note that the leaders of Revava themselves rarely post here.

Forum members need not have anything to do with Revava. I, a moderator of this forum, have nothing whatsoever to do with the organization. I am not involved with Revava or its leaders in any way, shape or form. I do not represent or necessarily ascribe to Revava's views, nor does Revava represent me. To me this forum is a place to discuss ideas. That the word 'revava' appears in the web address means nothing to me. If these posters were to relocate to another forum I would follow them.

This means that nobody need justify any sort of heterodoxy on his part. It also means that assigning Revava responsibility for anything written here is as senseless as expecting the owners of Rotter to be accountable for what other people write there. An organization can distribute free drinks; that doesn't automatically turn anyone who accepts a drink into an activist, affiliation which requires the organization to account for any of his actions. Views aired at Hyde Park don't represent the British government and neither does this forum represent Revava. This forum is likewise a public service and no more, although I assume it is helpful for Revava to have a community that it can reach when necessary.

Again, this forum is a place for discussions, not a party convention. There is no 'party line' for people to fall in line with, nor is Revava obligated to defend or explain anything written by a forum member.

Hopefully this message will (1) make it easier for newcomers to settle in, (2) clear things up for those who mistakenly believe everything written here to be the official position of the Revava organization.

 
 
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 Ma'aleh Adumim - Provisional Capital of The State of Judea.
 
 
Jonathan Shabbat
Hero Member

Posts: 4667


State of Judea Now!

 
      Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2006, 10:31:17 PM »   

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They recently banned a long time member who has since relocated to JTF and this member posted all his old posts on a 6 page thread at JTF. Elisha drives away people and they turn to Elisha's self-declared enemies. He is just helping the people he works against.

 
 
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 Ma'aleh Adumim - Provisional Capital of The State of Judea.
 
 
es
Administrator
Jr. Member

Posts: 76


     Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2006, 07:18:52 AM »   

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1. I dont know why this is being brought up here. we have already established that revava and its affiliates are a bunch of frauds theives and do everything in their power to harm important Jewsih causes and discredit important Jewish life saving efforts.

1. it seems elisha crossed haivris line when he banned nikmat dam. nikmat dam was a big supporter of haivri/revava and was recently banned by elisha so now haivri is trying to get him back by making elisha say publically that revava is not connected to the forum or that they do them a favor by letting them post there and so on as if haivri isnt in control. yada yada yada.

everyone knows that haivri is in full control of the forum and elisha was appointed by haivri to be moderator so i dont think that one will work and besides it seems as if nik is a genuine guy that really wants to help 
 jews so it makes sense that his place is not with revava.
 
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Nahum
Moderator
Sr. Member

Posts: 378



     Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2006, 01:22:48 PM »   

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that makes no sense at all. what is the point of the organization having a forum then?  why would they be connected?  looks like elisha made a boo boo.  thats what happen swhen you give a power hungry freak to much control.  way to go elisha!  kol hakavod!  this should be a lesson to haivri for the future; if you hire someone destructive, eventually they will destroy you.   
 
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es
Administrator
Jr. Member

Posts: 76


     Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2006, 04:30:15 PM »   

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its not like haivri is any better than elisha but who cares anyway. more important things to deal with
 
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Jonathan Shabbat
Hero Member

Posts: 4667


State of Judea Now!

 
      Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2006, 06:01:29 PM »   

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Elisha said there is no party line at Revava's forum. Then why does he delete messages that mention Yekutiel or JTF?

 
 
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 Ma'aleh Adumim - Provisional Capital of The State of Judea.
 
 
Nahum
Moderator
Sr. Member

Posts: 378



     Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2006, 06:43:08 PM »   

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his whole last message was just a ploy to get one of their contributors back on the boat.  he realized he screwed up and this was his retarded way of apologizing.  just another revava scheme.   
 
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nikmatdam
Newbie

Posts: 2

one of my earliest rebeiim... rav nacman bulman zt


     Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules
« Reply #7 on: Today at 12:29:40 PM »     

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hi everyone i'm going to be here as well thanks to torahzionist telling me this site is now cleansed of filth... kach etc. is still not correct? anyway... as i posted on jtf... my response in brief to elisha's recently re-stated rules over at revavomit is as follows... they are all utter lies and prevaracations... as i never ever told anyone to stop posting on that site nor did i ever demand allegiance by anyone there to rav meir's line (as i was not in charge there and this was not my right)... nor would i have done this had i been in command... but i wouldn't have begun a site in the interset of all viewpoints either... for if i were to start one... i would have stated from the beginning: "this is for the promotion of pro-kahane ideas... anyone disagreeing and wishing to challenge us... may do so by all means... we are not afraid of any of you... but we are not here for you... we know he was right and so we are here to continue the fight and struggle... etc." (you get the idea)... by virtue of the fact that this is not so at a site supposedly begun by the brother-in-law of rav binyamin hy"d should have been a glaring and flaming red flag for me... i'm sorry i was so naive...

anyway back to elisha... so it is a lie that these rules needed re-iterating as i never violated them... i was banned for accusing yby and others of being plants and for calling the israeli power-structure and gov't. "slime"/ something i had done repeatedly for months on end without reprisal until last weekend... also the plant thing... i don't know about yby for sure... but it turns out the whole damn site is a plant... so i was dead-on... thank G-d i'm not dead period for being so stupid and so trusting... NEVER AGAIN!!!

lastly... if as he said... this site was open to all viewpoints... then why was i banned...? don't i have just as much right to express my opinion as anyone else...? and yet i was banned and harrassed there constantly... so he and they are all a bunch of big fat liars... period... end of statement by me on this for now...

but btym... i was really banned for angrily challenging the lunacy of a newbie goy... rory blackshyster or something who must be some new force and source of mullah for them and he didn't want this guy to bail because i could tear his arguments apart in my sleep... that is the real reason why i am banned and why david hasn't even bothered as before to go to bat for me or to even if he agrees this time to at least have the courage to  answer my appeal to him directly like a man... coward!!!! they are all such utter slime just like the slime they work for... such a shame though... i really regarded him and yisroel and lenny as brothers... i thought the world of them... that is why i'm so livid now... they manipulated my love for the cause and my dedication and love for the kahanes... and for this alone i know they will all burn long and hard... for this deception and genevat da'at... nik. glad to be here as well... out...
 
« Last Edit: Today at 12:39:27 PM by nikmatdam »  Report to moderator    68.127.107.216 

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"i am nikmatdam... humble and imperfect servant of Hashem... i yearn for redemption but i absolutely ache for Divine justice and vengeance..."
 
 
nikmatdam
Newbie

Posts: 2

one of my earliest rebeiim... rav nacman bulman zt


     Re: Elisha's Make Believe Rules/ not just frat pranks...
« Reply #8 on: Today at 01:27:32 PM »     

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i need for you all to understand... i didn't go seeking out revava to join... they came to me in l.a. thru a mutual friend... i took them around town for several trips over several years... david had me write blurbs of their trips... and a book review for his har habayit book... and he personally asked me several different times to begin posting on his forum... i was there solely by his request... and because i thought we were tight... brothers-in-arms... etc. and as such... not that i should have been accorded special, preferential treatment... i was never looking for that... nor any recognition... this is why i am anon. but to be treated worse than everyone else...?! and now to learn that really david was directing this treatment of me behind the scenes thru elisha... this is very painful for me to have to accept... but it has to be the truth... i was betrayed right from the start... and they played with me... toyed with me... they went thru the ruse of having me banned and my appealing to david for re-instatement several times... at least on 7 or so separate occassions... this should be a warning to all of you... they are not just "a do-nothing plant org. to siphon-off funds and energy for the cause..." they are dangerous subversives whose orders are to sabatoge and destroy any hope of our succeeding in saving eretz yisroel and along with her... am yisroel... we are all in dire straits and in imminent peril and danger due to their existence and the evil power of their handlers and the slime erev rav gov't behind all of them... and the slime world gov.'t of amer. and britain over all of these... take stock... take a lesson from me... have nothing what-so-ever to do with them... they have to be shunned and exposed for the fraud which they are or they will hurt us all very badly and damage if not thoroughly destroy the dream we all share and work for... nik. out... 
 
 Report to moderator    68.127.107.216 

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"i am nikmatdam... humble and imperfect servant of Hashem... i yearn for redemption but i absolutely ache for Divine justice and vengeance..."
 
 
 
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[nikmatdam]

Printable View This message is not flagged. [ Flag Message - Mark as Unread ] To: [email protected]
Subject: New Personal Message: Rory Blackhand
From: "Revava Discussion Board" <[email protected]>  View Contact Details   Add Mobile Alert 
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2006 09:01:46 +0000
    You have just been sent a personal message by Yissachar on Revava
Discussion Board.

IMPORTANT: Remember, this is just a notification. Please do not reply
to this email.

The message they sent you was:

Shalom Nik,

1. There are ways to speak to people and ways not to speak to people.
When a newcomer to the forum takes initiative and opens a thread you
can't jump down his throat and ream him out as you did. You've gotta learn
to use Darkei Noam.

2. This isn't a Kahane forum. People can disagree with his teachings
freely without it being condemned as heresy.

3. When your post doesn't earn a response there's no reason to make a
post that says "Why are you guys listening to me??" That's not far from
spamming.

Kol Tuv.

o.k. so this started our little tet-a-tet... i had written in response a biting satirical article as to why this guy is off his rocker... but within reason... i just told him his "jordan is palestine" concept was not original and not acceptable... so then when yiss. sent me the above i backed down... and told him "fine"... but then when i went back to the thread and saw my response had been deleted in full and not just edited... i became outraged and began blasting away at yiss.' fascist streak... doing so for the umpteenth time and then he threatened to can me for good and said that this time even david haivri would'nt be be able to save me..."

well when i saw that e-mail to me i saw red... went completely livid... and i lashed back even harsher and posted each and every one of my diatribes and rants openly on the traitorous revava board  (knowing full-well as i was doing so that i was going to be immediately banned for doing so)... nik.   

[nikmatdam]

       
Yahoo!My Yahoo!Mail     Make Y! your home pageYahoo! SearchSearch:Welcome, nikmatdam
To: [email protected]
Subject: New Personal Message: Re: Rory Blackhand
From: "Revava Discussion Board" <[email protected]>  View Contact Details   Add Mobile Alert 
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 08:00:33 +0000
    You have just been sent a personal message by Yissachar on Revava
Discussion Board.

IMPORTANT: Remember, this is just a notification. Please do not reply
to this email.

The message they sent you was:

This forum is meant to discuss ideas. The rules are at the top of the
page so that there won't be new threads dedicated to discussing those
rules or other matters relating to proper conduct.

Opening new threads to air your grievances is no different than
spamming. Write whatever you want to whoever you want via private messages.
Complain about me to the other mods, accuse newbies of heresy, whatever
you want - but through private messages. Anything that goes on the
public forum needs to be fit for the public, and frankly the public deserves
better than some of the posts you make.

and so then he sent me this... nik.

[nikmatdam]

       
To: [email protected]
Subject: New Personal Message: Re: Rory Blackhand
From: "Revava Discussion Board" <[email protected]>  View Contact Details   Add Mobile Alert 
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 15:33:46 +0000
    You have just been sent a personal message by Yissachar on Revava
Discussion Board.

IMPORTANT: Remember, this is just a notification. Please do not reply
to this email.

The message they sent you was:

why is that one of the rules...? what if it is true and can be
verified...? you are a sad loser and you are destroying the free
exchange of ideas here... just my low take on your authoritarian dictatorship
here which you said i could make privately but i should be allowed as
is my right as a free human being and jew to make public... privacy
rules in this setting only protect the guilty and the evil...

as far as i'm concerned you can go take a flying leap... as for me... i
will continue to write whatever i damn please... whatever i believe to
be true and important for my fellow jews to hear and i don't give a rip
if you "ban me for good" because if you do it will just be proof
positive of my contention that this site is being tampered with by the slime
gov't. and then as a matter of course this site won't be and is not
worth a damn and so it is not worthy of my posting here... so stick that
in your craw and choke on it awhile... nik. in a rage... out...

No, you will NOT write 'whatever you damn please', because this is a
forum of dozens of people and isn't your private club. I'm all in favor
of a free exchange of ideas, but your posts aren't "ideas" - they're
vicious rants.

i was banned they said for calling the is. gov't slime and for accusing some posters of being gov. plants...

to wit i dashed off the above little gem and received this kind message in return... and in it he gives you an inkling as to what viciousness i sunk to in blasting him in the first place to get both deleted and banned all in one fell-swoop... and so people... there you have it... ta... nik.