Author Topic: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?  (Read 13106 times)

0 Members and 4 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Shalom,

In a previous thread I revealed that last Shabbat I spoke with my Rabbi and a friend about Rabbi Meir Kahane (ZT'l)... During this conversation I learned a couple of new things.

My friend said he had read something which disturbed him concerning the great rabbi. I asked him specifically what the issue was....

He said that he had seen the 'Playboy Interview' which Rabbi Kahane gave in the 70s (actually I am not sure of the date)... First off, I was not aware that Rabbi Kahane would grant an interview to such a magazine... So I took what he said with a grain of salt...

The real issue was that he said that in this interview the Rabbi admitted he worked for the FBI in an investigation of the John Birch society. Rabbi Kahane, under an assumed name, joined the John Birch society in order to infiltrate it in case the FBI wanted to know something about the organization.

As it turns out this is a true story. I found a link on JTF with a transcript of the interview...

Here is a link to the original interview re-posted on JTF @ http://jtf.org/forum/index.php?topic=5526.0

Quote
KAHANE: In the early Sixties, a friend and I set up a research institute, our own business. We did a lot of work for the Government?the State Department, the Pentagon. In 1963, we were contacted by one agency that asked whether we'd be interested in researching radical groups, particularly on the right.
PLAYBOY: What agency?
KAHANE: Well. . . .
PLAYBOY: Was it the FBI?
KAHANE: They'd say it's not true.
PLAYBOY: Is it?
KAHANE: All right, we were contacted by the FBI to do work on the Birchers. It was no big deal; I mean, I was no FBI agent. We just did contract work for them, and they paid us.
PLAYBOY: How did you conduct your investigation?
KAHANE: It was my idea that the best way to do a research job on a group was to join it. So I became a member of the Birch Society under the name Michael King.
PLAYBOY: That's more or less a translation of your name.
KAHANE: Yes. You don't join the Birchers and hope to get anywhere with the name Meir Kahane. I spent about two and a half years with them, and I really learned a lot. But it was difficult on account of my religion. I constantly had to make up reasons why I couldn't attend meetings on Friday nights.
PLAYBOY: Did you find that the Birchers were really a serious threat?
KAHANE: What bothered me more than anything else was the large number of ostensibly normal people in the society. There's this great liberal arrogance that anybody who's right of center has to be a kook, a nut, an oddball, and it's not true. If it were, I'd feel happier about it. But there was a large number of physicians, attorneys, college graduates, who sat and listened to?and believed ?things that were completely absurd about the Communist threat to America. These people were pillars of the community, and it frightened me that such people were willing to believe such stuff. That's what bothered me more than anything else about the Birchers. Today it's the John Birch Society; tomorrow it will be a worse group.
PLAYBOY: You and your organization do have one quality in common with many American conservatives: hawkishness on military issues. Your concern over Israel's security is understandable?doubly so since your wife and four children live there. But you've also supported the war effort in Vietnam. Do you feel that is in some way tied in with Israel's interests?

Now I am not a fan of John Birch society because I have heard that some members are Jew haters.... But my friend from minyan is a conservative, and he is a Jewish member of John Birch, and he viewed this revelation in a very negative light.

I was unable to discuss the topic with him at the time because it was news to me, I had never heard about A) The playboy interview, and B) That Rabbi Kahane worked for the FBI... My ex-wifes father also was a member of the John Birch society...


I was wondering if any other JTF members, or Chaim, can shed some insight into this chapter of Kahanist history...

Thank you,
Muman613
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline kahaneloyalist

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1959
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2014, 01:47:04 AM »
At the time the John Birch society was extremely anti-semitic. If they have changed great, but in that era the JBS was the respectable organization for Jew haters to join.
"For it is through the mercy of fools that all Justice is lost"
Ramban

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2014, 01:51:26 AM »
Wikipedia says this:

Former Eisenhower cabinet member Ezra Taft Benson — a leading Mormon — spoke in favor of the John Birch Society, but in January 1963 the LDS church issued a statement distancing itself from the Society.[45] Antisemitic, racist, anti-Mormon, anti-Masonic, and various religious groups criticized the group's acceptance of Jews, non-whites, Masons, and Mormons. These opponents accused Welch of harboring feminist, ecumenical, and evolutionary ideas.[46][47][48] Welch rejected these accusations by his detractors: "All we are interested in here is opposing the advance of the Communists, and eventually destroying the whole Communist conspiracy, so that Jews and Christians alike, and Mohammedans and Buddhists, can again have a decent world in which to live."[49]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Birch_Society
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2014, 02:01:46 AM »
It appears, by doing some 'googling' that I came across this article from 1967, when the ADL made the accusation against the JBS...

http://www.jta.org/1967/01/31/archive/adl-warned-of-anti-semitism-in-radical-right-john-birch-society

ADL Warned of Anti-semitism in ‘radical Right,’ John Birch Society
January 31, 1967
NEW YORK (Jan. 30)

America’s “radical right” has created “a huge patchwork blanket” of radio broadcasts, has made easier the recruitment of members by the John Birch Society, which “contributes to anti-Semitism,” and poses “the greatest danger” to the civil rights movement, the Anti-Defamation League of B’nai B’rith was warned today.

The warning came from Benjamin R. Epstein, national director of the ADL, and Arnold Forster, the League’s general counsel. They presented a special report dealing with the radical right to the League’s national commissioners at the closing session of the ADL’s 54th annual meeting, which has been in session since Friday.

They accused the John Birch Society again of “contributing to anti-Semitism.” They noted that, last year, the ADL had exposed the “rantings and ravings” of the radical right, including the Birch Society. “Since then,” they said, “the Society has done nothing to solve the continuous problem. Instead, it has concentrated on attacking its critic, the ADL, rather than its critical problem, that of attracting anti-Semites to its ranks.”

RADIO BROADCASTS REPORTED BY EPSTEIN, FORSTER, BEAM BIGOTRY

The report declared that a “united front” attack on the civil rights movement as an alleged Communist conspiracy is being waged by right-wing extremism, led by the John Birch Society “which provides leadership, strategy and necessary tools.” According to the Epstein-Forster report:
More than 600 radio stations carry the Twentieth Century Reformation Hour, broadcast by the Rev. Carl McIntire, a New Jersey-based fundamentalist clergyman;

Some 400 stations broadcast commentaries by Clarence Manion, a member of the national council of the John Birch Society;
Almost 200 stations carry broadcasts by the Rev. Billy James Hargis, termed as “a fiery evangelist of both religious and political fundamentalism”;

More than 125 stations broadcast the speeches of another right-winger, Dan Smoot;
More than 150 stations broadcast the messages of the White Citizens Council;

Other stations beam the commentaries of Maj. Edgar C. Bundy, and of Richard Cotten. The report called the latter “an undisguised anti-Semite.”

The ADL leaders said they believed that, in the long run, “America will reject the Birch Society and its allies,” but voiced deep concern over the “hazy borderlines” between the radical right and “true conservatives.”



Should we be suspect because ADL is involved?

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Israel Chai

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 9732
  • 112
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2014, 02:53:50 AM »
Conspiracy groups typically have a lot of antisemetics that join, but why would the Rabbi agree to talk to playboy?
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2014, 02:57:47 AM »
Conspiracy groups typically have a lot of antisemetics that join, but why would the Rabbi agree to talk to playboy?

Hi LKZ,

The only reason I can think of is that Playboy had a very sophisticated 'reputation' back in the 60s and 70s. A lot of celebrities and political figures were interviewed. It may have allowed him to get his story out. A lot of men did read playboy back in those days. They would only 'read the articles' of course...

Look at this list of names of great celebrities of the 70s-80s who were interviewed @
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_in_Playboy_1970%E2%80%9379

The Kahane interview was published in the October of 1972 edition...
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline drlmg

  • Master JTFer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1026
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2014, 08:51:43 AM »
Wikipedia says this:

Former Eisenhower cabinet member Ezra Taft Benson — a leading Mormon — spoke in favor of the John Birch Society, but in January 1963 the LDS church issued a statement distancing itself from the Society.[45] Antisemitic, racist, anti-Mormon, anti-Masonic, and various religious groups criticized the group's acceptance of Jews, non-whites, Masons, and Mormons. These opponents accused Welch of harboring feminist, ecumenical, and evolutionary ideas.[46][47][48] Welch rejected these accusations by his detractors: "All we are interested in here is opposing the advance of the Communists, and eventually destroying the whole Communist conspiracy, so that Jews and Christians alike, and Mohammedans and Buddhists, can again have a decent world in which to live."[49]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Birch_Society

..... so, is the JBS a reputable organization? What people claim and actually do can be miles apart.

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2014, 01:02:59 PM »
drmg, I am not interested in the merit or non-merit of the JBS... I am interested in the mindset of the Rabbi at the time and what he was trying to accomplish by doing some of these apparently questionable things... I am sure there is a rational reason and I hope to learn it...

The wikipedia page contains this information about this story...

Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meir_Kahane#Becoming_Michael_King_and_Infiltrating_John_Birch_Society

Becoming Michael King and Infiltrating John Birch Society[edit]

At some time in the late 1950s, Mr. Kahane took on the persona of a non-religious individual, living a double life, shaving his beard and renamed himself Michael King.[26] Kahane became a demagogue at this point according to most accounts, and re-imagined himself as virulently and violently anti-Communist and anti-hippie. He created the 'July Fourth Movement' which targeted left wing groups on US college campuses across the US, financed by the US Government. During this period Mr. Kahane attempted to rekindle his Brooklyn College friendship with Joseph Churba which resulted in them co-authoring the text, 'The Jewish Stake in Vietnam' together, which was an attempt to convince American Jews of the 'evil of Communism'.[27] Kahane and Churba wrote "All Americans have a stake in this grim war against Communism.... it is vital that Jews realize the threat to their very survival [should Communism succeed]" from the introduction. Churba had a major falling out with Kahane over the use of para-militarism, and they permanently parted ways, he went on to pursue his own career, joining the US Air Force, writing many books on the Middle East, later becoming one of Ronald Reagan's consultants. Kahane chose a violent path, even attempting to acquire and grow biological weapons to use on a Soviet military installation[11] but failed. Following the failure to get FBI training in the use of biological weapons, and the suicide of his 'Michael King' persona's non-Jewish mistress, he began using the phrase 'Never Again'[28] (wrote a book with that title, a few years after his first article using that phrase appeared), also conceiving the Jewish Star and fist insignia, a similar symbol to the Black Panther party, though Kahane himself was against the Black Panther party due to anti-Jewish riots they has supported in Massachusetts as he saw it, and leftist leanings as he saw it.

In the late 1950s to early 1960s, Kahane's life of secrecy and strong anti-communist views landed him a position as a consultant with the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI). According to his wife Libby, his assignment was to infiltrate the anti-communist John Birch Society and report his findings back to the FBI.[21] As reported by Michael T. Kaufman in The New York Times[29] (and subsequently followed up by The Village Voice in the early 1980s), Kahane (under his pseudonym Michael King) allegedly had an affair with a non-Jewish woman, Gloria Jean D'Argenio.[30][31] In 1966, Kahane/King allegedly sent a letter to D'Argenio in which he unilaterally ended their relationship. According to Friedman, Kahane had proposed to D'Argenio, and two days before the wedding, admitted he was already married with children. In response, D'Argenio jumped off the Queensboro ("59th Street", "Ed Koch") Bridge; she died of her injuries the next day. According to Kaufman, Kahane admitted to him that "he loved Ms D'Argenio and had sent roses to her grave for months after her death." He also established a foundation which carried the name she used in her modeling career, Estelle Donna Evans. Ads for the foundation appeared weekly in the Jewish Press, although the group never filed legally required financial documents detailing what it did with the money it collected.[32]
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline White Israelite

  • Ultimate JTFer
  • *******
  • Posts: 4535
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2014, 01:10:02 PM »
I don't think what rabbi Kahane did was bad although I'm not overly familiar with the john birch society, but sometimes infiltration and knowing your enemy by socially engineering them, you start to learn the ulterior motives and get a better stance on what is really going on.

Offline Ephraim Ben Noach

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5019
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2014, 08:08:05 PM »
drmg, I am not interested in the merit or non-merit of the JBS... I am interested in the mindset of the Rabbi at the time and what he was trying to accomplish by doing some of these apparently questionable things... I am sure there is a rational reason and I hope to learn it...

The wikipedia page contains this information about this story...
It looks like this is a pretty well documented story, and Rabbe went in because he thought they were anti-Semitic. .. It also looks like Rabbe started to like and may of been influenced by the Birch society? It seems today the birch society is a Illuminati Jewish group by the Koch brothers who started the Tea Party. ..

I don't see a problem with the FBI thing, if the FBI asked me to go into the Aryan Nation, I would too. The woman thing is not good....
« Last Edit: March 04, 2014, 08:24:39 PM by אפרים בן נח »
Ezekiel 33:6 But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the horn, and the people be not warned, and the sword do come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity, but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2014, 09:09:59 PM »
I don't know where it is learned that he joined to investigate 'antisemitism'....

According to the wikipage and the interview he joined to investigate whether the right wing was engaging in radical extremism. I believe he reported that they did not... Also, why would the FBI be concerned about antisemitism in JBS? It makes no sense..

The story concerning the woman is very disturbing... I hope to learn more about what was involved with this..
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2014, 09:23:48 PM »
I don't see why it's "questionable."   He infiltrated an antisemitic organization to help the FBI rein them in.  Please explain what your rabbi finds objectionable about it.   Iis it wrong to work for the FBI?   I don't think so.

I'm also wondering, why shouldn't he do an interview with playboy magazine?  He should only talk to perfectly righteous people and only spread his essential message to perfect tzaddikim? Why?

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2014, 09:29:39 PM »
And aside from the obvious reasons he took this job consider also what he learned from it.  He knew the fbi's capabilities, precisely the manner in which it sends operatives to infiltrate organizations it's uncomfortable with, and he probably gained some inside sources/friends and political capital by working for them and doing then this favor, which would certainly come in handy later.  Considering RabbiKahane and his JDL became a prime target of FBI monitoring and investigation diverting resources from fighting terror in order to shut him down (or try), this is another example of the Rav's great wisdom to anticipate future developments and prepare appropriately.

Offline Ephraim Ben Noach

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5019
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2014, 09:42:35 PM »
I don't see why it's "questionable."   He infiltrated an antisemitic organization to help the FBI rein them in.  Please explain what your rabbi finds objectionable about it.   Iis it wrong to work for the FBI?   I don't think so.

I'm also wondering, why shouldn't he do an interview with playboy magazine?  He should only talk to perfectly righteous people and only spread his essential message to perfect tzaddikim? Why?
But they weren't anti-Semitic, that was coming from the left.
Ezekiel 33:6 But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the horn, and the people be not warned, and the sword do come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity, but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2014, 09:43:44 PM »
I don't see why it's "questionable."   He infiltrated an antisemitic organization to help the FBI rein them in.  Please explain what your rabbi finds objectionable about it.   Iis it wrong to work for the FBI?   I don't think so.

I'm also wondering, why shouldn't he do an interview with playboy magazine?  He should only talk to perfectly righteous people and only spread his essential message to perfect tzaddikim? Why?

My rabbi knew nothing about this event... My friend brought it up in our conversation. He is a member of JBS...

Also, I have seen no evidence that JBS was antisemitic...

What is your opinion of his relationship with the woman? Was it necessary for the operation?

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2014, 09:46:50 PM »
And aside from the obvious reasons he took this job consider also what he learned from it.  He knew the fbi's capabilities, precisely the manner in which it sends operatives to infiltrate organizations it's uncomfortable with, and he probably gained some inside sources/friends and political capital by working for them and doing then this favor, which would certainly come in handy later.  Considering RabbiKahane and his JDL became a prime target of FBI monitoring and investigation diverting resources from fighting terror in order to shut him down (or try), this is another example of the Rav's great wisdom to anticipate future developments and prepare appropriately.

Just as likely is that FBI got to know the inner working and thinking of Rabbi Kahane.. It just is an odd story in light of the entire Kahane assassination and the WTC bombing in 1993...

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

  • Honorable Winged Member
  • Gold Star JTF Member
  • *
  • Posts: 12581
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #16 on: March 04, 2014, 09:47:32 PM »
But they weren't anti-Semitic, that was coming from the left.

It is well known that they were.  Just because the left said it doesn't make it automatically untrue.  The left today also says al qaeda is bad and the right agrees.  Or do you say al qaeda must be good since the left is against them?  Didn't think so.

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #17 on: March 04, 2014, 09:49:52 PM »
It is well known that they were.  Just because the left said it doesn't make it automatically untrue.  The left today also says al qaeda is bad and the right agrees.  Or do you say al qaeda must be good since the left is against them?  Didn't think so.

I have a Jewish friend who is in JBS and he says that they are not antisemtic today... Also their website vehemently claims that it will not stand any antisemitism or racism...

Quote
http://www.jbs.org/about-jbs/myths-vs-facts

Myth: The JBS message is hate-filled.

Fact: There never has been any hate in our agenda and it will never be employed as a tactic. From the outset, membership in JBS has been strictly denied to haters and, should any member adopt a racist or anti-Semitic attitude or behavior, the membership of such a person will be permanently revoked.
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Ephraim Ben Noach

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5019
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #18 on: March 04, 2014, 10:06:36 PM »
It is well known that they were.  Just because the left said it doesn't make it automatically untrue.  The left today also says al qaeda is bad and the right agrees.  Or do you say al qaeda must be good since the left is against them?  Didn't think so.
This was coming from leftists, left wing Jews (that supported Russian Communism), and Christian's that disagreed with anything other than their beliefs! And a Government that was dabbling in Communism...
Ezekiel 33:6 But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the horn, and the people be not warned, and the sword do come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity, but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.

Offline muman613

  • Platinum JTF Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 29958
  • All souls praise Hashem, Hallelukah!
    • muman613 Torah Wisdom
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2014, 10:12:37 PM »
It is well known that they were.  Just because the left said it doesn't make it automatically untrue.  The left today also says al qaeda is bad and the right agrees.  Or do you say al qaeda must be good since the left is against them?  Didn't think so.

In most of the extreme leftist media 'Al Queda' is painted as a CIA created organization. They always try to minimize anything done wrong by these monsters. So too the leftists seem to have no problem putting al-queda's media 'Al Jazeea' on cable...

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Tag-MehirTzedek

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5457
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2014, 10:57:47 PM »
I have a Jewish friend who is in JBS and he says that they are not antisemtic today... Also their website vehemently claims that it will not stand any antisemitism or racism...

 Keyword TODAY.

 Anyway, his job was to report what they were or weren't doing. If they weren't anti-semites (or whatever else the Rav had to work for) then they wouldn't have a problem.
.   ד  עֹזְבֵי תוֹרָה, יְהַלְלוּ רָשָׁע;    וְשֹׁמְרֵי תוֹרָה, יִתְגָּרוּ בָם
4 They that forsake the law praise the wicked; but such as keep the law contend with them.

ה  אַנְשֵׁי-רָע, לֹא-יָבִינוּ מִשְׁפָּט;    וּמְבַקְשֵׁי יְהוָה, יָבִינוּ כֹל.   
5 Evil men understand not justice; but they that seek the LORD understand all things.

Offline Tag-MehirTzedek

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5457
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2014, 11:02:32 PM »
This was coming from leftists, left wing Jews (that supported Russian Communism), and Christian's that disagreed with anything other than their beliefs! And a Government that was dabbling in Communism...

 Left wing Jews that supported Communism? What are you smoking lately. How many could these people be? I bet close to NONE. Jews in America did not support Communism. That is why they were in America and not in Russia under Communism. I don't get where you got this BS from?

 + For Rav Kahane ZTL HYD it was never about "left" vs. "right" he repeatedly said and wrote that its about safety and security for Jews and about Kiddush Hashem. Forget about left and right (if you want to understand his worldview). "Left" and "right" are just boxes people put themselves in.
 Anyone to the left of you isn't an automatic Communist and anyone to the right of you isn't a Fascist.
.   ד  עֹזְבֵי תוֹרָה, יְהַלְלוּ רָשָׁע;    וְשֹׁמְרֵי תוֹרָה, יִתְגָּרוּ בָם
4 They that forsake the law praise the wicked; but such as keep the law contend with them.

ה  אַנְשֵׁי-רָע, לֹא-יָבִינוּ מִשְׁפָּט;    וּמְבַקְשֵׁי יְהוָה, יָבִינוּ כֹל.   
5 Evil men understand not justice; but they that seek the LORD understand all things.

Offline Ephraim Ben Noach

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5019
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2014, 11:08:31 PM »
Left wing Jews that supported Communism? What are you smoking lately. How many could these people be? I bet close to NONE. Jews in America did not support Communism. That is why they were in America and not in Russia under Communism. I don't get where you got this BS from?

 + For Rav Kahane ZTL HYD it was never about "left" vs. "right" he repeatedly said and wrote that its about safety and security for Jews and about Kiddush Hashem. Forget about left and right (if you want to understand his worldview). "Left" and "right" are just boxes people put themselves in.
 Anyone to the left of you isn't an automatic Communist and anyone to the right of you isn't a Fascist.
Soo, you're telling me no Jews in America supported Communism?
Ezekiel 33:6 But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the horn, and the people be not warned, and the sword do come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity, but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.

Offline Ephraim Ben Noach

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5019
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2014, 11:13:33 PM »
SOROS!
Ezekiel 33:6 But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the horn, and the people be not warned, and the sword do come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity, but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.

Offline Tag-MehirTzedek

  • Silver Star JTF Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 5457
Re: Rabbi Kahane & the John Birch Society : What is the JTF back-story?
« Reply #24 on: March 04, 2014, 11:14:55 PM »
Soo, you're telling me no Jews in America supported Communism?


"This was coming from leftists, left wing Jews (that supported Russian Communism), and Christian's that disagreed with anything other than their beliefs! And a Government that was dabbling in Communism.."

 That's what  YOU wrote making it as if their was some group and conspiracy of Jews supporting Communism! That's an outright lie and usually propaganda by Jew haters. Any Jew (or many gentiles as well) even left-wing leaning isn't automatically a Communist.
.   ד  עֹזְבֵי תוֹרָה, יְהַלְלוּ רָשָׁע;    וְשֹׁמְרֵי תוֹרָה, יִתְגָּרוּ בָם
4 They that forsake the law praise the wicked; but such as keep the law contend with them.

ה  אַנְשֵׁי-רָע, לֹא-יָבִינוּ מִשְׁפָּט;    וּמְבַקְשֵׁי יְהוָה, יָבִינוּ כֹל.   
5 Evil men understand not justice; but they that seek the LORD understand all things.